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  #241  
Old 08-13-2013, 02:15 PM
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The line(s) through which William is descended from the Arundels is different from the lines through which he's descended from the Northumberlands. John FitzAlan, 13th Earl of Arundel's wife was Eleanor Berkeley, and they had a son, William FitzAlan, 16th Earl of Arundel, through whom William descends. Eleanor Berkeley later married Richard Poynings, Lord Poynings, and had a daughter, Eleanor Poynings, who married Henry Percy, 3rd Earl of Northumberland, through whom William also descends.

There are many lines to William from the Arundels (through both Elizabeth II and Prince Philip), but the one from the 13th Earl is this:

- Prince William, Duke of Cambridge
- Charles, Prince of Wales
- Elizabeth II of the United Kingdom
- Elizabeth Bowes-Lyon
- Claude Bowes-Lyon, 14th Earl of Strathmore and Kinghorne
- Claude Bowes-Lyon, 13th Earl of Strathmore and Kinghorne
- Thomas George Lyon-Bowes, Lord Glamis
- Thomas Lyon-Bowes, 11th Earl of Strathmore and Kinghorne
- John Bowes, 9th Earl of Strathmore and Kinghorne
- Thomas Lyon, 8th Earl of Strathmore and Kinghorne
- Elizabeth Stanhope
- Philip Stanhope, 2nd Earl of Chesterfield
- Henry Stanhope, Lord Stanhop
- Catherine Hastings
- Francis Hastings, Lord Hastings
- George Hastings, 4th Earl of Huntingdon
- Catherine Pole
- Jane Neville
- Joan FitzAlan
- Thomas FitzAlan, 17th Earl of Arundel
- William FitzAlan, 16th Earl of Arundel
- John FitzAlan, 13th Earl of Arundel

There are also several lines through which he's descended from the Dukes of Norfolk. The most recent one is:

- Prince George of Cambridge
- Prince William, Duke of Cambridge
- Charles, Prince of Wales
- Elizabeth II of the United Kingdom
- Elizabeth Bowes-Lyon
- Cecilia Cavendish-Bentinck
- Reverend Charles Cavendish-Bentinck
- Lord Charles Cavendish-Bentinck
- Dorothy Cavendish
- William Cavendish, 4th Duke of Devonshire
- William Cavendish, 3rd Duke of Devonshire
- William Cavendish, 2nd Duke of Devonshire
- William Cavendish, 1st Duke of Devonshire
- Elizabeth Cecil
- Catherine Howard
- Thomas Howard, 1st Earl of Suffolk
- Thomas Howard, 4th Duke of Norfolk

Through his mother, William is the current Duke of Northumberland's 12th cousin twice removed. He and George Percy, the Duke's eldest son, are 13th cousins, once removed.

The current Duke of Norfolk (the 18th), who is also the 36th Earl of Arundel, has a common ancestor with William in the 4th Duke of Norfolk. Through him they are 14th cousins, once removed; the Duke and Charles are 14th cousins, and William and the Duke's eldest son, Henry Fitzalan-Howard, Earl of Arundel, are 15th cousins.
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  #242  
Old 08-13-2013, 05:59 PM
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Hi Ish,

Thanks for clearing all that up for me. It really helped. I had all the facts set in stone, I just didn't know how to dissect everything to come to a consensus on what I was looking for.

There is another genealogy thread that I have under the Queen. Would you like to check it out for me?
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  #243  
Old 08-13-2013, 06:06 PM
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Not a problem. My current side project is tracing the ancestors of the Cambridges, which is why I was able to provide answers. There are other ways that William may be descended from the Northumberlands and Norfolks (and certainly the Arundels; one of the Arundels is an ancestor to George I, and HM and the DoE both descend from him in several lines), but my tree isn't so well done yet that the various duplicate individuals are linked.
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  #244  
Old 08-13-2013, 06:35 PM
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About the thread, I forgot that you've already commented on it, when I asked you. Sorry about that hun...
Anyway, it's here, as you know already.
I put in more names I remembered. Royalty and non-royalty.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ish View Post
I haven't done much on Catherine's side yet, but I've got William's side pretty much worked out. I'm just going over it all again and then I'll be turning more to Catherine. Once I'm happy with it all I'll probably post a link to it in the British genealogy thread.

Catherine's not descended from George Washington, but they do allegedly have a common ancestor in Sir William Gascoigne and his wife, Lady Margaret Percy. Here's an article on it from the DM: Kate Middleton and Ellen DeGeneres are cousins claims new research | Mail Online
Thanks hun. They also say that Beyonce & her royal baby are 23rd cousins of the Cambridges.

Also--George Washington and Elizabeth II, I read a couple months ago, are 6th cousins (I forget the number of times removed they are, though).

"They"=An E! News special about William & Kate I saw last week.

