Divorce rumours for Princess Masako ? - Page 6

CasiraghiTrio · #**101** 01-07-2007, 06:48 AM

I didn't know about the divorce rumors. Somehow I missed that. I guess Naruhito and Masako are deeply in love, as always, but the pressure from the IHA seems like a lot to bear. I can't imagine living like that. All the love in the world is wonderful, but for someone who is very depressed.... Depression is a serious disease and apparently Masako has depression or something akin to it. I think the IHA calls it "adjustment disorder" and everyone else in the press seems to say it's "stress related." I have Depression and to me, Masako looks like a depressed woman. I think she loves her family intensely, and they adore her, at least her husband and her daughter, I don't know about the rest of his family. I think Masako is an amazing woman and I would hate to see this family split up, but on the other hand, with her depression seeming so bad, I'm not sure that her being Empress one day is the best thing for her...or for Japan.

Jackswife · #**102** 01-07-2007, 07:55 AM

I think Naruhito would pull a Duke of Windsor and leave Japan, rather than give up Masako. Empress Michiko also IIRC had a lot of trouble adjusting to palace life when she married Akihito, but I don't know if that has translated into more (or less) sympathy for the situation Masako is in with the IHA. I also don't think NAruhito has any trouble at all standing up for his wife against anyone. He seems totally committed to her and Aiko and it would strike me as very uncharacteristic of him to divorce Masako.

CasiraghiTrio · #**103** 01-07-2007, 08:30 AM

Jackswife, I admit that I had the same thought about Naruhito. I tend to feel that if Masako wanted out of public life, he would follow her. You are also right about his mother, it seems. I think the details are unknown to the public, but two articles mention the "ill-health" of his mother. Both of them are about Naruhito and Masako and mention what the (London) Times terms as "the historical ill-health of his mother..." I think the IHA is to blame. They put too much strain on these people. If the Imperial monarchy could reform two aspects (1. weaken the IHA, 2. let Aiko be Empress!) everything would be great!

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article...105542,00.html
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article...182448,00.html

scooter · #**104** 01-07-2007, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AngelPrincess

Could you please explain - what evidence is there that Kiko is pregnant through IVF? And what do you mean by IVF-boy?

The technology is now advanced to the point that if you are doing in vitro, you can either 1. spin the sperm in a centrefuge to seperate the x and y sperm or 2. more likely, fertilize the eggs in vitro, select only male embryos which would give you 100% accuracy on the sex of the baby.This technology is commonly available in the states; for those who can afford it.

corazon · #**105** 01-09-2007, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mandy

Has Masako's doctor ever confirmed this diagnosis? Can you provide links to articles/books on which you base your opinion because I don't think anyone can diagnose postpartum depression simply by looking at pictures.

the doctors said sha have depression and that start before aiko's birth, may be was hard for her have a girl, the imperial family was ..... not good....when aiko born.

A King Consort · #**106** 01-22-2007, 03:42 AM

If I were God, I'd bless Masako with twin Boys just to keep the crown within the Crown Prince's family first before trying to change the succession laws if possible... I really hate to see the Crown going to Prince Akishino's family. To me, it seems that he's quite chauvanistic.

**Warren** · #**107** 01-22-2007, 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CasiraghiTrio

You are also right about his mother, it seems. I think the details are unknown to the public, but two articles mention the "ill-health" of his mother. Both of them are about Naruhito and Masako and mention what the (London) Times terms as "the historical ill-health of his mother..." I think the IHA is to blame. They put too much strain on these people.

The Empress Nagako (Kojun) didn't help matters. Apparently she never forgave Michiko for not being a princess from one of the old princely families, as she herself was. No doubt many within the IHA shared the same view. When she married into the Imperial Family it was hoped that Akihito and Michiko's experience of the Old Guard would somehow protect Masako from the same stresses, but it was not to be.

We can blame the IHA all we like, but the IHA is not the only power within the Imperial Palace compound.

**Elspeth** · #**108** 01-22-2007, 12:54 PM

Apparently the Empress Nagako herself was something of an outsider because she was a princess from a minor branch of the royal family and wasn't a member of one of the families that usually provided the Empress, so she was treated to some derision by the palace insiders. It's a great shame that the pattern repeated itself with the next generation and Empress Nagako was part of the reason why Empress Michiko had such a hard time of it.

