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  #141  
Old 02-07-2008, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Mandy View Post
If Masako is potrayed as enjoying the high society life, I must assume that the IHA is playing games in order to convey an unfavourable impression of Masako in the public eye. This scenario seems plausible since they are promoting their pet couple Akishino and Kiko over of the crown prince couple. Moreover, who can prove that Masako's attendance at the ice skating performance was really canceled for health reason. Or, was it canceled by the IHA to give her negative publicity. The one person who could tell us the truth, Naruhito, remains silent probably anticipating another censure from his unsupportive brother, Akishino, whose lust for power is well known.
i've always thought that, it's all about power (usually is, no matter what the culture). i've always been interested in royals but it was superficial until i found the forums representing ALL the royals from around the world and i find all the families facinating from the colorful ceremonies in indonisia, to the outlandish in monaco and i must say all if not most of these people play a role and actually are working to make a difference in the world- i want to visit their countries and am more interested in their cultures because of them, in relation to the japanese royals it's just the opposite. when they were first married it was interesting, now it's like watching ants being fried with a mirror. i'm just glad she has a husband that deeply loves her and a darling little girl it would be too awful, if she was denied any kind of happiness.
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  #142  
Old 02-11-2008, 06:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Charlotte1 View Post
The Times article about the Japanese tabloids negative stories on Masako shows the difference in how Masako is viewed by the traditionalist Japanese and the western media. The tabloids feed these views, they feed the views based on their cultural expectations of Masako's role. For the Japanese she is viewed negatively 'selfish, lazy Masako only thinking of herself', the western media feeds on the whole 'poor Masako, prisoner in the palace'

There is a large difference in the cultural values of western society and traditional Japan. And yes it does all go back to the Japanese belief that the collective is more important than the individual, now to someone who has only experienced western society and its focus on the importance of the individual, the idea that the individual is not the most important is a difficult one to grasp. But to the Japanese the individual is not the most important the collective is, for an individual to put their needs before the collective is considered selfish. So the Imperial Family and their role in Japanese society is more important than Masako and her needs. Horror I know to westerners, but think beyond your cultural norm and realise that other societies norms are different. Individual needs are seen as selfish and self-centered, the collective are not selfish and considerate of others more than yourself.

Western views are often posted that Masako could be such an asset if she were allowed to take on her own role. But all monarchies are different, the Japanese monarchy has set down specific roles for the crown princess, it's not acceptable that she go off and create her own role and not carry out the perscribed ones. Again Masako has been criticised by Japanese, 'how dare she want to carry out her own role, she's selfish, her role is to be the crown princess and carry out the duties that are set down for her' So western view, Masako should create her own role using her skills ( individual is important) Japanese view, Masako is the crown princess, she has a specified role and that role she should carry out. ( collective, here the Imperial Family, is important)

Tabloids on either side present their little factoids, made up facts, or twisted facts. The Japanese media have reported on Masako's outings from the beginning of her illness, it's only now hit the English language press. Masako has never been a prisoner in the palace, she's been seen at festivals, restaurants, she regularly rides horses in the palace complex where she lives.

As far as the western press is concerned,I'll debunk a few of the more common myths, she does go out, people visit her at her home, her sister is someone that is frequently seen driving through the gates, probably too, the only person the media can identify! She doesn't need permission to telephone her parents or anyone else ( a tabloid myth) the royals have access to their money, they even have credit cards, they have private money and they inherit money as well as jewels, artwork and antique furniture from deceased relatives. The government does pay large sums of money to the IHA but this is to run all the Imperial homes, hospital, science laboratory, orchestra, shrine priests and maidens, their police protection which comes from the IHA budget not the Police budget, the farms and holiday homes. All this information can be researched if one cares to do so and in English as well! (look beyond Google and tabloids!)

Mental illness in Japan carries a huge stigma, Masako is suffering from some form of mental illness, but look into her background beyond just her life as a princess and see that she's had large amount of pressure on her all her life. At age 8( after returning to Japan) she failed the entrance exam to the exclusive private girl's school that her mother and grandmother attended, Masako then spent a year at the local government school and attending after school cram classes to pass the entrance exam the following year. After doing the majority of her schooling in Japanese she gets dropped into an American high school in the 11th grade and in 2 years has to get good enough grades to enter an Ivy League university as she knows 2 years out of the Japanese school system means she has no chance of passing the entrance exam to Tokyo University ( the most prestigious university in Japan and also her father had been a student there) Her father didn't have a son so as the oldest she was groomed to be the substitute son, follow in her father's footsteps into the Foreign affairs department. All her life Masako has spent under pressure to fulfill other people's expectations of her, Imperial Family life just added to it and eventually she crashed.

