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  #21  
Old 01-16-2004, 01:52 PM
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would u plz read- Nine parts of a desire- a book by G. Brooks- she interviews KH and QN, and many J ppl in 1990 and in '91, c the chapter - A Queen- yes, QN was so much hated by J ppl, but in the period time when she worked her way in the White House, during the Gulf War, to make US Gov understand her hubby0s point of view, soon J ppl forgot what QN had done for the country and for KH- she was defending her own kids, had Q alia lived, she would have done the same. She's no insecure or nothing like that, on the contrary...... Alia, do u really think P Sarvath would have been a better Queen, so....plz, tell me why u're thinking that.

if u and your family are supporters of P Hasan, well, just try not to slander QN , and the rest of JRF, plz, I quote KH- The Princes and the Princesses are my children and the grandchildren are mine, too- wasn't he clear enough for u, there's no place for your Prince and his family in Jordan.

Alia, QN had her own right to do whatever she liked on her son's wed- as her husband is not here anymore,- so, plz, if u dislike QN and her kids, even your own King, just don't mention them...... of course, Hamzah and KA and his brothers had the last word , as always, it's sad u were so influenced by your father, try to think that KH' side are the leaders, P Hasan just lost everything......

I'm pretty sure Ali will do something great, he has everything 1 needs to be a great man, if only his brother gave him the chance......
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  #22  
Old 01-16-2004, 07:15 PM
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Hear, Hear.
I couldn't agree with you more shannen. alia is obviously an obedient and dutiful daughter and we should respect her for it. However, she needs to respect the way KH left his kingdom and the way he wished his family to govern Jordan.

One thing that impressed me when I visited Jordan was the way that the King and his family are so much a part of daily life. Here in Australia we are ambivalent as to whether we want a Queen or if we should become a republic. Even to the fact that the only public place you will see an image of Queen Elizabeth is in the Returned Servicemens Clubs. There are no pictures in/on public buildings anymore.
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  #23  
Old 01-16-2004, 10:27 PM
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Let's not jump on Alia. What she has to say has merit. I must admit I found it strange that we never saw pictures of Prince Asem bin Nayef at CP Hamzah and P. Noor's wedding. I wondered why this was so. Now I've figured it out. If a father attends his daughter's wedding, wouldn't he want his picture taken with the bride. Would there not be a picture of him and the bride together. But we only see pictures of P. Noor's mother. I just found this odd. I sensed from this that there was tension in the family somewhere; or that maybe P. Asem bin Nayef was not happy with his daughter marrying CP Hamzah. These are just my thoughts on the matter.

Maybe things will change by the time the official celebration is to take place. None of them are perfect. I have my issues with Q. Noor as I do with KA and Q. Rania. And learn from this: Q. Noor is treated in the same way Q. Rania will be treated if KA leaves his throne to Hamzah. There is no way Hamzah will be king. I think that KA is watching all this carefully and making arrangements to make sure his wife's and children's futures are secure should anything befall him. He's not the greatest but he's not dumb either.
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  #24  
Old 01-17-2004, 08:04 AM
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I don't hate the JRF, and yes I am an obedient and dutiful daughter in the fact I have been brought up to respect them as the rulers of my country, and do. It might be ignorance of any other system as Sean suggests but I do support them, all of them apart from QNour. I have nothing against His Majesty KA nor QRania, though I think he lacks his father's charisma, he also comes across as far more stable and less likely to make rash decisions. QRania, though spending lots of money on clothes, jewellry and houses which is what us arab girls are like, has again brought Jordan back to the eyes of the Western media, and the two of them together have already started making Jordan an easier place to live in (though old-timers like my father denounce the informality of royal protocol nowadays, and are very disapproving of the behaviour of young Jordanians going to bars, nightclubs, etc. (for some reason he doesn't seem to mind so much when its his own children in London but to see it Amman he finds outrageous)). Personally I think that Jordan has taken a turn for the better under KA which it would not have done under his late majesty. This is no longer the time for the totalitarian regimes of the 70s, and I think that KA realises that.

