Suitors and possible matches for the daughters of Nicholas II

[zehra.gurler]

If this has been discussed already you may link me to the discussion and delete this thread. If not I wondered who were serious contenders for Olga's hand in marriage?

 

[Marc23]

She was linked with Grand Duke Dmitri Pavlovich,but nothing came of it due to his dislike for Rasputin...she was further linked with Prince Carol of Romania,but both of them didn't like each other...She was linked with future Edward VIII and also with future King Alexander of Yugoslavia,who,according to Nicholas II's observations,paid most attention to her sister Tatiana.Marriage negotiations ended due to the outbreak of World War I,but Tatiana still managed to exchange some letters with him...

Apart from that Olga had a crush on several officers but that kind of marriage was impossible.One of them was Pavel Voronov,who married later Countess Olga Kleinmichel,lady in waiting at the Court...

The other was was Dmitri Chakh-Bagov,a wounded soldier she cared for when she was a Red Cross nurse.There was also an officer named Volodia Volkomski,who,according to Empress Alexandra "always has a smile or two for her"...

 

[Vasillisos Markos]

From what I have read, both Empress Alexandra and Queen Marie (perhaps she was still the Crown Princess then) of Rumania both decided that they would not force their children into a match but would let nature take its course. It makes one wonder if such a marriage had occurred prior to the outbreak of war, would Olga's descendants be alive today?

 

[fandesacs2003]

I read somewhere that Tzarine Alix was not really willing to be separated from her daughters, and this was the reason she did not really favoured anyone of the mach proposals, as they were not few, at least for the two older girls.
At the moment of the revolution, Olga was 22 and Tatiana 20. At this age, they should have been married. But Tzarina pretended not to accept non christian-othodox pretenders. The orthodox princes of a similar level than an Imperial Grand-Duchess, were only Crownprinces on Balcans (Romania, Serbia), but they were fresh royalties, and considered too far from her "civilized world".
It is very sad, because if she was less hysterical, at least the two girls would have survived!!

 

[Marc23]

I read somewhere that Tzarine Alix was not really willing to be separated from her daughters, and this was the reason she did not really favoured anyone of the mach proposals, as they were not few, at least for the two older girls.

Yet she wanted a foreign Prince for her daughters...when Tatiana's first crush Dmitri Malama visited them on March 17,1916 Alexandra wrote to Nicholas II:""My little Malama came for an hour yesterday evening...Looks flourishing more of a man now, an adorable boy still. I must say a perfect son in law he w(ou)ld have been – why are foreign P(rin)ces not as nice?"

 

[zehra.gurler]

Hmmmmm that's odd. Yet another addition to the list of Alexandra's incompetences as an Empress. Seems she didn't put much thought or effort into seeking a good match for her daughters. Not as much as their great grandmother's Queen Louise and Queen Victoria.

 

[AristoCat]

Yet she wanted a foreign Prince for her daughters...when Tatiana's first crush Dmitri Malama visited them on March 17,1916 Alexandra wrote to Nicholas II:""My little Malama came for an hour yesterday evening...Looks flourishing more of a man now, an adorable boy still. I must say a perfect son in law he w(ou)ld have been – why are foreign P(rin)ces not as nice?"

I don't think Alexandra wanted her daughters to marry, she kept them in an immature state and stunted their emotional and psychological growth. For the life of me, go figure, she really really knew how to mess a lot of things up.

Supposedly Grand Duchess Vladimir wanted her son Boris matched with Olga, but Alexandra was horrified at the thought, mainly because of the 'fast' set that Boris lived his life in.

 

[fandesacs2003]

I don't think Alexandra wanted her daughters to marry, she kept them in an immature state and stunted their emotional and psychological growth. For the life of me, go figure, she really really knew how to mess a lot of things up.

I have exactly the same opinion. She was abnormaly bound to her kids....

 

[Marc23]

I don't think Alexandra wanted her daughters to marry, she kept them in an immature state and stunted their emotional and psychological growth.

True,I agree to that,but the fact that she,in a letter to Nicholas II,regretted that there are no foreign Princes like the officer Malama admitted that she hoped to marry OTMA one day to some of them...

 

[AristoCat]

I understand that, but Alix really wasn't letting herself think realistically about it. She was happy with Nicholas, but I don't think Alix really, really would have been willing to let go. Alexandra on one hand wanted them to be happy, but wanted them to make 'worthy' matches as well, which si just an excuse to keep them cloistered and stunted.

 

[zehra.gurler]

I don't think Alexandra wanted her daughters to marry, she kept them in an immature state and stunted their emotional and psychological growth. For the life of me, go figure, she really really knew how to mess a lot of things up.

Supposedly Grand Duchess Vladimir wanted her son Boris matched with Olga, but Alexandra was horrified at the thought, mainly because of the 'fast' set that Boris lived his life in.

Not to mention the odd tension between Grand Duchess Maria Pavlovna and Alexandra. I'm sure that put her off Boris.

