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CharlotteAmalia 01-20-2011 10:18 AM

Prince William's Suitability to be King
 
I was wondering if William is suitable to be a King one day.

Just an imagination: The Queen dies in 2020. Charles will be King then as George VII. 2030 Charles/George VII. dies and William (V.) will become King.

Is he suitable for this "job"?
What particular instance has helped you to form your opinion regarding William or Harry ?
Do you think that his or their education and experience thus far has helped learn what he/they must do as king?

What i expect from a future King:

- a degree in Law, Economics or Politics
- a year or more at an university abroad. For example if you did a LLB in UK, then a Master degree in Politics abroad.
- English and two other languages fluent.
- a internship in two ministries (foreign affairs and something else)
- some military training


I do not want to offend anyone, but i always had a problem with William's poor education.
I have the feeling that he is far too much focused on the military training. He is a Lieutenant in the Household Cavalry and a search and rescue Pilot in the Royal Air Force.

William had been to university. He has a degree in Geography ( 2:1) and has studied history of art before at St Andrews University. But from somebody who might be King in some years, i would expect more - especially a better academic training in law (constitutional law) and politics.

I do not know what languages are spoken by William. I guess he speaks some French and Spanish, but is not fluent in one of them. But a king should be as good as any diplomat. They (at least the german ones) need to speak German, English and another UN-language (French for example) at a very high level/fluent.

He has not been abroad a lot. I would imagine a degree in France (Good for languages abilities and academic degree) or a internship at the UN. He did a gap year in which he visited Chile, Belize, worked on British dairy farms and visited countries in Africa and some other official or charity visites abroad. This is not the international academic career I would expect.




Just to show the difference to other princes close to the throne:

Haakon of Norway:
In 1995 he graduated from the Royal Norwegian Naval Academy in Bergen. In autumn 1996 he moved to the USA to study at the University of California at Berkeley, and received his BA in political science in spring 1999. The following autumn the Crown Prince was a member of Norway’s third delegation to the UN General Assembly. In 2001 he followed the Foreign Ministry’s trainee programme for diplomats, and completed his education in 2003 at the London School of Economics and Political Science, where he was awarded an MA in development studies, specializing in international trade and Africa.
He speaks Norwegian, English, German (just a bit). I don't know if he speaks more languages.

Victoria of Sweden: (from Wikipedia)
She next studied for a year (1996/97) at the Université Catholique de l'Ouest at Angers in France, and in the fall term of 1997 participated in a special program following the work of the Parliament of Sweden. During the years 1998 to 2000, Victoria resided in the United States, where she studied various subjects at Yale University, New Haven, Connecticut.

In May 1999 she was an intern at the Swedish Embassy in Washington D.C. In 2000, she studied conflict resolution and international peacekeeping at the Swedish National Defence College (Försvarshögskolan). Victoria followed the Swedish presidency of the European Union and completed a study program at the Government Offices (Rosenbad) in 2001.

During spring semester 2002, Victoria completed a study program with the Swedish International Development Cooperation Agency (Sida), and in June and September was an intern at the United Nations in New York; in the fall she was an intern at the Swedish Trade Council's offices in Berlin and Paris. In 2003, Victoria's education continued with visits to Swedish businesses, a study and intern program in agriculture and forestry, as well as completion of the basic soldier training at SWEDINT (the Swedish Armed Forces International Centre).

In 2004, Victoria continued with visits to Swedish businesses, and that fall she continued with courses in political science, international relations and conflict resolution at the Swedish National Defence College. In 2005, she continued with private tutored studies in society-related subjects as well as some courses at the University of Stockholm.
In 2006, Victoria enrolled in the Ministry for Foreign Affairs' Diplomat Program, running from September 2006 to June 2007. The program is a training program for young future diplomats and gives an insight to the ministry's work, Swedish foreign and security policies and Sweden's relations with the rest of the world. The education entails lectures, seminars, group work and visits to authorities and institutions. In 2007, Victoria studied French privately and held an internship at the Permanent Representation of Sweden to the European Union. In June 2009, she graduated with a Bachelor of Arts degree from Uppsala University

She speaks Swedish, German, English and French.

She did a basic military training.

Frederik of Denmark:

In 1989, the crown prince began to study for an academic degree, when he began a course in Political Science at University of Aarhus. This included a year at Harvard University (1992–1993) under the name of Frederik Henriksen, studying political science. He then took up a position for three months with the Danish UN mission in New York in 1994. In 1995 Crown Prince Frederik obtained his MA degree in Political Science from University of Aarhus. He completed the course in the prescribed number of years with an exam result above average. His final paper was an analysis on the foreign policy of the Baltic States. And he visited these countries several times during his studies.[1][2] The Crown Prince was posted as First Secretary to the Danish Embassy in Paris from October 1998 to October 1999.

He has completed extensive military studies and training in all three services, notably completing education as a sailor in the naval elite special operations forces (members of this are known as frogmen or frømænd in Danish). His frogman nickname is "Pingo".[3]

In the period 2001 and 2002, the Crown Prince completed further training for leaders at the Royal Danish Defence College. Crown Prince Frederik remains active in the defence, and in the period 2002–2003 served as a staff officer at Defence Command Denmark, and from 2003 as a senior lecturer with the Institute of Strategy at the Royal Danish Defence College.

The Crown Prince’s mother tongue is Danish. In addition, Crown Prince Frederik speaks French, English and German.

Willem of Orange-Nassau:

After high school he performed military service in the Royal Netherlands Navy from August 1985 to January 1987. He received his training at the Royal Netherlands Naval College and the frigates HNLMS Tromp and HNLMS Abraham Crijnssen, where he was an ensign. In 1988, he received additional training at the ship HNLMS Van Kinsbergen and became a lieutenant (junior grade).[6]

From 1987, Prince Willem-Alexander studied history at Leiden UniversityFrance's decision under President Charles de Gaulle to leave NATO's integrated command structure.[1] and received his academic degree in 1993. His final dissertation was on the Dutch response to

He went on to study government and the constitutional system, and visited ministries and the High Councils of State to learn how central government and other authorities function. He also visited the European institutions. He then completed an introductory programme with the Dutch business community.

He speaks Dutch, German, English fluently. I do not know if he speaks other languages.

Philippe of Belgium:

Prince Philippe was educated at the Belgian Royal Military School. From 1978 to 1981 he continued his education at Oxford University's Trinity College and finally attended Graduate School at Stanford University, California where he graduated in 1985 with an MA degree in Political Science.

He was appointed as a Second Lieutenant in 1980 and obtained his fighter pilot's wings and his certificates as a parachutist and a commando. In 1989, the Prince attended a series of special sessions at the Royal Higher Defence Institute. The same year, he was promoted to Colonel. On 25 March 2001, the Prince was appointed to the rank of Major-General in the Land Component and the Air Component and to the rank of Rear-Admiral in the Naval Component.

Prince Philippe has headed more than forty important economic missions


He speaks French, Dutch and English fluently. Might be German and italian as well, but not sure.

CharlotteAmalia 01-20-2011 10:19 AM

Felipe of Spain:
Felipe attended high school at Lakefield College School in Ontario, Canada,

From September 1985 to July 1988, His Royal Highness trained at the General Military Academy in Zaragoza, the Naval School in Marin and the General Academy of the Air Force in San Javier, and in July 1989 received despatches as Infantry Lieutenant, Sub-Lieutenant and Lieutenant of the Air Arm.

From October 1988 to June 1993, he studied at the Autonomous University of Madrid and graduated with a degree in Law. He also studied a number of subjects from the Economics syllabus in order to round off his training in that area.

In September 1993, he enrolled for a Master's degree in International Relations at the Edmund Walsh School of Foreign Service at the University of Georgetown (Washington DC), graduating on 26 May 1995.

The ranks he holds in the Spanish Armed Forces today are those of Lieutenant Colonel of the General Land Army Corps (Infantry), Commander in the General Navy and Wing Commander of the General Air Force. He is also a helicopter pilot, qualified for instrument flight in Air Force Squadron 402. He has his Helicopter Pilot's Wings for both the Land Army and the Navy.

From September 1999 to June 2000, he attended a refresher course in Security and Defence.
Felipe speaks Spanish, Catalan, French, English and some Greek

Sonjapearl 01-20-2011 10:53 AM

While I agree that William's choice of a degree was odd and should've studied political science instead, I really think time will tell if he's ready to be King.

He won't inherit the throne for another 30 years. He's got plenty of time for the training. All the other heirs you mentioned were all first in line to the throne.

Sherlock221B 01-20-2011 11:19 AM

Interesting...but William will not just be king of the United Kingdom but of 15 of other realms. That's a lot of economies and a lot of politics to study...embassies and UN delegations to intern with...not including the languages and customs of each realm. Quite a lot to just familiarize oneself with let alone seek a diploma of academic study.

CharlotteAmalia 01-20-2011 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sonjapearl (Post 1195031)
While I agree that William's choice of a degree was odd and should've studied political science instead, I really think time will tell if he's ready to be King.

He won't inherit the throne for another 30 years. He's got plenty of time for the training. All the other heirs you mentioned were all first in line to the throne.

yes, your are right, they are even more close to the throne. But it is a question to everybody when you are done with school (A-levels or what ever), how to achieve your goals or your mission. So i do not see a big difference between the crown princes and william.

Charles didn't (or at least not officially) improve his law, politics or diplomatic education after he finished his history degree and his military service. In 1977 Charles finished every kind of education. Since then he is involved in charities and state visits. Charles has a "profile" now, because he focuses on organic food, enviromental issues and architecture. Also his hobbies are special, like the painting and theatre or gardening.

I do not believe William will start an internship with the UN, a MBA-degree in Paris or a diplomatic training, once he is done with his military service. He is married then and has a child perhaps. I think he will always try to live a low-profile life. That is why they (W and C) are staying in Wales the next years. I have the fear, that william will stay without a proper interest (like Charles organic food and environmental issues, Willem Alexander's water management). Some people are calling William "boring" and i fear he could be some kind of "empty shell".



----------------------
(Haakon, born 1973, crown prince since 1991 (aged 17),
Victoria, born 1977, crown princess since 1980 (aged 2),
Frederik, born 1968, crown prince since 1972 (aged 3),
Willem-Alexander, born 1967, crown prince since 1980 (aged 13),
Philippe, born 1960, crown prince since 1993 (aged 33),
Felipe, born 1968, crown prince since 1975/86 (aged 7))

Lumutqueen 01-20-2011 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlotteAmalia (Post 1195018)
Just an imagination: The Queen dies in 2020. Charles will be King then as George VII. 2030 Charles/George VII.

What makes you think Charles has chosen the regal name George? Where is your source for this?


Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlotteAmalia (Post 1195018)
What i expect from a future King
- a degree in Law, Economics or Politics
- a year or more at an university abroad. For example if you did a LLB in UK, then a Master degree in Politics abroad.
- English and two other languages fluent.
- a internship in two ministries (foreign affairs and something else)
- some military training

Queen Elizabeth doesn't have any form of degree, she never partcipated in university abroad. She is fluent in languages other than English but I don't know if they were learnt before she became Queen. She had a little military training and no internship with anyone. I don't see why he "needs" any of this when his grandmother has done a fantastic job without any of these things.


Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlotteAmalia (Post 1195018)
But from somebody who might be King in some years, i would expect more - especially a better academic training in law (constitutional law) and politics.

Why should he have a training in Law, when he will not be getting involved in the politics of his country or the day to day running which will be parliaments job?

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlotteAmalia (Post 1195018)
I do not know what languages are spoken by William. I guess he speaks some French and Spanish, but is not fluent in one of them. But a king should be as good as any diplomat. They (at least the german ones) need to speak German, English and another UN-language (French for example) at a very high level/fluent.

I agree he should learn some new languages, especially Welsh and perhaps German.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlotteAmalia (Post 1195018)
This is not the international academic career I would expect.

It's not the academic career that any British Prince/ss has ever recieved, so why should William change that.
The future Monarch of Europe have experienced academic education in other parts of the world, but that's not what the British do.

What he needs to know, he can learn from his grandmother.
I see nothing wrong with Williams education or the way he is progressing. I would like to see him learn Welsh however.

windsorgirl 01-20-2011 12:23 PM

It's interesting to me that there is such a big difference in the preparations taken by other European heirs vs. British. Thank you, Charlotte Amalia, for pointing it out. It's as though they (W-A, Phillippe, Frederik, Victoria, etc.) are preparing for a bigger day-to-day involvement in affairs of state than Charles/William.

Britain has always seemed insulated from the rest of Europe, IMO, and not just geographically. Also, HM QEII has served so long and so well with little formal education and plenty (heaps) of real world experience to her credit that perhaps that family or the British public, in general, doesn't expect any different. I don't know the day-to-day workings of each monarchy but it would appear that the British roles are much more ceremonial (therefore taking less formal education/language/experience abroad) than their European counterparts.

I know that if I were preparing to be head of state one day, I'd benefit from more education and not less. :whistling:

Lumutqueen 01-20-2011 12:30 PM

There isn't a degree in Being King 101. When it comes down to it, experience is all that can make William a good King.

Duke of Marmalade 01-20-2011 01:43 PM

Charles is the next King and imo he is very well prepared, better than any of his peers. At this very moment, William isnt suited to be King at all but he doesnt have to. Charles grew with age and opportunities and HOPEFULLY, so will William, that one day he will be the the same position as his father is now, next in line and well prepared.

Marie of The Sea 01-20-2011 02:00 PM

Politics and King of England, never the twain shall meet, therefore, the idea of a future monarch studying political science is a foreign idea in the UK and Commonwealth.

William has had extensive constitutional instructions directly from the monarch, his Queen and Grandmother. Like past kings of his future realm, he is devoted to military service which is some of the very best life experience any person can have.

He is in touch with his people, sleeping rough, packing CARE packages for the Red Cross, visiting the sick and homeless, joining and teaching children in sport and much more. Such as the protection of endangered animal species, worldwide. He is a hands-on person.

He speaks some Welch, some Swahili, is fluent in French and Spanish and knows a good deal of Italian.

He will be a very dedicated King and bring much to the table. No worries about William. William is warm, compassionate and enthusiastic with great skills in all that is truly important.

I truly admire Haakon but Berkeley? Sighs~~~ There you get another sort of education, not always academic. I know, I've been there a lot. In fact, Mette Marit would almost have been a typical student there.

Lumutqueen 01-20-2011 02:09 PM

Where have you heard that William is fluent in French and Spanish, Marie of The Sea?

CharlotteAmalia 01-20-2011 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lumutqueen (Post 1195050)
What makes you think Charles has chosen the regal name George? Where is your source for this?

I wrote "an imagination" before that. There is no source to that. But some years ago it was written in the news, that Charles would use the name George when he becomes a King.
(article: Call me George, suggests Charles - Times Online )

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lumutqueen (Post 1195050)
Queen Elizabeth doesn't have any form of degree, she never partcipated in university abroad. She is fluent in languages other than English but I don't know if they were learnt before she became Queen. She had a little military training and no internship with anyone. I don't see why he "needs" any of this when his grandmother has done a fantastic job without any of these things.

(...)
It's not the academic career that any British Prince/ss has ever recieved, so why should William change that.
The future Monarch of Europe have experienced academic education in other parts of the world, but that's not what the British do.

What he needs to know, he can learn from his grandmother.
I see nothing wrong with Williams education or the way he is progressing. I would like to see him learn Welsh however.

But time has changes. When the Queen was young, there was war in Europe. She married at a very early age and had children.
And she was a girl. That does not make a difference today (at least to me), but it made a difference then. Her father had been to university at least for a year, and so did Albert Victor and Edward VIII.
I think Elizabeth's education was influenced by the war, her early marriage and the fact that she is female. It was suitable for a girl then to have some knowledge about literature and languages, playing the piano, needlework, how to cook and care for the kids and overall just waiting for a husband. And some parts of the society stick to that pattern, when you look a the biography in terms of education of Diana and Camilla. I'm sorry to say so.

But women younger than the queen got a better education. Margrethe of Denmark (born 1940 ) has studied at university for 5 years and her subject was politics and economics from 1961 to 1965.
Beatrix, born 1938, had been at Leiden University from 1965 on.

Education is a huge value in most parts of the world.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lumutqueen (Post 1195050)
Why should he have a training in Law, when he will not be getting involved in the politics of his country or the day to day running which will be parliaments job?

Even if the real power is by the parliament, he still will be the head of state. And this is a special role in every country and even more special with no core constitutional document. In Germany the head of state (Bundespräsident) is elected (by the Bundesversammlung , federal convention). He does not have more power than the queen. If it was up to me, i would not vote for somebody without a degree and a political or economical career.
If i were British, i would want a king who is bright and has shown this through his education. He should have a huge philosophical, historical, legal, economical and sociological knowledge. Otherwise i would not accept him as a head of state.

And even if he would not be head of state, he would be the head of one of the richest families in the world. If you inherit a family buisness, i would think it is very usefull to have an economic degree.

Lumutqueen 01-20-2011 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlotteAmalia (Post 1195133)
I wrote "an imagination" before that. There is no source to that. But some years ago it was written in the news, that Charles would use the name George when he becomes a King.
(article: Call me George, suggests Charles - Times Online )

And years ago he said he wanted to be Defender of Faith, he hasn't said anything since.


Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlotteAmalia (Post 1195133)
But time has changes. When the Queen was young, there was war in Europe. She married at a very early age and had children.
And she was a girl. That does not make a difference today (at least to me), but it made a difference then. Her father had been to university at least for a year, and so did Albert Victor and Edward VIII.
I think Elizabeth's education was influenced by the war, her early marriage and the fact that she is female. It was suitable for a girl then to have some knowledge about literature and languages, playing the piano, needlework, how to cook and care for the kids and overall just waiting for a husband. And some parts of the society stick to that pattern, when you look a the biography in terms of education of Diana and Camilla. I'm sorry to say so.

She was going to become Queen, why would an education in history have mattered when she was going to be told everything she needed to know throughout her reign. Like i've said previously; there is not a degree in Being a Monarch 101, nothing he learns from a lecture or a proffessor is going to help him become a King, experience will do that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlotteAmalia (Post 1195133)
If i were British, i would want a king who is bright and has shown this through his education. He should have a huge philosophical, historical, legal, economical and sociological knowledge. Otherwise i would not accept him as a head of state.

We don't vote for our head of state, if we wanted to vote for a head of state we could ask for a republic as of yet we haven't.

He shouldn't have anything like that, he recieved a 2:1 from the University of St Andrews which is an massive achievement and shows he is incredible bright. He has no control over the day to day running of his country, or the commonwealth, legal and economical education would be of no use to him. He will be told what he needs to know and when he needs to know it. 5 years of wasted education on something he is never going to use, isn't going to benefit him being a King. Experience is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlotteAmalia (Post 1195133)
And even if he would not be head of state, he would be the head of one of the richest families in the world. If you inherit a family buisness, i would think it is very usefull to have an economic degree.

That's what accountants, and legal advisors and the people in charge of the royal familys money are for. People who have trained for that specific job. Do you think Bill Gates takes care of his money on a day to day basis, deals with the paper work etc? Somehow I doubt that.

Somersby Tulip 01-20-2011 03:08 PM

Will as King
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sherlock221B (Post 1195038)
Interesting...but William will not just be king of the United Kingdom but of 15 of other realms. That's a lot of economies and a lot of politics to study...embassies and UN delegations to intern with...not including the languages and customs of each realm. Quite a lot to just familiarize oneself with let alone seek a diploma of academic study.

It true that should Will become King it could take at least 30 years.

His degree in geography could underlay an interest is astro which is to do with the air and water in part and soil for the earth; perhaps its global warming that interests him and an ambassadorial role is his training and immediate to medium term future rather than an more obvious route of economics and politics which I believe he is already both versed in and involved in respectively together with an understanding of defence and some civil issues from his army training. Well thought out if so. :cool:

On a more day to day note I think the Bank of England will always be considered the authority on finances and some economic issues together with government in the UK. Any european fiscal matters are taken care of by the EU which leave the commonwealth and sovereignty.

I think the laws of sovereignty and commonwealth are propably more of interest of Queen and future Kings and Queens than a law degree.

UK, European, Commonwealth and Sovereignty issues are where the importance and power of the realm lie.

The UN is an interesting topic and a broad one. Will it be global warming or solar power that will win the ticket of ebiquitious authority or fiscal under management where the hearts of us all lay. Who will wear the crown at the beginning and end of any political topic?

Though I imagine any strong sovereignty rely on not only the immediate but outer reaches of their family to build relationships to ensure all these and many other areas and matters of interest are covered.

Who shall be King...

Commonwealth is a traditional English term for a political community founded for the common good.

The Commonwealth of Nations, normally referred to as the Commonwealth and formerly known as the British Commonwealth, is an intergovernmental organisation of fifty-four independent member states. Headquarters are in London.

Iluvbertie 01-20-2011 05:22 PM

Is William suitable to be King is an irrelevant question. He has the only qualification he needs to have to take on that position - he is the eldest son of the eldest son of the monarch.

The education of the monarch's doesn't matter at all as all they need for the job is to be born in the right position in the right family. Therefore is William suitable to be King - yes.

Skippy 01-20-2011 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iluvbertie (Post 1195258)
Is William suitable to be King is an irrelevant question. He has the only qualification he needs to have to take on that position - he is the eldest son of the eldest son of the monarch.

The education of the monarch's doesn't matter at all as all they need for the job is to be born in the right position in the right family. Therefore is William suitable to be King - yes.

Say that also in the Denmark forum - same question asked about Prince Frederik. And I think you are looking at this in a purely (too) technical way.

Iluvbertie 01-20-2011 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skippy (Post 1195264)
Say that also in the Denmark forum - same question asked about Prince Frederik. And I think you are looking at this in a purely (too) technical way.

Not really - it wouldn't matter what education, experience etc he had. He is suitable to be King for the simple reason of his birth.

