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View Poll Results: Do You Think King Hussein Made the "Right" Succession Decision?
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  #21  
Old 01-03-2004, 04:22 PM
bluetortuga
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There are some who argue that Ali should be King instead of Abdullah or Hamzah. At one time, Ali was deputy crown prince after P. Hassan, at the request of K. Hussein. But Ali fell out of favor because of personal problems (I'm not sure what these problems were, some say drugs, alcohol and too much partying). Because of his problems, K. Hussein did not feel Ali was responsible enough to be king.

Is it true that Ali was recently fired by K. Abdullah? Why was Ali fired? Those of us in family-run organizations don't fire family members easily. That family member would have had to have done something very serious. I would hate to think that K. Hussein was right about his own son.

Whether he is full-Arab or not, the best man to be king is the one who is most qualified for the job. K. Abdullah is not a fool. P. Hussein will not be a shoe-in for king. As Q. Rania said in her interview with Vanity Fair. P. Hussein is going to have to work hard for any position he wants in life. He will have to prove himself worthy, as Hamzah is trying to do now.
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  #22  
Old 01-03-2004, 04:41 PM
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oh...okay i get it malak...i thought you meant he was more religious than the others...thanks
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  #23  
Old 01-03-2004, 07:07 PM
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thank you so much Banadoora..i didn't know those you told...
and thank you madonna23 for not misunderstanding me...i didn't mean to say anything bad cos i respect and admire Jordanian Royal family , esp Prince Ali...when the subject comes to Ali , i just can't stop saying i love him so much

Melek
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  #24  
Old 01-03-2004, 07:14 PM
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Bluetortuga , what do you mean by saying "I would hate to think that K. Hussein was right about his own son." What did K.Hussein say about Ali?? i really don't know and wondered :o
thank you.

Melek
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  #25  
Old 01-03-2004, 07:34 PM
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I meant that P. Ali was once deputy crown prince of Jordan. If you check old records you will see that was made deputy crown prince in 1978. Then all of a sudden in 1997, he was no longer deputy crown prince. Then the stories began to circulate that he was removed from that position because of his own personal problems. K. Hussein would have only removed P. Ali from the position of deputy crown prince, if there was something wrong. It was K. Hussein's intention at one time to make Ali king after him. At one time, Ali was the favorite son. Hamzah did not become the favorite until much later.
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  #26  
Old 01-03-2004, 07:39 PM
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oops..i see..thank you bluetortuga..yes i had known before that he lost his chance to be king in 1997..but i wasn't sure about the reason , about his personal problems i mean..
i wish he had never lost his chance...
I hope God helps him always in his life...
i really love him so much but just felt sorry for him now :(
thank you again..

Melek
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  #27  
Old 01-03-2004, 07:47 PM
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I feel for Ali too. Ali's problems began when he lost his mother, Q. Alia, I think he would have done much better if she had been alive to give him her love and support. I can't imagine how it was for him, P. Haya and Abeer growing up without their mother. I think of all the sad stories in the Hashemite family, the situation with Ali, Haya and Abeer is the most tragic. Even if K. Hussein had divorced Q. Alia, and she had not died, at least she would still have been there for children. Now, Ali, Haya and Abeer are "orphans": who do they have looking out for them? P. Muna looks out for her children. Q. Noor looks out for her children. Ali, Haya and Abeer have no one. :(
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  #28  
Old 01-03-2004, 08:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by pegassuss2525@Jan 3rd, 2004 - 3:00 pm
Quote:
The line of succession for the Jordanian throne, as it is defined by Jordans constitution, goes from father to son.
The Jordian constitution also allows for a brother to inherit the throne. Originally the constitution only stated the son should inherit. Hussein had that changed when Abdullah was small (about 3 years) due to the unrest in the area. He didn't want his son to be a target or the possibility of a regent's rule. Therefore he changed the constitution to allow for his brother to inherit.

