The Royal Forums Coat of Arms


Join The Royal Forums Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #81  
Old 09-03-2010, 01:00 AM
Kasumi's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: ****, Taiwan
Posts: 2,612
A national group of judges endorsed Wednesday a bid by International Court of Justice President Hisashi Owada to seek re-election as a judge of the world court in a fall 2011 poll, the Foreign Ministry said.
The 77-year-old former diplomat and father of Crown Princess Masako who has been serving as an ICJ judge since 2003 won approval for his re-election bid by the members of the national group of the Permanent Court of Arbitration. He assumed the presidency of the international judicial body in February last year. - Kyodo News
__________________

__________________
Reply With Quote
  #82  
Old 09-04-2010, 12:06 AM
Royal Highness
TRF Author
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina
Posts: 1,734
I wish we were able to knw if this "criticism" is true or it is only a bad rumor...

Vanesa.
__________________

__________________
Reply With Quote
  #83  
Old 10-29-2010, 07:21 AM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: ****, Denmark
Posts: 53
Unhappy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Empress View Post
I'm sorry but I don't understand what the problem is with this statement. I can't fathom why anyone could take exception to what she said. She called it a blessing that she has a healthy child, and expressed concern and compassion for those that do not.

Every parent wishes for and prays for a healthy child, and are thankful when they get one. That does not mean that they will not love a disabled child less. No one knows how they will react to such a situation until they are confronted with it.

Perhaps something has been lost in translation, but I can find nothing wrong with this statement.
I agree with you totally. However, there are those malcontent elements in Japan who are so fanatically anti-Masako and her daughter that they are trying every minute to damage their images.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #84  
Old 10-29-2010, 09:26 AM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: ****, Denmark
Posts: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanesa View Post
I wish we were able to knw if this "criticism" is true or it is only a bad rumor...

Vanesa.
It seems as though it is true that the Princess Naruhito (Masako) has been verbally attacked by many of the Japanese extreme right. It is quite apparent according to some internet sites that they are trying constantly to damage her reputation. This character assassination of Masako seems to be escalating day by day and some of them are even campaigning to remove the Prince Naruhito from the position of the heir apparent.

Some internet sites report that a man named Takeda has been encouraging the members of the fanatic right wing movement to murder the Japanese politicians who are pro-Princess Toshi's ascension to the Japanese throne. They are also calling the Prince Fumihito's family the "Holy Family" and his wife the Princess Fumihito (Kiko) who gave a birth to a boy the "Holy Mother" and the "Saviour".

And ..., the Prince Tomohito (of Mikasa) suggested that the male members of the Japanese imperial family should take up concubines in order to produce more male members of their clan.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #85  
Old 10-29-2010, 10:28 PM
Courtier
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 802
Quote:
Originally Posted by iamtheoneandonly View Post
It seems as though it is true that the Princess Naruhito (Masako) has been verbally attacked by many of the Japanese extreme right. It is quite apparent according to some internet sites that they are trying constantly to damage her reputation. This character assassination of Masako seems to be escalating day by day and some of them are even campaigning to remove the Prince Naruhito from the position of the heir apparent.

Some internet sites report that a man named Takeda has been encouraging the members of the fanatic right wing movement to murder the Japanese politicians who are pro-Princess Toshi's ascension to the Japanese throne. They are also calling the Prince Fumihito's family the "Holy Family" and his wife the Princess Fumihito (Kiko) who gave a birth to a boy the "Holy Mother" and the "Saviour".

And ..., the Prince Tomohito (of Mikasa) suggested that the male members of the Japanese imperial family should take up concubines in order to produce more male members of their clan.
Masako is not "Princess Naruhito" in English she is Crown Princess Masako and in Japanese she is referred to as "Masako-sama".

The far right extremists in Japan are a very tiny group of people. And the internet is the prime breeding area of extremists everywhere but they don't reflect society in general. Nor do they have much impact on it.
Back before Prince Hisahito was born, a rally was held in Tokyo where 10,000 people (not an actual count but an approximation by the media there so easily could have been far less) protested against female succession. The number sounds impressive until one puts it in context, Tokyo is a city with a population of 12 million people, Meiji Jinja, the main Shinto shrine at New Year when families go to the shrine, has 1 million people at the shrine. 10,000 people turning up for anything in Tokyo is a very small amount of people, illustrating that few people actually cared to protest against female succession. (Factoring too that some of the protesters would have been bussed in from other areas, the far right groups have their own buses which they use in rallies)

Prince Tomohito did not suggest that male members take up concubines! That's one of those factoids that does the rounds. What Prince Tomohito actually wrote, he never said it! He wrote in a newsletter to one of his patronages about the succession problem (this was before Kiko was pregnant with Hisahito) that in the past concubines were used to produce male heirs, BUT in this day and age that was not an acceptable alternative. Considering that Emperor Hirohito in the 1930s after the birth of 4 daughters and no sons, refused to use a concubine, the use of concubines in the Japanese Imperial Family is long dead.