He could have failed all the way through school, never got a job, been a playboy and he still would be suitable to be king because all he needs is to be born.

macer9312 01-20-2011 05:41 PM

Quote:

She was going to become Queen, why would an education in history have mattered when she was going to be told everything she needed to know throughout her reign. Like i've said previously; there is not a degree in Being a Monarch 101, nothing he learns from a lecture or a proffessor is going to help him become a King, experience will do that.
Yes, but wouldn't it be helpful to him to also have some of the experience that CharlotteAmalia suggested? Such as interning somewhere like the UN and studying abroad to get a feel of other cultures? Yes, I know he went to Africa and South America for his gap year. Also, I don't see him having gotten a degree in Economics, Political Science, or International Relations as a hindrance or useless to his future reign. I think it would have helped him to have a better understanding of the day-to-day politics of the UK. I mean, really, what's the point of his degree in Geography? Does it help him in the military, most likely yes. But he will not be in the military forever. If he understands the aspects of his own government well it would only help him to be a better king. So I agree with CharlotteAmalia that he could be doing more to prepare himself for his future role, whether he is second in line or first in line.

Somersby Tulip 01-20-2011 05:42 PM

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluvbertie http://cdn.theroyalforums.com/ugala/...s/viewpost.gif
Is William suitable to be King is an irrelevant question. He has the only qualification he needs to have to take on that position - he is the eldest son of the eldest son of the monarch.

The education of the monarch's doesn't matter at all as all they need for the job is to be born in the right position in the right family. Therefore is William suitable to be King - yes.


Say that also in the Denmark forum - same question asked about Prince Frederik. And I think you are looking at this in a purely (too) technical way.





I agree with both of you and thank you for realising my point.

It is Charlie that will be crowned King at next coronation.

Lumutqueen 01-20-2011 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by macer9312 (Post 1195270)
Yes, but wouldn't it be helpful to him to also have some of the experience that CharlotteAmalia suggested? Such as interning somewhere like the UN and studying abroad to get a feel of other cultures? Yes, I know he went to Africa and South America for his gap year. Also, I don't see him having gotten a degree in Economics, Political Science, or International Relations as a hindrance or useless to his future reign. I think it would have helped him to have a better understanding of the day-to-day politics of the UK. I mean, really, what's the point of his degree in Geography? Does it help him in the military, most likely yes. But he will not be in the military forever. If he understands the aspects of his own government well it would only help him to be a better king. So I agree with CharlotteAmalia that he could be doing more to prepare himself for his future role, whether he is second in line or first in line.

He will be told everything he needs to know, why waste years of your life at university when you're going to be told what you need to know when the time comes?

Skippy 01-20-2011 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iluvbertie (Post 1195269)
Not really - it wouldn't matter what education, experience etc he had. He is suitable to be King for the simple reason of his birth.

He could have failed all the way through school, never got a job, been a playboy and he still would be suitable to be king because all he needs is to be born.

IMO it depends on how you view 'suitability' - being born in a certain position or with a certain outlook doesn't automatically mean that you are suitable or capable of living up to it.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree.

CharlotteAmalia 01-20-2011 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iluvbertie (Post 1195258)
Is William suitable to be King is an irrelevant question. He has the only qualification he needs to have to take on that position - he is the eldest son of the eldest son of the monarch.

The education of the monarch's doesn't matter at all as all they need for the job is to be born in the right position in the right family. Therefore is William suitable to be King - yes.

it came to my mind when reading the same question about Crown Prince Frederik of Denmark ( http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums...ing-14778.html )

Every citizen of the Commonwealth Realms could get involved in a republican movement, which might end in an change of constitution from monarchy to republic. I'm not a expert on constitutional law, so i do not know the procedure of a change of constitution.
So it is very important for most royal families if the people like them, if the people believe they are doing a good job and if the heir is suitable to be King.

But Skippy is right: We have to agree that we disagree about William's suitability.

Iluvbertie 01-20-2011 05:55 PM

William, like Charles before him, has been trained to be King by the best training possible - the incumbent.

As William already is eligible to be a Counsellor of State (like Charles, Harry and Andrew) he has a solid understanding of what it entailed.

When Charles becomes King, if not sooner, he will start getting regular briefings from the government of the day about what is happening. Charles does that now (he gets a summary of the papers sent to the Queen each day and often full copies of the stuff as well - there is even a small horse-drawn carriage that takes the documents from BP to CH - I was at the Mews one day when it returned and asked what it was for and was told 'It takes the government's documents from the Queen to the Prince of Wales and then brings them back again when they are both in London')

Skippy 01-20-2011 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iluvbertie (Post 1195282)
William, like Charles before him, has been trained to be King by the best training possible - the incumbent.

As William already is eligible to be a Counsellor of State (like Charles, Harry and Andrew) he has a solid understanding of what it entailed.

When Charles becomes King, if not sooner, he will start getting regular briefings from the government of the day about what is happening. Charles does that now (he gets a summary of the papers sent to the Queen each day and often full copies of the stuff as well - there is even a small horse-drawn carriage that takes the documents from BP to CH - I was at the Mews one day when it returned and asked what it was for and was told 'It takes the government's documents from the Queen to the Prince of Wales and then brings them back again when they are both in London')

Your original post stated something different to me. I leave it at that.

Esmerelda 01-20-2011 06:11 PM

How much politics and economics does the monarch need to know? They will be briefed by staff I imagine but they aren't involved in policy or diplomatic negotiation. I would argue that he needs some experience in representation and practical experience such as taking part in state visits would be valuable. Also, some training in management may be a good idea as royal courts are organizations which exist at least partly to sell themselves and their country.

Iluvbertie 01-20-2011 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skippy (Post 1195285)
Your original post stated something different to me. I leave it at that.

My original post states the facts - the only thing needed to be suitable is birth.

That doesn't mean that the incumbent doesn't do something to prepare their heir/s, which is what my most recent post explained.

Queen Victoria basically did none of this preparation for her son but he still was able to do the job and do it very well. His only qualification to be King was being born. He had no training and still was popular and respected both at home and abroad.

The preparation is irrelevant to the order of birth. That the Queen has given her descendents some training doesn't change the fact that the only thing they need to be suitable for the job is to be born in the right position in the right family.

rossop7 01-20-2011 06:23 PM

Personally for me I think someone (sorry I can't recall the poster's name!) pointed out that the Queen herself, an excellent monarch over the years, has had little to no "traditonal" education, or time at University, work experience abroad etc etc & yet is undoubtedly suitable to her role. I think the British RF have a different expectation & tradition with their heirs when compared to some of the other European RFs, less focused on concrete qualifications such as degrees or experience within diplomacy etc & more just general experience of Royal duties learned through actually doing them & through the experience of everyone behind the scenes at BP as to what has worked in the past & what hasn't etc. There is of course a heavy leaning towards military training of some sort but to me the British RF has never seemed to "demand" that the members of family be vastly qualified in academic means or have anything really to "prove" they are suitable, they just do their job & learn as they do it. I believe Prince Edward is quoted as saying that there is no training for what they do & they only learn what works by doing it & seeing what does or does not work & looking at other fmaily member's actions as to what has or has not worked.

I also think that they needn't necessarily have degrees & qualifications to be suitable (yes it'd be nice as I always think it's nice when someone shows they can study something to some level of difficulty & helps show they can be analytical, expressive, broadens horizons & interests & various other skills you gain through further education etc). But to me the British RF's role these days is almost entirely media related. So long as they look good, know how to act when they do their various duties, know how to talk to people & the media, know the role they have I almost think that's enough. Yes there are some aspects of the monarch's job that are more than mere PR & media roles but they must have so much backup & advise from advisors & courtiers etc that I'm fairly certain you wouldn't need a degree in politics to understand the role of the monarch or to carry out the weekly audience with the PM. One thing I do think William could do with working on, and maybe it's just me being fussy, but his public speaking I think could use some improvement. I mean actual speeches & the like that he will have to presumeably give many times over his lifetime (maybe he'll improve naturally as he does more of them) but I've watched a few speeches he's given & think he could improve there a bit.

I think all the RF need these days really is a good basis of knowledge in what is actually expected of them in their roles (how to act at state dinners & other duties, who exactly you may be meeting/talking to, how to carry out a conversation without offending anyone etc). Basic media training too in how to act & talk to media & sound good. Sure it'd be nice if everyone had degrees in history & politics & economics & could speak 3 languages & be an expert debater of any & all topics but really I don't think it's utterly necessary for them these days especially considering the fact that they will have a multitude of experienced advisors within BP, the civil service & also of course from the political world & any private acquaintances they may know who could be helpful. They won't just be left to their own devises & expected to know everything on their own.

Skippy 01-20-2011 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iluvbertie (Post 1195292)
My original post states the facts - the only thing needed to be suitable is birth.

That doesn't mean that the incumbent doesn't do something to prepare their heir/s, which is what my most recent post explained.

Queen Victoria basically did none of this preparation for her son but he still was able to do the job and do it very well. His only qualification to be King was being born. He had no training and still was popular and respected both at home and abroad.

The preparation is irrelevant to the order of birth. That the Queen has given her descendents some training doesn't change the fact that the only thing they need to be suitable for the job is to be born in the right position in the right family.

Never mind, we will never agree on this and that is okay.

Roslyn 01-20-2011 09:09 PM

"Fog in Channel: Europe Isolated".

Delightful as I find the idea that headline actually appeared, I understand it is a fake. I do, however, think it contains an element of truth, in that the British view things a certain way, and do things the way they do them, and that's that! I doubt the British RF gives a hoot about the fact that the heirs to other European thrones have far more formal education than they do. The way they do things has served them well for centuries, throughout the period when the sun never set on the Empire, and through two World Wars, so why should they change?

Considering the fact that the monarch has very little, if any, real power, they're probably right, and, as Bertie said, the only qualification William really needs he achieved by being born. I personally believe that having more formal education, particularly in political science and economics, would have been a good idea, as would a good, solid stint at the UN or somewhere similar.

wanderingnana 01-20-2011 09:42 PM

Quite frankly, most professional people that I know and I know quite a few have said that they learned a great deal more once they graduated from college than they ever learned in school. They received the basics in school, but learned a great deal more from practical experience. This has certainly been true in my case. As I understand it, the British Monarch advises and listens but does not rule, per se. Now, if they elected a King it's possible they would need a broader education, but this is not always the case even in countries that do elect a leader. William is very young yet. I imagine as time goes on his grandmother and father will help give him the training he will need. As for only having a military education, of course that isn't true. He has a college degree. His uncle Andrew only has a military education, yet since his retirement from the service, he has proven to be quite efficient as a representative of his country's business elements. So I don't think I'd worry right now about his suitability to be King. Let's let him get through his military service and hope that he does that safely. He has a very risky job.

doric44 01-21-2011 12:27 AM

seems to me he is qualified right now he can read prepared speeches wave shake hands cut ribbons and smile
...not to be flippant about it but honesty were talking about a powerless ceremonial figurehead here. who will have nothing to do with the running of the country and make no decisions.. that could help or hurt the kingdom or the commonwealth.
he will be surrounded by aides and staff that will assist him in protocol and tell him what he needs to know in virtually every situation he will face.

if he had real power then yeah this notion he needs more education and exp might be applicable but not for a ceremonial figurehead

Roslyn 01-21-2011 09:01 AM

:previous: If I have to have a powerless ceremonial figurehead, I want my powerless ceremonial figurehead to be as well educated as all the other powerless ceremonial figureheads.