Idriel · #**109** 05-23-2007, 03:41 PM

^maybe one of the reasons Nagako displayed hostility toward Michiko was her own insecurities. It must have must some sort of relief (if a twisted one) to have someone to look down upon, and be, for once, the bully instead of the victim. I know it a bit of a DIY psychology, but I don't think it's too far-fetched.

Hereditary Mapmaker · #**110** 05-23-2007, 05:52 PM

Perhaps some of the more informed members of these forums can help me to understand what is going on with the IHA and Japan's royal family. I've looked up everywhere I can find about the history of the IHA and from what I gather, it was created by a Japanese emperor to assist with the runnings of the emperor's household. After WWII and up until 2002 (?) it was an agency under the authority of the Prime Minister. Now it is called an "external" agency of the Prime Minister, under the authority of a "Grand Steward".

Everything I've seen about the Japanese PM Junichiro Koizumi indicates that he is progressive and was outspoken about wanting Princess Aiko to be named after her father in the imperial line of succession.

My questions are as follows: When did this agency become so powerful? Does anyone have the authority to tell them their services are no longer needed? Can the emperor or PM replace any or all of the IHA? I understand the respect for tradition but couldn't the royal family "go on strike" until the things change? Or do the citizens and government of the country of Japan just don't care about the royal family and how they may or may not be being treated/pressured by the IHA?

Thank you in advance for any response/insights.

Mapper

Vanesa · #**111** 05-23-2007, 07:14 PM

Hello, Mapper:

I was wondering exactly the same. All people is being very agressive toward the IHA (and sometimes they are right), but we doesn't really know whose authority it has. I wish I could know more about IHA and its authority. It will be very sad that the Imperial Family could be almost a prisonner of this organism. Of course, I'm with traditional ways...but if things are like you presented them, Mapper, it is clear that tradition is not involved here...It's almost like the Imperial family is commanded by an external force...I'm really worried.

Vanesa.

EmpressRouge · #**112** 05-23-2007, 09:10 PM

Based on some of the other posts in the forum, it seems the IHA controls the money for the imperial family. And he who controls the purse-strings can have a lot of power.

Charlotte1 · #**113** 05-24-2007, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hereditary Mapmaker

Perhaps some of the more informed members of these forums can help me to understand what is going on with the IHA and Japan's royal family. I've looked up everywhere I can find about the history of the IHA and from what I gather, it was created by a Japanese emperor to assist with the runnings of the emperor's household. After WWII and up until 2002 (?) it was an agency under the authority of the Prime Minister. Now it is called an "external" agency of the Prime Minister, under the authority of a "Grand Steward".

Everything I've seen about the Japanese PM Junichiro Koizumi indicates that he is progressive and was outspoken about wanting Princess Aiko to be named after her father in the imperial line of succession.

My questions are as follows: When did this agency become so powerful? Does anyone have the authority to tell them their services are no longer needed? Can the emperor or PM replace any or all of the IHA? I understand the respect for tradition but couldn't the royal family "go on strike" until the things change? Or do the citizens and government of the country of Japan just don't care about the royal family and how they may or may not be being treated/pressured by the IHA?

Thank you in advance for any response/insights.

Mapper

Former Prime Minister Koisumi wasn't a progressive, rather he was a populist. He sniffed which way the wind was blowing in regards to female succession ( the opinion polls that showed overwhelming support for female succession) and then decided to put together a committee to look at the succession and make recommendations to parliament, who are the ultimate authority over the Imperial Family. When it seemed that the opinion polls showed that most Japanese people would only consider a female Emperor, if there was no-one else, and there was a possibility that a male could be born, he shelved the legislation to change the succession laws.

The IHA was actually far more powerful before the end of the Second World War, the reform done with the American occupation severely curtailed their power. They also had far more people and had a lot more money.
I don't know where the 2002 changes you got, there has been no change in the way the IHA has operated since the reform in the late 1940's. The Head of the IHA, the Chief Steward is answerable to the government of the day. The Japanese tax payer funds the royals and they are one of the most expensive royal families. Inside the Imperial Palace grounds there is a fully staffed hospital for the royals and their staff that sees a couple of patients a week.