 

[zehra.gurler]

Quiet surprised that at 22 G. D Olga didn't have more serious suitors besides the rumoured intentions and suggestions.

 

[Daria_S]

Quiet surprised that at 22 G. D Olga didn't have more serious suitors besides the rumoured intentions and suggestions.

I'm not too shocked at this, because Olga grew up isolated from her peers. Her parents (mother specifically) didn't encourage her or their other children to develop friendships or relationships outside of the immediate family circle. Olga was a very intelligent individual, but even those who are intelligent, if not given the proper opportunities to socialize and grow will end up being alone. It's sad that these children were not allowed to reach their full potential, and not just by their parents, but by their untimely deaths.

 

[AristoCat]

I just wonder, if Olga would have been allowed at all. Alexandra was in a lot of ways a fatalist and I don't think that she would have found anyone good enough, beyond just being a mother. She was keeping them under such a tight rein and I am sure that she never would have let them marry, except under a howl of protest. Nicholas was so passive that it's no wonder that none of them had the ability to really get lives of their own beyond their mother's problems and Alexei's problems. I always wondered why Alexandra was so determined to cut them off the way she was.

 

[NGalitzine]

Its not like there was a lot of opportunity for them to marry prior to WWI. They were still young, not exactly over the hill. Carol of Roumania was not exactly a good bet as a husband and Boris of Russia as well as being a close relative did not have the best of reputations as far as women were concerned.

 

[XeniaCasaraghi]

Olga and Tatiana were quite old to still be unmarried and having no prospects. I believe it was Olga who stated that she never wanted to leave Russia; wouldn't that have been a hard hurdle to finding a husband of a Emperor's daughter within the boundaries of Russia? I assume that the only suitable candidates would have had to have been within her own family.
Taking into consideration that there was fear that Alexie would not live long, Nicholas should have married his older daughters off (Victoria had her married by 18) and seen if one of them had a son who could succeed him if Alexie indeed died.
Alexandra did stifle her children and their development and kept them emotionally and socially immature; but Nicholas allowed her to isolate them and himself from his family and the outside world.
BTW could you imagine what kind of Mother-in-law Alexandra would be?

 

[NGalitzine]

No son of Nicholas's daughters could have succeeded but for the extinction of the male line of the Romanoff family. Olga and Tatiana were only 19 & 17 when WWI began in 1914 which hardly made them old maids in that time period.

 

[XeniaCasaraghi]

I forgot the line doesn't go through the females.
As has been stated before, royal brides were married by 18 and prospects were mentioned long before that. With Olga and Tatiana there was no talk and Olga should have been married by at least 18. But by the time they died they were more akin to a 16yr old as opposed to being in their early 20s.

 

[AristoCat]

Olga and Tatiana were quite old to still be unmarried and having no prospects. I believe it was Olga who stated that she never wanted to leave Russia; wouldn't that have been a hard hurdle to finding a husband of a Emperor's daughter within the boundaries of Russia? I assume that the only suitable candidates would have had to have been within her own family.
Taking into consideration that there was fear that Alexie would not live long, Nicholas should have married his older daughters off (Victoria had her married by 18) and seen if one of them had a son who could succeed him if Alexie indeed died.
Alexandra did stifle her children and their development and kept them emotionally and socially immature; but Nicholas allowed her to isolate them and himself from his family and the outside world.
BTW could you imagine what kind of Mother-in-law Alexandra would be?

I think Alexandra would have been a horrible mother-in-law, mainly because she would have been miserable with a daughter married and she would never have found a prince 'nice enough,' but couldn't view any of the Russian aristocracy with favor, mainly since she viewed the entire aristocracy as corrupt and without any semblence of decency. I am sure that with all the princes there, that someone appropriate owuld have been found, but in the end, then I am sure that no one would have been good enough. Since Olga didn't want to leave Russia, who knows how things would have ended up. It was a quandry, mainly since there were the Pauline Laws and again, Nicholas was shirking his job as a father to see his kids grow up healthy and shirking his job as Emperor to ensure the continuation of the line. In 1914 and 1916 the girls should have been finding husbands and ended up securing the line. Usually at sixteen Romanov girls married and had kids of thier own and there was no shortage of princes that would have made fine husbands.

So, a commoner wouldn't be good enough, but a prince wouldn't be nice enough, so it was a no-win situation with anyone.

 

[XeniaCasaraghi]

There is also the mystery of which daughter was a carrier; I wonder if danger of passing on the disease ever occured to Nicholas and Alexandra? There was a zone of silence when it came to Alix getting married and she appeared to be in denial that she was possibly a carrier.

 

[Marc23]

Since Olga didn't want to leave Russia, who knows how things would have ended up

It could easily be the same case as was with Oldenburg and Leuchtenberg families...marry her off to some foreign Prince under the condition to live in Russia...Alexandra's grandmother Victoria did the same with her sons in law,Prince Christian von Schleswig-Holstein and Prince Heinrich von Battenberg!