Seriously though, I want my Head of State to be someone I can respect as much as I respect our current Governor-General: Quentin Bryce, AC, and State Governor: Professor Maria Bashir AC, CVO. These talented, high achieving, and charming women are merely our Head of State's representatives in our Country and State respectively.

A little background:

Governor-General: Quentin Bryce, AC:

Quentin Alice Louise Bryce, AC, (born 23 December 1942) is the 25th and current Governor-General of Australia (the first woman to hold the position) and a former Governor of Queensland. Born in Brisbane, Queensland, as Quentin Strachan, she spent her first years in Ilfacombe, with her family subsequently living in a number of country towns around Australia. She attended the University of Queensland, where she completed a Bachelor of Arts and a Bachelor of Laws, becoming one of the first women accepted to the Queensland bar.

In 1968 she became the first woman to be a faculty member of the Law school where she had studied, and in 1978 she joined the new National Women's Advisory Council. This was followed by a number of positions, including the first director of the Queensland Women's Information Service, the Queensland director of the Human Rights and Equal Opportunity Commission and the Federal Sex Discrimination Commissioner in 1988. Her services to the community saw her appointed an Officer of the Order of Australia in 1988, and a Companion of the Order of Australia and Dame of the Order of St John of Jerusalem in 2003.

Bryce was appointed the Governor of Queensland in 2003. Although some concerns were raised during her time in the position, her five-year term was to be extended until 2009. However, on 13 April 2008, before the completion of the initial five years, it was announced that Bryce was to become the next Governor-General of Australia. The decision was generally well received, and on 5 September 2008 Bryce was sworn in, succeeding Major General Michael Jeffery, becoming the first woman to be the Governor-General. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quentin_Bryce

Governor: Professor Marie Bashir AC, CVO:

Professor Bashir, the first woman to be appointed Governor of NSW, took up her office on 1 March 2001.

Born, of Lebanese descent, in Narrandera in the Riverina district of NSW, and educated at Narrandera Public School and Sydney Girls High School, Marie Bashir gained her bachelor degrees in medicine and surgery in 1956 from the University of Sydney.

Dr Bashir taught at the Universities of Sydney and NSW, increasingly working with children's services, psychiatry and mental health services, and indigenous health programs. At the time of her appointment as Governor of NSW, she was Clinical Professor of Psychiatry at the University of Sydney (a post she took up in 1993); Area Director of Mental Health Services Central Sydney (from 1994); and Senior Consultant to the Aboriginal Medical Service, Redfern (from 1996) and to the Aboriginal Medical Service, Kempsey.

Professor Bashir's widespread involvements and interests have included juvenile justice, research on adolescent depression, health issues in developing countries, education for health professionals and telemedicine and new technologies for health service delivery. Along with many professional medical association roles, she was, at the time of her appointment as Governor, a member of societies as diverse as Amnesty International, the National Trust, the NSW Camellia Research Society and the Tandanya National Aboriginal Cultural Centre, as well as being a patron of the Sydney Symphony and Opera Australia. She was appointed an Officer of the Order of Australia in 1988 for her services to child and adolescent health; and was invested by Her Majesty, the Queen, with the insignia of a Commander of the Royal Victorian Order (CVO) in 2006.
http://www.parliament.nsw.gov.au/pro...fNewSouthWales

Is William Windsor suitable to be my head of State? When stacked up against these two outstanding human beings, young William pales into insignificance. He may be the elder son of the current Prince of Wales and therefore the future King of the UK, but I respect, and assess, people based on their demonstrated skills and achievements, not because of who their parents chanced to be.

I am glad that by the time William is the King of the UK, it will not be an issue for my country, for by then we will have one of our own numerous outstanding citizens representing us, and us alone, on the world stage.

American Dane 01-21-2011 09:39 AM

Suitable
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Skippy (Post 1195264)
Say that also in the Denmark forum - same question asked about Prince Frederik. And I think you are looking at this in a purely (too) technical way.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Iluvbertie (Post 1195269)
Not really - it wouldn't matter what education, experience etc he had. He is suitable to be King for the simple reason of his birth.

He could have failed all the way through school, never got a job, been a playboy and he still would be suitable to be king because all he needs is to be born.


Sorry Iluvbertie but I think you're confusing the words 'eligible', which William certainly is, and 'suitable' :previous:

To be suitable means to be RIGHT for the position one is to take up, which William may or may not be

Chimene 01-21-2011 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by American Dane (Post 1195578)
Sorry Iluvbertie but I think you're confusing the words 'eligible', which William certainly is, and 'suitable' :previous:

To be suitable means to be RIGHT for the position one is to take up, which William may or may not be

That's a great distinction. I hadn't thought of that.

CharlotteAmalia 01-21-2011 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roslyn (Post 1195554)
:previous: If I have to have a powerless ceremonial figurehead, I want my powerless ceremonial figurehead to be as well educated as all the other powerless ceremonial figureheads.

Seriously though, I want my Head of State to be someone I can respect as much as I respect our current Governor-General:

I have to sign this.

I would not what some kind of "empty shell" or "puppet" as a head of state. Somebody who is handsome, knows how to give a speech, which somebody else wrote, waves to his people and smiles would be not enough for me.
A head of state - even if he has no real power in the country - should instruct and controll his servants or secretaries. And he should be able to do so. It would be horrible to me, if i knew that my head of state is ruled and instructed by his servants or majordomo. That would make him to a marionette with the strings in the hand of his majordomo or private secretary. There is a way to prevent this: either you have a strong character (which the queen seems to have), or you have a education which makes you on par with your staff.

psm 01-21-2011 03:45 PM

I agree with CharlotteAmalia, actually that was a question I was asking myself too. How come Prince William is not better trained and educated for his future role as King of UK and 15 more states.

While I agree he will get assisstance and advise from helpers all his life, it does not mean him knowing what these advisors are talking about would not help. Actually at times, he may even get conflicting advise from different people and would have to make up his own mind.

We do not know what kind of challenges he will face in the future, I would expect him to be at least well trained in UK constitution. To his credit, he probably already is. He does not need a formal university education when he could have the best tutors privately.

William is going to represent UK internationally so I would expect him to speak multiple languages. I do not know whether he speaks any foreign languages.

As far as I know, QEII is fluent in French. Queen Victoria was fluent in multiple languages and again to my knowledge received excellent private education which prepared her for her future role as the Queen.

While you learn your job best doing your job, a formal education can speed up that process. International relations, political science, basic economy and law education would train PW better for his role. Philisophy is also something any head of state should study.

He will always be briefed by staff before his engagements, but even knowing the basics in these areas would help him go through his briefings more easily, ask pointed questions to his staff and understand everything better. He would also be less prone to make mistakes/gaffes when speaking to other people during his engagements. I have no idea what kind of briefing RF members get, but I have enough education to know that none of these topics are easy to comprehend for an uneducated mind. The more he knows the more he can perform his duty. His knowledge would also impress people, which is always excellent PR.

I also think having a more formal education with degrees relevant to your duties may be the way to go. Our Queen is of another generation, when people respected the monarch, thought she was appointed by God, it was her right and duty, etc... None of these are true today. Now people are questioning monarchy's relevance. Some want to abolish it and these people will only increase in numbers when Charles becomes the king. Having a future king who is formally training for the job, not passing his time working other jobs and performing a few engagements per year, waiting for his time, would at least silence some of those critics who believe having born is not enough qualification to be the head of state.

We have to look forward, not past since things have changed so much. That is why I don't think bringing up the past monarchs is a good idea. Prince Charles got a degree from one of the best universities in the world. While his studies were not the ones mentioned here, they were not completely irrelevant. Since then, I believe he carved himself a place and showed the world that he works tirelessly for his country and the world. Of course for many people his personal life shadows his achievements. Yet I see Prince Charles more of a modern day king.

Prince William on the other hand. I am not sure...

Iluvbertie 01-21-2011 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by American Dane (Post 1195578)
Sorry Iluvbertie but I think you're confusing the words 'eligible', which William certainly is, and 'suitable' :previous:

To be suitable means to be RIGHT for the position one is to take up, which William may or may not be


He is right for the position simply because he was born to it. I am not confusing eligible with suitable. I don't see that there is a difference in a heriditary system as the only person suitable is the person eligible.

One of the fundamental flaws of the system and one of the reason for me becoming a republican.

Iluvbertie 01-21-2011 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by psm (Post 1195721)
As far as I know, QEII is fluent in French. Queen Victoria was fluent in multiple languages and again to my knowledge received excellent private education which prepared her for her future role as the Queen.

Queen Victoria started learning her job after she became Queen - she had no training for it and was trained initially by Lord Melbourne. Had she had any training the entire BedChamber Affair wouldn't have happened. Her real training began after she allowed Albert to share her load - after she had been Queen for a number of years and had made a number of mistakes. She also refused to train her own son and heir but he did fine.

While you learn your job best doing your job, a formal education can speed up that process. International relations, political science, basic economy and law education would train PW better for his role. Philisophy is also something any head of state should study.

He will always be briefed by staff before his engagements, but even knowing the basics in these areas would help him go through his briefings more easily, ask pointed questions to his staff and understand everything better. He would also be less prone to make mistakes/gaffes when speaking to other people during his engagements. I have no idea what kind of briefing RF members get, but I have enough education to know that none of these topics are easy to comprehend for an uneducated mind. The more he knows the more he can perform his duty. His knowledge would also impress people, which is always excellent PR.

I also think having a more formal education with degrees relevant to your duties may be the way to go. Our Queen is of another generation, when people respected the monarch, thought she was appointed by God, it was her right and duty, etc... None of these are true today. Now people are questioning monarchy's relevance. Some want to abolish it and these people will only increase in numbers when Charles becomes the king. Having a future king who is formally training for the job, not passing his time working other jobs and performing a few engagements per year, waiting for his time, would at least silence some of those critics who believe having born is not enough qualification to be the head of state.

We have to look forward, not past since things have changed so much. That is why I don't think bringing up the past monarchs is a good idea. Prince Charles got a degree from one of the best universities in the world. While his studies were not the ones mentioned here, they were not completely irrelevant. Since then, I believe he carved himself a place and showed the world that he works tirelessly for his country and the world. Of course for many people his personal life shadows his achievements. Yet I see Prince Charles more of a modern day king.

Prince William on the other hand. I am not sure...[/QUOTE]

Charles degree was from a good university but from looking at his results - not all that strong which isn't a surprise seeing as his results shouldn't have allowed him to go to that university. What Charles has mastered is all the things you say he should have studied at uni - by doing these things.

William has a degree from a good university and has a large inheritance to manage so will learn about economics simply from managing that fortune. He will learn what he needs as he goes.