As for whether there is a place for Prince Hassan and his family in Jordan, I think that is one of the most ridiculous things I have ever heard. If you knew what you were talking about and sincerely respected the JRF then you too would realise that the only place for him is Jordan. The people still love him, probably more so now as he no longer wields any influence, and he has done so much for our country, far more than than QNour or QRania will have ever done. He was his late majesty's closest friend and companion, his trusted ally above all others, but we all know how the story ended, and have different ideas as to why. This does not mean that he should have to leave, he has served his country all his life and the least one could do for him is show him some respect. As for PSarvath being Queen, I think that she would have made a wonderful queen. She speaks beautiful Arabic, bilingual Urdu and English, fluent French and quite a bit of German I believe. She was brought up all over the world, her parents were both highly intelligent and very well connected, as a consequence so is she. She is also very happy to take on a supporting role as we have seen in her duties as CPrincess, unlike QNour. And last but not least, she has done so much for Jordan: she has taken on the burden of improving the education system providing schools at times when there weren't enough (namely after the great Palestinian migrations to Jordan), schools for the disabled, the first truly bilingual school in Jordan, improving the education system as a whole with the help of her husband. She also was a great friend of his late majesty's and he respected her opinion as the extremely intelligent woman that she is.
I do not begrudge the King that he is now King and not Prince Hassan, as the late majesty's eldest son it only seems natural that he should have succeeded, however I do begrudge the family the way in which Prince Hassan has been treated, and I think that Jordan would be a far better place if this division could be overcome so that KA and his uncle could work together, it would also be a much better situation for his son PRashid, who has inherited his parents intelligence.

On the subject of QNour, you obvoiusly do not understand my society if you say things like "QN had her own right to do whatever she liked on her son's wed- as her husband is not here anymore". She does not have any right whatsoever. An engagment is a family affair led by the heads of both families, in this case the King and PAzem. She had no right to help stir up conflicts between her future in-laws, and in fact should have been doing her best to quell them, to lessen the tensions at the ceremony itself. Bluetortuga, you are right when you say that PAzem was noticeably missing from the photos and it wasn't because he didn't want his duaghter to marry CP so much as his ex-wife and QNour doing their best to make him feel uncomfortable and unwelcome.

I'm not trying to spread slander about QNour, as I have too much respect for her late husband, but I thought that you might appreciate learning different sides to the story and what people think who actually know something about the situation on the ground rather than from Hello or other high-brow tabloids or QN's book.
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  #25  
Old 01-17-2004, 10:49 AM
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Alia, I never read Hello, should we take our infos from u ? u're so one- sided, yes, u did slander QN, u called her a -vile- that was awful, to say the least. Anyway, I'm sure KA had his say about everything at Hamzah's wed- he's the Head of the Family, so he's entitled to do as he pleases.
Winmanda, I agree about all your posts, I'm not surprised u're from australia..... we, who come from the West, I'm from Italy, can keep our mind as open as we wish to, no1 tells us what we must think or say or do.
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  #26  
Old 01-17-2004, 12:36 PM
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Me calling her vile was just an expression of my personal opinion. And yes I admit that my opinion of her is one-sided, but i have never said otherwise, and I have never expected you to take any info I've posted as god's honest truth, because it isn't, it is mostly from Amman gossip and my interpretation of QNour's actions, but I would expect you to at least appreciate that there might be another side to yours, and that my opinions might have challenged you in some way to come up with some interesting counters. As for you having an open mind, well I hate to say it but I think your posts about Ali showed us how close minded you actually are.
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  #27  
Old 01-17-2004, 07:06 PM
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do you think sarvath's being a non-arab has anything to do with her lack of popularity? if she became queen would that have hurt her? i know noor was american but she was part arab...sarvath is not arab at all. what do you think?
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  #28  
Old 01-17-2004, 07:41 PM
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Though she's not Arab, her family allegedly came from the Hijaz with the first Muslim conquerors and they are still considered Qureishi, and a very good Muslim family. I think people in power didn't like her because she was not the type to play games, flatter egos and pander to people's opinion when she thought they were wrong, which I must admit we Arabs are very good at doing. She comes across as very intelligent and very frank with her opinions (something we aren't good at as a people) and I think that the political elite did not like that, especially as most of them got to where they were by doing the exact opposite.

