Tsar Alexander III (1845-1894) and Empress Marie Feodorovna (Dagmar) (1847-1928)


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1. Here is Dagmar and her husband, Tsar Alexander III.
2. Dagmar with the last Tsar, Nicholas II.
3. Dagmar with her baby sons.
4. Again with the last Tsar.
 

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Dagmar as Empress of Russia.
 

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1. Young Dagmar.
2. Dagmar as the Dowager Empress of Russia.
3. From the website called "Thyra, Alexandra, Dagmar": Alexandra on the left, Thyra in the middle and Dagmar.
 

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gaoshan1021 said:
The Tsar's Mother, Marie Feodorovna (1847-1928)

Thank you very much for the story. It is very interesting.
 
Sean.~ said:
I maintain that she is not correctly styled Her Royal Majesty. One never addresses her as such. She is correctly Her Majesty or Her Britanic Majesty. Just like the King of Spain is His Catholic Majesty and the Emperor of Austria was his Apostolic Majesty. If she was properly styled Her Royal Majesty her initials would be HRM (like HRH for Royal Highness). They are not. They are HM. I've just checked in all of the Gothas going back to 1867 as well as Burkes Peerage.

HM and HRM are equivalents.

That's why kings who are also emperors are sometimes called "Imperial & Royal Majesty".
 
Charles said:
HM and HRM are equivalents.

That's why kings who are also emperors are sometimes called "Imperial & Royal Majesty".

:)

Sometimes, but in those cases it was done to highlight the fact that the individual in question was both an Emperor and a King. No such distinction applies to HM QE II or any of the other European monarch, since as you know, there are no dual Emperor-Kings.

Second even when there were, they were not really addressed as such (with the exception of the German Emperor, but not even always then). The Emperor of Austria was simply HIM Majesty und Apostolic Majesty (for Hungary, after St. Stephen). Or, more properly, after 1868 he was Kaiser von Österreich, König von Böhmen u. s. w. und Apostolischer König von Ungarn or in abbreviated form Kaiser von Österreich und Apostolischer König von Ungarn with the style of Seine Majestät der Kaiser und König or Seine k. u. k. (kaiserliche und königliche) Apostolische Majestät. (http://www.heraldica.org/topics/royalty/royalstyle.htm#austria)

(Although, the Archdukes and Archduchesses were Imperial and Royal Highnesses after the introduction of the dual monarchy.)

In Russia the Czar was simply his HIM, and in Germany the Kaiser was also addressed as HIM, although he was properly Kaiserliche und Königliche Majestät -- or His Imperial and Royal Majesty,for the reason stated above. In Britian, the monarch remained HM, despite being Empress/Emperor of India from the 1870s to the 1940s. They weren't allowed the style of HIM, although I believe it was debated in Parliament ( I will have to check my sources for exact dates)

For QE II, a style of Royal Majesty is be redundant, as the Majesty already implies that she is royal. It would be like referring to her as " Your Royal Royal Majesty". If that makes any sense. :))
 
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Poppy said:
Again with the last Tsar.

I think this picture is her son Georg. I dont think it looks like Nikolaj
 
Sisterly love
(Dagmar with Alix)
 

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Sean.~ said:
I maintain that she is not correctly styled Her Royal Majesty. One never addresses her as such. She is correctly Her Majesty or Her Britanic Majesty. Just like the King of Spain is His Catholic Majesty and the Emperor of Austria was his Apostolic Majesty. If she was properly styled Her Royal Majesty her initials would be HRM (like HRH for Royal Highness). They are not. They are HM. I've just checked in all of the Gothas going back to 1867 as well as Burkes Peerage.

Correct. Her Most Gracious Majesty is also used, and has been since at least the reign of Her Majesty Queen Victoria. I believe the prefix: Her/His Majesty is considered to be the conventional short-form.
 
Overture

I would like to share this wonderful piece I discovered today.

It is the 'Festival Overture on the Danish National Anthem' by Tchaikovsky. It was composed to celebrate the marriage of Tsar Alexander III and Princess Dagmar of Denmark (later Empress Marie Feodorovna).

If you listen carefully you will hear strands of both 'God Save the Tsar' and 'Kong Christian'. It ends with a fantastic version of 'Kong Christian'.

You can download it from here for 7 days, but if anyone wants it after that I will post again. As it is over 100 years old the copyright no longer exists so don't worry - you won't be arrested!

I really recommend it! :D

Festival Overture on the Danish National Anthem : Download
 
Sean.~ said:
I maintain that she is not correctly styled Her Royal Majesty. One never addresses her as such. She is correctly Her Majesty or Her Britanic Majesty. Just like the King of Spain is His Catholic Majesty and the Emperor of Austria was his Apostolic Majesty. If she was properly styled Her Royal Majesty her initials would be HRM (like HRH for Royal Highness). They are not. They are HM. I've just checked in all of the Gothas going back to 1867 as well as Burkes Peerage.

Queen Elizabeth II is correctly styled by the prefix of "Her Majesty" and nothing else.
 
Are there any photos of the Empress?
 
Re:

At last! Will the Grand Duchess Maria attend do we think?
 
BeatrixFan said:
At last! Will the Grand Duchess Maria attend do we think?