Japanese in general respect the Imperial Family but considering the sense of duty and obligation which is part of their culture they don't think there is anything really awful happening to the royals. There is a cultural clash here between western and eastern values. Masako is most heavily defended and pitied in western press and scorned and criticised by Japanese.

If you want to find out about the history of the IHA, try their website, just google "kunaicho" that's Japanese for Imperial Household Agency and they have an English index with a link to the role and I think history of the IHA.

monica17 · #**114** 05-24-2007, 10:55 PM

Are the senior officials of the IHA and members of the parliament composed of people from the former nobility and cadet branches of the Imperial Family? That's the only reason I can think of why can they be more powerful than the Imperial Family.....

Why can't the family's wealth be restored to them? Japan is the only monarchy in the world whose royal family hardly have personal assets (correct me if I'm wrong). What the was decreed (with the USA at the helm) after WW 2 should no longer matter. IMHO, things would be much simpler if they have their own sources of money, so that they can't be cowed by the IHA. Then things would change, and there would be less problems in the family.

Charlotte1 · #**115** 05-25-2007, 05:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by monica17

Are the senior officials of the IHA and members of the parliament composed of people from the former nobility and cadet branches of the Imperial Family? That's the only reason I can think of why can they be more powerful than the Imperial Family.....
.

No, the IHA members aren't from the former nobility or cadet branches. But the real old guard are generational employees of the IHA, the same family would have worked with the IHA in the same capacity for several generations.
This is not the case anymore, the CP couple have as their head of household a former diplomat who had worked with Masako's father. Supervising Aiko's education is a women who is an actual Early Childhood expert with degrees, unlike the former "aunties", from the same families, cared for the Imperial children. Masako's chief Lady in Waiting is like Masako educated in both Japan and the US.
The Japanese Imperial Family never had much access to their money, before Japan was forced to open up in the mid 19th century the Emperor lived such a reclusive life that most Japanese weren't even sure they existed. Employees of the IHA devote their life to the Imperial Family and the tradition that is the Imperial Family, therefore the older ones and the ones who have worked for the IHA for generations are very tradition bound and conservative.
They do have some private money, very modest compared to other royals. When Emperor Hirohito died he left in his will 1 million yen to be divided among his children, surviving daughters as well as his 2 sons who were Imperial Family members. ( the girls marry 'out') They also privately own art work and antiques, which gets passed down through inheritance.

Vanesa · #**116** 05-26-2007, 12:39 AM

Thank you for clarifying things, Charlotte1. I supposed that things were not as simple as they were being presented. IHA's story is rather complex and we must study it more thorougly.

As for the "progressive" and "populist" thing, I wouldn't state my opinion, since these are adjectives...and adjectives are always subjective. For me, none of these words has any practical meant. Sometimes a person is qualified of being a "progressive" only for he/she is against tradition (good or bad ones), family , any kind of religion, decency, etc, etc (and there is people who things these are possitive ideas)...And sometimes a "populist" is only a person who loves the people and tries to make his happyness. (and this is considered a bad thing

) When I was younger, I used a lot the word "progressive" to speak good things about a politician I admired. Nowadays, I'm much less inclined of using this word, knowing its common meant these last years. And of course, every time I heard the words "populist" and "demagoge" applied to a politician, I take it with a grain of salt. Now, I judge persons by their actions, without qualifying them under any subjective word. If Mr.Koisumi is a cunning man who acts in a determined way just to get more power...well. That's the way I'll define him.

Thank you for all the great info work you are doing here, people. I admire you all for your work as researchers!

Vanesa.

monica17 · #**117** 05-28-2007, 06:10 AM

Many, many thanks for the detailed answers, Charlotte1. It makes things clearer about the IHA's attitude and why they act in such a manner, and also on the Imperial Family's finances. I'm also happy to know that the IHA is slowly being "modernized" with the changes in staffing; hopefully these new people will be more relaxed than their predecessors.

Is Masako really scorned and criticized in Japan? Then that's not going to help her recover, will it? Do the Japanese think that Masako's illness is partly caused by her "reluctance" to conform to palace life and that she is "neglecting" her duties by "insisting" to be a modern woman? No wonder the divorce rumors never stop....some - if not many- people are out to get her out of the picture.