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Jacknch 12-20-2017 10:35 AM

The British Royal Family: Race & Racism
 
In light of recent discussion and inspite of our reservations,
this thread has been created in order to discuss the issue of race and racism and the British Royal Family.

However, this thread will be moderated carefully and the following rules will apply to the thread without exception:

1) Posts deemed to be of a racist/prejudiced nature or could be construde as being racist/prejudiced will be removed without notice.
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3) Accusations of racism against any member of the forum, journalists/reporters or other entities outside of the forum will be removed - members are requested to report any posts they take issue with rather than responding to them within the thread.
4) Disrespectful posts made accusing other posters of being a part of "the PC brigade", "snowflakes", "SJWs", etc will be removed.
5) Members are reminded to be respectful of one another and to pay particular attention to the sensitivity of the subject.

Failure to comply with the above may result in membership being suspended, and with further violation of the rules resulting in a possible ban.

Please be aware that in the event the Moderation Team feel this thread has outlived its usefulness or that the discussion cannot continue,
the thread will be closed and not reopened.

ACO 12-20-2017 08:11 PM

So thoughts on Princess Michael of Kent wearing a Moor broach to the lunch knowing she would be meeting Meghan the first time. Seems a bit insensitive, no? Oh well.

Osipi 12-20-2017 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ACO (Post 2054120)
So thoughts on Princess Michael of Kent wearing a Moor broach to the lunch knowing she would be meeting Meghan the first time. Seems a bit insensitive, no? Oh well.

Can you be more specific? I've no clue what a Moor brooch is and what its relation to Meghan may be.

ACO 12-20-2017 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osipi (Post 2054122)
Can you be more specific? I've no clue what a Moor brooch is and what its relation to Meghan may be.

They are somewhat controversial and many deem racist figurines. It is a big debate about them. Just was surprised to see her having one on her coat knowing Meghan who is half black was in attendance. Kind of threw me but also didn't knowing her reputation.

JR76 12-20-2017 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osipi (Post 2054122)
Can you be more specific? I've no clue what a Moor brooch is and what its relation to Meghan may be.

Moor is an old name for dark skinned North Africans. Think of the Moors that ruled Spain who was often of Berber extraction ie not Arabs.

cepe 12-20-2017 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ACO (Post 2054135)
They are somewhat controversial and many deem racist figurines. It is a big debate about them. Just was surprised to see her having one on her coat knowing Meghan who is half black was in attendance. Kind of threw me but also didn't knowing her reputation.

I agree with OSipi, I just cannot see the link and this tweet makes it even less clear.

The only "Moors" that I know of are North African Arabs whose extensive empire included Spain ( 711).

And I cant see a connection there at all.

Gaudete 12-20-2017 09:20 PM

People will try to find unpleasantness in everything it seems. Even a brooch.

TLLK 12-20-2017 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ACO (Post 2054135)
They are somewhat controversial and many deem racist figurines. It is a big debate about them. Just was surprised to see her having one on her coat knowing Meghan who is half black was in attendance. Kind of threw me but also didn't knowing her reputation.

Actually I was wondering if it represents one of the Magi aka The Three Kings and therefore would be appropriate for Christmas. Balthazar is traditionally depicted as being of African origin. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balthazar_(Magus)

ACO 12-20-2017 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR76 (Post 2054136)
Moor is an old name for dark skinned North Africans. Think of the Moors that ruled Spain who was often of Berber extraction ie not Arabs.

Yeah. I don't want a big debate about it so I will bow out. If definitely rubbed me the wrong way though. It is what it is. I can see how others not bothered by it though. I have a different history with it.

Gaudete 12-20-2017 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TLLK (Post 2054140)
Actually I was wondering if it represents one of the Magai aka The Three Kings and therefore would be appropriate for Christmas.


This seems more likely IMO.

I have to say however on the OP, the suggestion that Princess Michael would have chosen jewellery specifically to make a nasty racial slur against someone is not only unlikely as it is unfair. I’m not sure what’s meant by “her reputation” but I absolutely do not believe for one minute that Her Royal Highness would have gone to such great lengths to make a statement I don’t believe is in her nature to make.

cepe 12-20-2017 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaudete (Post 2054143)
This seems more likely IMO.