Couldn't pat my reply here. I had to take 2 screenshots of everything.
Oh... I could just put it in text.

Updates are italicized.

Well, here it is. My new updates:

(About HM & Grace's kinship) They're 43rd cousins. I forget the # of times removed they are...

(About Debo Mitford being possibly related to HM) I read in a certain Elizabeth II thread that HMQEII almost married Debo's-brother in-law, the ex-Duke of Devonshire/Marquess of Hartington.
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  #245  
Old 08-13-2013, 07:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QueenElizabeth2Fan View Post
I have heard that Catherine, thus, is descended from George Washington--I know for a fact that she is this related to one of my favorite actresses of all time. I love that :)
.
i

No one is a descendent of George Washington, at least not legitmately, as he had no children from his marriage and I have never read of him having any illegitimate descendents either.
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  #246  
Old 08-13-2013, 08:34 PM
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If you are interested in having your genealogy records being easy to read and understand, I would suggest you use a top notch genealogy program. It will do all the cross links for you. There is also space for proof documents. birth, marriage and death records. I use the Mormon one called PAF, but there are other good ones. I would very much like to see all the data in that format.
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  #247  
Old 08-13-2013, 08:53 PM
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Are the BRF related to the following?

The Queen Mother does have Iranian/Persian ancestry.
I was wondering if any other members have some.

And if any are related to these people:

--Person Number 1

--Person Number 2

--Person Number 3

I have heard that "anyone with even the slightest English ancestry" is automatically related to Edward III.


1) Are they related to them?

And:

2) Is that true?

Any users here into genealogy.. I'd appreciate your expertise on this.
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  #248  
Old 08-13-2013, 08:58 PM
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^^^^^
About 30% of English people can claim descent from Edward III.
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  #249  
Old 08-13-2013, 09:47 PM
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Interesting. But, I've done the math. I see that the Queen Mother would have to trace her ancestry back 16 generations to Edward (he is the present Queen's 17th great-grandfather).

I'll write her descent back for each generation, representing the amount of ancestors in numerical form:

--2
--4
--8
--16
--32
--64
--128
--256
--512
--1,024
--2,048
--4,096
--8,192
--16,384
--32,768
--65,536

So apparently, because Edward III is the Queen Mother's ancestor... She had 65,536 ancestors who lived during the 14th-15th centuries...
How 30% of people living today in the modern UK can claim descent from him? I'm baffled. How do the genealogists know that? I feel like they're the ones who revealed that percentage.
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  #250  
Old 08-13-2013, 09:58 PM
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http://www.dur.ac.uk/a.r.millard/gen...IIIDescent.php

If you're mathematically inclined you might find the argument here interesting. Or not. I'm not overly mathematically inclined and found the numbers to be a bit too much.
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  #251  
Old 08-13-2013, 10:05 PM
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Another link for the math: http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-t...of-edward-iii/

Basically the estimate is that Edward III has over 100 million living descendants. That works out to more than twice the population of England; so if you are of English descent you are likely a descendant of Edward III through some line, particularly if you or your family lives in (or recently came from) England.
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  #252  
Old 08-13-2013, 10:27 PM
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Hi Ish,

Well, I don't have family from England that I know of, at least. But my father was from Bermuda.
I've always wondered that, since Elizabeth I had an armada travel there--but they arrived at Bermuda on accident--if any of the British royals or monarchs have descendants on the island today.
The numbers won't be too much for me. I'm excellent at mental math too.
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  #253  
Old 08-13-2013, 10:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandma828 View Post
If you are interested in having your genealogy records being easy to read and understand, I would suggest you use a top notch genealogy program. It will do all the cross links for you. There is also space for proof documents. birth, marriage and death records. I use the Mormon one called PAF, but there are other good ones. I would very much like to see all the data in that format.
There are a lot of good ones out there, I agree.

Personally right now I'm preferring to use good old Microsoft Excel though. It's more work, perhaps, but I like the fact that I'm in control of it all.
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  #254  
Old 08-14-2013, 04:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NGalitzine View Post
No one is a descendent of George Washington, at least not legitmately, as he had no children from his marriage and I have never read of him having any illegitimate descendents either.
Descended meant related in that sentence. I just mixed up related & descended. I know he had no children. I think his older half brother Lawrence did have some though..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandma828 View Post
If you are interested in having your genealogy records being easy to read and understand, I would suggest you use a top notch genealogy program. It will do all the cross links for you. There is also space for proof documents. birth, marriage and death records. I use the Mormon one called PAF, but there are other good ones. I would very much like to see all the data in that format.
Did you direct this at Ish or myself?
But anyhow, I have no money. I'd want software that is free to use.
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  #255  
Old 08-14-2013, 08:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NGalitzine View Post
i