 

[NGalitzine]

In 1914 and 1916 the girls should have been finding husbands and ended up securing the line. Usually at sixteen Romanov girls married and had kids of thier own and there was no shortage of princes that would have made fine husbands.

Well there was a little news event called WWI going on between 1914-1918 you might of heard of. That rather limited the marriage markets for foreign husbands. Most of the male Romanoffs were serving on active duty so that limited national husbands. Had they married Russian aristocrats they would have lost their already limited spot in the succession. Also girls could not pass on succession rights except in the absence of male heirs and at that time the Romanovs had no shortage of males able to succeed to the throne should Alexis fail to survive his father.

 

[XeniaCasaraghi]

For the love of gawd stop bringing up WWI like we haven't heard of it! We all know WWI occurred in 1914, the point people are making is that long before that Tatiana and Olga's marriage prospects should have been in order, Olga could have been married by 1914; someone else has mentioned that other Russian royal women were being married by 16; Olga was 18 or 19 by the time WWI broke out.

 

[AristoCat]

Alexandra knew it was a possibility because it was so much a part of her family. There is the possibility and I am sure it was there, but who knows. Sometimes it's just one kid that gets it, but then there might eb more. I am optimistic that she might have had a healthy boy, but it was always possible.

 

[zehra.gurler]

For the love of gawd stop bringing up WWI like we haven't heard of it! We all know WWI occurred in 1914, the point people are making is that long before that Tatiana and Olga's marriage prospects should have been in order, Olga could have been married by 1914; someone else has mentioned that other Russian royal women were being married by 16; Olga was 18 or 19 by the time WWI broke out.

You took the words right out of my mouth. If not Tatiana, Olga should have been engaged. I'm sure there were many out there considering the daughter of a Tsar. I don't claim to be an expert of the Romanov family, I just find it really strange at 19 she wasn't even engaged or inspected seriously by future mother in laws. I think Alexandra not only ruined Nicholas's reign but also would have probably arranged unsuited marriages and glued the girls by her side. Not to mention perhaps no one liked the idea of Alexandra as mother in law lol - bad omen? The girls said "I never want to leave Russia or convert" oh come on, I think 80% of princesses said the same thing as potential brides.......Her mum had the same difficulty. I don't think that was the reason she was unmarried. Something tells me the big pair would have had dysfunctional marriages with Alexandra over involved anyway.

 

[AristoCat]

I do remmeber that Alexndra pushed her friend Anna Vyrubova into an unpleasant marriage, which was annulled based on non-consummation so quite frankly her matchmaking skills were more than a little questionable.

 

[NGalitzine]

For the record The Tsars sisters Xenia and Olga both married at age 19, in Olga's case rather unwillingly, so the Tsars daughters were not exactly old maids as far as the marriage market went. The Empress herself was 22 when she married the Tsar. Had not the war interferred it is quite possible suitable husbands could have been found. I am not convinced the Empress would have stopped them from marrying but do not think either parent would have forced them into marriages of convenience just to have them married.
Since Nicholas allowed his sister Olga to divorce and remarry to a Russian commoner during the war it is possible if the monarchy had survived he may have alllowed his daughters more freedom to marry members of the aristocracy after the war. There would certainly have been no appetite for a German spouse after the war so marriage to a Russian with a good war record may have proved quite popular, especially if Russia had moved to a more limited constitutional monarchy. JMO.

 

[AristoCat]

Nicholas was pretty much under Alexandra's thumb and she was determinedly keeping her daughters emotionally and psychologically immature. She wasn't really sounding like she was grooming them for marriage. Why else would the girls sound so immature according to their captors and why would Alexandra refuse a perfectly legitimate marriage proposal to Grand Duke Boris Vladirmirovich?

 

[Grandduchess24]

Crown prince Carol of Romania and the future Edward VIII and Alexander I of Yugoslavia were suitors that were proposed to her but she "wanted to marry a Russian and stay in Russia" so I thought why the czar and czarina never throught about HIH grand duke Constantine constantinovich who actually had a crush on Olga but unfortunately both olga and Constantine died in 1918 at the hands of the Bolsheviks.also a one time fiancee was grand duke dmitri pavlovich but it was called off due to the rasputin thing .

Grand duchess Tatiana was of marriable age but who could have been their husbands if they had not died in 1918.

 

[NGalitzine]

Boris didnt have the best reputaion, being something of a well known rake. Also his clan, the Vladimirs, were not exactly the most popular with Nicholas and Alexandra so refusing his suggested proposal seems pretty reasonable if the parents were more concerned about their daughters happiness rather than forcing a dynastic marriage on them.
Given how Carol of Roumania treated his wives there is no reason to suspect he would have treated a Russian Grand Duchess any better, although obviously if Olga had married him she would at least have survived the revolution