Your Opinions About Felipe and Letizia

[olga7777]

First in the issue of Starbucks for what I have seen in news in TV, they were making references to the cultural value of the Forbidden City, and one Chinese person that appeared in the news was talking about the cultural value for Chinese people of the place and the need to keep it free of things such Starbucks. The fear of globalization would refer to all Starbucks in China. As far as I know, the campaign is only against that specific outlet in the specific context of the Forbidden city. I assure you the images I have seen about the outlet are very respectful in my opinion with the place. But that's my western opinion.

Again the red top was barely visible, as I said before it's my opinion she should have played on the safe side and avoid the suit descending from the plane. She didn't wore the whole suit or anything in whole white after that. When I was talking about the shift, based in the comment made by Lena T, I mean that it was important before, and therefore the need to play in the safe side. If there is a shift is because it's still remember, and again I would like to point to my first message in that regard saying that "it might not be what it was before".

Regarding to the Chinese reactions, considering her status and the situation I'm sure they are aware of the cultural differences between the two countries and I'm completely sure they did not take it as an offence but it's a question of impressions made in other people. You can never depend in their understanding, you have to try to play in the safe side when you are in a situation as Letizia is. That's what is all about. Protocol, more specifically royal protocol is not only an issue of the rules but more like an art about how you can apply them, so to speak.

The Chinese children wore white shirts, red neckties and skirt and trousers in non-white colours. They were not wearing white in full.

I have repeatedly provided information about the context of the photos, on arrival descending of the plane, and provided links to those photos plus link to the thread in this forum that deals with the trip to China. I've tried very hard to be very specific in my messages and to provide sources and information about that specific event.

 

[ysbel]

First in the issue of Starbucks for what I have seen in news in TV, they were making references to the cultural value of the Forbidden City, and one Chinese person that appeared in the news was talking about the cultural value for Chinese people of the place and the need to keep it free of things such Starbucks. The fear of globalization would refer to all Starbucks in China. As far as I know, the campaign is only against that specific outlet in the specific context of the Forbidden city. I assure you the images I have seen about the outlet are very respectful in my opinion with the place. But that's my western opinion.

Again the red top was barely visible, as I said before it's my opinion she should have played on the safe side and avoid the suit descending from the plane. She didn't wore the whole suit or anything in whole white after that. When I was talking about the shift, based in the comment made by Lena T, I mean that it was important before, and therefore the need to play in the safe side. If there is a shift is because it's still remember, and again I would like to point to my first message in that regard saying that "it might not be what it was before".

Regarding to the Chinese reactions, considering her status and the situation I'm sure they are aware of the cultural differences between the two countries and I'm completely sure they did not take it as an offence but it's a question of impressions made in other people. You can never depend in their understanding, you have to try to play in the safe side when you are in a situation as Letizia is. That's what is all about. Protocol, more specifically royal protocol is not only an issue of the rules but more like an art about how you can apply them, so to speak.

The Chinese children wore white shirts, red neckties and skirt and trousers in non-white colours. They were not wearing white in full.

I have repeatedly provided information about the context of the photos, on arrival descending of the plane, and provided links to those photos plus link to the thread in this forum that deals with the trip to China. I've tried very hard to be very specific in my messages and to provide sources and information about that specific event.

To a certain point I agree with you olga, but if the Chinese children were partially clothed in white too, that really changes my perception of the event. Its too much of a coincidence that both the children and Letizia were all partially clothed in white. Do we absolutely know for sure that a color scheme wasn't agreed upon by the Chinese hosts and Spanish guests in advance? If white is so taboo in China, why were Chinese children wearing white when representing their country in front of the wife of a future foreign king? That seems a more unforgivable taboo for the Chinese children to wear partial white than Letizia wearing white. At least the adults dressing the children should have known better but Letizia as a foreigner not used to the culture could be forgiven.

Based on the last posts about the event, I think the Chinese hosts were very well aware of what they were expecting when they invited Letizia and that white in this circumstance was OK. As I said, it was too much of a coincidence that both the children and Letizia were clad in white.

