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  #21  
Old 02-05-2012, 08:47 PM
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Are they considered "saints" or "passion bearers" by the Russian Orthodox Church?
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  #22  
Old 02-06-2012, 07:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vasillisos Markos
Are they considered "saints" or "passion bearers" by the Russian Orthodox Church?
Passion bearers. Do you know the difference between the two?
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  #23  
Old 02-06-2012, 08:22 PM
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Were the Romanovs canonized by the Roman Catholic Church?
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Old 02-06-2012, 08:29 PM
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Mmmm, no because they were Orthodox, not Roman Catholic.
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Old 02-07-2012, 08:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Benedict XVI View Post
Passion bearers. Do you know the difference between the two?
My dear Benedict XVI,

I believe a passion bearer accepts his or her death with what some call a "Christ like" resignation. In other words, a passion bearer accepts that the death will occur and yet he or she holds fast to his or her religious beliefs and accepts the death as part of God's will. A saint is usually a martyr who dies for his or her religious beliefs, such as the saints who would not renounce Christianity and were then put to death for those beliefs. In this case, Nicholas and Alexandra were not killed because of their religious beliefs but because they were the rulers of an overthrown government. Yet, they were deeply religious and the Church called them passion bearers.
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Old 02-08-2012, 07:31 PM
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Ok thank you I was not sure. From the accounts I read about they were very brave. And even tried to do the sign of the cross which does show they were willing to take what god gave them.
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Old 02-08-2012, 08:23 PM
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You are entitled to your opinion, COUNTESS. GD Elisabeth did beome a nun with her own convent, order and church. But, I think she can be classified as a 'martyr' instead of a 'saint'.. Alexandra converted to Orthodoxy and seemed very pious, but wasn't what one outside of Russia considered a saint. Neither was Nicholas. But Elisabeth is the only one who should be considered as a canonized saint. Every Christian religion has different rules for what they believe and practice. It seems to me that the Imperial Family should have done more 'saintly' things. But then again, I guess it doesn't take much more than dying to become a saint in Russian Orthodoxy!
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Old 02-08-2012, 08:32 PM
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Dear VM: I guess then GD Elisabeth should be considered a 'passion bearer' instead of 'martyr' or 'saint'. So, I guess that means that 'passion bearers' can be canonized in the Russian Orthodox church?
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  #29  
Old 02-08-2012, 08:52 PM
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In many ways Ella was saintly, after Segei's death. The others were victims. The children assuredly. But there was no reason to murder Alix and Nichiolas, either. They just weren't "saints".
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  #30  
Old 02-08-2012, 09:24 PM
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There was every reason to kill Nicholas and the children - they would have been the focus for groups to rebel against the new government - get rid of them and the focus has no legs.
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  #31  
Old 02-08-2012, 11:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Alexey 1904 View Post
Dear VM: I guess then GD Elisabeth should be considered a 'passion bearer' instead of 'martyr' or 'saint'. So, I guess that means that 'passion bearers' can be canonized in the Russian Orthodox church?
My dear Alexey,

I am not sure if the Russian Orthodox Church "canonizes" people as passion bearers or not--I am ignorant on most religious practices other than Roman Catholicism. I read somewhere that the Royal Family were considered passion bearers but whether that means the church employs a process of naming them so or whether the head of the orthodox church can simply call them that is a mystery to me.
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Old 03-11-2012, 07:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Alexey 1904 View Post
You are entitled to your opinion, COUNTESS. GD Elisabeth did beome a nun with her own convent, order and church. But, I think she can be classified as a 'martyr' instead of a 'saint'.. Alexandra converted to Orthodoxy and seemed very pious, but wasn't what one outside of Russia considered a saint. Neither was Nicholas. But Elisabeth is the only one who should be considered as a canonized saint. Every Christian religion has different rules for what they believe and practice. It seems to me that the Imperial Family should have done more 'saintly' things. But then again, I guess it doesn't take much more than dying to become a saint in Russian Orthodoxy!
There are several categories of saints in Orthodoxy, martyrs and passion bearers being two of the categories. They are saints whichever category they fall into. They would be canonized as saints whichever category they are given when they are canonized.

GD Elizabeth is categorized as a Martyr. The title on the back of my icon of her is "St. Elizabeth the New Martyr".
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  #33  
Old 05-23-2012, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Vasillisos Markos View Post
Are they considered "saints" or "passion bearers" by the Russian Orthodox Church?
Saints and passion bearers, because to be a passion bearer is one of the forms of sainthood.
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