No one is a descendent of George Washington, at least not legitmately, as he had no children from his marriage and I have never read of him having any illegitimate descendents either.
Nope, George Washington had no children. I am descended from his sister, Betty, and her husband, Fielding Lewis.
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  #256  
Old 08-14-2013, 01:59 PM
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That's very interesting :) I wonder if his half-brother Lawrence has any descendants, maybe famous ones too!
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  #257  
Old 08-14-2013, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QueenElizabeth2Fan View Post
That's very interesting :) I wonder if his half-brother Lawrence has any descendants, maybe famous ones too!
George's youngest brother Charles had four children though.
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  #258  
Old 08-14-2013, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SLV View Post
Wow!
Now, that is thorough research.
Thanks! I used Wikipedia to start then went through it again using the Peerage (then again for Wikipedia). Basically it was go through Wikipedia for all the names, then Peerage to double check the names/get the dates, then Wikipedia again for dates that Peerage didn't have.

I still love how you do your ancestor lines, mine aren't nearly as neat or well put together. The Cambridge and Wives lines look great!
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  #259  
Old 08-14-2013, 03:23 PM
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Your lines are very systematic and orderly.
I just arrange them in such a way as to get the clearest possible picture. It's quite easy though to forget a step. In your structure that would be obvious immediately.

Hi QueenElizabethfan,
Have you seen this thread:
British Royal Family Genealogy

There are a lot of people (including myself) there working on all kinds of ancestor-lines of the BRF.
I made one today with the link you gave concerning the common ancestry of the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge.
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  #260  
Old 08-14-2013, 03:34 PM
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I have Updated my Post I made a few months ago before the birth of Prince George Tracing Queen Elizabeth Bloodline back to the Tudors:

I made a British Royal Family Tree Tracing Queen Elizabeth Ancestry Line back to the Tudors.

1. 14th Great Grandparent King Henry VII 1457-1509 Elizabeth of York 1466-1503

2. 13th Great Grandparents Margaret Tudor 1489-1541 Archibald Douglas, 6th Earl of Angus 1489-1557- Margaret Tudor Daughter of Henry VII and Elizabeth of York

3. 12th Great Grandparent Margaret Douglas 1515-1578 Matthew Stewart, 4th Earl of Lennox 1516-1571

4. 11th Great Grandparents Henry Stuart, Lord Darnley 1545-1567 Mary, Queen of Scots 1489-1541- Henry Stuart Son of Margaret Douglas and Matthew Stewart

5. 10th Great Grandparent King James I 1566-1625 Anne of Denmark 1574-1619- James I Son of Henry and Mary of Scots

6. 9th Great Grandparents Elizabeth Stuart 1596-1662 Frederick V, Elector Palatine 1596-1632- Elizabeth Daughter of James I and Anne of Denmark

7. 8th Great Grandparents Sophia of Hanover 1630-1714 Ernest Augustus 1629-1629- Sophia of Hanover Daughter of Frederick V, Elector and Elizabeth

8. 7th Great Grandparents King George I 1660-1727 Sophia Dorothea of Celle 1666-1726-King George I Son of Sophia of Hanover and Ernest Augustus

9. 6th Great Grandparents King George II 1683-1760 Caroline of Ansbach 1683-1737- George II Son of Gorge ! and Sophia

10. 5th Great Grandparents Frederick, Prince of Wales 1707-1751 Princess Augusta 1719-1772- Frederick Son of George II and Caroline

11. 4th Great Grandparents King George III 1738-1820 Charlotte of Mecklenburg-Strelitz 1744-1818- George III Son of Frederick and Augusta


12. 3rd Great Grandparents Prince Edward, Duke of Kent 1767-1820 Princess Victoria of Saxe-Coburg-Saalfeld 1786-1861- Prince Edward Son of George III And Charlotte

13. Great Great Grandparents Queen Victoria 1819-1901 Prince Albert 1819-1861- Victoria Daughter of Edward and Princess Victoria

14. Great Grandparents King Edward VII 1841-1910 Alexandra of Denmark 1844-1925- Edward VII Son of Victoria and Albert

15. Grandparents King George V 1865-1936 Queen Mary of Teck 1867-1953
-George V Son of Edward and Alexandra

16. Parents King George VI 1856-1952 Queen Elizabeth, The Queen Mother 1900-2002
-George VI Son of George and Mary

Queen Elizabeth II Born 1926 Prince Philip Born 1921
Daughter of King George VI and Elizabeth


Next Generations:
Prince Charles Born 1948 Princess Diana 1961-1997 married 1981-1996
Son of Queen Elizabeth II and Prince Philip

Prince Williams Born 1982, Married Kate Middleton Born 1982. Son of Prince Charles and Princess Diana

Prince George Born 2013. Son of Prince William and the Duchess of Cambridge (Catherine). Great Grandson of Queen Elizabeth and Prince Philip.
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