 

[olga7777]

My opinion about the children in the photos is that they were wearing school uniforms in a western style plus a red necktie in a western manner. I assume that the western manner would be because it might be more normal that uniform in China nowadays and also because they will wanted to honour their guests and make them feel comfortable. That's my opinion, though

Regarding to the issue of colours I don't think the exchange of information in those events reach that point. I know of one story that involves Tony Blair, British Prime Minister, in America with George Bush and "some" informal gathering taken place, ending with Tony Blair rushing to change his clothes to be dressed properly for the event. So I don't think the exchange of information reaches that level. Also it points to the importance of being properly dressed for the events.

Letizia is not a normal foreigner, she is the consort of the heir to the throne in Spain, she is advised in questions of protocol and has to behave in a manner that represents the country and leaves the country in the best manner. The marriage to the Prince of Asturias brings that with it. I'm not saying she made a horrendous and unforgivable mistake, but she should know better by now.

 

[planetcher]

Ok, I just called my cousin's Chinese husband and asked him about this. He told me that there is no such thing as you're not supposed to wear white because it's a taboo of some sort. He laughed and asked me where the hell I got it from.

 

[olga7777]

This is going in circles and not being a very productive discussion and I have to sleep.

I have never said it was a tabu, I have never said it was forbidden, I have talk about the issue being a tradition, white being an unlucky colour because it was associated with mourning. Something about superstition. I have also added it's no longer what it was, and added about playing in the safe side. Please read my messages, I will not be quoting parts of them as it's very late for me. I remind everyone that I have always expressed it was my opinion and I have provided some sources so as to explain why this was my opinion.

Just one question, I'm Spanish living in Ireland. How many of the people in this conversation are Chinese living in mainland China?

 

[planetcher]

My cousin-in-law (is there such thing?) Ang said that white is the color of mourning, but you can also wear it on any typical day. My cousin Dina wore a white dress on their wedding day in China he said. He said this is already 2007 and Chinese people have already been following Western practices. He said it's just like black, we wear it at funerals and we can also wear it on any occasions. I will ask my Chinese friend Mai when she gets back from HongKong.

Official Trip to China July 12-14 2006

http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f11/official-trip-china-july-12-14-2006-a-10187.html

 

[Avalon]

All possible opinions about Princess Letizia, wearing a white suit have been voiced and backed up with numerous sources.
I think we can now move on.

 

[mapian]

Can somebody translate this article? I haven't a good translator. It is very interesting, I think so. It's a opinion abaut the princess of Asturias from a well known spanish's writer.

ABC.es: opinion - firmas - Una princesa

 

[Elsa M.]

Can somebody translate this article? It' s a opinion abaut the princces of Asturias from a well known spanish's writer.

ABC.es: opinion - firmas - Una princesa

The appearance of the Princess of Asturias, accompanying her husband to the headquarters of the Cervantes Institute has moved me profoundly. Her deep pain, her stoic attitude towards the tragedy has moved me. Nobody could have censured her, if she cancelled her official agenda during some time, to look for refuge in her privacy, until the external signs of her pain were mitigated. Not even her merciful detractors would have reproached it. But Doña Letizia has decided to reassume her activities, in a responsible gesture that only makes her more human to our eyes. On one hand, we have been able to see the damage that the pain has caused in her face (a pale reflection of what was caused in her spirit); at the same time, we have been able to verify her immediate will of sacrifice, her desire to put her high mission before the exhausted tears she was struggling not to show in her eyes. Never has Doña Letizia appeared so much as a princess like now.

Doña Letizia has had to face mistrusts and suspicions since her engagement to the Prince of Asturias was announced. About her all type of delirious rumours has circulated. I must confess that there was a time when I credulously listened to them; unfortunately, malicious stories usually have convincing attires. But that image, tributary to the calumny, started to be dissolved in a conversation I had with the archbishop Don Francisco Perez González; the picture he offered me of Doña Letizia exhaustively refuted it. Opposed to the frivolous, capricious and insufferable Letizia that the malicious chains have created, Don Francisco told me of a spiritual, discreet young woman, willing to self-sacrifice to the new dignity she has assumed and fully dedicated to the man she had decided to tie her destiny.

