The Royal Forums Coat of Arms


Join The Royal Forums Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #321  
Old 02-12-2018, 04:44 PM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Netherlands
Posts: 7,800
Eeeermmm... The risirgimento by Garibaldi was exactly to kick out the foreign royals (the Bourbons, the Habsburgers, etc,) and unite under an Italian royal family: the Savoias.

The prospect of a new Savoia monarchy is very low but to reinstate a foreign royal family which was exactly toppled to unite Italy really is the most extreme position in that spectrum and utmost unlikely.

The only chance is a Prince Umberto as the one and only undisputed head of the House of Italy.
__________________

__________________
Reply With Quote
  #322  
Old 02-12-2018, 05:33 PM
Frozen Royalist's Avatar
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Raleigh, United States
Posts: 128
Well, still the fact that there are several monarchist parties in Italy like the Monarchist Alliance, which has 110,000 members as of 2012, does show that there is an appetite for a constitutional monarchy in the nation. I know that the likelihood of a restoration is absurdly low in the next few years but in the end there is still an appetite and several movements. Heck I've read several articles on the internet about Italian monarchists and their movements, I think that some have even received a good number of votes, not enough to get into parliament but a large number of votes roughly in tens of thousands.

So much for my Bourbon idea then...

-Frozen Royalist

Some Articles in Question:
D. Maggioni, Blocco Nazionale: ''Porto i valori della monarchia'' - MerateOnline

Elezioni regionali 2010: anche Alleanza Monarchica (stella e corona) pronta a correre!

L'Unione monarchica italiana: "Il 2 giugno è data sbagliata per festeggiare la Repubblica"

Cambia l'aria verso i Savoia: si tratta sul rientro delle salme

Hey Duc_et_Pair, you mind to further elaborate on your Prince Umberto statement please because the one that is currently alive was born in 2009. So are you suggesting that a kid that is only 9 years old take over as head of the House of Savoy-Aosta? Other than that I am having a hard time understanding the statement sir.

-Frozen Royalist
__________________

__________________
Reply With Quote
  #323  
Old 02-13-2018, 07:12 AM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Netherlands
Posts: 7,800
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frozen Royalist View Post
[...]

Hey Duc_et_Pair, you mind to further elaborate on your Prince Umberto statement please because the one that is currently alive was born in 2009. So are you suggesting that a kid that is only 9 years old take over as head of the House of Savoy-Aosta? Other than that I am having a hard time understanding the statement sir.

-Frozen Royalist
At the moment the line of succession is:

Vittorio Emanuele di Savoia (75), The Duke of Savoy
Emanuele Filiberto di Savoia (45)
-----------------------------------------------------------
Amedeo di Savoia-Aosta (75),
The Duke of Aosta
Aimone di Savoia-Aosta (50)
Umberto di Savoia-Aosta (8)
Amedeo di Savoia-Aosta (6)

Because Emanuele Filiberto has no sons, once little Umberto will become the most senior male agnate in the House of Savoia. The rivalry between the branches Savoia and Savoia-Aosta will disappear like snow for the sun. (Unless Emanuele Filiberto does like King Michael of Romania and drafts his own private succession to get his daughters in line).
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #324  
Old 02-13-2018, 08:07 AM
LadyRohan's Avatar
Courtier
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Sweden, Slovenia
Posts: 515
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
(Unless Emanuele Filiberto does like King Michael of Romania and drafts his own private succession to get his daughters in line).
And in so doing brings the Italian Royal Family in line with every reigning and ruling house in Europe, and in line with the minds of most 'ordinary' citizens of Italy.

And around-and-around-and-around we go ..
__________________
"He who has never failed to reach perfection, has a right to be the harshest critic" - Queen Elizabeth II
Reply With Quote
  #325  
Old 02-13-2018, 09:04 PM
Frozen Royalist's Avatar
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Raleigh, United States
Posts: 128
Well we're going to have to wait for at least a decade then if we go with that plan. Still it would be nice for a change in attitude towards monarchism in Italy, I just wish that article 139 would just go away.

In the meantime all we could is campaign and support the House of Savoy-Aosta.

It is nice that there is at least one pro-monarchy movement with at least 110,000 members like the Monarchist Alliance though. Nice to see it isn't a total lost cause.

-Frozen Royalist
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #326  
Old 02-14-2018, 07:45 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,564
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frozen Royalist View Post
Well even though there are low prospects for monarchism in the country what about the Monarchist Alliance, the organization does have over 110,000 members and is an Italian monarchist party. You've got to admit that at least 110,000 out of 60,589,445, the Italian population as of 2016, isn't too bad. It would be nice for there to be some polls, I would be surprised if they received more than 10% considering all the factions and what nots that would influence the majority of people to be in favor of a republic.

