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Chris77 04-12-2011 03:05 PM

Hever Castle
 
I know it isn't used as Royal Palace anymore. But has anyone been there? I've been dying to go but it'll be quite some time before I can get over to England.

scooter 04-12-2011 08:54 PM

Yes, it's great fun historic house wise and garden wise. Did you know you can stay there now? www.heverhotel.com

Chris77 04-13-2011 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scooter (Post 1231143)
Yes, it's great fun historic house wise and garden wise. Did you know you can stay there now? www.heverhotel.com

Yes, I know you can stay there now. I'm so hoping to get to England sometime soon.

Do you have any pictures of the interior? I've found a bunch on google but was interested in a better picture of Anne Boleyn's bedroom The only thing the internet shows is her bed frame.

I really enjoyed seeing Henry VIII's room!

HM Queen Catherine 04-13-2011 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris77 (Post 1230986)
I know it isn't used as Royal Palace anymore. But has anyone been there? I've been dying to go but it'll be quite some time before I can get over to England.

Hever Castle has never really been used as a royal palace.. at least not in the same sense as Windsor or Hampton Court or Whitehall.

Yes, Henry VIII stayed there at least once (probably several times) and he did acquire ownership of it in 1539. But he gave it to Anne of Cleves in 1540 as part of their annulment.

The castle itself was the home of the Boleyn family from 1462. It was where Thomas Boleyn, his wife Elizabeth and their children lived, and was the childhood home of Queen Anne.

When Thomas Boleyn died in 1539, Henry took possession of Hever, as Thomas had no surviving son to inherit. But his ownership was short-lived and Anne of Cleves owned the house thereafter.

I would not classify Hever as a royal residence, although it is of interest as the home of Anne Boleyn.

Zonk 04-13-2011 02:35 PM

Interesting that Harry would take possession of it when Mary had two children (and a son at that) and Anne had Elizabeth. So there was some legacy.

HM Queen Catherine 04-13-2011 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zonk (Post 1231585)
Interesting that Harry would take possession of it when Mary had two children (and a son at that) and Anne had Elizabeth. So there was some legacy.

Yes, that is a little odd.. makes me wonder if the estate was entailed to the Earldom of Wiltshire when the title was created for Thomas Boleyn.

Thomas would have no reason NOT to entail it to the title at the time, because he had a son and every reason to believe that George would produce an heir.

But of course, after George was executed he had no male heir.. if the estate was entailed, it would explain why Hever reverted to Henry when Thomas died.

Obviously, a grandson through his daughter would not qualify to inherit the earldom of Wiltshire without a special remainder - nor would any entailed property.

So Henry gave it to Anne of Cleves when their marriage was annulled.

Unfortunately, Anne died in 1557, during the reign of Queen Mary, who had appointed Commissioners to sell any land the Crown had seized. As Anne of Cleves had no heirs, that included Hever Castle. One of the commissioners was Sir Edward Waldegrave, a Catholic and member of a favored family of Mary's.

Edward assigned Hever Castle to himself, without objection, so by the time Elizabeth came to the throne the estate had been in the Waldegrave family for several years.

Elizabeth did deprive Edward and his son Charles of all their appointments, and it is said that Charles Waldegrave retired to Hever. The Waldegraves owned it for more than a hundred years.

Vasillisos Markos 04-13-2011 10:26 PM

Could Henry seize it in right of his late wife? I seem to recall reading that somewhere and it is rather cheeky, considering Henry was the cause of Anne being "late." But royalty does have its privileges. Still, it doesn't explain why it did not go to Mary if she was the elder of the sisters, because women did inherit at that time. She just could not inherit the earldoms without special leave.

Chris77 04-14-2011 02:16 PM

:previous: Yes, I thought that Henry could seize it as well. Wasn't he entitled to the lands of those whom he had executed anyway? I thought I remember hearing that somewhere.

I know Hever Castle isn't classified as a Royal Palace but I wasn't sure where to post this. :unsure: Since Henry VIII did own it at one time, I just stuck the thread here. And Anne Boleyn is of enormous interest to me.