Soon, I had the opportunity to see her and greet her, when she went with her husband to the basilica of the Virgin of Atocha, to present her new born-daughter, Infanta Leonor. I specially recall the mixture of timidity and pride whereupon she welcomed the congratulations from the audience; there was no calculation in that attitude, only an effusive genuineness that completely defeated my initial reluctance. Shortly after, I had the opportunity to have a long talk with her, during the prize-giving ceremony of the Mariano de Cavia awards, when I had the honour of being placed in the same table. She exuded genuineness through all the pores of her skin; she was cautious without being shielded; she was likeable without any histrionic signs; very calmly amused, when the occasion deserved it, and also serenely conscious of her obligations and the vocation she had assumed. That night, I could verify by myself that the woman created by the gossip was exactly on the antipode of the woman I had at my side.

I have never been courtesan. I have not vocation, nor convictions to be such, but Doña Letizia, under her fragile appearance, seemed to me as a woman of a very special temper. I thought I would never pay her this tribute to her; that I would always keep those impressions in the most recondite corner of my memory. But, when I saw her bearing her pain with so much integrity, I was sincerely touched. I beg your pardon.

 

[donnaK]

Juan Manuel de Prada (the author of the article) is a very famous Spanish writer. He won the Planet award in his 20s, also won other prestigeous literature awards.
My opinion, Letizia has always been the same Letizia. Nothing she did at the tragic death of her sister surprises me. But I'm glad that many people in Spain who haven't followed the Princes very closely saw the real Letizia this time, the malicious weekly attacks by the likes of Jaime Penafiel on her and her family can no longer blind people.

 

[adelaide]

Yes, it's obvious, this article- well written, with the sens of the measure- is favorable to the Princesss of Asturias by a very pricefull way: with precise words regarding specific attacks against the Princess of Asturias, for which the autor may be were contributing telling nothing at the moment where they were writing. This article is a true recognition of errors.

Error of easy thaught for a woman whom the only fault is to be in love of a "Prince of blood". In the collective unconscious mind it could be necessary a fault bacause, even you are able to analyse a situation overtaking your normal appreciation of classical stratification of the society, it's very difficult to admit that marying a Crown Prince it can be a love affair.

In fact it's a very strong and deep love affair because a Crown Prince is not alone : it's a man with all his fellow citizen, it's a lot of people. It's a man with many significant duties very far away of the expression of the liberty of thaught that it was the way for a journalist wanting to succeed in her job respecting a strong ethic( Generally speaking :can you think that is easy?)

May be my sentences are too pompous but marying a Crown Prince it's too marying a country, a lot of contraints; is the equivalent of the disapearence of your ego to give it at the others, your citzen fellows.

You know very well, me too, that the main argument of the Letizia's detractors is : may be some time it could be a little upset but with such avantages, with such facilties in your diary life, with such possibilities to have a luxury life. One answer, in a certain way may be, but all that your are doing is to be criticized, to be systematically unconfirmed, begining you :who are you?

I don't think it's possible to have a first plan's role if you are all days long calling into question for little, absurd of irrelevant details.If you consider the landsacape in wich Letizia Ortiz is becoming Princess of Asturias, a mixing of anachronism and great modernity of a society which hardly thirty years ago was under the quiet despotic regime, you have to consider that if a wise Crown Prince is marying a plebeyan woman it's not only to give something to eat to a yellow press gossipthirsty.

This article, very acurate about the subject of the gossips, is a true lesson of humility.

Happily, it's possible to see journlists having reflexions!

 

[MissSaga]

What is my opinion of Felipe and Letizia ?

Hmm .. I like them very much. I think they are a good looking couple, very in love, and they have cutest daughter. They appear happy. I've liked Letizia since the first time I saw her, which was at F&M's wedding. I still like her a lot.(not her fashions, but that another question lol) The only thing is that I find her so depended on her husband. A princess' job is not just to follow her husband around, but it's solo activities too. Involvments in something YOU find interesting and vital. I sort of feel sorry for her, because most of what they do, I could imagine, was something Felipe was most enthusiastic about, and sometimes she looks so bored at some meetings that last for a whole week or something(NO OFFENCE, I would too .. ) But they are very hardworking , and I like the fact that they are "a team" in a way.. And they way the hold hands is just endearing.Anyways, they , I think, have fulfilled their jobs as crownprinces of Spain very well. Felipe is very ready to be king IMO.