Of course she's always smiling in photos, she'd hardly be out in public when she was feeling awful! Look at the recent trip to Nagano, Masako and Naruhito attend the opening ceremony of a winter games, the following day Masako was due to watch the ice skating with Naruhito, but pulled out because of fatigue. If she can't manage 2 days in a row of duties, she's not going to manage any kind on foreign visits. The IHA press office have been quite open as they did say last year that Masako is taking medication and is also seeing a counsellor. Pretty earth shattering by Japanese standards where no-one with a mental illness admits they have one, let alone make public that they're taking medication is seeing a counsellor. You grin and bear whatever is wrong with you.
This is an interesting viewpoint and to tell the truth, all the monarchies trump the value of the collective over the individual to some extent. Princess Diana had just as hard a time dealing with the British monarchy as the Japanese ladies have with the IHA. The problem with the Japanese is that the imperial family is very tied to their Shinto religion and the emperor while not considered a god anymore is considered a high priest of the religion and I think that extends to members of his family. If you look at the rites and lifestyle restrictions of the priesthood in Western society compared to normal royal families then it may be easier to understand why the Japanese Imperial Family is so different and why their life is so restricted to the point that its so much harder for a commoner to marry into this situation.

If they continue to want to raise a band of priests to serve the country, then I can understand their wanting a male heir. Even Protestant religions in the West have come out against women clergy. But in that case, I don't understand why they don't just give the throne over to the younger son who has a son and be done with it.

Then Masako, Akiko, and Nahurhito can lead somewhat normal lives again. Unless Nahurhito's male pride would rebel at being passed over by his younger brother. But he seems pretty Western minded.
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  #143  
Old 02-12-2008, 11:04 AM
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Sometimes I think princess hardships of Japanese imperial family.
Prince are also pressed , of course,
but princesses lives through various hardships especially.
Princess who fell sick is not only masako...
YES Michiko had a breakdown,too.
And princess Nobuko ,prince Tomohito's wife,is still sick.

Anyway,princess masako is getting better.
She has warmful relationships to her family(not only imperial family),friend,doctor,ex-coworker,and so on.
I can easily imagine those relationships helps her,and it's not crimes associate with those people...
I'm not so worried about masako for her recovery,
BUT problems of imperial family still remain.
It can't be solved only say 'all problems are masako's fault'
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  #144  
Old 02-14-2008, 07:36 PM
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[FONT='Cambria','serif']I’m a Japanese and let me make this clear: strong resentment against the Crown Princess Masako shown in the comments on Times made by the Japanese do not necessarily represent the people’s feeling in the country. There are huge crowds of enthusiastic well-wishers who happily greet her at any place she shows up. As far as I'm concerned, I am not a big fan of hers, but I feel sorry for her. And none of my friends and aquaintances is critical of the ‘lavish’ outing of the princess. Some are sympathetic to the plight of the princess and respect the prince for his unshakable commitment to support his sick wife. Others are simply indifferent to what ‘s going on behind the chrysanthemum curtain. And who makes a fuss about her dining-out at fancy restaurants? Although its ecnomic presence in the world has been shrinking , Japan is still one of the world’s top ecnomic superpowers. Even in the time of the recession, the middle-class people can afford to have $100 dinner for special occasions such as birthday and anniversary. Contrary to the criticism againt her in the comments, it seems that many of her people are not much furious than sympathetic to the princess who is under attack for having a little break out of the stifling life in the gilded cage. It is only some Japanese tabloids and Anti-Masako fanatics that are having a fun digging up dirt to smear on the princess.[/font]
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  #145  
Old 02-14-2008, 07:55 PM
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thank you for your insight pamina, i'm glad to hear this from you. perhaps it makes her feel better when she's out and is warmly treated by the "real people" not the people with an agenda trying to smear her and grind her down.
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  #146  
Old 02-15-2008, 04:41 AM
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Masako is getting better and if there's one thing that may helps her and makes her happy, why don't just let her do it? I'm pretty sure that she knows her duties and understands her position as a member of the imperial family and as wife of the crown prince, and she'll do her best for that. It seems that she needs more relax and warmful relationships with peoples around her. With support from her family, friends, and people there, I believe she's gonna conquer the problems and be a great member and representative of the imperial family (as she always try to be).
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  #147  
Old 02-15-2008, 09:30 AM
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my personal opinion- the palace (IHA) wants the women weak and broken (so far it's working pretty good) they don't want her to get better. this strenghtens their arguement women aren't fit to rule and they can keep complete control of power, thus keeping their county about 2 centuries behind the modern world (royalty wise).
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  #148  
Old 02-16-2008, 04:43 PM
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I'm going to say something unpopular here.