Book learning only goes so far. Practical learning is preferable.

For a British monarch, who has no power, having too much book learning could lead to problems when they make a comment to the PM, or other visiting dignitary, that could conflict with the government's view. The British monarch has no views on anything officially. Their views are those of the government so having ideas on things like politics or diplomatic relations could actually get in the road of them doing their job - waving, smiling, small talk, signing the legislation (their only real constitutional role and a child can do that).

Marie of The Sea 01-21-2011 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lumutqueen (Post 1195132)
Where have you heard that William is fluent in French and Spanish, Marie of The Sea?

Family. I was told he learned French from his mother and grandmother Windsor and Spanish from his Uncle Spencer. The Italian is from Kate and Prince Charles.

Zonk 01-21-2011 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marie of The Sea (Post 1195807)
Family. I was told he learned French from his mother and grandmother Windsor and Spanish from his Uncle Spencer. The Italian is from Kate and Prince Charles.

He learned Spanish from his Uncle Charles Spencer? I am going to go out on a limb here...since we don't know what William does 24/7. But when would he have had enough time to spend with Charles Spencer that be fluent in Spanish?

Mermaid1962 01-21-2011 08:14 PM

Diana said that she couldn't speak French when she visited France with Prince Charles and so she wore Chanel getting off the plane there. Of course, she might have learned some later.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Marie of The Sea (Post 1195807)
Family. I was told he learned French from his mother and grandmother Windsor and Spanish from his Uncle Spencer. The Italian is from Kate and Prince Charles.


Charlotte1 01-21-2011 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marie of The Sea (Post 1195807)
Family. I was told he learned French from his mother and grandmother Windsor and Spanish from his Uncle Spencer. The Italian is from Kate and Prince Charles.

William doesn't speak fluent French or Spanish! He did the compulsory few years of French at school, he took Spanish at GCSE level (10th grade) but did no languages for A-Levels which shows he wasn't particularly skilled at languages. He didn't do French at GCSE, the subjects you take at exam level are the ones you are best at. William has never spent any kind of extended time in either a French speaking or Spanish speaking country, unlike the Queen he was never educated privately and so never had a French speaking governess, or for that matter a French speaking nanny! Diana did not speak French.

Contrast this with the Kents who did learn French within the family, Marina of Kent spoke French at home. Her son the current Duke was a French interpreter in the Army. (He also studied at Le Rosey in French part of Switzerland) Alexandra lived with a French noble family in Paris for a while, Michael also speaks French and added Russian and became a Russian language interpreter for the Army. His interest in Russian was sparked at an early age as Marina used to visit the Grand Duchess Xenia who lived in exile in the UK. The Duke of Kent's oldest grandson Baron Downpatrick has just graduated from Oxford with a degree in French and German. Prince Michael's daughter Gabriella is actually fluent in Spanish, she has a degree in Hispanic literature and as a journalist wrote articles for Spanish Hola, in Spanish!

Italian? Well Kate did spend 3 months at the British Institute in Florence learning Italian so she knows some basics, she's not spent any time in Italy since. She didn't take Italian as an A-level subject, her A-levels (very good ones) are public knowledge. I doubt whether when they're together William and Kate revise Italian verbs and vocabulary together. Charles doesn't speak Italian, he does speak French.

Sadly while the Queen and DoE are fluent in at least 2 languages, it seems foreign languages are not priorities among their grandchildren. Their children are slightly better, Edward and Sophie are fluent in French, as is Charles. Their grandchildren, Beatrice and Eugenie took French at GCSE level, neither took it at A-Level and neither are studying a language at university. (Neither did William)

William will learn 'on the job' like his predecessors. While the CVs of the European heirs looks impressive, they did not begin fulltime royal duties until they were well into their 30s. Prince Phillippe who is the best educated was even criticised that he was spending so long studying. He was told not the bother taking a degree, just spend a short time at the universities which was what Margarethe and Beatrix did. They studied a variety of individual subjects but never completed a degree. Crown Princess Victoria was following the same road, but last year had a degree stitched together for her based on the various courses she had done.

rossop7 01-21-2011 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charlotte1 (Post 1195832)
Sadly while the Queen and DoE are fluent in at least 2 languages, it seems foreign languages are not priorities among their grandchildren. Their children are slightly better, Edward and Sophie are fluent in French, as is Charles. Their grandchildren, Beatrice and Eugenie took French at GCSE level, neither took it at A-Level and neither are studying a language at university. (Neither did William)

^ That's pretty much the norm these days for kids I find. Lol! It's a stereotype but seeminly true, the vast majority of British children/younger generations barely see the point in learning foreign languages to any great depth & skill. Firstly I don't think the generally available schooling here is adequate in the subjects nor are the requirements in the curriculum as strict in making sure students are learning at least one foreign language, if not two, to a high level. It's almost to the point where you don't have to even do one foreign language at GCSE. In general, as a country, we seem to be quite lazy at learning other languages these days & aren't doing a good job at promoting the need to learn other languages, we almost assume that we won't need to learn any as everyone else speaks English nowdays! :rolleyes:

jemagre 01-21-2011 11:14 PM

The best type of education is a combination of formal and in-formal. The best university can only give you so much knowledge before the real-world rears its occasional ugly head. So you need to be able to deal with both in order to do well. A thirst for knowledge is also key. After all it signals that a person has real desire to keep improving themselves which is a great quality in a leader.

What William didn't learn in university he can learn by hiring a private tutor. I feel like he should learn some foreign languages (or at least one) and he should spend some time outside the U.K. in a commonwealth realm(s) studying. I also hope that William will one day become more confident in his role. I feel like he is reluctant to take on the role that he was given at birth. I have no evidence to back this up it is just a perception. Perhaps if he does more public events he will become more confident.

It may be a bit off topic but even Harry can benefit from learning these things. I know that he suffers from dyslexia but he can still try. Harry hits back at his critics | The Sun |News After all he is quite high up there and he will play a role as an advisor to his brother as well as performing his own role for the family.

I wonder why the royal family never suggested to the boys about the potential options they may have by expanding the very tiny circle they live in.

Rosapru 01-22-2011 02:35 AM

sorry but William himself said a few years ago he speaks fluently french and didnt want to speak it in public. Prince Charles speaks also french, I saw a documentary on french tv a wee ago where he spoke with a photographer (very famous I try to found his name, I forgot for the moment) and he is interviewed in Highgrove about the climate change by a french tv chanel.William speak swahili fluently too and it was proved by an african journalist of Hello Magazine a few years ago who try at a polo match after the interview of william for his 18 birthday to speak with william and he concede that it was correct and that William understand and speak the language with him. This is facts and not "a source told me ...". one source is william himself, the other the journalist of Hello.

Rosapru 01-22-2011 02:37 AM

Yann Arthus-Bertrand ........ "Le Prince Charles" Il y a plus de vingt ans, le Prince Charles a créé une ferme biologique à Highgrove, dans la campagne anglaise. Au fil des années, le lieu est devenu une véritable institution en Grande-Bretagne. Pour évoquer ses nombreux projets, le Prince offre un entretien exclusif à Yann Arthus-Bertrand.

Charlotte1 01-22-2011 02:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rosapru (Post 1195913)
sorry but William himself said a few years ago he speaks fluently french and didnt want to speak it in public. Prince Charles speaks also french, I saw a documentary on french tv a wee ago where he spoke with a photographer (very famous I try to found his name, I forgot for the moment) and he is interviewed in Highgrove about the climate change by a french tv chanel.William speak swahili fluently too and it was proved by an african journalist of Hello Magazine a few years ago who try at a polo match after the interview of william for his 18 birthday to speak with william and he concede that it was correct and that William understand and speak the language with him. This is facts and not "a source told me ...". one source is william himself, the other the journalist of Hello.

William has never said he can speak French fluently! The most he has conceded that he can speak when it comes to a foreign languages, is during one interview he stated he was trying to teach himself Swahili but wasn't being very successful. William hasn't given many interviews so this is easy enough to confirm! Being able to respond to a simple question after a polo match doesn't make William fluent in Swahili.

If William could speak French fluently he would have taken French for his exams, he didn't. He also did not study French at university and there has been no mention of William having a private tutor. His post-university study has all been maths and science orientated to qualify as a pilot. There was also mention that William would start having private tuition in constitutional law as he's the heir to the heir.

I already stated the Charles can speak French, that's been long established, as well as Edward and Sophie.

CharlotteAmalia 01-22-2011 06:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charlotte1 (Post 1195918)
I already stated the Charles can speak French, that's been long established, as well as Edward and Sophie.

I think Charles is able to speak German as well. He spent a lot of time in Germany with Prince Phillip's relatives. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9i1a7F_IfvE&feature=fvw (0:50-1:10 minutes, you could easily understand him, but he is sounding very English when speaking German. Haakon of Norwegen is similar good in German http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9OsUSjmgps 0:55 on...).
I'm pretty sure his German is a lot better than the average German, spoken by English guys. (I lived in the UK for a year. When guys started flirting with me in a pub or club and they found out i was German, they always said the same 2 or 3 sentences: "Ich möchte bitte ein Bier" ("I'd like a beer, please" - no i was not the waitress ;)), "Ich habe einen Hamster, einen Bruder und eine Schwester" ("I have got a hamster, a brother and a sister" - this sentence seems to be from the school lessions when they started learning German and should introduce themselves to the class.) It was nice that they were trying to speak German. But it was also very funny, because quite often it was very hard to understand and it were always the same sentence.:whistling: But there are also people, who speak German very well.)

Rosapru 01-22-2011 09:33 AM

Sorry Charlotte1 but William did say he can speak French fluently, and it's not because you didnt read or hear this interview that you can doubt what I said. William is always underestimate himself so of course He said he was'nt successful at speaking SWAhili but if you check the board you can see the interview of the Hello journalist who engage himself in a conversation in swahili. Or you can email to Hello Magazine to check the information. But dont try to impose your point of vue as fact please. I speak spanish (so I'm french) and I never and couldnt pass this language in my studies. Things are not so simple. Prince Charles speaks French and did he study at university? (I recognise I have no the answer, but I believe it's was not the case). Learn french is a tradition in the family for historic reasons. I'm checking the web to find the interview and you can do the same to prove (but really prove) the contrary

Nice Nofret 01-22-2011 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lumutqueen (Post 1195274)
He will be told everything he needs to know, why waste years of your life at university when you're going to be told what you need to know when the time comes?

What an interesting idea, that time at university or education is wasted :whistling:

That's not my idea though. I think aquiring a very good education, is the best thing, what can happen to you :flowers:. Spending time at a top university is such a privileg! I only went to "normal" university, and I would have relished in a top one! It's highly stimulating.

Skippy 01-22-2011 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nice Nofret (Post 1196069)
What an interesting idea, that time at university or education is wasted :whistling:

That's not my idea though. I think aquiring a very good education, is the best thing, what can happen to you :flowers:. Spending time at a top university is such a privileg! I only went to "normal" university, and I would have relished in a top one! It's highly stimulating.

That indeed sounds a bit rude imo, to me it doesn't hurt when someone has a mind of his/her own - I think it always helps to have (some) knowledge yourself.

