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  #141  
Old 09-24-2011, 07:48 PM
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I believe Maxima's train was an heirloom as well.
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  #142  
Old 09-24-2011, 08:10 PM
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I could very well be wrong, but...

To my eyes, Maxima's veil does not have the appearance of an heirloom veil. I've always assumed it was also designed by Valentino.
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  #143  
Old 09-24-2011, 08:12 PM
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Yes,it was designed by Valentino.
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  #144  
Old 09-24-2011, 08:20 PM
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Thanks for clearing the air! I always thought the veil had a modern look. I just read on the website for the Dutch royal family that the veil was made of silk tulle and decorated with hand-embroidered flower and tendril motifs.
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  #145  
Old 09-24-2011, 09:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Meraude View Post
I don't know about Maxima's veil, but the veil that Victoria wore is an old heirloom, worn by her mother and grandmother, and several other Swedish princesses. If you have such a special veil you can wear, it's a much better choice than a new transparant veil just to show off a train. As for using the train as a "canvas" for the veil, I think the train is more a protection for a unique veil, in Victoria's case a veil made 150 years ago and irreplacable.
Excellent point, Meraude. In addition, the design of CP Victoria's wedding gown allowed for the details of the veil to clearly be seen at the top of it because the back dipped down and her tanned skin highlighted the lace. Also, we all need to remember that nothing we see in video clips or pictures gives us even 1/2 of what we could actually see in person. I'm sure all of the veils were lovely. But in this thread we are addressing the trains...and as many have posted those super-long trains can seem a bit pretentious...like non-verbally telling people "LOOK AT ME! I'M THE BRIDE!" or "I'M THE PRINCESS!" which is completely unnecessary...everyone already knew both of those things. It isn't even necessarily a "royal" thing. There have been trains on non-royal wedding gowns for years, and some royal gowns have had a very small train or no train at all and have been just as regal and impressive as any others. Again it comes back to the bride - elegance and good taste are regal. One doesn't have to attach a huge train to a dress to achieve that effect if they are innately part of the person.
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  #146  
Old 09-24-2011, 09:35 PM
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Sorry i was wrong about Maxima's veil. I thought I read that she was part of a veil tradition. Anyway, isn't this thread about the lengths of trains/veils? As for Victoria's train, I think the length was fine, but there was something very plain about it that gave it the toilet paper feel like Diana's train. I guess I personally just prefer trains that have some kind of shape to them, like Mette-Marit's and Marie Chantal and Kate; especially if the bride is going to go very long.
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  #147  
Old 09-24-2011, 09:52 PM
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Her are some pics of Diana's train:

http://www.examiner.com/images/blog/...-gown-back.jpg

http://www.nydailynews.com/img/2010/...iana_dress.jpg
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  #148  
Old 09-24-2011, 11:53 PM
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I think that any bride, being royal or not, who have a heirloom veil has to take the length of the veil in consideration when deciding on the length of the train, as the train acts as a protection of the veil. I read somewhere that it was discovered late that the train of queen Silivia's wedding gown was too short, I don't know if it meant that it was shorter than the lace veil, and that it was the reason why Siliva wore the veil bundled up as she did, as that didn't look very good. If that's why, it was better option that a veil that was longer than the train.
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  #149  
Old 09-25-2011, 12:38 AM
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Didn't some brides have a veil that was longer than the train and everything worked out fine? I believe Mette-Marit's veil was longer than her train. I have always heard that Silvia's veil was bunched, but I honestly don't see it. Whenever I think of a bunched veil I think of Maxima.
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  #150  
Old 09-25-2011, 02:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XeniaCasaraghi View Post
Didn't some brides have a veil that was longer than the train and everything worked out fine? I believe Mette-Marit's veil was longer than her train. I have always heard that Silvia's veil was bunched, but I honestly don't see it. Whenever I think of a bunched veil I think of Maxima.
There is a difference between having a new veil, perhaps just meant to be used once, dragging over a stone floor and perhaps a coarse mat in church and cobblestones and/or asphalt, with having the same wear and tear on a 100-year+ old veil would probably destroy it forever.

As for Silvia's veil being bundled, compare how the veil was hanging doubled at the back of her tiara with how Victoria and princess Christina wore it, for example here: The Royal Order of Sartorial Splendor: August 2011
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  #151  
Old 09-25-2011, 11:43 PM
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With few opulent coronations (where regal robes with trains would feature among the regalia) taking place in modern times, I look to the weddings for pomp and circumstance. My preference for a long train is not about a tacky and needless statement of "Look at me; I'm a princess!" It has little to do with a stream of fabric tacked on 'just because.' For me, a longer train is about regal magic and ceremonial grandeur. It has to do with preserving some of the distinction of royalty, and with merging an historic institution with the current times.