Masako isn't overly popular in Japan among people, but that has mainly to do with the fact that she is seen as shirking her workload. Everyone in Japan who works is stressed! Therefore not much sympathy goes to Masako, families stresses are also common, motherinlaw issues, family expectations, now Japanese families also have to deal with lack of employment. Women who worked before marriage, struggle with trying to balance their family life with wanting to rejoin the workforce. Masako isn't the only Japanese woman who gave up her career to marry and is now unhappy, there are millions of them!
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #86  
Old 10-30-2010, 03:01 AM
Kasumi's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: ****, Taiwan
Posts: 2,612
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlotte1 View Post
...Masako isn't overly popular in Japan among people, but that has mainly to do with the fact that she is seen as shirking her workload...
Charlotte1,
Thanks for clearing the situation! Well done indeed.
I believe all the speculations about "the Crown Princess's criticisms" are due to the book "The Prisoner of the Chrysantemum throne" which is full of inaccuracies and rumors itself.
I can't but say I was impressed greatly with HIM the Empress's sence of duty to perform her official routine during her eye illness.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #87  
Old 10-30-2010, 06:39 AM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: ****, Denmark
Posts: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlotte1 View Post
Masako is not "Princess Naruhito" in English she is Crown Princess Masako and in Japanese she is referred to as "Masako-sama".

The far right extremists in Japan are a very tiny group of people. And the internet is the prime breeding area of extremists everywhere but they don't reflect society in general. Nor do they have much impact on it.
Back before Prince Hisahito was born, a rally was held in Tokyo where 10,000 people (not an actual count but an approximation by the media there so easily could have been far less) protested against female succession. The number sounds impressive until one puts it in context, Tokyo is a city with a population of 12 million people, Meiji Jinja, the main Shinto shrine at New Year when families go to the shrine, has 1 million people at the shrine. 10,000 people turning up for anything in Tokyo is a very small amount of people, illustrating that few people actually cared to protest against female succession. (Factoring too that some of the protesters would have been bussed in from other areas, the far right groups have their own buses which they use in rallies)

Prince Tomohito did not suggest that male members take up concubines! That's one of those factoids that does the rounds. What Prince Tomohito actually wrote, he never said it! He wrote in a newsletter to one of his patronages about the succession problem (this was before Kiko was pregnant with Hisahito) that in the past concubines were used to produce male heirs, BUT in this day and age that was not an acceptable alternative. Considering that Emperor Hirohito in the 1930s after the birth of 4 daughters and no sons, refused to use a concubine, the use of concubines in the Japanese Imperial Family is long dead.

Masako isn't overly popular in Japan among people, but that has mainly to do with the fact that she is seen as shirking her workload. Everyone in Japan who works is stressed! Therefore not much sympathy goes to Masako, families stresses are also common, motherinlaw issues, family expectations, now Japanese families also have to deal with lack of employment. Women who worked before marriage, struggle with trying to balance their family life with wanting to rejoin the workforce. Masako isn't the only Japanese woman who gave up her career to marry and is now unhappy, there are millions of them!
Thank you for your kind reply. Well, according to 宮内庁 (kunai cho), Masako's correct title is 皇太子徳仁親王妃雅子 (Kotaishi naruhito shinnohi masako) that, I thought, it was correct to refer her as the Princess Naruhito.

Yes, I should have said that the prince had "written" rather than "said". I understand that it was 読売新聞 (yomiuri shinbun) which reported about 寬仁親王's (Tomohito Sinno) comment re: 側室 (soku****su) but am I correct ?


Whatever it is, the prince is against 女系天皇 (nyokei tenno). Am I correct ?

I also understand that the prince had referred the Japanese nationals as "民草 (tamikusa)" in the past and this offended some Japanese people.

I was also under the impression that the tradition of 側室 (soku****su) was discontinued during the reign of the Emperor Taisho.

Regarding Masako, I am under the impression that she is suffering from 適応障害 (tekio shogai) but the general public of Japan are not so sympathetic because of the reasons that you have mentioned. This leads me to wonder if the Japanese general public are not aware of the importance of the mental health issues. Here in the West, though there are some prejudices, we have become very much aware of such issues as the mental health problems. When the fact that the Princess Victoria was suffering from anorexia was established, people in general were very sympathetic towards her. It was the same when the Duchess of Kent's depression was reported, people were more understanding of her situation.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #88  
Old 10-30-2010, 06:41 AM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: ****, Denmark
Posts: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasumi View Post
Charlotte1,
Thanks for clearing the situation! Well done indeed.
I believe all the speculations about "the Crown Princess's criticisms" are due to the book "The Prisoner of the Chrysantemum throne" which is full of inaccuracies and rumors itself.
I can't but say I was impressed greatly with HIM the Empress's sence of duty to perform her official routine during her eye illness.
Oh, I've never heard about the book about which you mention here. What is it about ?
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #89  
Old 10-30-2010, 07:40 AM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: ****, Denmark
Posts: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4Pam View Post
I like Masako. I read somewhere that during a dinner she was sitting between Clinton and Putin and she spoke to both in their language. Now that's impressive .
I, too, understand that Masako is linguistic and speaks Japanese, English and French well and has a command of some German, Spanish and Russian as well.