Many people feel that Ali should be king because he is the only full-blooded Arab.
well no wonder things are so complicated.
but as far as i understand what's been said, the constitution defines the line of succession to go from father to son and only allows the brother to inherit in certain circumstances.
So unless, God forbid, something happens to King Abdullah or Prince Hussein, Prince Hamzah isn't the first candidate to be King, not when the current King already has an heir, although he's a minor at the present.
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  #29  
Old 01-03-2004, 08:29 PM
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Actually the constitution allows for either a son or a brother to inherit. The actual person is up to the current ruller. Hussein never intended until the very end to change the person designated Crown Prince. He had planned for his brother to inherit and then a family council to convene to determine the next heir. Hussein wanted the Hashimites to remain in control but wanted the best one to rule. His brother wouldn't agree to this and because of it and other issues, Hussein removed him from being Crown Prince. Whoever Abdullah chooses for Crown Prince, whether it is Hamzah, Hussein, or another brother, at the time of his death will suceed him to the throne.
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  #30  
Old 01-03-2004, 11:21 PM
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From what I know, the reason why King Hussein passed on Ali becoming hi heir, was he had a "playboy lifestyle." As for Hamzah, when I look at him I see his father, which is weird because I 'm american and have never been to Jordan. He has his father's warm smile, anybody agree with me on that?
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  #31  
Old 01-04-2004, 12:43 AM
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he's definitely the son who went after his father the most (in the looks department, at least)
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  #32  
Old 01-04-2004, 02:26 AM
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I think just because Hamzah is Crown Prince now doesn't mean he WILL be king - wasn't Hussein's brother crown prince until just before the king died and was replaced by Abdullah? Does anyone know the reasons behind that sudden switch? Maybe history will repeat itself later on down the road??
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  #33  
Old 01-04-2004, 04:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Banadoora+Jan 3rd, 2004 - 3:19 am--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Banadoora @ Jan 3rd, 2004 - 3:19 am)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-~*~Humera~*~@Jan 2nd, 2004 - 11:11 pm
Doesn&#39;t Jordan have clear cut succession laws that would put an end to all the speculation?
Jordan&#39;s constitution would favour King Abdullah&#39;s son, Hussein, to be king after his father. The line of succession for the Jordanian throne, as it is defined by Jordans constitution, goes from father to son. Hamzah is Crown Prince only as a result of his father&#39;s wishes. I think that King Hussein favoured him because he showed much more enthusiasm towards his country and his family&#39;s history than did his brothers. King Hussein wrote about that in his letter to his brother Hassan.

If you ask me, I doubt that Hamzah will ever become king. I think that by the time King Abdullah passes away, his son will be old enough to take over. But then again, I could be wrong. :flower:


P.S. Kudos to semipatriot for coming up with this topic&#33; :woot: [/b][/quote]
Actually, the constitution does not favor Prince Al Hussein bin Al-Abdullah&#33;&#33;

It is very specific about succession. It favors whomever is named Crown Prince.

It doesn&#39;t technically allow the King to pick and choose amongst his own sons (as KH wanted to do) it only allows for the eldest son to be named or he may choose a CP from among his brothers.

The constitution is on KA&#39;s website I suggest you check it out. It is cut and dry about the requirements. Male primogenture, son of muslim parents, legitimate wife......says nothing about being 100% Arab. Though Ali is the only full arab of the boys with Hamzah and Hashim being the next closest.

As it stands:

1. Hamzah
2. Hussein bin Al-Abdullah
3. Faisal
4. Omar bin Al-Faisal
5. Ali
6. Hashim

Then to Mohammed (who I think is actually older, thus higher, than Hassan) and his son&#39;s Ghazi and Talal.........Then Hassan and Rachid......you could make the line (17 or 18 before it passes out of the line of Abdullah I)
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  #34  
Old 01-09-2004, 10:28 PM
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In light of all the criticism that has been heaped upon K. Abdullah and Q. Rania, do you think the Jordanian people would have preferred a K. Hamzah instead? Do the Jordanian people prefer Q. Noor to Q. Rania? Do some of Q. Noor&#39;s critics now wish they had her to deal with instead of Q. Rania?
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  #35  
Old 01-10-2004, 12:10 AM
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Okay, they need democracy. But, which would they see as the lesser of two evils? Abdullah? Or Hamzah?
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  #36  
Old 01-10-2004, 03:59 AM
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My family is Jordanian, and I have never, never, never heard them criticize Queen Noor. Whenever she would be on Larry King Live, we would always phone each other frantically to let everyone know to watch her. When I was in Jordan, people spoke highly of her and everyone thought she was a beautiful woman. The era when King Hussein and Queen Noor were the monarchs was a good one; I think Jordanians felt very proud of them, and also felt secure. When I asked my relatives who live in Jordan what they thought of King Abdullah and Queen Rania, they just shrug their shoulders. I don&#39;t think that KA and QR are especially close to the hearts of Jordanians.... In my opinion, Queen Rania lacks the sincerity that Queen Noor has. In terms of Hamzah, I think his sincerity is very evident.... he was a favorite of King Hussein, and I think Jordanians realize that.... they may rally towards him, especially if reminded of King Hussein&#39;s letter (to his brother Hassan) and the glowing reference to Hamzah.
A problem that King Abdullah will never get rid of is the fact that he will never eclipse the popularity of his father. Perhaps some people have noticed that in photos of the royal family, whether they are taken at public engagements or the Palace, there is always one framed photo of KA, and one of KH. Queen Noor is a constant reminder of King Hussein to the Jordanian people, and as much as Queen Rania tries, she can&#39;t undo that. I think that when the time comes when King Abdullah will have to choose his successor (Hamzah or his son, Prince Hussein) Hamzah will be the favorite of the Jordanian people, with his mother (and the words of his father) as his strongest allies.
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  #37  
Old 01-10-2004, 06:16 AM
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Well put queenkat101&#33;&#33; :flower:

My family isn&#39;t Jordanian but they alsways spoke so highly of King Hussein and Queen Noor. I think that they were loved everywhere in the Middle East. I remember my mother seeing Queen Noor on television once, and getting so excited. I&#39;m not Jordanian but I&#39;ve heard about King Hussein&#39;s great deeds since I was young. And I can only imagine the amount of love that the Jordanians had for King Hussein.

We have to keep in mind that Abdullah hasn&#39;t been a king for very long and hasn&#39;t had the chance to prove himself to his people. It&#39;s very unfortunate for him that he has to work in his father&#39;s shadow.
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  #38  
Old 01-10-2004, 06:18 AM
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To answer the question...

I think that the Jordanian people would have preferred Hamzah because he was his father&#39;s favourite. But I&#39;m sure that there&#39;s a great reason for which King Hussein chose Adbullah as his successor. I think he&#39;s a good king.
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  #39  
Old 01-10-2004, 03:57 PM
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Very well said queenkat101.

For me, you&#39;ve hit several important key points.

In interviews Queen Noor always seemed very sincere and dedicated and committed to furthering causes and improving lives of the Jordanian people. Whether she felt that she had more to prove because she was part American, I don&#39;t know. And if Queen Noor lived as lavish a life as Queen Rania presently does - in ways not as visible as Queen Rania&#39;s designer clothes and handbags - then she hid it very well, or at least was more subtle about it.

I remember seeing a 20/20 or Primetime interview with Queen Noor prior to King Hussein&#39;s death, in which she took Barabara Walters around parts of Jordan. She struck me as very humble, and sometimes even embarassed about her lavish and numerous homes in comparison to the living conditions of most Jordanians. And the way she spoke to Jordanians was with utmost respect; she never talked down to them or acted superior to them because she was the Queen.

And I think that when the time comes for someone to succeed Abdullah, the words of his much loved and respected father will be what holds Abdullah accountable and paves the way for Hamzah rather than Abdullah&#39;s own son. That Hamzah seems to share his father&#39;s politics and passion and pride for Jordan and its people will be what generates support for him.
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  #40  
Old 01-10-2004, 06:09 PM
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The Jordanian RF is as evil and currup as any other ME government.There is only one difference between the governments of Syria (for example) and Jordan. Jordan does what the American government want them to do. There is no democracy, no free press and human rights are violated.
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