 

[mapian]

Thanks so much, Elsa

 

[Roxsteve]

Yes, it's obvious, this article- well written, with the sens of the measure- is favorable to the Princesss of Asturias by a very pricefull way: with precise words regarding specific attacks against the Princess of Asturias, for which the autor may be were contributing telling nothing at the moment where they were writing. This article is a true recognition of errors.

Error of easy thaught for a woman whom the only fault is to be in love of a "Prince of blood". In the collective unconscious mind it could be necessary a fault bacause, even you are able to analyse a situation overtaking your normal appreciation of classical stratification of the society, it's very difficult to admit that marying a Crown Prince it can be a love affair.

In fact it's a very strong and deep love affair because a Crown Prince is not alone : it's a man with all his fellow citizen, it's a lot of people. It's a man with many significant duties very far away of the expression of the liberty of thaught that it was the way for a journalist wanting to succeed in her job respecting a strong ethic( Generally speaking :can you think that is easy?)

May be my sentences are too pompous but marying a Crown Prince it's too marying a country, a lot of contraints; is the equivalent of the disapearence of your ego to give it at the others, your citzen fellows.

You know very well, me too, that the main argument of the Letizia's detractors is : may be some time it could be a little upset but with such avantages, with such facilties in your diary life, with such possibilities to have a luxury life. One answer, in a certain way may be, but all that your are doing is to be criticized, to be systematically unconfirmed, begining you :who are you?

I don't think it's possible to have a first plan's role if you are all days long calling into question for little, absurd of irrelevant details.If you consider the landsacape in wich Letizia Ortiz is becoming Princess of Asturias, a mixing of anachronism and great modernity of a society which hardly thirty years ago was under the quiet despotic regime, you have to consider that if a wise Crown Prince is marying a plebeyan woman it's not only to give something to eat to a yellow press gossipthirsty.

This article, very acurate about the subject of the gossips, is a true lesson of humility.

Happily, it's possible to see journlists having reflexions!

If the article would have criticized Letizia, the author would have been lying, a horrible person, a traitor, not a very good writer, etc. In my opinion, this is just one of many authors writing something about the prince and his wife. I don't necessarily believe what he writes as I don't believe the other ones (the ones who don't like her either). Yes, she has suffered a big blow with the passing of her sister, and her husband is not an amazing man for being with her...he did what any husband, who loves his wife, should do. Glorifying Felipe for being there for his wife is not the way. He did what he was expected to do. What kind of person would he be if he would have not been there for his wife. Letizia is a strong woman, but life goes on, and all of us have to go on. I admire her for that but I think the article is too much.

 

[donnaK]

If the article would have criticized Letizia, the author would have been lying, a horrible person, a traitor, not a very good writer, etc. In my opinion, this is just one of many authors writing something about the prince and his wife. I don't necessarily believe what he writes as I don't believe the other ones (the ones who don't like her either). Yes, she has suffered a big blow with the passing of her sister, and her husband is not an amazing man for being with her...he did what any husband, who loves his wife, should do. Glorifying Felipe for being there for his wife is not the way. He did what he was expected to do. What kind of person would he be if he would have not been there for his wife. Letizia is a strong woman, but life goes on, and all of us have to go on. I admire her for that but I think the article is too much.

Juan Manuel de Prada is a well-known and well accomplished novelist and journalist with many prestigeous awards. So please don't confuse him with the 3rd rated gossip writers, mostly on the internet. He was in favor of the traditional equal royal marriage before he met Letizia in person a couple of times, had a long conversation with her. I believe if he hadn't changed his view on Letizia, were to write an article against an unequal marriage, he would have written in a very tasteful way, no cheap shots.
If you read his article carefully, the main ingrediant is not about how Letizia or Felipe handling the tragedy. The writer's opinions of Letizia had long formed before this tragedy.

 

[Duncan]

The article was published in the serious and monarchist newspaper ABC.