I also understand that she was very thoughtful when Felipe, Prince of Asturias and Doņa Letizia were visiting Tokyo. Masako kindly organised a menu for a state dinner which was suitable for then pregnant Letizia. I suppose that, because she once misscarried, she was very much aware of Letizia's possible anxiety in her pregnancy. This sort of personal touch is very important and demonstrates what sort of person Masako is, I think. Probably, she is a very sensitive person that she has developed this adjustment disorder.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #90  
Old 10-30-2010, 01:12 PM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: ****, Denmark
Posts: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Al_bina View Post
Japan is an extremely cruel country, which strives for perfection and rests upon strict adherence to traditions. Throughout Japanese history, the Imperial family has been a symbol of the Japanese identity as a nation. So the Japanese will be reluctant to introduce any major changes that may adversely affect this symbol or tarnish its images in any manner. The Japanese respect harmony and do not like anyone, who attempts to express his/her personal opinion. Any person, who dares to behave in differently, always gets pressure from others to conform to generally accepted rules and traditions, receive harsh criticism, and suffer ostracism. I believe that Crown Princess Masako dared to utter “me” a few times instead of “we”. In short, Crown Princess Masako attempted to rock the boat of the eternal harmony and peace. The same situation takes place in Vatican.
I do not think that Japan is an extremely cruel country but she has her own social code which may be quite different from our sort of social code. I am under the impression that Saudi Arabia can be seen as an extremely cruel country where women are not allowed to drive cars, can be stoned to death etc..

The Japanese Emperor (天皇tenno) was only brought into the lime light of the Japanese politics and society in the latter part of the 19th century because of the social changes that came about after the extreme pressure to end her international isolation policy (鎖国sakoku) was placed upon Japan by the western countries such as the USA, the UK, France, Russia and so on. Until then not many Japanese people were really aware of the emperor's existance. They were only vaguely aware that there was a Shogun (将軍) or the Kubosama (公方さま) in Edo but their true rulers were their feudal lords (大名daimyos) who ruled their regions directly. It was after the Meiji Restoration when the emperor became more like a European style monarch, so I understand, and many Japanese people of the extreme right movement today are wanting to restore the Meiji style imperial authority which was very similar to that of the German Kaiser. Hirohito only became the synbol of the Japanese nation's unity after the WWII when the new national constitution of Japan was declared.

I understand that it was after Masako's miscarriage when some Japanese people started becoming more hostile towards her. Some people blamed her for losing the Crown Prince's (東宮さまTogusama) child and when she gave a birth to a girl, they became more aggressive in their tactics in condemning her and now some malcontent elements in the Japanese society are saying that Masako is a spy from the Sokagakkai (創価学会) sent into the imperial family in order to destroy the imperial lineage (皇統koto) etc..

I also understood that the Empress Michiko was treated quite harshly by her mother-in-law the Empress Nagako (香淳皇后Kojun kogo) when she married to Akihito. The Princesses Takamatsu (宣仁親王妃喜久子Nobuhito shinnohi Kikuko) and Chichibu (雍仁親王妃勢津子Yasuhito shinnohi setsuko) as well as Nobuko Matsudaira (松平 信子) were also hostile to Michiko, too, because she did not come from an aristocratic/dynastic background. Having said that, I understand that the Empress Nagoko was badly treated by her mother-in-law the Empress Sadako (貞明皇后the teimei kogo) as well during the period in which she was still the crown princess consort.

It seems as if the imperial family have been making some changes in their traditions for a while by the looks of its history. The Emperor Meiji was the first emperor in Japan to abolish the nyoin (女院) system in his household that his natural mother Yoshiko Nakayama was not given an official title in the court circle. Neither his concubine Naruko Yanagiwara was given a title of her own. She was later referred as Niinotsubone (二位の局) unofficially because of her rank in the Japanese honours system.

The Emperor Meiji also instructed his courtiers not to use goshokotoba (御所ことば ) or the court language and adopted the Kanto (関東) buke (武家) style language as the official language and introduced the European style dress code into the life of his court.

The Empress Nagoka was also the first imperial consort who breast-fed her own children. She did have a wet nurse for her children but whenever it was possible she breast-fed her children.

Yes, I agree, to a degree, this situation is somehow similar to that of the Vatican authority and the Roman Catholic Church as a whole.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #91  
Old 10-30-2010, 08:34 PM
Mermaid1962's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: NearTheCoast, Canada
Posts: 5,272
It's a novel that is supposed to be a veiled biography of either Masako or the current Empress. I can't remember which. Perhaps it's discussed under the Royal Books section.