William Waldorf Astor did a magnificent job restoring the castle! I would have loved to have seen it in its various stages throughout the years.

HM Queen Catherine 04-14-2011 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vasillisos Markos (Post 1231770)
Could Henry seize it in right of his late wife? I seem to recall reading that somewhere and it is rather cheeky, considering Henry was the cause of Anne being "late." But royalty does have its privileges. Still, it doesn't explain why it did not go to Mary if she was the elder of the sisters, because women did inherit at that time. She just could not inherit the earldoms without special leave.

I doubt Henry could actually seize it in right of Anne. She was not the eldest daughter in any case, as demonstrated by Henry Carey's claim to the earldom of Wiltshire.

An entail is an estate of inheritance in real property, however, which cannot be sold, devised by will, or otherwise be disposed of by the owner. Entailed property must pass by law to the owner's heirs upon his death.

If the letters patent creating the earldom of Wiltshire for Thomas Boleyn included the phrase "lawful sons of his body" or something similar, then I can see why the title and any entailed property were not immediately conferred on Henry Carey.

If there were no special remainder allowing Thomas' grandson through female offspring to inherit, then his title and entailed lands would revert to the crown upon his death.

This is the most logical way that Henry VIII could have acquired Hever Castle, but he very well could have seized it just because he wanted it.. and as an absolute monarch I have no doubt it was within his power to do so.

And for Chris 77 - Henry VIII never executed Thomas Boleyn - just his daughter Queen Anne, and his son and heir George, Viscount Rochford. So the earldom of Wiltshire and the lands of Thomas Boleyn could not have been in the legal entitlement of the king, unless they reverted to the Crown when Thomas died without a male heir.

Vasillisos Markos 04-14-2011 09:33 PM

We must assume the property was entailed because if not, then Mary would have the superior claim and Henry VIII (unless acting as an absolute monarch) could not have taken it in right of Anne.

windsorbrides1 04-15-2011 02:01 AM

Actually, because Anne was tried and put to death for treason, and because Thomas Bolelyn would have been named as a co-conspirator because he didn't tell Henry if he knew about Anne cheating, then the estate would have immediately been taken from Thomas and given to the Crown, as part of his punishment. Of course, now no one believes that she did cheat, but that's beside the point.

HM Queen Catherine 04-15-2011 06:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by windsorbrides1 (Post 1232974)
Actually, because Anne was tried and put to death for treason, and because Thomas Bolelyn would have been named as a co-conspirator because he didn't tell Henry if he knew about Anne cheating, then the estate would have immediately been taken from Thomas and given to the Crown, as part of his punishment. Of course, now no one believes that she did cheat, but that's beside the point.

Thomas Boleyn was never named as a co-conspirator in the fall of his daughter, Anne.

On the 24th April 1536, two commissions of oyer and terminer were set up to investigate treason and Thomas Boleyn was one of the commissioners. He didn't know at the time, but was shortly to learn, that the four men being investigated were accused of adultery with his own daughter.

The fact is, Thomas Boleyn never lifted a finger to help Queen Anne or George, Viscount Rochford. He acquiesced to their executions without ever asking the king for mercy for either of them. To give him the benefit of the doubt, however, it can be said that he would have known nothing could sway Henry or his court over the fate of Anne or George.. and we now know that the charges against them were false.. perhaps Thomas knew it then. But he would have also known that nothing could stop Henry's will either.

Though his family was disgraced by the whole affair, and most likely his marriage to Elizabeth suffered in the process, Thomas himself blended into the background, but he never gave up trying to get back into the king's good graces.

He was active in suppressing the Pilgrimage of Grace in 1536, and he was present for the christening of Prince Edward (later Edward VI) in 1537. And by 1538, he was properly back at Court.

When he died in 1539, the fact that Henry VIII ordered masses to be said for his soul clearly shows that he was back in the king's favor.

And unlike his son and daughter, Thomas has an impressive monument at St. Peter's Church, Hever, Kent.