Susanna Wynne 01-22-2011 12:39 PM

Prince William's Education
 


I remember reading that Pr. William received private tutoring while at Eton from an Oxbridge scholar or two (perhaps more?) and that the Queen had weighed in on, and had a strong interest in, his education/preparation. He also met with her privately weekly for a number of years as part of his preparation.

After her father ascended the throne, according to Marion Crawford's book, Princess Elizabeth had regular private tutoring from a famous constitutional scholar/historian (perhaps more than one?) for several years. Thus her education probably exceeded that of most students who studied history, per se, and her education/preparation was more focussed on her future.

Mumper 01-22-2011 02:37 PM

I don't think William will be a good King. He reminds me too much of the Duke of Windsor; he wants his cake, and eat it, too. He and Kate are always know for going on vacations here and there, and seen WAY too often partying at questionable nightclubs, yet, where are the causes? What charitable organizations does he even quietly support and work for? All I see and read, are party, party, party. And oh, they want their "privacy". They still want their tax-payer funded fun, though.
I know it's not politically correct to say it, but I hope he and Kate recede into the background. How come regular English people are not hyped up about his wedding? :whistling:

Skippy 01-22-2011 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mumper (Post 1196134)
I don't think William will be a good King. He reminds me too much of the Duke of Windsor; he wants his cake, and eat it, too. He and Kate are always know for going on vacations here and there, and seen WAY too often partying at questionable nightclubs, yet, where are the causes? What charitable organizations does he even quietly support and work for? All I see and read, are party, party, party. And oh, they want their "privacy". They still want their tax-payer funded fun, though.
I know it's not politically correct to say it, but I hope he and Kate recede into the background. How come regular English people are not hyped up about his wedding? :whistling:

Well, I for one disagree with your post. If all you see and read is party, party, party then I think you don't read all there is to read. He is training to be a full SAR pilot with the RAF, he wouldn't even have time for it. Catherine has worked for her parents' company, and as long as there are no reports to the contrary, I assume that she is still doing that.

And, I believe it has been mentioned multiple times on this forum, William does not live off taxpayer funds. His finances are provided by mainly the British Army. More information about William's finances can be found here:
http://www.princeofwales.gov.uk/faqs...092138025.html.

As for your question about charities, I recommend reading this thread:
http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums...ges-18465.html.

Lumutqueen 01-22-2011 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mumper (Post 1196134)
I don't think William will be a good King. He reminds me too much of the Duke of Windsor; he wants his cake, and eat it, too. He and Kate are always know for going on vacations here and there, and seen WAY too often partying at questionable nightclubs, yet, where are the causes? What charitable organizations does he even quietly support and work for? All I see and read, are party, party, party. And oh, they want their "privacy". They still want their tax-payer funded fun, though.


Could you please tell me the last time they were seen out partying together?
If you check the Current Events thread, William and Kate have done a lot of charity events (FA Association work, BAFTA work, Help For Heroes events, Starlight Foundation events)
William is currently in the RAF and Kate is still a private citizen, she has no reason to participate in royal events until after the 29th April.
William does his fair share, even though he doesn't have to.

Again, the last time they went on holiday was when?


Quote:

Originally Posted by Mumper (Post 1196134)
I know it's not politically correct to say it, but I hope he and Kate recede into the background. How come regular English people are not hyped up about his wedding? :whistling:

Considering William will one day be King and Catherine his Queen; receding into the background is not an option unless they give up their titles.
Being a "regular english person"; I know many people who are "hyped" up for the wedding.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nice Nofret (Post 1196069)
What an interesting idea, that time at university or education is wasted :whistling:

What I meant was extra years of university education; a lot of people say he should go and get a degree in Poltical Science, Economics or History. I don't see the point in doing an extra 3 to 5 years when he'll be told everything he needs to know.

Roslyn 01-22-2011 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lumutqueen (Post 1196169)
What I meant was extra years of university education; a lot of people say he should go and get a degree in Poltical Science, Economics or History. I don't see the point in doing an extra 3 to 5 years when he'll be told everything he needs to know.

I find the idea that he will be told everything he needs to know a little unsettling. Who is going to be telling him all he needs to know, and how can he be sure that it is in fact all he needs to know? If others are telling him everything he needs to know, why aren't they doing the job? Rhetorical question, of course.

It may well be that William is having/has had/will have private tutoring from appropriately qualified scholars, but, if that is the case, I would like to know about it.

We don't really know much about William at this stage, and hopefully it will be a long time before he is king, so he has plenty of time to acquire the knowledge that I would like him to have. One thing tertiary education does is teach you how to learn, so he already has that skill.

Lumutqueen 01-22-2011 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roslyn (Post 1196197)
I find the idea that he will be told everything he needs to know a little unsettling. Who is going to be telling him all he needs to know, and how can he be sure that it is in fact all he needs to know? If others are telling him everything he needs to know, why aren't they doing the job? Rhetorical question, of course.

It may well be that William is having/has had/will have private tutoring from appropriately qualified scholars, but, if that is the case, I would like to know about it.

We don't really know much about William at this stage, and hopefully it will be a long time before he is king, so he has plenty of time to acquire the knowledge that I would like him to have. One thing tertiary education does is teach you how to learn, so he already has that skill.

It's not going to be scholars who give him extra information, it'll be advisers. Private Secretarys and the like who are employed to tell William what he needs to know.
For instance when he's going to a benefit for a specific charity, beforehand he will presumably be briefed on what the charity is for, it's history and why William himself is going. If he's got enough time he might event do some personal research of his own.
He'll be told what he needs to know to look like a good King in my mind, i don't think William is going to be the one to change the system; not yet anyway.

Iluvbertie 01-22-2011 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roslyn (Post 1196197)
I find the idea that he will be told everything he needs to know a little unsettling. Who is going to be telling him all he needs to know, and how can he be sure that it is in fact all he needs to know? If others are telling him everything he needs to know, why aren't they doing the job? Rhetorical question, of course.

The people telling him will be the people he employs to tell him and the government. After all he won't be allowed to have any views publicly that the government doesn't approve so the government will be involved in the telling. Remember the monarch is a figurehead who has no power and so he doesn't need to know all the ins and outs as that could lead to a conflict of interest where his ideas conflict with the government's - not allowed to happen.

His role as King is to sign legislation and sprout government approved statements - nothing more or less.

Quote:

It may well be that William is having/has had/will have private tutoring from appropriately qualified scholars, but, if that is the case, I would like to know about it.
It was reported regularly during his school days that he was being given additional training in constitutiona affairs and how to be king and the role of the monarch by the best person to give him that information - his grandmother - every Sunday at 4.00 while he was at Eton and she was at Windsor (which is most weekends) they would meet for that training.

Now you know about it.

Quote:

We don't really know much about William at this stage, and hopefully it will be a long time before he is king, so he has plenty of time to acquire the knowledge that I would like him to have. One thing tertiary education does is teach you how to learn, so he already has that skill.

He has the knowledge he needs - he can read and he can write his name. He doesn't need to be able to do anymore than that. He can wave and shake hands. He will be briefed on who he is meeting and what topics he can and cannot discuss with that person e.g. government A says you can say we support this idea but five years later new government B says you can say we no longer support this idea - he has no need to know anything else as he isn't allowed to publicly have views.

Charlotte1 01-22-2011 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rosapru (Post 1196017)
Sorry Charlotte1 but William did say he can speak French fluently, and it's not because you didnt read or hear this interview that you can doubt what I said. William is always underestimate himself so of course He said he was'nt successful at speaking SWAhili but if you check the board you can see the interview of the Hello journalist who engage himself in a conversation in swahili. Or you can email to Hello Magazine to check the information. But dont try to impose your point of vue as fact please. I speak spanish (so I'm french) and I never and couldnt pass this language in my studies. Things are not so simple. Prince Charles speaks French and did he study at university? (I recognise I have no the answer, but I believe it's was not the case). Learn french is a tradition in the family for historic reasons. I'm checking the web to find the interview and you can do the same to prove (but really prove) the contrary

Well you're also trying to push your point of view that William speaks French without any evidence that he does! At least I've provided the evidence that he didn't take French in his exams or at university. Charles studied French at school, he also spent time in France (on school trips) as did Andrew, although his French is questionable. Princess Anne doesn't make any claims to speak French either and she was taught it when she was younger.

The tradition to learn French among royals was observed when they were taught at home, they learn French not from their parents (who they saw little of) but from tutors and governesss especially employed to teach the children to speak the language. (Just like European royals all had English nurses and nannies so they would learn English at an early age)

The Queen Mother learnt French from her French governess and German from her German governess, not from the time she spent at school. The current queen never attended school, she learnt French from her governess. Philip lived in Paris when he was young and went to school there and that's how he learnt French. The education system taught languages to their children and since languages are not given a high priority in th UK anymore, their grandchildren had ended up basically mono-lingual. With English being their only language.

Roslyn 01-22-2011 11:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iluvbertie (Post 1196226)
He has the knowledge he needs - he can read and he can write his name. He doesn't need to be able to do anymore than that. He can wave and shake hands. He will be briefed on who he is meeting and what topics he can and cannot discuss with that person e.g. government A says you can say we support this idea but five years later new government B says you can say we no longer support this idea - he has no need to know anything else as he isn't allowed to publicly have views.

I do actually get this, but described this way it sounds a bit as though the monarch is not much more than the pampered pet of the government of the day. I think it's a bit sad, actually.

The Monarch is merely a symbol of the unbroken continuity of the state, and their only qualification is accident of birth. If the role of head of state really is merely symbolic and ceremonial, I think that the office is more appropriately held by someone who has had a long and distinguished career doing something constructive other than merely opening fetes and making small talk. Our Governors and Governors-General have opinions and have expressed them in the past and they can be known to anyone who cares to do the research, and I'm sure the same is true of, for example, Presidents of the United States. Why is it that members of the British Royal Family cannot have opinions and express them before they become monarch? Charles has done things with the intention of benefiting his country and future generations, and he has been criticised heavily for it. HM didn't have a chance to let us know what she thought before becoming Queen.

I suppose I'm just questioning the relevance of the whole system of monarchy as it affects me as an Australian. Why on earth should we bow to these people? William hasn't done anything to make me think he should ever be my Head of State. The fact he can read and write his own name and wave and shake hands and makes all the right noises and doesn't offend anyone just doesn't impress me.

Iluvbertie 01-23-2011 12:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roslyn (Post 1196262)
I do actually get this, but described this way it sounds a bit as though the monarch is not much more than the pampered pet of the government of the day. I think it's a bit sad, actually.

The Monarch is merely a symbol of the unbroken continuity of the state, and their only qualification is accident of birth. If the role of head of state really is merely symbolic and ceremonial, I think that the office is more appropriately held by someone who has had a long and distinguished career doing something constructive other than merely opening fetes and making small talk. Our Governors and Governors-General have opinions and have expressed them in the past and they can be known to anyone who cares to do the research, and I'm sure the same is true of, for example, Presidents of the United States. Why is it that members of the British Royal Family cannot have opinions and express them before they become monarch? Charles has done things with the intention of benefiting his country and future generations, and he has been criticised heavily for it. HM didn't have a chance to let us know what she thought before becoming Queen.