Quote:
Originally Posted by iamtheoneandonly View Post
Oh, I've never heard about the book about which you mention here. What is it about ?
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #92  
Old 10-30-2010, 08:38 PM
Mermaid1962's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: NearTheCoast, Canada
Posts: 5,272
I've seen clips of Japanese game shoes where a dog's mouth is duct-taped shut and then a treat put on the dog's nose. So the poor dog is salivating and desperately wants the treat but can't open its mouth. Meanwhile, the audience is laughing and finding it extremely funny. These are on YouTube if you're interested in finding them. The way people think about and treat animals shows their regard for all living things, including other people.


Quote:
Originally Posted by iamtheoneandonly View Post
[FONT=Arial]I do not think that Japan is an extremely cruel country but she has her own social code which may be quite different from our sort of social code.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #93  
Old 10-31-2010, 12:08 AM
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Spring Hill, United States
Posts: 2,533
All social codes are different, but those of countries like Japan and Saudi Arabia show extreme distain for woman and those with differences in many ways. Yes, how you treat animals, is relective on how you treat huiman beings, too.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #94  
Old 10-31-2010, 06:26 AM
Courtier
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 802
Quote:
Originally Posted by iamtheoneandonly View Post
Thank you for your kind reply. Well, according to 宮内庁 (kunai cho), Masako's correct title is 皇太子徳仁親王妃雅子 (Kotaishi naruhito shinnohi masako) that, I thought, it was correct to refer her as the Princess Naruhito.

Yes, I should have said that the prince had "written" rather than "said". I understand that it was 読売新聞 (yomiuri shinbun) which reported about 寬仁親王's (Tomohito Sinno) comment re: 側室 (soku****su) but am I correct ?


Whatever it is, the prince is against 女系天皇 (nyokei tenno). Am I correct ?

I also understand that the prince had referred the Japanese nationals as "民草 (tamikusa)" in the past and this offended some Japanese people.

I was also under the impression that the tradition of 側室 (soku****su) was discontinued during the reign of the Emperor Taisho.

Regarding Masako, I am under the impression that she is suffering from 適応障害 (tekio shogai) but the general public of Japan are not so sympathetic because of the reasons that you have mentioned. This leads me to wonder if the Japanese general public are not aware of the importance of the mental health issues. Here in the West, though there are some prejudices, we have become very much aware of such issues as the mental health problems. When the fact that the Princess Victoria was suffering from anorexia was established, people in general were very sympathetic towards her. It was the same when the Duchess of Kent's depression was reported, people were more understanding of her situation.
On the Kunaicho English site Masako is referred to as the Crown Princess, unlike the other wives who have their husband's names eg Prince and Princess Akishino, Prince and Princess Hitachi. When looking at TV broadcasts of Masako, she is always refered to as "Masako-sama", Aiko is always "Aiko-sama". Their names are also written this way in the news reports. Masako upon marrying Naruhito, is now of the House of Naruhito is what an English translation could be. Naruhito is his adult name given for him to establish his own house or line. His childhood name was Prince Hiro. That's where the official title in Japanese with the Naruhito comes in with Masako, but she is not Princess Naruhito.

The Yomiuri shimbun is a tabloid, it writes symplistic stories in a tabloid form. So not a great resource for accurate information, Prince Tomohito wrote his opinion in a newsletter for one of his patronages, the Yomiuri Shinbun it seems wrote their interpretation of what he wrote. I've seen the original from the newsletter and therefore the whole text of what he wrote. No he didn't agree with a female succession, his preferred method of solving the problem of no male heirs (before Hisahito's birth) was to reinstate the noble families who lost their nobility status after WW2. The succession would go sideways to a male heir.

Using a substitute (concubine sounds demeaning to me!), to father a male child was last used by the Emperor Meiji. The Emperor Taisho was the son of Emperor Meiji and the Empress's ladyinwaiting. Taisho fathered 4 sons, so no need for substitutes and Hirohito refused. Using a substitute is something that hasn't been done is the Japanese Imperial Court for well over 100 years.

The IHA press office eventually made a statement that Masako suffered from 'adjustment disorder' something normally suffered by children who live outside of Japan for a number of years and have problems when they come back to Japan. From what the press office has stated, Masako has (is?) receiving counselling and has (is?) on medication. Mental health issues are not something that are readily discussed in Japan. But the main lack of sympathy for Masako is Japan now is mainly that she's not carrying out a full workload. It's been too many years as far as mental health issues are concerned, as Aiko is having problems at school, it's Masako who takes her to school each day and sits in the class with her. If Masako is well enough to spend days at school, then she's well enough to carry out more engagements is the view.