 

[adelaide]

If the article would have criticized Letizia, the author would have been lying, a horrible person, a traitor, not a very good writer, etc. In my opinion, this is just one of many authors writing something about the prince and his wife. I don't necessarily believe what he writes as I don't believe the other ones (the ones who don't like her either). Yes, she has suffered a big blow with the passing of her sister, and her husband is not an amazing man for being with her...he did what any husband, who loves his wife, should do. Glorifying Felipe for being there for his wife is not the way. He did what he was expected to do. What kind of person would he be if he would have not been there for his wife. Letizia is a strong woman, but life goes on, and all of us have to go on. I admire her for that but I think the article is too much.

You are totally right if my aunt was my uncle I shall tell him "my uncle" and the opposite, so what?

As I can see, it's difficult to admit that we can be eulogistic with the eulogIers and in a total consitant attitud,deny at the detractors theirs systematic quarrel to undervalue people that they don't like. It's quiet normal but not very rewarding. It's obious that goes on for every body and all of us have to go on - You can't imagine what this words can have as signification for people who has suffering a personal drama- but I' m going to say does'nt matter because it's not the life of the others which interst me but the life of the Princes of Asturias.

 

[Mari_*]

Thanks for the ABC article mapian.. very good and interesing! =)

 

[Rossina]

I love them sooooo much ....

 

[seto]

I think they are a good couple who love each other and always have. I also think they work really hard for their country and love it.

 

[mapian]

El Semanal Digital=

An other article abaut Princess Letizia, from a journalist who has known her in person and has changed his opinion on her, opinion that she had through the commentaries of others.

It's difficult to translate it for me, but in summary, she says that when knowing and speaking with her during minutes, its glance has said many things to her on the princess and now she admires her and is not in agreement with the critics that have received, this phrase is very pretty:

Letizia has the sincere glance; sad, yes, but clean, and that it could not pretend nor Bette Davis in its better times. Today I know that, him in spite of who weighs to him, woman that has chosen heir of crown is real princess and for me, what do you want that I say to you, has been a magnificent and rewarding discovery.

If somebody can translate it better, I thank for it.

 

[Duncan]

If somebody can translate it better, I thank for it.

The article isn't easy to translate, but can be summarized like this.

Ely del Valle used to believe everything she heard about Letizia: she liked her when she heard positive appraisals and she disliked her when she heard criticism.

In the next paragaphs, Ely states some of the crudest attacks against Letizia.

But then, she says, on February 27 she had the opportunity to talk with Letizia for ten minutes. From the moment she looked into her eyes, she started feeling a strong sympathy for Letizia, because she saw a clean gaze. For her, that gaze was the evidence Letizia was a real princess.

 

[Paty]

Dear Duncan, what a magnific summary! You have described very well and briefly the article.

 

[mapian]

Thanks so much Duncan

 

[Roxsteve]

You are totally right if my aunt was my uncle I shall tell him "my uncle" and the opposite, so what?

As I can see, it's difficult to admit that we can be eulogistic with the eulogIers and in a total consitant attitud,deny at the detractors theirs systematic quarrel to undervalue people that they don't like. It's quiet normal but not very rewarding. It's obious that goes on for every body and all of us have to go on - You can't imagine what this words can have as signification for people who has suffering a personal drama- but I' m going to say does'nt matter because it's not the life of the others which interst me but the life of the Princes of Asturias.

I'm not sure I understand your point. But don't assume that other people have never suffered blows like Letizia's. I'm not sure I get it.

 

[Vanesa]

I must said that now I appreciate Princess Letizia a little more than before (not for the tragedy she is overcoming these last days but for she seems to love the Prince of Asturias a great deal). I must confess that I'm legitimist, and that I like Royal, equal marriages, not for I despises commoners (I'm a commoner myself, so I wouldn't do such an idiot thing ) but for a conception of Monarchy that would be very difficult for me to explain here, since my English is REALLY bad and I wouldn't say what I really want to say. Of course, I'm always a fighter for love unions, but love unions are not always "unequal". One of the most great loves among Royals was the one of Queen Victoria of England and Prince Albert, and other, the one of Empress Alexandra of Russia and her husband, Tsar Nicholas II...Without mentioning other famous "love unions" among Royals circles. It IS natural for Royals to marry among them, since they attend the same parties, ceremonies, official acts, etc, etc...However, time to time, it's not bad for them to marry a "commoner". The bad thing for me it's that today they almost ALWAYS marries a commoner, and they seems even to search to marry them. IN some years to come, Royals would not have a single drop of Royal blood, and for me at least, it's a great pity.