I have a couple a few ideas that may help Italian monarchism;

Idea 1: Put somebody else in charge of the House of Savoy and begin restoring relations between the Italian people and the House of Savoy.

Idea 2: Support a different dynasty, I have the House of Bourbon-Two Sicilies in mind.

Idea 3: Do something about article 139, I don't care if it to defend a "democratic" system, the whole concept of the article is undemocratic in my opinion because it doesn't allow people self determination. Honestly it's okay to allow separatist parties to break up Italy but it isn't okay for there to be another referendum on what government should Italy have, talk about double standards. Actually it might not happen the monarchist cause in the long run but at least the idea of the referendum won't be illegal.

-Frozen Royalist

P.S. I know the odds are against us in Italy but I don't see the idea of a new Kingdom of Italy as something impossible to achieve. Yes it would be difficult but who says you can't try? Look I'm very optimistic and my glass is always half full, no matter what the situation is or the circumstances, I'll always refuse to throw in the towel.
No pro-Savoia monarchists association or party has so many members in Italy.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #327  
Old 02-15-2018, 01:18 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,564
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
Eeeermmm... The risirgimento by Garibaldi was exactly to kick out the foreign royals (the Bourbons, the Habsburgers, etc,) and unite under an Italian royal family: the Savoias.

The prospect of a new Savoia monarchy is very low but to reinstate a foreign royal family which was exactly toppled to unite Italy really is the most extreme position in that spectrum and utmost unlikely.

The only chance is a Prince Umberto as the one and only undisputed head of the House of Italy.
The Bourbons were hardly seen as a "foreign ruling House" in 1860 and remain quite popular in Naples even today.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #328  
Old 02-15-2018, 03:52 AM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Netherlands
Posts: 7,800
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cory View Post
The Bourbons were hardly seen as a "foreign ruling House" in 1860 and remain quite popular in Naples even today.
They were seen as Spanish intruders and joyfully kicked out of the country. If that is not true, why are they then not today's Kings of Italy?
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #329  
Old 02-15-2018, 11:19 AM
Frozen Royalist's Avatar
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Raleigh, United States
Posts: 128
I never said the Monarchist Alliance was pro-Savoy, all they wish to do is reestablish a constitutional monarchy in the nation of Italy. Granted there are probably Savoyists and anti-Savoyists in the organization but the MA is primarily just an organization wishing to reestablish a constitutional monarchy. Besides even Franco Caccarelli, who is the party's current president, has come out and said he wasn't a supporter of the former king's oldest son, so you can't really call that pro-Savoy now can you.

IMO I think it would be best to support the House of Savoy-Aosta at his point because it least they aren't badly controversial plus, like what Duc_et_Pair said, they aren't really seen as foreigners. Plus to be fair the Kingdom of the Two-Sicilies wasn't exactly one of the best Italian states at the moment, they were still an absolute monarchy and they were rather backwards with a high amount of illiteracy among other things such as corruption.

-Frozen Royalist
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #330  
Old 02-15-2018, 11:48 AM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Netherlands
Posts: 7,800
Exactly. It was not for nothing that the risorgimento started in the Two Sicilies and found fertile soil.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #331  
Old 02-15-2018, 05:14 PM
Frozen Royalist's Avatar
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Raleigh, United States
Posts: 128
Truth be told it was rather hard to find membership numbers even when I did my extensive research on Italian monarchist parties. I did find an organization called the Savoy Honor Guard has a total of 5,000 members which could be better or could be worst depending on your views. As for the Monarchist Alliance, all I can go with for their membership total is 110,000 as of 2012, I got that information from wikipedia and I have been looking for other websites throughout the internet for another statement of how many members in the organization/party. Heck I found information as early as 2017 on the Monarchist Alliance but they didn't state anything about how many members. I tried looking on their blogs and tumblrs and nothing really there about membership total and as for their website it apparently no longer exists.

I honestly do hope they have at least 110,000 members because I'm tired of the constant bad news when it comes to monarchism lately with the former King of Romania dying and the Serbian polls being outrageously rigged, seriously who the heck rigs a poll for something like that.