Quote:
I understand that it was after Masako's miscarriage when some Japanese people started becoming more hostile towards her. Some people blamed her for losing the Crown Prince's (東宮さまTogusama) child and when she gave a birth to a girl, they became more aggressive in their tactics in condemning her and now some malcontent elements in the Japanese society are saying that Masako is a spy from the Sokagakkai (創価学会) sent into the imperial family in order to destroy the imperial lineage (皇統koto) etc..
The idea that some Japanese people were hostile to Masako after her miscarriage is not accurate. I was living in Japan at the time, with the annoucement she was 'showing signs of pregnancy' there was enormous excitement and goodwill, with the miscarriage news there was enormous sadness and sympathy. She certainly didn't get any bad press, and pre-internet forums so no condemnation then.
With Aiko's birth, it was more happiness that she had given birth and 'well next time it will be a boy' rather than condemnation she had a girl!
And again far right fundamentalists are a very small minority group, getting older and the numbers fewer if going by how many turn up at the Imperial Palace on the Emperor's birthday and New Year. Whatever can be found on their websites are not widespread views!

Quote:
I also understood that the Empress Michiko was treated quite harshly by her mother-in-law the Empress Nagako (香淳皇后Kojun kogo) when she married to Akihito. The Princesses Takamatsu (宣仁親王妃喜久子Nobuhito shinnohi Kikuko) and Chichibu (雍仁親王妃勢津子Yasuhito shinnohi setsuko) as well as Nobuko Matsudaira (松平 信子) were also hostile to Michiko, too, because she did not come from an aristocratic/dynastic background. Having said that, I understand that the Empress Nagoko was badly treated by her mother-in-law the Empress Sadako (貞明皇后the teimei kogo) as well during the period in which she was still the crown princess consort.
I wouldn't argue that Michiko wasn't given a hard time by her motherinlaw (as are many young Japanese wives! It's the revenge of the young Japanese wife, you too can be the motherinlaw from hell!) But the other Princesses I would question. Princess Chichibu didn't even live in Tokyo in the early years of Michiko's marriage. Princess Takamatsu was quite progressive in her views and attitudes in 2002 (when she was 92 years old) she spoke out in favour of female succession. She was close to Masako and Kiko (both commoners) and bequethed her personal tiaras to them.

Empress Sadako had little to do with her daughterinlaw and after she became Empress Nagako, Sadako moved out of Tokyo to Omiya and so didn't even live in the Imperial compound where the royals live now.

Quote:
The Empress Nagoka was also the first imperial consort who breast-fed her own children. She did have a wet nurse for her children but whenever it was possible she breast-fed her children.
I would question this as well. Nagako's children were taken from her as soon as they were born and raised in a separate house, with the first 2 girls she did try and spend time with them but was actively discouraged by the nursery staff. So with her other children she spent little time with them, so breast feeding was done by wet nurses. Michiko was the one who breastfed all her children (no wet nurses) and she and Akihito insisted they live and bring up their own children. (They actually weren't the first royals to do so, Prince Mikasa, Emperor Hirohito's youngest brother lived with his children, they were Imperial children but brought up by their parents and not courtiers. Using his example helped Akihito and Michiko in pushing for the right to raise their own children. With the next generation of young royals there was never any question of anyone other than their parents raising them. Once things change in the Imperial Court, there is no going back to how things were)
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #95  
Old 10-31-2010, 08:31 AM
Kasumi's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: ****, Taiwan
Posts: 2,612
Quote:
Originally Posted by iamtheoneandonly View Post
...Masako is linguistic and speaks Japanese, English and French well and has a command of some German, Spanish and Russian as well...
This is not correct. HIH the Crown Princess can't speak Russian, since she was not able to greet late President Yeltzin during his state visit to Japan.
You are quoting the Wikipedia article "Crown Princess Masako" which refers the above mentioned Ben Hill's book full of gossips and inaccuracies.
Do we really need to discuss this topic? I believe this is some kind of endless circle.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #96  
Old 11-01-2010, 09:31 AM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: ****, Denmark
Posts: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mermaid1962 View Post
I've seen clips of Japanese game shoes where a dog's mouth is duct-taped shut and then a treat put on the dog's nose. So the poor dog is salivating and desperately wants the treat but can't open its mouth. Meanwhile, the audience is laughing and finding it extremely funny. These are on YouTube if you're interested in finding them. The way people think about and treat animals shows their regard for all living things, including other people.
This sounds so awful. I have not seen this but I do not like the sound of it at all. However, not advocating the Japanese and I suppose it's none of my business since I am not Japanese, but, in Spain too, people treat animals in such ways as in the manner of bull fighting and this weird Easter custom in which they put live pigeons in clay pots and smash them by throwing stones at them. In the UK, until recently, certain people were enjoying fox hunting. The way in which they were hunting the poor fox was so cruel. That many dogs jumping on a poor fox and tear its body into pieces and they called that a recreation. I remember, when the ban was brought into, reading an article of the Dowager Duchess of Devonshire saying that she would carry on hunting and would get arrested for it. She is a lovely lady but I thought she lost it. Oh, there are still some people who use dogs to hunt badgers in the same way. In Greece, Russia, Turkey etc people put a defenceless bear on a burning stake and call that a dancing bear. In Australia, some farmers kill kangaroos and their babies in such cruel ways, too. Oh, some Danish fishermen also slaughtered some dolphins in a brutal fashion which some fishermen in Japan do regularly. And, in Turkey, Romania etc, they put children and people who are mentally disabled in such inhumane conditions. Then, they still think they can join the EU. Oh, not forgetting the human trafficking of women and children from the former communist block. They are shipped around to other countries just like animals.

