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zehra.gurler 01-22-2012 06:33 AM

Suitors and possible matches for the daughters of Nicholas II
 
If this has been discussed already you may link me to the discussion and delete this thread. If not I wondered who were serious contenders for Olga's hand in marriage?

Marc23 01-22-2012 10:20 AM

She was linked with Grand Duke Dmitri Pavlovich,but nothing came of it due to his dislike for Rasputin...she was further linked with Prince Carol of Romania,but both of them didn't like each other...She was linked with future Edward VIII and also with future King Alexander of Yugoslavia,who,according to Nicholas II's observations,paid most attention to her sister Tatiana.Marriage negotiations ended due to the outbreak of World War I,but Tatiana still managed to exchange some letters with him...

Apart from that Olga had a crush on several officers but that kind of marriage was impossible.One of them was Pavel Voronov,who married later Countess Olga Kleinmichel,lady in waiting at the Court...

The other was was Dmitri Chakh-Bagov,a wounded soldier she cared for when she was a Red Cross nurse.There was also an officer named Volodia Volkomski,who,according to Empress Alexandra "always has a smile or two for her"...

Vasillisos Markos 01-22-2012 11:30 PM

From what I have read, both Empress Alexandra and Queen Marie (perhaps she was still the Crown Princess then) of Rumania both decided that they would not force their children into a match but would let nature take its course. It makes one wonder if such a marriage had occurred prior to the outbreak of war, would Olga's descendants be alive today?

fandesacs2003 01-23-2012 05:00 AM

I read somewhere that Tzarine Alix was not really willing to be separated from her daughters, and this was the reason she did not really favoured anyone of the mach proposals, as they were not few, at least for the two older girls.
At the moment of the revolution, Olga was 22 and Tatiana 20. At this age, they should have been married. But Tzarina pretended not to accept non christian-othodox pretenders. The orthodox princes of a similar level than an Imperial Grand-Duchess, were only Crownprinces on Balcans (Romania, Serbia), but they were fresh royalties, and considered too far from her "civilized world".
It is very sad, because if she was less hysterical, at least the two girls would have survived!!

Marc23 01-23-2012 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fandesacs2003 (Post 1362163)
I read somewhere that Tzarine Alix was not really willing to be separated from her daughters, and this was the reason she did not really favoured anyone of the mach proposals, as they were not few, at least for the two older girls.

Yet she wanted a foreign Prince for her daughters...when Tatiana's first crush Dmitri Malama visited them on March 17,1916 Alexandra wrote to Nicholas II:""My little Malama came for an hour yesterday evening...Looks flourishing more of a man now, an adorable boy still. I must say a perfect son in law he w(ou)ld have been – why are foreign P(rin)ces not as nice?"

zehra.gurler 01-23-2012 10:45 AM

Hmmmmm that's odd. Yet another addition to the list of Alexandra's incompetences as an Empress. Seems she didn't put much thought or effort into seeking a good match for her daughters. Not as much as their great grandmother's Queen Louise and Queen Victoria.

AristoCat 01-23-2012 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marc23 (Post 1362217)
Yet she wanted a foreign Prince for her daughters...when Tatiana's first crush Dmitri Malama visited them on March 17,1916 Alexandra wrote to Nicholas II:""My little Malama came for an hour yesterday evening...Looks flourishing more of a man now, an adorable boy still. I must say a perfect son in law he w(ou)ld have been why are foreign P(rin)ces not as nice?"

I don't think Alexandra wanted her daughters to marry, she kept them in an immature state and stunted their emotional and psychological growth. For the life of me, go figure, she really really knew how to mess a lot of things up.

Supposedly Grand Duchess Vladimir wanted her son Boris matched with Olga, but Alexandra was horrified at the thought, mainly because of the 'fast' set that Boris lived his life in.

fandesacs2003 01-23-2012 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AristoCat (Post 1362273)
I don't think Alexandra wanted her daughters to marry, she kept them in an immature state and stunted their emotional and psychological growth. For the life of me, go figure, she really really knew how to mess a lot of things up.

I have exactly the same opinion. She was abnormaly bound to her kids....

Marc23 01-23-2012 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AristoCat (Post 1362273)
I don't think Alexandra wanted her daughters to marry, she kept them in an immature state and stunted their emotional and psychological growth.

True,I agree to that,but the fact that she,in a letter to Nicholas II,regretted that there are no foreign Princes like the officer Malama admitted that she hoped to marry OTMA one day to some of them...

AristoCat 01-23-2012 04:14 PM

I understand that, but Alix really wasn't letting herself think realistically about it. She was happy with Nicholas, but I don't think Alix really, really would have been willing to let go. Alexandra on one hand wanted them to be happy, but wanted them to make 'worthy' matches as well, which si just an excuse to keep them cloistered and stunted.

zehra.gurler 01-24-2012 04:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AristoCat

I don't think Alexandra wanted her daughters to marry, she kept them in an immature state and stunted their emotional and psychological growth. For the life of me, go figure, she really really knew how to mess a lot of things up.

