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-   -   The Protestant Religions and Protestant Royals (http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f164/the-protestant-religions-and-protestant-royals-7970.html)

tiaraprin 11-18-2005 05:45 PM

The Protestant Religions and Protestant Royals
 
As we are all learning about Roman Catholicism in the Catholic thread, I saw that some people were confused about which religions were Protestant religions. I felt perhaps there can be a forum of learning and discussing the many Protestant religions that exist today and the Royals who practice them. I would like a forum that is meant for a true exchange of knowledge; not one of a prejudical attack.

The USA, my native land, is more than 50% percent Protestant. Some of the Protestant religions in my country are: Presbyterian, Methodist, Lutheran, Baptist, Anabaptist, Episcopalian, and Born Again Christianity. This is just a short list, there are many more.

Anyone who has questions about any Protestant faiths or have any news relating to religious issues with Protestant Royals, here is a place to ask and share.

Princejohnny25 11-18-2005 05:55 PM

Good idea Tiarapin. I have always been intreseted in the State Churches of Protestent countrys. Is the King of Sweden still the head of the swedish church. Is presbytarian still practiced widley and scotland and how is its role in scotland compare to the anglican church in england.

marlene 11-18-2005 07:44 PM

a swedish friend of mine told me that as lutheranism is the state religion of sweden everyone who is born there is counted as lutheran at birth except if you specifically indicate that you are not by sending in the proper documentation to the government.Could someone tell me if this is correct.Does this mean that as the state religion the king can not change his faith?

Sylvina 10-28-2007 09:33 AM

These days the goverment and the church of sweden is split apart, but i still belive that the king can not change his faith.

norwegianne 10-29-2007 12:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sylvina (Post 685771)
These days the goverment and the church of sweden is split apart, but i still belive that the king can not change his faith.

I remember reading something from when the church/state split was a reality in Sweden, that the King himself did not want to change that part of the law. He wanted the monarch and the Swedish church to be tied together.

Iain 01-17-2008 04:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Princejohnny25 (Post 325985)
Is presbytarian still practiced widley and scotland and how is its role in scotland compare to the anglican church in england.

In Scotland the Church of Scotland (or Kirk as it's usually called) is not the "State Church" but is termed the "National Church." It plays a far bigger role in national life than the Anglican Church does in England but many in Scotland get rather annoyed with it as it fails to speak out on moral issues and there has been a lot of criticism of it in the press because of this. One journalist said that it had lost it's right to be called the National Church and called for that title to pass to the Catholic Church, which has for the past 30 years or so been the largest religion in Scotland, and it is to that Church that the media always turn when it wants comments on various moral issues. The Church of Scotland is now just a shadow of it’s former self. As one newspaper put it “Ask any Scot who the Cardinal is and everyone knows his name, but ask who the Moderator of the Kirk is and you would be lucky if one in thousand could name him.”

Marengo 01-17-2008 11:52 AM

The Dutch RF (most of them) are members of the PKN, Protestant Churches Netherlands. The PKN has 3 main branches united, lutherans (smallest one), reformed and the Dutch reformed. The RF traditionally is Dutch reformed, which is based on Calvinism. Note that it took 50 years or so to unite the protestant branches in The Netherlands and that the most orthopdox protestants immidiately split up and started the 'Hersteld gereformeerden', the 'restaured reformed'.

I am not sure but I believe the Prussian RF is also traditionally Calvinist instead of Lutheran (more common in Germany).

BryanCornett 02-28-2008 03:49 PM

i believe the canute family of the country Denmark when they were no longer royalty moved to france and became huguenots along with john calvin. and i also believe that John calvin protected the canute family that's how i'm here today. and i believe the Danish Monarchy knows something about this. see in order for the canute family to carry King Canute The Great's personal coat of arms they would have to prove their lineage plus have permission from the Danish Monarchy to carry the Canute Coat of the Arms from Country to country and now the Canute coat of arms is in the hands of the cornett family of the USA and that's how us Canute's still survive today.

Next Star 10-13-2008 10:28 PM

The Norway royals are protestant I think their Lutheran or maybe Angelican I'm
just guessing I don't know really.If I am wrong I hope someone will correct me.

Marengo 10-14-2008 05:23 AM

I think all the Scandinavian monarchies are Lutheran.

The house of Luxembourg (Nassau) used to be protestant until GD Guillaume IV married a Portuguese infanta. The deal was that their sons would be raised as protestants and their daughters as catholics. The couple only got daughters so after thta the GD house was catholic.

Royal Fan 10-23-2008 06:14 PM

This is an Interesting topic thanks for posting it

Viv 10-23-2008 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marengo (Post 837148)
I think all the Scandinavian monarchies are Lutheran.

They are indeed!

Smart 12-21-2010 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tiaraprin (Post 325976)
As we are all learning about Roman Catholicism in the Catholic thread, I saw that some people were confused about which religions were Protestant religions. I felt perhaps there can be a forum of learning and discussing the many Protestant religions that exist today and the Royals who practice them. I would like a forum that is meant for a true exchange of knowledge; not one of a prejudical attack.

The USA, my native land, is more than 50% percent Protestant. Some of the Protestant religions in my country are: Presbyterian, Methodist, Lutheran, Baptist, Anabaptist, Episcopalian, and Born Again Christianity. This is just a short list, there are many more.

Anyone who has questions about any Protestant faiths or have any news relating to religious issues with Protestant Royals, here is a place to ask and share.

Number of problems with this one. In particular, the idea that there are Protestant "religions" and "faiths". The word denomination is used, to denote a community within the Protestant sub-religion of Christianity.