Anyway, going back to Masako, yes, she is treated unfairly and had she been married to a Danish prince, a Dutch prince or a Swedish prince or whoever, her situation would have been more different.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #97  
Old 11-01-2010, 09:39 AM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: ****, Denmark
Posts: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by COUNTESS View Post
All social codes are different, but those of countries like Japan and Saudi Arabia show extreme distain for woman and those with differences in many ways. Yes, how you treat animals, is relective on how you treat huiman beings, too.
Well, I do not think that Japan and Saudi Arabia are the same regarding how they treat women. I have lived in Tokyo for a while once but I do not remember women being treated in such degrading ways like in the Arab world. I found the Japanese women in general quite westernised and liberal in many ways. I was quite surprised to see how much they were enjoying going out until the early hours of the morning. In my opinion, some British women are more restricted because they are women (for instance, certain clubs do not allow women's entry etc). I came across some American men who were so male chauvinist and treated their women inferior to them whereas in Scandinavia women in general are more progressive.

Anyway, going back to the subject of Masako, I do think that the female members of the imperial family are more disadvantaged than the male members of their family which may be not so dissimilar to the status of some women in some parts of Switzerland where women are not allowed to vote. I do think it is rather strange when their society has this strange custom of "muko yoshi" in which the heiress of the family takes up her husband and succeeds as the head of her family and her husband changes his surname to that of his wife.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #98  
Old 11-01-2010, 09:46 AM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: ****, Denmark
Posts: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasumi View Post
This is not correct. HIH the Crown Princess can't speak Russian, since she was not able to greet late President Yeltzin during his state visit to Japan.
You are quoting the Wikipedia article "Crown Princess Masako" which refers the above mentioned Ben Hill's book full of gossips and inaccuracies.
Do we really need to discuss this topic? I believe this is some kind of endless circle.
This is not correct. HIH the Crown Princess can't speak Russian, since she was not able to greet late President Yeltzin during his state visit to Japan.
You are quoting the Wikipedia article "Crown Princess Masako" which refers the above mentioned Ben Hill's book full of gossips and inaccuracies.


Well, I do read the wikipedia but I, who does not speak French, too, can speak a bit of French if the need must be when I am in France. I think some people are sort of quite linguistic by nature and I think that Masako, too, is like that. Besides, she did live in the USSR as a child. I do not say that I speak Russian but even I know few words in Russian, too, to greet to my Russian guests. Anyway, I understand that Masako takes a great interest in the art of Russian icons. And .., one never knows if she learned a bit of Russian after Yeltzin's visit before meeting with Putin.

Do we really need to discuss this topic? I believe this is some kind of endless circle. No. However, it was not me who started this topic but 4Pam.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #99  
Old 11-01-2010, 10:22 AM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: ****, Denmark
Posts: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mermaid1962 View Post
It's a novel that is supposed to be a veiled biography of either Masako or the current Empress. I can't remember which. Perhaps it's discussed under the Royal Books section.
Oh, I see. Well, it sounds as if this book is full of rubbish about Masako or Michiko or whoever that no point for me to read it.

Thank you anyway for this info.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #100  
Old 11-01-2010, 11:27 AM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: ****, Denmark
Posts: 53
To Charlotte1

Yes, it seems as if the Japanese media often call the Crown Princess consort Masako sama (雅子さま) and her daughter Aiko as Aiko sama (愛子さま). I think this is quite unusual because when Akihito and Michiko were the Crown Prince and the Crown Princess consort, their children were called by their go sho go 御称号 (or titles).Hiro no miya sama 浩宮さま Aya no miya sama 礼宮さま and Nori no miya sama 紀宮さま. Had this custom been carried out still today, Aiko would have been referred to as Toshi no miya sama 敬宮さま, I think.

Well, as far as I am aware, Naruhito is his given name and his gosho go was Hiro no miya (his grandfather Hirohito named him Hiro no miya Naruhito 浩宮徳仁). Because he is the Crown Prince, he does not have his miya go 宮号 but his younger brother Fumihito has his own miya go which is Akishino 秋篠. Michiko when she was still the Crown Princess consort, she created a rule book re: how to see to Prince Naruhito for her household staff. The media called this rule book "Naru chan Kempo" or Naru's National Constitution, as I remember.