I think the Japanese system has put to much pressure on Masako, and she probably does need to go out with friends etc.

But I also think that the critics kind of have a point. If Masako is well enough to go out to fancy restaurants, trips to Disney Land, etc. Then's she's well enough to do at least some duties. Maybe not hard duties, but surely it wouldn't be hard to let say go to the hospital and visit some patients. Or cut some ribbons at events.

The Emperor and the Empress are very old, and they said that the Empress mental health isn't very good herself..Now, the Empress is having physical problems as well. Surely she could use some help...

And I think too since it is common for the Japanese royalty to live frugally, then perhaps you don't need to go to the most expensive restaurants, etc. (Especially if your not doing the royal duties that other family members are doing.)
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  #149  
Old 02-16-2008, 04:59 PM
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Just a thought. A Doctor friend of mine suggested that perhaps CP Masako could have-----fibromyalgia. Very difficult to treat and not much is known about it...but she does seem to have similar systems. Again, perhaps "another" Country's medical doctors could help her more IF she were allowed out of Japan. Ya, dream on! Would the Palace Graymen want her well ??? And, if she were well would they be able to control her ??? I guess we will never know
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  #150  
Old 02-16-2008, 10:38 PM
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Smile Agreed!

Quote:
Originally Posted by bekalc View Post
I'm going to say something unpopular here.

I think the Japanese system has put to much pressure on Masako, and she probably does need to go out with friends etc.

But I also think that the critics kind of have a point. If Masako is well enough to go out to fancy restaurants, trips to Disney Land, etc. Then's she's well enough to do at least some duties. Maybe not hard duties, but surely it wouldn't be hard to let say go to the hospital and visit some patients. Or cut some ribbons at events.

The Emperor and the Empress are very old, and they said that the Empress mental health isn't very good herself..Now, the Empress is having physical problems as well. Surely she could use some help...
I agree with you, here. I don't think your views are unpopular. Maybe they can be thought of as being controversial, but then again ... what's wrong with controversy?

I think Masako needs to "fish or cut bait".

Get the treatment she has been told she needs, or ...

Get out of the proverbial Kitchen!

She's a super-sharp women. She knew what she was getting into marrying her ardent Suitor. She just knew! She wasn't some Babe-in-the-Woods-Bimbo who was a "green horn" at living life!

I want to see her BUCK UP. She can do it, IF she wants to.
IF she does NOT want to, then she should pave the way for her successour and perhaps think strongly about separating from Naruhito, or (God forbid!) divorcing him.

You can't wait & wait & wait forever for someone to "get with the program" especially when there just might be some monies available to treat Masako & she can go anywhere in the whole world that she elects to, to get the help she needs!

Please note: There is absolutely nothing wrong with being mentally ill. Believe me, I can tell you this first hand. But ... there is a lot wrong with not doing what you know you should do, have the financial resources to do, and ... must do in order to live the life you chose to marry into.

I think The Japanese People and The IHA have given her enough time to retreat and withdraw from HER DUTIES, and NOW, she must get back in the swing of things.
Frankly, I think The People of her Country and everyone else has been inordinately tolerant of her.
Now, they should think about demanding excellence, of her.

-- Abbie
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  #151  
Old 02-17-2008, 02:11 AM
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Sure there are the funds to treat her. The question still remains, are they allowing her to be treated. We don't know what goes on behind palace walls. The IHA even picks out her clothing, what makes you think they will allow her to be treated by physicians when its better to leave her as an embarassment so the road is paved for Akihito and Hisahito. Much cleaner that way. No crazy talk about allowing a woman on the throne.