Princess Letizia seems to be a good woman, and I do not believe she is the monster that some papers would make of her. I do not believe she is a saint,either. I still trying to make my mind about how she really is. Prince Felipe is not my kind of good Crown Prince either, even if he is awfully good looking and is from Royal birth. You may call me old-fashioned (and I'm really am! ), but he seems much more a man of bussiness, an enterprise owner than a Prince (and this is a default I noticed in many of the new Crown Princes, excepting , maybe Prince Frederick of Denmark). So, we can criticize Princess Letizia, but she is not so different than her husband.

But we must not forget that they are Infanta Leonor's parents and that this girl is the hope of Spanish Monarchy. If we have something to say about the Princes of Asturias, the littel Infanta could relieve us of our critics. I've a great faith in the little and wonderful "Monarchy Sprouts" that are appearing all the world around. I'm sure that they will do a succeful task.

I like and love Spanish Monarchy, but for this, I'm in between of the opinions.

Vanesa.

 

[adelaide]

Vanessa, your explanation is very topic because with great sincerity you are telling how is for you the Monarchy.

You notice, very accurately that Felipe of Spain looks more a buisinessman rather a Crown Prince, I can't share totally your opinion because in the absolute it don't exist a Crown Prince Pattern. For me, if at the XVII and XVIII th century a Crown Princes had to Know the War's Art as a model of structuration of their personality, at the end of XX th and at the beginiing of the XXI th century the war is economic. If the Prince of Asturias can have the spirit of entrepreneur knowing the economic's workings of his country is the proof that his studies was the good ones because nowaday a country as Spain needs more as Crown Prince a economic connoissor and as a leader a man who works for the peace, for that I'm sure that the Prince of Asturias is a very good Crown Prince in tune with the times.

I want to add that I 'm just discovering the "enlightened face" of the Prince in the XVIIIth century meaning because more his necessary business approach of the Society, he has a great interest for intelectual and scientific fields as astronomy and his first fight seems to be the protection of the planet. Why not ? It's a beautiful fight, isen't it?

 

[biboquinhas]

Like all other Royal couples they are friendly, have a friendly look all the time, smilling to everyone, waving goodbye, kissing, shaking hands, having a friendly smile, having a normal and casual conversation, speaking to journalists sometimes, chating about normal things, we don't have anything wrong to say about them has we don't have anything wrong to say about all other Royal Couples. They are doing their job so they have the same posture and attitude towards their work! In private we really can't tell anything because we don't know, everything we say - pure expeculation!

 

[adelaide]

Like all other Royal couples they are friendly, have a friendly look all the time, smilling to everyone, waving goodbye, kissing, shaking hands, having a friendly smile, having a normal and casual conversation, speaking to journalists sometimes, chating about normal things, we don't have anything wrong to say about them has we don't have anything wrong to say about all other Royal Couples. They are doing their job so they have the same posture and attitude towards their work! In private we really can't tell anything because we don't know, everything we say - pure expeculation!

Right about their public life, they are acting according their agenda exactly as all Crown Princes 's couples ..... who have so much work! ( Certainely for the prince of Walls and the Duchess of Cornwall, even they don't be my cup of tea ) If your are good observor you can't denied that the percentage of working time for the Princes of Asturias is not quiet the same, neither range of their activity is much larger than for instance these of the Princes of Brabant or Danish Crown Princes ( for the Belgian and danish Crown Princes it's normal becauseit's an internal question of Constitional attributions)

For their private life as you say all must be only speculation because they are very descret and they want descretion, that's all!

 

[Duncan]

his first fight seems to be the protection of the planet. Why not ? It's a beautiful fight, isen't it?

Nothing wrong with that, although I don't remember Felipe fighting for the protection of the planet.

If you are talking about that time when the Spanish public television showed him in a ten-chapter documentary series about animals, that was ten years ago. Nevertheless, I appreciate the fact he isn't a hunter.