His childhood name was Prince Hiro. That's where the official title in Japanese with the Naruhito comes in with Masako, but she is not Princess Naruhito. Oh, I see. However, in Japanese, her real style is Kotaishi Naruhito shinno hi Masako 皇太子徳仁親王妃雅子 or a direct translation will be something like the Crown Prince Prince Imperial Naruhito's imperial or royal consort Masako. Because she was not born as a naishinno 内親王 or a joo 女王, according to Kunai cho, it is wrong to call her Princess Masako or whatever.

You say that the Yomiuri shimbun is a tabloid, it writes symplistic stories in a tabloid form. That is not good, is it ?

Prince Tomohito wrote his opinion in a newsletter for one of his patronages which was 柏朋会 Hakuhokai's newsletter ざ・とど Za Todo, so I understand.

Well, it seems as though it is not so clear regarding his opinion of josei tenno 女性天皇 but I do understand that he is against jokei tenno 女系天皇. Oh, if I may say so, it is not the nobility whom he thought about to be reinstated but the male members of the former imperial cadet houses (kyu kozoku 旧皇族) to be reinstated. The old nobility (kyu kazoku 旧華族) of Japan do not belong to koto 皇統 (the imperial lineage) that they are not entitled to succeed the throne. Otherwise, the long line of the current imperial house will be discontinued according to the prince's understanding. There were 11 miya ke 宮家 (imperial cadet houses) who were instructed to leave their imperial highness status after the WWII. Asaka no miya, Kaya no miya, Kuni no miya etc houses had to give up their membership of the kozoku 皇族.

Using a substitute (concubine sounds demeaning to me!) Well, the upper class concubines in Japan were called soku****su 側室 and otherwise mekake 妾. Yes, Mutsuhito had a lot of soku****sus.

Yes, Naruko Yanagiwara (aka Nii no tsubone) was the Emperor Taisho's natural mother. Naruko's brother was Count Yanagiwara.

Yes, the Emperor Showa was quite adamant about this and he told his advisers that "Watashi wa Naga miya de yoi." (Nagako alone is enough for me) or something.

The IHA press office eventually made a statement that Masako suffered from 'adjustment disorder' something normally suffered by children who live outside of Japan for a number of years and have problems when they come back to Japan. To me, it sounds as if she is suffering from a combination of depression and anxiety disorder. I do understand that Masako has been treated professionally for a good while.

You say that the mental health issues are not something that are readily discussed in Japan. I reckon that the Japanese are still a bit backward when it comes to this sort of topic.

But the main lack of sympathy for Masako is Japan now is mainly that she's not carrying out a full workload. Well, the Duchess of Kent has not been doing anything "royal" for a lot longer than Masako because of her physical/mental health problems. She was teaching music to some under privileged children or something. It's been too many years as far as mental health issues are concerned, Well, this sort of mental health problem just goes on and on, so I understand.

You talk about the fact that Masako takes Aiko to school everyday is something not so good but don't most mothers/fathers take their children to school ? Otherwise, how do they get to school ? I used to have a Spanish friend who went to the same school as Don Felipe of Spain. She used to tell me that the Queen Sofia used to bring Felipe to school in her own car everyday. and sits in the class with her. Oh, that is not good. I wonder why ? If Masako is well enough to spend days at school, then she's well enough to carry out more engagements is the view. Well, I do not see that at all. I do not think that it is good for a child to have his/her parent sitting with them in his/her class everyday (though we can occasioanlly help their classes as a volunteer) but this is the very nature of the mental health problems. They may be fine within their comfort zone or within their private capacity but when they are brought into the public arena, they can develop such awful panic attacks and anxiety problems.Again, it seems to show the Japanese people's lack of understanding regarding the mental health issues. I read in a health care related book that one in four people now have some degree of mental health problems.

Re: her miscarriage, well, the general public was more sympathetic about all her miscarriage, so I understand, but the far right had already started making some noises, so I understood then when I was chatting with some Japanese people. Around at that time of Aiko's birth, I did hear from some Japanese ladies that there was so much pressue put upon Masako to produce a male heir. They were saying, "kawaiso."

Well, it is good to know that the extreme right wing people are minority in Japan. However, I do understand that there is a streak of xenophobia/jingoism growing in Japan of late. The Yunohana Onsen incident was one example of this latest trend, I hear. And .., people who are associated with the extreme right wing movement are often anti-Masako as well, so they say.

Well, I understand that Nagako, Setsuko, Kikuko as well as Yanagiwara Byakuren who caused a scandal when she was young were verbally, via certain channels such as Tokiwa kai etc, hostile to Michiko.

Princess Takamatsu was quite progressive in her views and attitudes in 2002 (when she was 92 years old) she spoke out in favour of female succession. Yes, I heard that she was pro-josei tenno but did not express her thought upon the jokei tenno.