I appreciate that a train can be too long. But, on the flip side, much of the dissatisfaction with Catherine's gown that I've read includes complaint that her shorter train lacked presence, that it was lost in the scale of the venue, and should have been longer. For those who prefer shorter trains, what do you think of the length of Catherine's train? I personally liked the train for the dress...yet I do not think a little more length would have subtracted anything, only added to its presence
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  #152  
Old 09-26-2011, 12:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Meraude View Post
I think that any bride, being royal or not, who have a heirloom veil has to take the length of the veil in consideration when deciding on the length of the train, as the train acts as a protection of the veil. I read somewhere that it was discovered late that the train of queen Silivia's wedding gown was too short, I don't know if it meant that it was shorter than the lace veil, and that it was the reason why Siliva wore the veil bundled up as she did, as that didn't look very good. If that's why, it was better option that a veil that was longer than the train.
Absolutely! Many of the heirloom veils would be somewhat fragile. But, whether an heirloom or not, the train is one of the options available for displaying a veil, as was the case with Maxima's stunning veil and long train. (This is part of the reason why it's a little hard to discuss train length without mentioning veils at all.)

The way in which Silvia wore the veil did little for me, but if it was because the train was too short to protect it, them I'm glad she put vanity second on the list of priorities!

I think the length of Victoria's train was spot on. For me, its simplicity complemented the dress well (and would still do so without a lace veil). Its length looked both regal and elegant. And, perhaps most importantly, it supported and displayed the veil beautifully.

Although I like a train with presence, I think the length must be appropriate -- in balance with and in complementation to the dress.

The Danish heirloom veil does not require a long train causing me to wonder why Mary opted for a train so needlessly long that, to me, looked way out of proportion with the dress, that looked tacked on rather than incorporated into the design, and, in part, looked more like a stream of fabric flowing off her waist than part of the bridal attire. But without it, the small train formed by the actual dress would have been inadequate. If it was lengthened, I do not feel it would have looked as lovely (the pleating at the back would have be too flat).

Alexandra, who also wore the Danish lace, also had a train much longer than the veil, and I liked it. But, unlike Mary's, Alexandra's train elegantly trailed behind her, was adorned in form with the dress, not only complimenting but looking like an extension of it. The length of her train also complemented the double effect of the bell sleeves and hemline -- there is a little more.

Queen Margrethe's train was also significantly longer than the lace veil. Despite its hard edges, I think this train went beautifully with the gown. Perhaps it is the regal fall from the shoulders with so majestic a dress that made it work.
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  #153  
Old 09-26-2011, 01:20 AM
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Princess Mary had one of the good long trains and it fit perfectly with her dress. Mette-Marit's train was the perfect fit with her dress in that it looked like it was literally a continuation of the bottom of the dress. Not something stapled to her waist like Diana and Princess Victoria. Some of the best royal wedding gowns, Princess Grace and Princess Margaret, have had short trains and the dresses were still breathtaking. If I had to make the train of Catherine's dress longer I would do it in the style of Mette-Marit. More than anything I think Kate's veil was the thing that needed to look longer; I was so happy she chose a veil that fell close to her face like old style veils from the Elizabethan and Victorian age, but I hated how it didn't go the length of the train.
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  #154  
Old 09-26-2011, 06:37 AM
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A train that is too long can often spoil the look of the gown. There is also nothing worse than seeing a bride "labour" down the isle with a clumsy, heavy train that does not "fan" out properly and just gets in the way. It never looks tidy nor elegant for that matter. I do prefer a shorter train with a longer veil that has substance and detail in the form of beading and embroidery. It also gives a lovely shimmer and regal air to the entire bridal look.
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  #155  
Old 09-29-2011, 04:29 PM
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Ok to bring in Charlene of Monaco, I liked her top train, and the way the two trains spread out when she was sitting down; but that was the only time I felt the bottom train worked well. Other than that it just looked cumbersome, ridiculous, and unnecessary. I can't recall how long her trains were, but I did think they were a flattering length.
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  #156  
Old 09-30-2011, 03:44 AM
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I must confess that I did not like the two trains at all. Trying to make too much of a statement which just spoilt the gown. In fact, the gown actually looked better at the end when the top train had been completely removed. We then got to see the back of her dress. Charlene also seemed to cope better.
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  #157  
Old 09-30-2011, 05:58 AM
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I also thought the two trains were too much. It subtracted from the overall elegance and movement looked awkward.

But as there were two... I'm not sure if it was intended or not, but the way both trains fanned out in different directions during the ceremony looked silly to me -- I wish her attendants had positioned one under the other.
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  #158  
Old 09-30-2011, 06:31 AM
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The fanning out was the best effect for me; I don't recall the top train (wateau?) being removed; anyone have pictures of that?
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  #159  
Old 09-30-2011, 10:38 AM
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The longer top train was removed when they went to the palace chapel to sign the registers. It was not shown on TV but you can see when she was signing that it was no longer there and also when she leaves. When they entered the chapel there were 1 or 2 women just inside the entrance, I assume they were the ones who removed it since everyone else in the chapel appeared to be clergy.
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  #160  
Old 10-19-2011, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by IloveCP View Post
Even 30 years on, it still looks simply stunning IMHO.
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