I have to say however on the OP, the suggestion that Princess Michael would have chosen jewellery specifically to make a nasty racial slur against someone is not only unlikely as it is unfair. I’m not sure what’s meant by “her reputation” but I absolutely do not believe for one minute that Her Royal Highness would have gone to such great lengths to make a statement I don’t believe is in her nature to make.

Well said. I don't think she would do that either.

Curbside 12-20-2017 09:54 PM

I looked for a photo, but didn't see one. It seems like the family has been pretty accepting, so I would hope no one is engaging in racist gestures towards Meghan (and by extension, Harry).

ACO 12-20-2017 10:09 PM

Well some media has picked up on it. Below is an example. Maybe it is just a misunderstanding. Either way I think the luncheon was a success.

https://twitter.com/MonarchyUK/statu...61856895504389

Osipi 12-20-2017 10:13 PM

I know who the Moors are as a people but, not knowing jewelry well, I thought perhaps Moor could have been a designer or something.

I don't think anything can really be read into Princess Michael wearing it. There are many explanations possible along with the fact that PM may have just really liked the brooch. If anything, I think Meghan would have found it to be interesting.

I also wouldn't put any real money behind the belief that this Christmas lunch would have been the first time Meghan met Princess Michael. They both live on KP grounds and could have already met. Harry did say that she's met quite a few members of his family already.

And so ends a tempest in a teapot. Now I need to make me some real tea. :biggrin:

CrownPrincessJava 12-20-2017 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ACO (Post 2054157)
Well some media has picked up on it. Below is an example. Maybe it is just a misunderstanding. Either way I think the luncheon was a success.

https://twitter.com/MonarchyUK/statu...61856895504389

Hmmmm....Princess Michael is well-known for being antagonistic and likes to stir...:whistling::whistling::whistling::whistling::whistling:

Zaira 12-20-2017 10:18 PM

I agree with ACO. When I saw that picture with the brooch (before I saw any commentary on it) I literally gasped and was shocked no one had brought it up.

I can't imagine I am the only POC who saw that and immediately thought of the racial undertones.

JR76 12-20-2017 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ACO (Post 2054142)
Yeah. I don't want a big debate about it so I will bow out. If definitely rubbed me the wrong way though. It is what it is. I can see how others not bothered by it though. I have a different history with it.

Given that the Moors are often depicted with distinct African features I can definitely see why it bothers you. Meghan or not it's not something that's entirely correct in my opinion. That said I'm sure Marie-Christine wasn't wearing it to make a dig at Meghan. She might hold controversial opinions at times but I don't think she's rascist.

Osipi 12-20-2017 10:28 PM

Marie Christine could also have selected and worn the brooch in *honor* of Meghan's biracial heritage. To me this seems so much more likely than a person deliberately purchasing/or having a brooch just for the prime purpose of offending people let alone a future family member at the Queen's luncheon.

We all wear things we like that represent ourselves sometimes. Election time you wear a button supporting your candidate. Christmas time you wear your best holiday ugly sweater or a Christmas tree brooch. Royals on tour wear things that reflect the country they're visiting.

People will make out of it what they wish to though. Its the way of the world.

jacqui24 12-20-2017 10:30 PM

Yea, Meghan and her possible feelings on this aside, that’s just not a good move as a member of the royal family, even a distant one.

Zaira 12-20-2017 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osipi (Post 2054164)
Marie Christine could also have selected and worn the brooch in *honor* of Meghan's biracial heritage. To me this seems so much more likely than a person deliberately purchasing/or having a brooch just for the prime purpose of offending people let alone a future family member at the Queen's luncheon.

People will make out of it what they wish to though. Its the way of the world.

Are you kidding me? The racist origins of these kinds of pieces is extremely well known. :bang: There is nothing "honoring" about them. I am going to go out an say it, whether or not this was intentional, it was certainly ignorant and still offensive. This is not something you wear to honor a POC of black ancestry.

I can already tell this is a thread I will need to bow out of.


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