-Frozen Royalist
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #332  
Old 02-16-2018, 03:18 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,564
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
They were seen as Spanish intruders and joyfully kicked out of the country. If that is not true, why are they then not today's Kings of Italy?
The Kings of Two Sicilies were speaking the Naples dialect and very popular in their Kingdom and still are in the south. The myth they were " intruders" was built after the Risorgimento.
The real intruders were those that support Garibaldi.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #333  
Old 02-16-2018, 03:21 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,564
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frozen Royalist View Post
Truth be told it was rather hard to find membership numbers even when I did my extensive research on Italian monarchist parties. I did find an organization called the Savoy Honor Guard has a total of 5,000 members which could be better or could be worst depending on your views. As for the Monarchist Alliance, all I can go with for their membership total is 110,000 as of 2012, I got that information from wikipedia and I have been looking for other websites throughout the internet for another statement of how many members in the organization/party. Heck I found information as early as 2017 on the Monarchist Alliance but they didn't state anything about how many members. I tried looking on their blogs and tumblrs and nothing really there about membership total and as for their website it apparently no longer exists.

I honestly do hope they have at least 110,000 members because I'm tired of the constant bad news when it comes to monarchism lately with the former King of Romania dying and the Serbian polls being outrageously rigged, seriously who the heck rigs a poll for something like that.

-Frozen Royalist
Unfortunately the reality is much different and the question of numbers is just one aspect. Not only that the pro-Savoy associations/groups/parties are not really big but their influence in the society is not great either. The last important royalist leader Sergio Boschiero died three years ago and today the only significant royalist voice is of prof. Mola.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #334  
Old 02-16-2018, 04:00 AM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Netherlands
Posts: 7,800
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cory View Post
The Kings of Two Sicilies were speaking the Naples dialect and very popular in their Kingdom and still are in the south. The myth they were " intruders" was built after the Risorgimento.
The real intruders were those that support Garibaldi.
Whatever the reason, the Kingdom of the Two Sicilies ended 157 years ago. The referendum on the monarchy in 1946 showed the best results in favour of the Savoias in exactly the former Kingdom of the Two Sicilies. For so far the "loyalty" to the Bourbons.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #335  
Old 02-16-2018, 08:34 AM
Marengo's Avatar
Administrator
Royal Blogger, TRF Author
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands
Posts: 19,022
Time to move on...

This thread is about the house of Savoy, their conflicts, heirs and restoration movements. This thread is not about the Italian houses of Bourbon.

We encourage our posters to maintain some connection with reality. And the reality is that there is no movement that works towards the break-up of the Italian republic coupled to the return to Bourbon, Habsburg and Papal states. People who are interested in discussing alternative histories or realities are kindly requested to take their cause elsewhere. Forums dedicated to alternate historical fiction can be found here:


Alternate History Websites, Discussion Boards and Blogs
__________________
TRF Rules and FAQ
Reply With Quote
  #336  
Old 02-18-2018, 04:19 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,564
The royalists supporting Prince Amedeo are highly divided these days between those that defend the official line of Unione Monarchica Italiana and those that consider La Consulta dei Senatori del Regno the best representation for their ideas. The question of voting or not at the next elections is just the pretext for the new dissensions between the two groups. It is not known of any intervention of Prince Amedeo or Prince Aimone to bring again unity among their supporters.
__________________

__________________
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
amedeo, duke amedeo, duke of aosta, prince vittorio emanuele, savoy, savoy-aosta


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
HRH Duke Amedeo and the Savoy-Aosta Family Julia Royal Families of Italy 351 Today 12:48 PM
Prince Aimone and Princess Olga of Savoy-Aosta and Family, September 2008- Benjamin Royal Families of Italy 349 02-03-2018 07:25 AM
Prince Aimone of Savoy-Aosta and Princess Olga of Greece, September 2008 Benjamin Weddings: Non-Reigning Houses & Nobility 135 04-30-2015 03:16 AM
Prince Aimone of Savoy-Aosta engaged to Princess Olga of Greece, May 2005 bigheadshirmp Royal Families of Italy 176 09-20-2008 07:09 AM




Popular Tags
baltic republics birthday carl gustaf china chris o'neill crown princess victoria current events cymry denmark duchess of cambridge evening wear duchess of cornwall family general news grandchild hereditary grand duchess stéphanie hereditary grand duke guillaume hereditary princess sophie infanta cristina infanta leonor infanta sofia iñaki iñaki urdangarín king felipe king felipe vi king philippe king willem-alexander letizia liechtenstein monarchy myth nassau news philippe prince alexander prince carl philip prince daniel prince felix prince gabriel prince harry prince jean prince liam prince nicholas prince of wales prince oscar princess beatrice princess claire of luxembourg princess estelle princess leonore princess madeleine princess of asturias princess sofia princess victoria queen elizabeth ii queen letizia queen letizia casual outfits queen letizia cocktail dresses queen letizia daytime fashion queen letizia fashion queen letizia gala dresses queen mathilde queen maxima queen maxima style queen silvia state visit stephanie sweden swedish royal family theatre vatican victoria



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:05 PM.

Social Knowledge Networks

eXTReMe Tracker
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2018
Jelsoft Enterprises