I suppose I'm just questioning the relevance of the whole system of monarchy as it affects me as an Australian. Why on earth should we bow to these people? William hasn't done anything to make me think he should ever be my Head of State. The fact he can read and write his own name and wave and shake hands and makes all the right noises and doesn't offend anyone just doesn't impress me.


You sound like you are starting to realise why many Australians are now republicans - because the royals have no relevance to us and can't say or do anything without the government's approval.


When I joined this board 2 and a half years ago I was as big a monarchist as you could find and now - bring on the republic!!!!

Roslyn 01-23-2011 02:00 AM

:previous: I, too, was a Monarchist until quite recently and it's only since I started to think of William being our King that I decided it was time for us to have one of our own who would represent our interests above all others on the world stage.

I was born a British Subject and grew up with HM as my Queen and with Charles as a piece of the furniture and God Save the Queen as our National Anthem, and even as late as the early 1980s we still had appeals to the Privy Council. But times have changed dramatically over the last 30 years and not only have the judicial and political ties between our countries been weakened by legislation, I feel no connection to William and have no trouble objectively thinking about his relevance to us.

Osipi 01-23-2011 02:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mumper (Post 1196134)
I don't think William will be a good King. He reminds me too much of the Duke of Windsor; he wants his cake, and eat it, too. He and Kate are always know for going on vacations here and there, and seen WAY too often partying at questionable nightclubs, yet, where are the causes? What charitable organizations does he even quietly support and work for? All I see and read, are party, party, party. And oh, they want their "privacy". They still want their tax-payer funded fun, though.
I know it's not politically correct to say it, but I hope he and Kate recede into the background. How come regular English people are not hyped up about his wedding? :whistling:

I would imagine that the people that have found out that it was William that flew the helicopter when they needed emergency medical assistance would strongly disagree with you. Right now William's first and foremost responsibility is to his SAR duties and knowing how the rules work here for being "on duty", it would really put a severe limitation on Will's wild and crazy partying. (Here in WV the rule is no alcohol 12 hours before either a volunteer or professional run).

Kataryn 01-23-2011 05:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roslyn (Post 1196197)
I find the idea that he will be told everything he needs to know a little unsettling. Who is going to be telling him all he needs to know, and how can he be sure that it is in fact all he needs to know? If others are telling him everything he needs to know, why aren't they doing the job? Rhetorical question, of course.

The fact that William successfully attended university and left with an academic degree means that he has learned to cover a subject in an academical way. He learned all the necessary techniques and the ways to analyse and think about a topic which of course is skills he will use when his time has come to agther more information and knowledge about Britain's political system and his place in it.

Iluvbertie 01-23-2011 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kataryn (Post 1196313)
The fact that William successfully attended university and left with an academic degree means that he has learned to cover a subject in an academical way. He learned all the necessary techniques and the ways to analyse and think about a topic which of course is skills he will use when his time has come to agther more information and knowledge about Britain's political system and his place in it.


His place in Britain's politica system is simply - sign the legislation, give the speeches the government writes for him to give, listen the to PM and maybe advise him/her if relevant and possible - basically be an apolitical ear who will listen but can't overrule. The monarch is a rubber stamp.

The monarch in Britain has no real power - the old saying - if Parliament voted for the monarch's death warrant the monarch would have to sign it gives a very good understanding of the power of the monarch - none.

Kataryn 01-23-2011 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iluvbertie (Post 1196314)
The monarch in Britain has no real power - the old saying - if Parliament voted for the monarch's death warrant the monarch would have to sign it gives a very good understanding of the power of the monarch - none.

Okay, so you don't seem to understand what Human Rights are. Of course noone can be forced to sign his own death warrant - a king could always abdicate or call the European Court for Human Rights.... Or do both.

A degree in geopgraphy will certainly help William when he has to receive ambassadours and Catherine will be helped by her history of Arts degree when it comes to research cultural topics to talk about with the ambassadours' wifes....

Princess BellyFlop 01-23-2011 02:36 PM

It's fun for me to imagine William's wedding but almost impossible to imagine him as my king... hum... maybe the links to the British monarch are going thinner and thinner... As for his geography degree improving his ability to be king, I'm afraid that the role of our king is oh so limited even when hosting heads of state and anything needing to be said or done is already prepared by knowledgeable politic staff. Not sure I want my Head of State to go as a loose cannon on a subject he likes if his opinion can harm bilateral relationships.

Roslyn 01-23-2011 04:32 PM

One thing his geography degree will help with is being able to have lively discussions with other heads of state about where they all went on their holidays.:lol:

There will be lots and lots of topics it is safe to discuss and the more he knows, whether it is about history or economics or political science or art or psychology or philosophy, the more he will be able to understand and talk about. As Kataryn said, the degree he already has will have taught him to analyse and process information, and I have a feeling he is intelligent enough to not go off like a loose canon on controversial subjects. His advisors will point out the taboo issues before an event anyway, but I think it is always useful - and just makes life more interesting - to understand the "why" and "how" of issues.

And Kate's knowledge of art history will help her when researching cultural topics to discuss with ambassadors' husbands, too, and the husbands of visiting heads of state. :cool:

Iluvbertie 01-23-2011 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kataryn (Post 1196382)
Okay, so you don't seem to understand what Human Rights are. Of course noone can be forced to sign his own death warrant - a king could always abdicate or call the European Court for Human Rights.... Or do both.

A degree in geopgraphy will certainly help William when he has to receive ambassadours and Catherine will be helped by her history of Arts degree when it comes to research cultural topics to talk about with the ambassadours' wifes....


You misunderstood - it was a 'saying' not something that would happen in fact. It was an expression to explain how little power the monarch has - they have to sign all legislation passed by both Houses of Parliament.

It was said before the Human Rights courts came into being because the monarch had to sign ALL death warrants in Britain when they had the death penalty. They don't have the death penalty anymore so that 'saying' isn't used anymore - but it was in the 1960s when I was growing up - hence my use of the phrase 'old saying'.

jemagre 01-23-2011 10:42 PM

I think that while William has a degree and may speak some French and Swahilli he could still be learning more things. However I also understand the argument that as a figurehead all he really needs to do is wave to the cameras and he is capable of doing that.

Ultimately it depends on what you want in a monarch. I don't really see him though breaking the mold of his predecessors. In fact I don't see him bringing anything really new to the table. If you like continuity this can be a great thing but if you want something different he will probably not be your man. By the way I am mostly basing my theory on the idea that he has so far stuck to a very traditional way of doing things.

Royal Fan 01-24-2011 02:24 AM

which for this Insitiution is good

Marie of The Sea 01-25-2011 08:07 PM

William is already doing things differently in his personal life, such as never having a valet thus far and not having the usual staff to run his household in Wales. William has a lot of interests that may be useful as king.

jemagre 01-26-2011 01:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marie of The Sea (Post 1197536)
William is already doing things differently in his personal life, such as never having a valet thus far and not having the usual staff to run his household in Wales. William has a lot of interests that may be useful as king.

While I think the "idea" of not having a valet is nice...I was referring to the possibilty of him changing the monarchy itself. Ideas that directly effect the country(s) that he is representing. His personal life isn't changing that much. Marrying a commoner is not that big of a deal to really alter things.

I do acknowledge that for some people there is no need for change. They feel he is good the way he is. I believe that William will be just another monarch in the line and not someone that really stands out. This could turn out to be a fantastic thing. Who knows for certain.



Iluvbertie 01-26-2011 01:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jemagre (Post 1197599)
While I think the "idea" of not having a valet is nice...I was referring to the possibilty of him changing the monarchy itself. Ideas that directly effect the country(s) that he is representing. His personal life isn't changing that much. Marrying a commoner is not that big of a deal to really alter things.

I do acknowledge that for some people there is no need for change. They feel he is good the way he is. I believe that William will be just another monarch in the line and not someone that really stands out. This could turn out to be a fantastic thing. Who knows for certain.




In what ways would you like to see the monarchy change?

Of course the monarchy today is a very different beast to what it was when the Queen acceded to the throne and she has kept up to date in many ways but what would you like to see William do differently when he becomes King, in hopefully 30+ years time.

ladongas 01-26-2011 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iluvbertie (Post 1197612)
...but what would you like to see William do differently when he becomes King, in hopefully 30+ years time.

Here's what I hope to see:

Google Image Result for http://www.apetogentleman.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/Prince-William-Mohawk.jpg

Wayne 01-26-2011 10:09 PM

I think that William has a fine head on his shoulders, and it's not essential that he is considered an intellect. While it would be nice if he did further he learning, I think that he as well as the British people are happy with his current career path, and he has proven him self to be very good at what he is currently doing. I don't think that speaking other languages is as important to native English speaks as it is to other Europeans. While it is a blessing that English is so widely spoken, it has also led to a lack of interest in other languages by anglophones ( why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free mentality). The only that William needs to improve on is his vocal delivery, he tends to speak very fast and mumble and it is sometimes hard to complete understand what he is saying. I am sure as he gets more involved with his duties they might seek to remedy this.

Mermaid1962 01-27-2011 02:03 AM

Oh dear me! :eek::lol:


Quote:

Originally Posted by ladongas (Post 1198038)


CrownPrincess5 01-27-2011 02:27 AM

Lol:lol::lol::lol::rofl:
I don't even know what to say about this pic!

Kataryn 01-27-2011 02:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roslyn (Post 1196571)
One thing his geography degree will help with is being able to have lively discussions with other heads of state about where they all went on their holidays.:lol:

That's one point. But much more important seems to be that a degree in geography includes a lot of knowledge about how the weather works, I was told.... :whistling:

Skippy 01-27-2011 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrownPrincess5 (Post 1198148)
Lol:lol::lol::lol::rofl:
I don't even know what to say about this pic!

I do and it is that I don't find it appealing at all.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kataryn (Post 1198152)
That's one point. But much more important seems to be that a degree in geography includes a lot of knowledge about how the weather works, I was told.... :whistling:

Is that so? I would think that the main course for that would be meteorology :biggrin:

jemagre 01-29-2011 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iluvbertie (Post 1197612)
In what ways would you like to see the monarchy change?

Of course the monarchy today is a very different beast to what it was when the Queen acceded to the throne and she has kept up to date in many ways but what would you like to see William do differently when he becomes King, in hopefully 30+ years time.

Hmmmm. So much of what I would like to see will probably be done during Charles' reign. Certainly the family could stand to be smaller. Though I suspect most of the junior members will leave through "natural selection." I would also hope that there is going to be more information about the financial situation for the royals. There are aspects of the new monetary agreement set to be handed down in a few years that is questionable. Is a billionaire King really necessary?

Then again what can he change? He is a figure-head. For example: Inheritance rights and even his religious beliefs were decided for him at birth by the elected government and the monarchies role as defender of the faith. I would say they could be more accepting of Catholics (or any other religion) but is he responsible for that? I don't believe he is. He could go on the record about it but he doesn't seem the type.