Chris77 04-15-2011 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HM Queen Catherine (Post 1232880)
And for Chris 77 - Henry VIII never executed Thomas Boleyn - just his daughter Queen Anne, and his son and heir George, Viscount Rochford. So the earldom of Wiltshire and the lands of Thomas Boleyn could not have been in the legal entitlement of the king, unless they reverted to the Crown when Thomas died without a male heir.

Thanks! I know Thomas Boleyn wasn't executed by Henry. I just had it all confused because I thought since he executed Anne, that he would be entitled to all of her family's property. Kind of confusing!

KittyAtlanta 04-15-2011 02:56 PM

Henry VIII also executed her brother, George. However, there was no bad blood between the King and Thomas Bullen. Bullen??? Yep, that was their name. Anne was the one who frenchied it up and it stuck.

Thomas Bullen supported Henry VIII throughout his reign.

Chris77 04-15-2011 09:34 PM

Has anyone recently visited Hever and have pictures they'd like to share?

I saw an episode of Most Haunted on Youtube featuring Hever Castle. It was so fascinating! I love ghost hunts. :rofl: Has anyone experienced anything paranormal while there?

KristineML 06-05-2011 09:02 PM

I visited Hever in 1983 when it was still owned by the Astor family. It was for sale at the time and my dad and my cousins and I walked around the house and grounds with a little fantasy plan of buying the house and turning it into an inn and banquet facility. A few months after we got home, we found out it had been sold and the new owners were going to turn it into a hotel and conference centre.

HM Queen Catherine 08-27-2011 11:15 AM

New information on Hever Castle and why it was in the possession of Henry VIII.

At the death of Thomas Boleyn, 1st Earl of Wiltshire, he was a large landowner and held many properties.. but he had no male heir. His estate was divided between his two remaining heirs - his daughter Mary Boleyn (then married to William Stafford), and the Lady Elizabeth (daughter of Anne and Henry VIII).

His properties were essentially divided accordingly, but after Anne Boleyn's execution an Act of Attainder was passed against her in June 1536, meaning any property she possessed reverted to the Crown. This also meant that Elizabeth, her daughter, had been declared illegitimate and therefore could not inherit.

So any division of her father's estate which would have been hers by inheritance reverted immediately to the Crown under the terms of the Act of Attainder. The portion that reverted to the Crown included Hever Castle, Seal and Blickling Hall.

And since those properties were claimed under the attainder, then Henry VIII became the rightful owner.

Blickling was transferred by Act of Parliament to Jane, Lady Rochford, after her father-in-law's death.. since it had once been the property of her husband George. It was apparently given with its revenues for the maintenance of his widow. When she was executed in 1542, it was either sold or transferred to the Clere family.

As for Hever Castle, we know Henry VIII bestowed it on Anne of Cleves in 1540 as part of her settlement after their marriage was annulled.

EchoLynn 08-27-2011 11:32 AM

Quote:

Blickling was transferred by Act of Parliament to Jane, Lady Rochford, after her father-in-law's death.. since it had once been the property of her husband George. It was apparently given with its revenues for the maintenance of his widow. When she was executed in 1542, it was either sold or transferred to the Clere family.
Do you mean that Lady Rochford was executed? If so why? I had never heard of this...

Duchessmary 08-27-2011 11:35 AM

Lady Rochford stayed on at Court and later served Catherine Howard. She was involved in the scandal surrounding the Queen and executed. :ermm:

HM Queen Catherine 08-28-2011 09:22 AM

Her name was Jane Parker, and she was the wife of George Boleyn, Viscount Rochford. Not only did she testify against him, helping to send him to the block, but she also aided in Catherine Howard's affair.

When Henry VIII found out that Jane helped his wife cheat on him, he had her tried and executed in 1542.

Personally, I have never understood what motivated her in any of it. Henry VIII had been generous to Jane Parker in her widowhood - providing for her maintenance and even forcing Thomas Boleyn to give her financial support - not to mention keeping her at court. Encouraging the Queen to cuckhold her husband was really biting the hand that fed her.


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