I understand that the Princess Chichibu was particularly fond of Kiko because her ancestor was a shizoku from the Aizu han and the Princess Chichibu's grandfather was the last daimyo of Aizu or something.

I understand that before the WWII ended, the Empress Dowager moved to a goyotei (imperial villa) in Shizuoka and passed away at the Omiya gosho 大宮御所, Akasaka Goyochi 赤坂御用地, Minato ku (Omiya sama 大宮さま means Big Shrine sama which refers to an empress dowager that Omiya gosho means the empress dowager's palace). Well, I understand that the Empress Sadako's chief lady-in-waiting Tsuneko Takeya and the Empress Nagako's chief lady-in-waiting ****oko Takeya were sisters. They recalled that they found it awkward to be between the Empress Sadako and the Empress Nagako because it was their duties to relay the Empress Sadako's displeasure about the Crown Princess consort to the Crown Princess consort Nagako herself or whatever.

Oh, Nagoko's Omiya gosho was the Fukiage gosho 吹上御所 in the Fukiage gyoen 吹上御苑 (the old Fukiage no oniwa 吹上の御庭 of the Edo Castle) within the Kokyo 皇居 (the Imperial Palace).

Well, I do understand that Nagako did breast-feed her children. Yes, there was an Ochinohito or Menoto (wet nurse) but as much as it was possible, she tried to breast-feed her children, so I understand. Hirohito and Nagako's first child the Teru no miya Shigeko naishinno and her sister were not sent out to another family to be looked after but were looked after at home which was regarded as something new to the Imperial Family and the upper nobility of Japan. However, later in 1930, the Teru no miya and her sisters were moved to a building within the old honmaru of Edo Castle to be looked after by the nursery staff. Akihito was also brought up by his parents first but, when he was two years old, moved to Akasaka Palace and looked after by the nursery staff, so I understand. Yes, Michiko, too, breast-fed. Michiko also requested to have a small kitchen installed in the Crown Prince's Palace or Togu gosho so that she could cook for her husband by herself. I take it that this did not go down very well with the Empress Nagako.

Anyway, the Imperial House of Japan is an old institution and has its adaptability to survive throughout all sorts of events in the history of Japan, I am sure.

Anyway, I was chatting with a Japanese lady yesterday at a Halloween party. According to her, Masako is not particularly unpopular in Japan but the general public in Japan just think that unfortunately she is not suited to the post of the crown princess consort because she is more suited to be a diplomat or something else. She said that people in general just think that her talent is waisted. She also said that people tend to say that, in an ideal world, it is better if she and her husband with their daughter could quit the imperial family but there is no such a precedence it will be impossible for them to take up such an option. She also said that otherwise the general public were not bothered about the imperial family that much but they were more interested in the lives of the Japanese celebrities etc.. People who are into this subject are some sad people such as the extreme right and people who have nothing better to do or something.
__________________

__________________
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
criticism and praise, crown princess masako, hisashi owada, masako, princess masako, tabloid press


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Prince Philippe, Duke of Brabant and Mathilde d'Udekem d'Acoz: 4 December 1999 Josefine Royal Weddings 161 12-08-2014 01:35 PM
The Family of Crown Princess Mary - The Donaldsons Chatleen Crown Prince Frederik and Crown Princess Mary and Family 200 11-25-2014 06:30 AM
Crown Prince Naruhito & Crown Princess Masako: Current Events Mandy Crown Prince Naruhito and Crown Princess Masako and Family 155 07-24-2006 12:23 AM
Crown Prince Philippe and Crown Princess Mathilde: Current Events Part 10 pdas1201 Current Events Archive 209 03-05-2006 09:23 PM
Crown Prince Philippe and Crown Princess Mathilde: Current News Part 9 Alexandria Current Events Archive 199 01-24-2006 03:58 PM




Popular Tags
belgium brussels carl philip charlene chris o'neill crown prince frederik crown princess mary crown princess mette-marit crown princess victoria current events engagement fashion genealogy germany grand duke henri hohenzollern infanta sofia jordan king carl xvi gustav king felipe king felipe vi king harald king juan carlos king philippe king willem-alexander letizia luxembourg nobility official visit olympics ottoman pieter van vollenhoven poland president hollande president komorowski prince albert prince albert ii prince carl philip prince constantijn prince daniel prince floris prince pieter-christiaan princess aimee princess alexia (2005 -) princess anita princess beatrix princess charlene princess laurentien princess madeleine princess margriet princess marilene princess mary princess mary fashion queen fabiola queen letizia queen mathilde queen maxima queen rania queen silvia queen sofia royal royal fashion russia sofia hellqvist spain state visit sweden the hague wedding winter olympics 2014



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:22 AM.

Social Knowledge Networks

eXTReMe Tracker
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2014
Jelsoft Enterprises

Royal News Delivered to your Email!

You can get the latest Royal News right in your inbox.

unsusbcribe at anytime with one click

Close [X]