For all we know, her being a smart woman put her in disfavor with the IHA in the first place. Now that they have broken her, why not leave her untreated and unpopular so Kiko's star can rise. After all, she is the heirs mother, not Masako.
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  #152  
Old 02-17-2008, 11:44 PM
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Cool I don't know

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Originally Posted by kimebear View Post
Sure there are the funds to treat her. The question still remains, are they allowing her to be treated.
ARE there? As you wisely pointed out, we do NOT know what goes on behind those palace walls. Are they funds being put aside to treat her?
I wonder ...

Quote:
We don't know what goes on behind palace walls. The IHA even picks out her clothing, what makes you think they will allow her to be treated by physicians when its better to leave her as an embarassment so the road is paved for Akihito and Hisahito. Much cleaner that way. No crazy talk about allowing a woman on the throne.
Oof-dah! I don't think The IHA ACTUALLY selects her clothing! That seems to me to be a bit over-the-top, and preposterous, to me, no offence. I think Designers come to The Palace (that she and Naru inhabit), and show her their creations which they think will suit her and the demands of her "job". Then, within certain strictures and guidelines, as priour set forth by The palace, Masako-Sama makes her choices. Even in this day and age, I cannot fathom where Masako would ever permit anyone to chose what she wears! And, I can see Naru throwing a "hissy", too.

Also, I have to take issue with your thinking that The IHA might prefer to have Masako be their embarrassing "foil" (if you will) so that Naruhito's Bro and his wife can take the reigns of Royal "leadership" when the time comes. I don't think so, only because I cannot IMAGINE anyone thinking so distortedly.

Quote:
For all we know, her being a smart woman put her in disfavor with the IHA in the first place.
I can ASSURE you of this: If The IHA did NOT want Naru to marry Masako, they would have put their collective foot down, and THAT would have been that!
They would not have allowed such a Union to transpire.
Remember now, that The current Emperor and Empress LOBBIED so hard, for Masako's inclusion into the family only AFTER having met with her and her family repeatedly, before the engagement was approved, let alone announced to The Media! They vetted her and her family, her background TOOTH and NAIL.

Quote:
Now that they have broken her, why not leave her untreated and unpopular so Kiko's star can rise. After all, she is the heirs mother, not Masako.
However they have NOT, as you put it, "broken" Masako! They haven't. She's has some setbacks, but she is far from being "broken".
Her affliction / her condition IS treatable!

-- Abbie
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  #153  
Old 02-18-2008, 01:05 AM
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Originally Posted by HRH Abigail View Post
You can't wait & wait & wait forever for someone to "get with the program" especially when there are FUNDS available to TREAT Masako AND she can go anywhere in the WHOLE WORLD that she elects to, to GET the HELP she needs!
You are the one who said there were funds available.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HRH Abigail View Post
Oof-dah! I don't think The IHA ACTUALLY selects her clothing! That seems to me to be a bit over-the-top, and preposterous, to me, no offence. I think Designers come to The Palace (that she and Naru inhabit), and show her their creations which they think will suit her and the demands of her "job". Then, within certain strictures and guidelines, as priour set forth by The palace, Masako-Sama makes her choices. Even in this day and age, I cannot fathom where Masako would ever permit anyone to chose what she wears! And, I can see Naru throwing a "hissy", too.
Well, they may not pick out each item, but as you yourself admit, they set down the strictures and guidelines, so in the end, what is the difference?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HRH Abigail View Post
Also, I have to take issue with your thinking that The IHA might prefer to have Masako be their embarrassing "foil" (if you will) so that Naruhito's Bro and his wife can take the reigns of Royal "leadership" when the time comes. I don't think so, only because I cannot IMAGINE anyone thinking so distortedly
You can take issue with it if you like, but there is no ignoring the fact that Akihito and Kiko are seen at official functions more frequently, photographed more frequently and reported on more favorably in the media than the CROWN PRINCE since Hisahitos birth. This is simply not done in Japanese palace protocol under normal circumstances where everyone knows perfectly well what their place is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HRH Abigail View Post
I can ASSURE you of this: If The IHA did NOT want Naru to marry Masako, they would have put their collective foot down, and THAT would have been that!
They would not have allowed such a Union to transpire.
Remember now, that The current Emperor and Empress LOBBIED so hard, for Masako's inclusion into the family only AFTER having met with her and her family repeatedly, before the engagement was approved, let alone announced to The Media! They vetted her and her family, her background TOOTH and NAIL.
I don't believe that I ever said that the IHA didn't want Naruhito to marry Masako. On the contrary, it is said that their meeting was engineered by the IHA along with several other candidates. What I believe might have transpired was Masako asserting herself AFTER the marriage and thus falling out of favor with the IHA when it was seen that she would not toe the line as a meek little consort. Also, you shouldn't confuse the Emperor and the Empress with the IHA. They are certainly not the same thing. Don't forget that Michiko also succumbed to a mental illness from the pressure exerted on her, but she was given much more freedom to move around after she provided two heirs.