It was not the Jordanian people who didn't like her as much as the Jordanian politicians and QNour.
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  #29  
Old 02-22-2004, 04:34 PM
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Queen Noor's relationship with her in-laws & (step) kids

Does anybody know the relationship between Q. Noor and P. Sarvarth? Do they get along?
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  #30  
Old 02-22-2004, 06:37 PM
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i don't think they hate each other...too strong of a word, no? i think they dislike each other...it could be for a number of reasons...but i think it's mostly because when hassan was crown prince, there was a lot of talk that sarvath and hassan were spreading rumors about noor...
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  #31  
Old 02-22-2004, 06:45 PM
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And no doubt there is further resentment of Queen Noor since Prince Hassan was cast aside as King in lieu of his nephew Abdullah, to be succeeded by Queen Noor's son Hamzah. I've read stories (not sure if they are merely rumours exactly) that Queen Noor really wanted Hamzah to succeed King Hussein but because he was too young, Abdullah did instead, and that Noor played a big part in Hassan not being made to succeed his brother.

That would cause a lot of tension and reason for dislike between the two ladies, I would think.
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  #32  
Old 02-22-2004, 06:47 PM
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so i guess mainly why they don't particularly like each other is because both are part of a power struggle in jordan...similar to the way rania and noor are now.
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  #33  
Old 02-22-2004, 08:57 PM
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How wealthy and comfortably do Prince Hassan and Princess Sarvath live these days? I am not sure what their present situation is (though I am sure they are not exactly living in poverty) but I'm sure that if today Prince Hassan were King Hassan, their lives would be much more luxurious. And a power struggle as madonna23 mentioned, and money are two very big reasons for tension and discord between two people, family or not.
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  #34  
Old 02-22-2004, 11:06 PM
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you're right, alexandria...money and power most often lead to tension and animositiy...it makes me kind of happy that i don't have either of those!! :P
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  #35  
Old 02-23-2004, 03:13 PM
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It's been rumoured that P Sarvath and P Hassan were spreading very bad rumours about Q Noor and her kids. I don't know how true that is, and which rumours these were. There was one rumour in particular, that went around early on in Q Noor's marriage to K Hussein, that she was a CIA agent. I get the impression, from everything that I've read, that she blames P Hassan and P Sarvath for starting it.

But I don't know, I'm reading rumours about rumours. I'm not sure how true they are.
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  #36  
Old 02-23-2004, 03:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Banadoora@Feb 23rd, 2004 - 2:13 pm
But I don't know, I'm reading rumours about rumours. I'm not sure how true they are.
I've read the same rumours, too, Bandoora. And you're probably quite right about it being rumours from rumours.

But where there's smoke ...
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  #37  
Old 06-26-2004, 06:21 AM
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For all of those who have read QN's book, could someone tell me about the part where she discussed her step children because there are some members who say she treated QA's children horribly, while others say differently.
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  #38  
Old 06-26-2004, 03:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by sommone@Jun 26th, 2004 - 5:21 am
For all of those who have read QN's book, could someone tell me about the part where she discussed her step children because there are some members who say she treated QA's children horribly, while others say differently.
She speaks of them fondly in her book, but says, as teenagers, the older ones presented KH and her with a long list of grievances.
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  #39  
Old 06-30-2004, 10:49 PM
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I think KA and QR should leave QN alone and let her live in peace. I gather from the wedding QN has already "lost" one son. I can't understand Hamzah's behavior. It will come back to bite hime. As for Q Rania, she had better be careful how she treats a widow. God forbid something happen to KA at a young age; she'll be in the same position as Q Noor is now. What goes around, comes around!
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  #40  
Old 06-30-2004, 11:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by bluetortuga@Jun 30th, 2004 - 9:49 pm
I think KA and QR should leave QN alone and let her live in peace. I gather from the wedding QN has already "lost" one son. I can't understand Hamzah's behavior. It will come back to bite hime. As for Q Rania, she had better be careful how she treats a widow. God forbid something happen to KA at a young age; she'll be in the same position as Q Noor is now. What goes around, comes around!
I'm with you, bluetortuga. But I'd take it a step further and wish that KA and QR would treat QN with the dignity and respect she deserves or, if they can't do that, then do as you say (i.e., leave her alone). It does seem like C.P. Hamzah has sold his soul and, if/when the succession changes, it'll all be for naught. What the heck is he thinking?!!! I hope he matures and sees the error of his ways.
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