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HRH Kimetha 05-02-2007 02:38 AM

Windsor/Windsor-Mountbatten: Name of Royal House and Surname
 
I felt that this would be an interesting topic.

If the last name of Prince Charles is Windsor, why does William and Harry use the name Wales instead of the correct surname?

As I understood it, Queen Elizabeth changed the old German surname to the English surname back in the 50's (?) to reflect a "British" sounding Monarch over a Germanic surname that also representing the losing side in WWII. Does anyone have any other information on this subject. Is this true? If not, what is the story on the Windsor name?

As I see it, if the true surname is Windsor then Windsor should be used instead of Wales, which only means (to me, anyway) that they are Prince Harry of Wales and Prince William of Wales only for royal purposes and Prince William Windsor of Wales etc.

Does Princesses Beatrice & Eugenie go by York?

THis would be so confusing to genealogists who are tracing ancestors by using the surname.

What is the point of the surname if the parties aren't going to use it?:smile:

Sister Morphine 05-02-2007 03:03 AM

Mountbatten-Windsor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Both William & Harry and Beatrice & Eugenie use their fathers' titles (Wales and York) as surnames occasionally [such as when they were in school, they were William Wales and Beatrice York, for example], although their actual surnames would be Mountbatten-Windsor, as that is their fathers' surname.


Quote:

An Order-in-Council was issued in 1960, which stated the surname of male-line descendants of the Duke and the Queen who are not Royal Highnesses or Prince or Princess was to be Mountbatten-Windsor. This was to address the Duke's complaint that he was the only father in the country unable to pass his name to his children. In practice, however, the Queen and the Duke's children have all used Mountbatten-Windsor as the surname they prefer for themselves and their male-line children.

Windsor became the name of the Royal house not in the 50s, but during WWI because of unpopular sentiment toward the Germans at the time (obviously).

Quote:

In 1917, during World War I, anti-German feeling among the people resulted in the Royal Family exchanging use of all of their German titles and house names for English-sounding versions........Thus, the name Wettin was replaced with Windsor, which also became the name of the Royal House through an Order-in-Council of King George V.

Iluvbertie 05-02-2007 04:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HRH Kimetha
I felt that this would be an interesting topic.

If the last name of Prince Charles is Windsor, why does William and Harry use the name Wales instead of the correct surname?

Wales designates that William and Harry are the children of the Prince of Wales - it really isn't their surname but indicates to which branch of the royal family they belong.

Quote:

As I understood it, Queen Elizabeth changed the old German surname to the English surname back in the 50's (?) to reflect a "British" sounding Monarch over a Germanic surname that also representing the losing side in WWII. Does anyone have any other information on this subject. Is this true? If not, what is the story on the Windsor name?
The change of names came about during World War I and involved not only the Royal Family but other families as well such as the Battenburgs who changed their name to Mountbatten. (Philip is a descendent of the Prince of Battenburg who did this and thus the name Mountbatten is linked with Windsor).

Quote:

As I see it, if the true surname is Windsor then Windsor should be used instead of Wales, which only means (to me, anyway) that they are Prince Harry of Wales and Prince William of Wales only for royal purposes and Prince William Windsor of Wales etc.
The RF actually don't use a surname as such. The surname officially for the grandchildren, if needed, would be Mountbatten-Windsor not Windsor as Philip's surname at the time of the marriage was Mountbatten and the Queen added that to the Windsor name for those of her descendents who actually need a surname.

Quote:

Does Princesses Beatrice & Eugenie go by York?
Yes - think about poor old Queen Victoria who had a number of granddaughters names after her - by saying 'of Wales' etc she knew which one was being referred to.

Quote:

THis would be so confusing to genealogists who are tracing ancestors by using the surname.
If a geneologist was at the point of tracing ancestors and they were getting to that level of royalty then the 'of' is just as relevant, if not of more use in the situation of multiple grandchildren through sons having the same surname.

Quote:

What is the point of the surname if the parties aren't going to use it?:smile:
For most royals they never use them anyway as they use their title not their surname.

magnik 05-02-2007 06:51 AM

Members of the Royal Family can be known both by the name of their Royal house, and by a surname, which are not always the same. And often they do not use a surname at all.

The Royal Family > Titles and succession > Royal Family name


SIDOROFF 04-22-2008 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elspeth (Post 757371)
Of course he is. The House of Windsor is intended to continue in perpetuity and not change its name when the next female heir comes along. In many countries the House doesn't change when a female monarch is married; it depends on the country. The bloodline is the same whether the name changes or doesn't change.