I think the biggest problem for the royals is relevance. I don't think that is something that is easy to change. Certainly one person is not going to change how people feel about the concept of a monarchy. How could the royals make themselves relevant if you could get over the issue of birth-right? They already do charity work but anyone could do that.

I wish I could answer you question more specifically but I am not a monarchist. I comment on this forum because I like studying governments and I am familiar with the royals through that and entertainment magazines. So it is hard for me to imagine how the royals could change in ways that would make me say I believe in a royal family as my head of government.

Iluvbertie 01-30-2011 12:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jemagre (Post 1199195)
Hmmmm. So much of what I would like to see will probably be done during Charles' reign. Certainly the family could stand to be smaller. Though I suspect most of the junior members will leave through "natural selection."

The question could be asked who is actually a member of the family? Is it only those with HRH or is it the relationship to the monarch and then how far do you take that relationship.

If only HRH - then currently there are 12 plus spouses and Philip. Of those 12 only three who can give the HRH to their spouses aren't married and one is engaged. I don't count Louise and James as to me the Queen's consent and the parents' desire not to have them have HRH says that they won't be taking on that designation or any royal duties.

The next question is why should it be smaller? How do you tell someone that they can't have children e.g. do we say that the monarch can only have two children who are royal - so what happens if William and Kate decide on a large family and have 8 kids - are they not going to be royal?

jdcharlie 01-31-2011 04:46 AM

I had a hard time imagining William in the role of King until recently. But he's matured a lot in the past year or so and has become quite impressive. I think with his marriage and a lot of happiness in his personal life, he is more content with the future and what it inevitably holds.

He's personable, well-spoken, intelligent, caring, thoughtful and has a good head on his shoulders. Even, as bizarre as it sounds, the balding has helped him a bit. It gives him a bit more gravity, and less the image of a playboy. IMO, he represents the UK well and is a great public face.

I was reading back through articles I missed recently and came across this (fairly amusing) account of the day of the engagement. This reporter seems to feel somewhat similar to me:
Express.co.uk - Home of the Daily and Sunday Express | Express Yourself :: Royal wedding: Caught in the whirlwind of an historic day

Mumper 01-31-2011 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osipi (Post 1196287)
I would imagine that the people that have found out that it was William that flew the helicopter when they needed emergency medical assistance would strongly disagree with you. Right now William's first and foremost responsibility is to his SAR duties and knowing how the rules work here for being "on duty", it would really put a severe limitation on Will's wild and crazy partying. (Here in WV the rule is no alcohol 12 hours before either a volunteer or professional run).

How come we never hear about Will's alleged work, but always about his and Kate's many vacations? How many service people can take several vacations a year?

Osipi 01-31-2011 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mumper (Post 1199904)
How come we never hear about Will's alleged work, but always about his and Kate's many vacations? How many service people can take several vacations a year?

I would imagine that William would rather be "one of the crew" and not have attention drawn to what he and many others in SAR do in the line of duty. I think if you do check through these forums here for William, there are stories and links to reported stories that have come out about Will's rescues. With following these threads here for over 2 years now, I really don't see all that much about vacations. We all know Kate and William went to Kenya in October as that's when they got engaged and other than that, the only other vacation I really remember from 2010 is they did go skiing in the spring I think. Did you read too where William spent Christmas Day on duty? Its kind of a traditional thing to do so that married crew members could spend the day with their families.

One thing I'd almost bet my life on is that as far as time on duty, William works as many hours as any other SAR crew member.

You can read discussions about his work in SAR here: http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums...e-18482-8.html

jemagre 02-01-2011 01:15 AM

Maybe they could do something like the Dutch royals do where there is a royal family and then a royal house. Those in the royal house have titles but no real roles in terms of the monarchy.

I suspect that maybe Beatrice and Eugenie might go out and get "normal" jobs while still doing charity work. As you pointed out Edward's children are kind-of out of it and Anne's children are as well. The Queen's children, on the other hand, will still have roles in the family probably until they pass on. Same for the Dukes/Duchess of Kent and Gloucester. As for the Dukes/Duchess' children I don't believe that they have given any indication of carrying on their parents role. I could be wrong though.

This could leave William and Harry their spouses and maybe 8 children. :lol: How do you slim it down from there? I don't know. You would still need a "heir" and a "spare" and their children would not be old enough to fulfill that role for a while. So thats where Beatrice and Eugenie would come in. They could have normal jobs unless the "top job" called.

Lumutqueen 02-01-2011 04:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mumper (Post 1199904)
How come we never hear about Will's alleged work, but always about his and Kate's many vacations? How many service people can take several vacations a year?

When was the last time we heard about his vacation?

Conny 02-01-2011 05:44 AM

He must be in Kenia last Oct-Nov. with Kate and friends. Was that not a vacation?

muriel 02-01-2011 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdcharlie (Post 1199619)
I was reading back through articles I missed recently and came across this (fairly amusing) account of the day of the engagement. This reporter seems to feel somewhat similar to me:
Express.co.uk - Home of the Daily and Sunday Express | Express Yourself :: Royal wedding: Caught in the whirlwind of an historic day

Lovely article.

rossop7 02-01-2011 11:59 AM

I'm sorry but EVERYONE is entitled to vacation time each year, regardless of whether you are royalty or not. I've no idea what the terms are for an RAF SAR pilot's holiday time but most jobs in UK have 4-5 weeks available as holiday that can be booked & taken anytime in the year, some jobs may have more holiday time, some may be more stringent on when exactly holiday can & cannot be taken & the max number of consecutive weeks that can be taken off at any one time, but everyone gets holiday time. I've always suspected - note this is pure speculation on my part, nothing to back me up - that William is allowed a little more leeway than other RAF pilots, simply coz of who he is & the events he has to carry out whilst also doing his RAF duties, I'm sure he is given extra days off here & there to attend charity events etc , trooping of the colour etc. At the same time I think that's sensible, he'll never be "normal" but they seem to be doing as best they can to make his time with the RAF as normal as possible while also obviously allowing him time to do his other duties with his family.

I've never really seen why people get so up in arms about supposedly being on holiday all the time, I think in the last few year they merely have the normal amount of holiday as most other people in the UK but luckily for them have the luxury to be able to afford going to more exotic or far flung locations. From the holidays we know about - of course they could take many more holidays we've never been aware of - I would say I've had a similar amount of holiday time over the years, the difference with me is that I can't always afford to go somewhere skiing or an island somewhere & instead opt to stay at home for a few weeks off. I think the fretting over the number of holidays is just people looking for anything to attack them/him/her with.

Lumutqueen 02-01-2011 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conny (Post 1200011)
He must be in Kenia last Oct-Nov. with Kate and friends. Was that not a vacation?

He was there to propose to Catherine, he wasn't there for a long time 2 weeks or something.
I cannot remember the last time he was away before that. Maybe skiing last February.
It's not like we hear about him hopping on a plane every two weeks to some far off island.
We don't hear about his work in the army because there is no point to use hearing about it. We see him on official visits, like we might see him at the BAFTAS.

scooter 02-01-2011 12:43 PM

It's not like the whole BRF doesn't ever take time off. There are big stretches at Sandringham and Balmoral.

Lumutqueen 02-01-2011 12:47 PM

Sandringham and Balmoral are on "home turf", Kenya and tropical islands are not. ;)

muriel 02-01-2011 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scooter (Post 1200132)
It's not like the whole BRF doesn't ever take time off. There are big stretches at Sandringham and Balmoral.

Whilst at Sandringham and Balmoral, it has been reported that HM continues to review her official red boxes. The PoW and the DoC also often carry out engagements locally in Scotland / Norfolk whilst in residence.

Iluvbertie 02-01-2011 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scooter (Post 1200132)
It's not like the whole BRF doesn't ever take time off. There are big stretches at Sandringham and Balmoral.

There are stretches there but they are also the bases from which they carry out a number of royal duties e.g. the Braemar Games, the annual visit to the WI from Sandringham.

And of course the Queen still does her daily boxes. They follow her everywhere and every day.

Mermaid1962 02-01-2011 11:36 PM

I think that the republishing of vacation photos might give the impression that they're on vacation more than they are. Also, most people in North American start with two weeks' vacation in a new job. So to people on this side of the water, it seems like the British get a lot of vacation time. I used to think that my UK friends were vacationing an awful lot, and then I learned that it's the norm over there to have four to five weeks.


Quote:

Originally Posted by rossop7 (Post 1200116)
II've no idea what the terms are for an RAF SAR pilot's holiday time but most jobs in UK have 4-5 weeks available as holiday that can be booked & taken anytime in the year,
I've never really seen why people get so up in arms about supposedly being on holiday all the time,


KittyAtlanta 02-02-2011 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlotteAmalia (Post 1195623)
I have to sign this.

I would not what some kind of "empty shell" or "puppet" as a head of state. Somebody who is handsome, knows how to give a speech, which somebody else wrote, waves to his people and smiles would be not enough for me.

How would you know that person could do more than be handsome, know how to give a speech, etc.?

scooter 02-02-2011 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by muriel (Post 1200145)
Whilst at Sandringham and Balmoral, it has been reported that HM continues to review her official red boxes. The PoW and the DoC also often carry out engagements locally in Scotland / Norfolk whilst in residence.

I dont recall WIlliam doing so. My point is, they have 2 months at their various 'vacation homes' every year. I personally would be thrilled to have 2 months a year off, as I am sure other members of William's squadron would be. Though I would personally prefer to go Pss Margaret's route of Mustique for the vacation home. William used to spend quite a bit of time in Switzerland skiing with his father too. Does anyone know the last year they did that?

KittyAtlanta 02-02-2011 12:48 PM

About the foreign language thing...isn't the official language of the Court of St. James French? Has that been changed? Why would not all "working" royals be required to speak it (or at least be adept enough to translate a menu.)

And about the vacation thing. I am sure that William gets preferential treatment, as most military men and women get a 30 day furlough and it is taken all at one time. Then again, the rules probably don't apply to PW.

Osipi 02-02-2011 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scooter (Post 1200476)
I dont recall WIlliam doing so. My point is, they have 2 months at their various 'vacation homes' every year. I personally would be thrilled to have 2 months a year off, as I am sure other members of William's squadron would be. Though I would personally prefer to go Pss Margaret's route of Mustique for the vacation home. William used to spend quite a bit of time in Switzerland skiing with his father too. Does anyone know the last year they did that?

We have to remember also that William is not a full time working royal at this point. His full time duties are in Wales with SAR. I really don't buy into it that William wouldn't work any more or less than than his fellow crewmates either. What most probably happens when William needs to have a week off at a certain time is that he'll work more shifts when he is able rather than like others perhaps who work 4 shifts on and 3 shifts off kind of thing and putting in as many hours a month as anyone else. IIRC William wants to be treated like any other member of his regiment and most certainly would not take advantage of who he is to wangle more time off etc.

The last time I recall him going skiing was last spring with the Middletons. I have no clue when the last time he skiied with his dad. Those trips may have become rarer since his father remarried and both boys have active military roles now.


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