Supposedly Grand Duchess Vladimir wanted her son Boris matched with Olga, but Alexandra was horrified at the thought, mainly because of the 'fast' set that Boris lived his life in.

Not to mention the odd tension between Grand Duchess Maria Pavlovna and Alexandra. I'm sure that put her off Boris.

zehra.gurler 01-24-2012 04:15 AM

Quiet surprised that at 22 G. D Olga didn't have more serious suitors besides the rumoured intentions and suggestions.

Daria_S 01-24-2012 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zehra.gurler (Post 1362507)
Quiet surprised that at 22 G. D Olga didn't have more serious suitors besides the rumoured intentions and suggestions.

I'm not too shocked at this, because Olga grew up isolated from her peers. Her parents (mother specifically) didn't encourage her or their other children to develop friendships or relationships outside of the immediate family circle. Olga was a very intelligent individual, but even those who are intelligent, if not given the proper opportunities to socialize and grow will end up being alone. It's sad that these children were not allowed to reach their full potential, and not just by their parents, but by their untimely deaths.

AristoCat 01-24-2012 08:44 PM

I just wonder, if Olga would have been allowed at all. Alexandra was in a lot of ways a fatalist and I don't think that she would have found anyone good enough, beyond just being a mother. She was keeping them under such a tight rein and I am sure that she never would have let them marry, except under a howl of protest. Nicholas was so passive that it's no wonder that none of them had the ability to really get lives of their own beyond their mother's problems and Alexei's problems. I always wondered why Alexandra was so determined to cut them off the way she was.

NGalitzine 01-24-2012 09:19 PM

Its not like there was a lot of opportunity for them to marry prior to WWI. They were still young, not exactly over the hill. Carol of Roumania was not exactly a good bet as a husband and Boris of Russia as well as being a close relative did not have the best of reputations as far as women were concerned.

XeniaCasaraghi 01-24-2012 11:19 PM

Olga and Tatiana were quite old to still be unmarried and having no prospects. I believe it was Olga who stated that she never wanted to leave Russia; wouldn't that have been a hard hurdle to finding a husband of a Emperor's daughter within the boundaries of Russia? I assume that the only suitable candidates would have had to have been within her own family.
Taking into consideration that there was fear that Alexie would not live long, Nicholas should have married his older daughters off (Victoria had her married by 18) and seen if one of them had a son who could succeed him if Alexie indeed died.
Alexandra did stifle her children and their development and kept them emotionally and socially immature; but Nicholas allowed her to isolate them and himself from his family and the outside world.
BTW could you imagine what kind of Mother-in-law Alexandra would be?

NGalitzine 01-25-2012 12:18 AM

No son of Nicholas's daughters could have succeeded but for the extinction of the male line of the Romanoff family. Olga and Tatiana were only 19 & 17 when WWI began in 1914 which hardly made them old maids in that time period.

XeniaCasaraghi 01-25-2012 12:52 AM

I forgot the line doesn't go through the females.
As has been stated before, royal brides were married by 18 and prospects were mentioned long before that. With Olga and Tatiana there was no talk and Olga should have been married by at least 18. But by the time they died they were more akin to a 16yr old as opposed to being in their early 20s.

AristoCat 01-25-2012 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XeniaCasaraghi (Post 1363034)
Olga and Tatiana were quite old to still be unmarried and having no prospects. I believe it was Olga who stated that she never wanted to leave Russia; wouldn't that have been a hard hurdle to finding a husband of a Emperor's daughter within the boundaries of Russia? I assume that the only suitable candidates would have had to have been within her own family.
Taking into consideration that there was fear that Alexie would not live long, Nicholas should have married his older daughters off (Victoria had her married by 18) and seen if one of them had a son who could succeed him if Alexie indeed died.
Alexandra did stifle her children and their development and kept them emotionally and socially immature; but Nicholas allowed her to isolate them and himself from his family and the outside world.
BTW could you imagine what kind of Mother-in-law Alexandra would be?

I think Alexandra would have been a horrible mother-in-law, mainly because she would have been miserable with a daughter married and she would never have found a prince 'nice enough,' but couldn't view any of the Russian aristocracy with favor, mainly since she viewed the entire aristocracy as corrupt and without any semblence of decency. I am sure that with all the princes there, that someone appropriate owuld have been found, but in the end, then I am sure that no one would have been good enough. Since Olga didn't want to leave Russia, who knows how things would have ended up. It was a quandry, mainly since there were the Pauline Laws and again, Nicholas was shirking his job as a father to see his kids grow up healthy and shirking his job as Emperor to ensure the continuation of the line. In 1914 and 1916 the girls should have been finding husbands and ended up securing the line. Usually at sixteen Romanov girls married and had kids of thier own and there was no shortage of princes that would have made fine husbands.

So, a commoner wouldn't be good enough, but a prince wouldn't be nice enough, so it was a no-win situation with anyone.

XeniaCasaraghi 01-25-2012 09:40 PM

There is also the mystery of which daughter was a carrier; I wonder if danger of passing on the disease ever occured to Nicholas and Alexandra? There was a zone of silence when it came to Alix getting married and she appeared to be in denial that she was possibly a carrier.


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