I'm not sure she would be allowed to go to Russia, even for a family occassion.
Does anyone know her travel record to Russia?
 
branchg said:
Queen Elizabeth II is correctly styled by the prefix of "Her Majesty" and nothing else.

I disagree in offical documents such as MY PASSPORT lol it states

'In the Name of Her Britannic Majesty'

so i would say that is offical, no?
 
I know Empress Marie had a villa in the French Riviera and I was wondering if anyone knows what it's name is/was and where in the French Riviera it was. Thanks
 
Sorry for my question, but did anyone know which and how many orders Empress Marie and other Russian Empresses/Grand Duchesses ever had? Is there any site about that?

Thank you.
 
Actually they have opened the room where her coffin is so people can see it before she is traveling to Russia. So hurry if you want to see it in Roskilde Domkirke.
 
No, I believe they kept putting it off and changing the date.
 
It's indeed Georgiy
Here is the whole picture, the children are Nicholas, Ksenia and Georgiy
42gj1.jpg
 
Something that is often overlooked is the fact that Dagmar of Denmark [later Marie Fedorovna Tsaritsa of All Russias] was originally bethrothed to Nicholas Alexandrovich [son of Alexander II, not Tsar Nicholas II]. On his deathbed, he told Alexander Alexandrovich [Alexander II] to marry Dagmar. Nicholas died of Bronchitis. His illness came from and infection to the lungs after a fall while wrestling [like all true Romanovs love]. The illness started as bronchitis and became turburcolosis. Ironically his father freed the Russian serfs, and he died in the same year that the United States ended their Civil War. [1865]
 
photos of the engagement of Dagmar and Nicholas
MariaFyodorovnaEngagementtoNixa.jpg


1864.jpg


They were such a lovely couple, too bad that it ended that soon.
 
Warren, thank you very much for welcoming me back on to the board! :)

wetken, your idea regarding the apology is good, but it won't come to pass. First of all, the present Russian government has distanced itself from the Bolshevik government of 1918, even from the Soviet government of 1991; not to mention that Yeltsin did apologize for the crimes of the Soviet government -- by putting the Stone of Memory next to Lubyanka. Each year Russians commemorate the victims of Lenin and Stalin there.

Secondly, the idea of a separate solemn apology for Romanovs' massacre won't probably go very well with Putin -- why should he single out the monarchic victims of Lenin? There is no immediate political gain from that... I know that I'm sounding cynical now, but that's the way it is. Probably I'm wrong and Putin will go all the way, bury Lenin, apologize for Yekaterinburg and other Soviet crimes (there are several of them left that really are a no-no for discussion in Russia...)

A bit of trivia -- Volkogonov wasn't a KGB general, he served in the Army; nevertheless, his books are well worth reading, especially his biographies of Lenin and Stalin, and Volkogonov's portrait of Chernenko in 'The Seven Leaders' is a must-read for everyone who is a Soviet history buff! :)
 
Help Solving a Photographic Mystery

I recently acquired in Paris a set of three original photographs of the Vladimirovichi in a folding leather display portfolio. The photographs can be dated to about 1885-6 because of the apparent age of their youngest child, G.D. Helena, who appears to be 3 or 4.

The photograph in the middle is of G.D. Vladimir and his wife. The one on the right is the Grand Duchess and her four children (the back was labeled in French with the names and titles and Vladimir spelled with a “W”).

The one on the left appears to have the three Vladimirovichi boys with two other male adults. The one in the white uniform looks to me like Tsar Alexander, though his beard is shorter than I have seen it otherwise. The other one I first guessed to be G.D. Pavel. However, the Hussar uniform he is wearing is not decorated with the cords that I have otherwise seen in pictures of G.D. Pavel. Also, the man in the photo has less hair on his forehead than I have seen in photos of Pavel.

The photos have an embossed old-style cyrillic word at the bottom, presumably the name of photographic studio. In transliterated Russian it appears to me to be: Levtuxii . Also, the leather portfolio has the following on the back: Tonnel, 12 rue de la Paix, Paris. I checked and there is no company of that name presently at the address mentioned.

The provenance of the photos is also somewhat of a mystery.

The dealer is reputable, someone I met originally on a previous trip to Paris eight years ago. He is almost 90 and of Russian origin, though he left Russia in the 1960s. He told me he purchased them around 1970 in Rome from a relative (variously granddaughter or niece) of the former governess of G.D. Olga, the dowager Queen of Greece who was a daughter of G.D. Konstantin Nikolaevich. He also gave me reason on at least one of my visits to conclude that they had originally belonged to the Olga herself.

The specifics differed slightly during the three times I visited him, but that can be understood given his age and health and the fact that his daughter was on one occasion prompting him to recite again the provenance.

One corroborating fact is that eight years ago he had for sale a large leather portfolio containing two oval glass-covered photographs of G.D. Pavel and his first wife, Alexandra of Greece, who was Queen Olga’s daughter. (I foolishly delayed my decision to purchase it for a month during which it sold to someone else). He told me that all his Russian imperial artifacts came from this one purchase).

All that being said, why would Queen Olga’s governess (or perhaps more likely Queen Olga herself) have had three photos of the Vladimirovichi? Perhaps it was normal for members of the Imperial Family to share photos back and forth.

Any help identifying/confirming my identification as well as speculation on their provenance would be very much appreciated.
 

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