It is the house name that will stay the same, not the house.

SIDOROFF 04-22-2008 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by serenissima (Post 757372)
The name of our dynasty is Windsor but not Mountbatten.

It has no reason to be Mountbatten, it should be Oldenburg.

Jo of Palatine 04-23-2008 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIDOROFF (Post 757381)
It has no reason to be Mountbatten, it should be Oldenburg.

I realise Sidoroff has been banned and I understand that seeing how much completely wrong information came his/her way in an aggressive manner, but I've been wondering for years why "Oldenburg"? I have heard that prince Philip considered to name himself "Oldhouse" from "Oldenburg, but why Oldenburg at all? He isn't related to the Oldenburgs, AFAIK?

BeatrixFan 04-23-2008 12:09 PM

I always thought it should be Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glucksburg. Or just Glucksburg.

Jo of Palatine 04-23-2008 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeatrixFan (Post 757655)
I always thought it should be Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glucksburg. Or just Glucksburg.

Yes, that's the family he is from. He is not an Oldenburg. or are the Oldenburgs SHSG's, too? Where's Warren when one needs him? :flowers:

BeatrixFan 04-23-2008 12:17 PM

Can you imagine if they had their original surnames and put them together? The House of Saxe-Coburg-Gotha-Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glucksburg. I like it actually!

Stefan 04-23-2008 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jo of Palatine (Post 757657)
Yes, that's the family he is from. He is not an Oldenburg. or are the Oldenburgs SHSG's, too? Where's Warren when one needs him? :flowers:

The House of Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glücksburg is a junior line of the House of Oldenburg.

Jo of Palatine 04-23-2008 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stefan (Post 757666)
The House of Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glücksburg is a junior line of the House of Oldenburg.

I just found out, too, thank you. The Gottorps are a line of the Oldenburgs as well, interesting!

Russophile 04-23-2008 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeatrixFan (Post 757660)
Can you imagine if they had their original surnames and put them together? The House of Saxe-Coburg-Gotha-Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glucksburg. I like it actually!

What do you do when you write a check? :rolleyes::biggrin:

LadyCat 04-23-2008 06:30 PM

Weren't the surnames originally "place" names( Battenberg, Hesse, etc.)? And with the current surname "Windsor" didn't Georgie just continue the trend?


Cat

Russophile 04-23-2008 07:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LadyCat (Post 757837)
Weren't the surnames originally "place" names( Battenberg, Hesse, etc.)? And with the current surname "Windsor" didn't Georgie just continue the trend?


Cat

Yes, but George changed it because it sounded too German and Windsor sounded more English during the 1st WW.

serenissima 04-23-2008 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russophile (Post 757855)
Yes, but George changed it because it sounded too German and Windsor sounded more English during the 1st WW.

Oh, and the Gotha bombers were attacking our land but the king's family name had Gotha in it !

LadyCat 04-23-2008 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russophile (Post 757855)
Yes, but George changed it because it sounded too German and Windsor sounded more English during the 1st WW.

This is true. I guess my point was that, with the exception of the Bernodottes, most reigning houses don't really have surnames per se.

Cat

Leslie2006 04-23-2008 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jo of Palatine (Post 757671)
I just found out, too, thank you. The Gottorps are a line of the Oldenburgs as well, interesting!

and Gottorp is part of the Romanov line - Holstein-Gottorp-Romanov. The House of Romanov is also a branch of the Oldenburg House.

Jo of Palatine 04-24-2008 01:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LadyCat (Post 757837)
Weren't the surnames originally "place" names( Battenberg, Hesse, etc.)? And with the current surname "Windsor" didn't Georgie just continue the trend?


Cat

Interesting that "Coburg" actually is a town in Bavaria, not Saxony... And Sonderburg is in Denmark but Glücksburg in Germany. But that has historic reasons, of course.

prince nathan 10-10-2008 11:51 AM

Windsor/Mountbatten - Name of Royal House
 
I was wondering might the House of Windsor be changed to the House of Mountbatten when Charles becomes King. There is precedence in history. When Queen Victoria reigned, it was over the House of Hanover, her 'maiden' name, But when her son, Edward VII, succeeded her it was over the house of Saxe-Coburg-Gotha - his fathers family name.
On a side-note I think it would be a nice tribute to the Prince Philip.


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