"Protestant" has historically meant "not of Rome or the East" (ie, not Roman Catholic, Eastern or Oriental Orthodox). Thus Anglicanism/Episcopalianism qualifies under this very broad definition.

However, since at least the 1800s, Anglicanism has been very distinct from Protestantism. So has Pentecostalism.

As such, my definition of Protestant: anyone who follows the Reformers post-Luther. (Calvin, Knox, etc)

Thus:
Christianity:
sub-religions: Protestantism - Catholicism - Eastern Orthodox - Oriental Orthodox - Neo-Christianity (cults/sects of the last 200 years)

Protestantism:
All Trinitarian churches that adhere to Calvinistic or Arminian doctrine, such as Baptists, Presbyterians, Methodists, etc.

Catholicism:
Roman/Eastern - Anglican - Lutheran - Traditional - Old

Eastern Orthodox:
all regional churches that accept Ancient Patriarchates' rulings/teachings.

Oriental Orthodox:
Ethiopian/Eritrean - Coptic - Armenian - others

Neo-Christianity (those originating after 1800, without alignment with prior movements):
Jehovahs Witnesses, Seventh Day Adventists, Christian Science, Pentecostalism/Charismatic, amongst others.

Note - Mormonism excluded, as that is a separate religion from Christianity, despite modern Mormon laymen trying to connect it to Protestantism.

Maura724 12-21-2010 05:42 PM

I'm not sure how Luther and Lutheranism can not be considered as Protestant. I would define Protestant as groups which sprang from the Reformation, in protest to the Catholic church and its doctrine. The beginning of the Reformation (although there were certainly "reformers" before this, e.g. Wycliffe) is often dated to 1517, beginning with Martin Luther in Germany. IMO, it's hard not to call that Protestant. The central doctrines that set Protestantism apart in the Reformation era were a rejection of transubstantiation and a rejection of good works having any role in salvation. Lutheranism fits both these.

I agree with the description of Baptists/Presbyterians/Methodists etc. as Protestants, but why do you hang the definition on Calvinism and Arminianism, especially since those are exactly opposite doctrines?

And I'm curious why you exclude Mormonism from Christianity if you include Jehovah's Witnesses and Christian Science?

Smart 12-25-2010 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maura724 (Post 1179193)
I'm not sure how Luther and Lutheranism can not be considered as Protestant. I would define Protestant as groups which sprang from the Reformation, in protest to the Catholic church and its doctrine. The beginning of the Reformation (although there were certainly "reformers" before this, e.g. Wycliffe) is often dated to 1517, beginning with Martin Luther in Germany. IMO, it's hard not to call that Protestant. The central doctrines that set Protestantism apart in the Reformation era were a rejection of transubstantiation and a rejection of good works having any role in salvation. Lutheranism fits both these.

I agree with the description of Baptists/Presbyterians/Methodists etc. as Protestants, but why do you hang the definition on Calvinism and Arminianism, especially since those are exactly opposite doctrines?

And I'm curious why you exclude Mormonism from Christianity if you include Jehovah's Witnesses and Christian Science?

Martin Luther died a Catholic. As he put up the 99 theses he was a Catholic. This is an irrefutable fact. He never took the title "Protestant". And all forms of Lutheranism since him and now reflect a strong connection to Roman Catholicism - something Baptists or other Protestant groups completely lack. Lutheranism is a Catholic faith. All Lutherans are Catholics. The difference between them and a Papist is the side of the Tiber River they are on.

Luther never broke from Rome, he condemned the actions of the Papacy at the time. The reason why many Historians (not Theologians) place the Reformation as beginning at 1517 is because this is the first time, ANYONE stood up (in public, unashamed) against the Roman Catholic faith and authority. This was the catalyst which later men - who were Protestant and anti-Catholic (like Calvin, Knox, Wesley, etc) built upon.

Well, I personally would place all non-Calvinists in a completely separate religion, even farther than Rome. But this is not a matter of what is Biblical and what is not - but rather the categorization in modern times.

As Mormonism is Polytheistic (literally an infinite number of gods and universes) it can not be considered part of Christianity, or even a Christianized religion - as it fundamentally denies all tenants of Christianity. (the virgin birth, the incarnation, the sacrifice at Calvary, the Resurrection, etc). This is not the case in Jehovahs Witnesses or Christian Science. Jehovahs Witnesses are Neo-Christian (do not agree with accepted Orthodoxy of 400-1800AD) as it denies the Trinity - albeit affirming some sort of divine status for Jesus (like Arius did). As for Christian Science, it's clearly a cult, but the modern concept of Young-Earth Creationism originated in Christian Science. So it's hard, at least in the case of American Christianity, to separate the Christian Science movement from Christianity.

irishthanhy 01-07-2011 06:56 AM

Lutherans aren't Catholic.

Maura724 01-07-2011 09:22 AM

I very much agree with you, irishthanhy. Regardless of what Martin Luther called himself, the beliefs he held and spread among others, and the beliefs Lutherans hold today, are not the same as the beliefs of the Catholic Church in certain very significant areas. Lutherans are closer to Catholics than, say, Presbyterians are, but they are not Catholic. A rejection of transubstantiation and the mass, and an emphasis on sola fide sola gratia are the crucial doctrines that mark a church or a person as Protestant rather than Catholic. Lutheranism rejects the mass, and its doctrine of consubstantiation is quite different from transubstantiation. And although it places a higher value on baptism than other Protestant denominations, Lutheranism emphasizes a salvation by grace through faith.


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