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Originally Posted by HRH Abigail View Post
However they have NOT, as you put it, "broken" Masako! They haven't. She's has some setbacks, but she is far from being "broken".
Her affliction / her condition IS treatable!
Here we are just going to have to continue to disagree. Of course her condition is treatable. I just don't think that the powers that be want her treated.

The conservatives in Japan don't want to consider putting Masako's daughter on the Imperial throne. While the Japanese people as a whole are more in favor of this idea (at least they were before Hisahitos birth), the men in power are completely against it. Masako having a mental illness is shameful in their culture and promoting it so publicly is an intentional stab at her. Japan isn't the West. While talking about someone's mental illness here is met either with compassion or disinterest, it's a real black mark on a person there. All the more argument they have to bypass public opinion in favor of Hisahito being recognized with definite finality as the one and only heir. Why take the chance of having a woman on the throne who might be prone to mental illness? The accusations have already begun against Aiko. My aunt and cousins, who are Japanese and live outside of Tokyo, have told me that there are rumors of Aiko being retarded not so quietly whispered about in circles.
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  #154  
Old 02-20-2008, 03:24 PM
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For Masako to be without a boy would have been the same as Princess of Wales without any children at all. This kind of pressure can kill some women. There are many cultures where women commit suicide because they have only produced girls and the extended family members were relentless in their requirement for a boy. I can ONLY IMAGINE how it must feel for her with this weight. It might be lifted a small tad with the nephew's presence now, but it is still disappointing to the IHA and public that Masako has not had a male heir for her husband.

Gender is determined by the father/sperm. They should decide where to truly throw blame.

R.
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  #155  
Old 02-20-2008, 03:27 PM
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Have any of your tried to "treat" a broken heart?
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  #156  
Old 02-21-2008, 04:17 PM
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Everyone can be suffering of any illness there is in the world. Royalty doesn't protect you from them. But I think that before we are speculating all time about what this princess or another could be suffering from, we need to have the OFFICIAL communicate of OFFICIAL doctors about their health, emotional or physicall.

The sad truth is that we doesn't know nothing real about them. We have only rumors. And we already know what rumors does when they are spread and they are false.

The only thing we can speak about is proved facts...And we have sooo little here!

Vanesa.
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Old 02-21-2008, 06:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanesa View Post
Everyone can be suffering of any illness there is in the world. Royalty doesn't protect you from them. But I think that before we are speculating all time about what this princess or another could be suffering from, we need to have the OFFICIAL communicate of OFFICIAL doctors about their health, emotional or physicall.

The sad truth is that we doesn't know nothing real about them. We have only rumors. And we already know what rumors does when they are spread and they are false.

The only thing we can speak about is proved facts...And we have sooo little here!

Vanesa.
The IHA is notoriously private about Princess Masako's illness and most other personal things. The most we ever get is vague mumblings about an "adjustment disorder." I doubt they'd ever make a clear statement regarding her mental health.
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  #158  
Old 02-21-2008, 06:28 PM
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Then, there are reports that when they went to the Netherlands, they were asked to do some public duties as well, but they refused, but then went to all kinds of private meetings. (This I from what I hear where some of the anger is coming from.)
I don't quite understand what you meant here. Could you elaborate on that?
The CP couple were supposed to do public duties in the Netherlands?
They were invited to a dinner hosted by the Dutch Royal Family, but Masako couldn't attend it because she was sick(Naruhito did). I don't have any recollection of their refusing public duties in the country.
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Old 02-21-2008, 09:56 PM
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I thought it was supposed to be a private visit anyway, which means there wouldn't have been much if anything in the way of public duties scheduled.
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Old 06-27-2011, 02:03 PM
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Here's a post about her a couple a months ago

Princess Masako - "She's Useless" | The Royal Universe

It's so sad reading it.
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