Reburial of Empress Marie Feodorovna: 23-28 September 2006 - Page 3

BeatrixFan · #41 07-19-2006, 03:27 PM

And that is saying something. If the Russian Federation and every other Royal House recognises her as a Grand Duchess and an HIH then that just adds to her role.

queenofcelts · #42 07-19-2006, 03:40 PM

I wonder can commoners visit ceremony or not?
I am seriously thinking about going to St.Petersburg this autumn, maybe even in September

BeatrixFan · #43 07-19-2006, 03:44 PM

You could probably stand along the route of the procession but I doubt you'd get into the Cathedral without a ticket unless you were very lucky.

branchg · #44 07-19-2006, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeatrixFan

And that is saying something. If the Russian Federation and every other Royal House recognises her as a Grand Duchess and an HIH then that just adds to her role.

As far as I know, only Juan Carlos grants Maria the courtesy of recognition as she is a long-time citizen of Spain. The rest of the major royal houses do not and hold the position the dynastic claim ended with Vladimir's death.

queenofcelts · #45 07-19-2006, 03:57 PM

Maybe I will be lucky...maybe be they will let commoners to say last "good-bye" and their respect and honor to Maria Feodorovna.

BeatrixFan · #46 07-19-2006, 04:03 PM

I should think there'll be a time for people to file past the casket. Thats the point of a State funeral so you may be lucky and I hope you are.

Benjamin · #47 07-19-2006, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by branchg

Grand Duke Vladimir was the rightful Head of the House and certainly could grant titles and dignities as he saw fit. And yes, he did declare his wife and daughter to be of imperial rank with the title of Grand Duchess of Russia.

If you say that Maria was declared to be an Imperial Grand Duchess by her father then why did you earlier post:

Quote:

Originally Posted by branchg

She has no right to hold the rank of Imperial Highness or to be a Grand Duchess. She is simply Princess Maria Vladimirovna Romanovskaya, just like everyone else in the family, as a morganatic descendant of an imperial dynast.

Isn't that a bit contradictory?

Benjamin · #48 07-19-2006, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by branchg

As far as I know, only Juan Carlos grants Maria the courtesy of recognition as she is a long-time citizen of Spain. The rest of the major royal houses do not and hold the position the dynastic claim ended with Vladimir's death.

See my earlier post:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benjamin

I'm not sure where you're getting that she would be a Princess Romanovskaya, as such a title has never been granted to Leonida as her marriage to Wladimir has been recognized as equal (not only by Wladimir himself) but also by practically all the Heads of European Royal Houses (to name a few, the King of Spain, the King of Romania, the King of Bulgaria, the King of Greece, the Crown Prince of Yugoslavia, the Prince of Prussia, the Count of Paris).

Benjamin · #49 07-19-2006, 04:52 PM

Here is a quotation from The Grand Duchesses in Chapter 12, page 215:

Quote:

In Russia, Grand Duchess Maria Wladimirovna is welcomed as the heiress to the imperial throne. She has visited the country dozens of times since 1992 and continues to participate in charitable endeavors within Russia. The Russian Orthodox Church has provided Maria Wladimirovna with its solid backing and support, while the government recognizes her historic position. In and around Europe, all other heads of house recognize Grand Duchess Maria Wladimirovna as the head of the imperial house of Russia. In Spain, for example, she is always invited to any official celebrations hosted by King Juan Carlos. Next door in France, Maria Wladimirovna can always count on the support of the Count of Paris, head of the royal house of France. Her Balkan cousins from Yugoslavia, Romania, Bulgaria, and Greece recognize and accept her position. Her German cousins, particularly the Prussians, have no doubts as to the role she plays as head of her house.

BeatrixFan · #50 07-19-2006, 04:57 PM

I do remember an announcement on the Crown Prince of Serbia's site where he'd attended some event with "HIH Grand Duchess Maria Vladimirovna, Head of the Imperial House of Russia".

Mapple · #51 07-20-2006, 02:37 PM

Let us keep a bit closer to the topic, shall we? There is a neighbour of a thread dedicated to Maria Vladimirovna and her claims. :)

Wonder whether I would be able to visit St Petersburg in these September days. I think that there will be some time allotted to the common people to see and to walk past the coffin in the Cathedral of St Peter and St Paul, even if the funeral ceremony itself is going to be closed to us. It is so in case of prominent Russian émigrés that have been reinterred in Moscow in recent years, e.g. Shmelev, Denikin...

**Lady Jennifer** · #52 07-20-2006, 06:40 PM

This might sound like a silly (& possibly morbid) question but will they be using the same casket or will they put the body into a new casket for the reburial?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mapple

Wonder whether I would be able to visit St Petersburg in these September days. I think that there will be some time allotted to the common people to see and to walk past the coffin in the Cathedral of St Peter and St Paul, even if the funeral ceremony itself is going to be closed to us. It is so in case of prominent Russian émigrés that have been reinterred in Moscow in recent years, e.g. Shmelev, Denikin...

Vecchiolarry · #53 07-20-2006, 07:08 PM

Hello All,

I heard from someone who is going to St. Petersburg in September that her coffin will lie-in-state at the Alexander Nevsky Monastary. This is at the east end of the Nevsky Prospect. It will be there from September 26th to 28th, when it will process west down the Nevsky Prospect and south down the English Embankment to St. Isaac Cathedral.
Then after a requiem mass it goes north up English and Palace Embankments and across the Neva to St. Peter and St. Paul Fortress.
There it will be interred next to Alexander III.

Larry

Mapple · #54 07-21-2006, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lady Jennifer

This might sound like a silly (& possibly morbid) question but will they be using the same casket or will they put the body into a new casket for the reburial?

The latter, I think -- old coffins are quite erm... unsightly to behold.

**Lady Jennifer** · #55 07-21-2006, 06:03 PM

Thats what I was thinking as well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mapple

The latter, I think -- old coffins are quite erm... unsightly to behold.

BeatrixFan · #56 08-01-2006, 03:28 PM

I think that Marie's coffin has been over ground since her death so they will probably use the one she's currently resting in. When Marie died in 1928, there were services in the Orthodox church in Copenhagen but her body was placed in the Roskilde Cathedral. Now, I believe that her coffin has been above ground in a small alcove in the Cathedral and so another coffin probably won't be used.

I'm currently converting to Orthodoxy and I asked my catechist about a reburial service. He said that it's most likely that the coffin will stay the same unless she was interred below ground. Then a new one will be used and it will probably be opened for people to view. Then, the coffin will probably remain open and Marie's remains will be blessed with Holy Water. Now, considering how long Marie has been dead and considering that she did have a kind of funeral service when she died, the prayer of absolution which usually follows probably won't be said because she has already been absolved from sin. Also, the family won't go forward to kiss the deceased but they may place flowers or written prayers in the coffin instead. Then, prayers will be said and there will be some kind of adapted funeral service before Marie is finally interred next to her husband.

**Lady Jennifer** · #57 08-10-2006, 07:42 PM

Here is an article I just found:

Russia, Denmark discuss transfer of Russian empress’ remains

09.08.2006, 21.48

ST. PETERSBURG, August 9 (Itar-Tass) -- Russia’s State King-of-Arms Georgy Vilinbakhov met with Dutch officials in Copenhagen has discussed the details of the first stage of a ceremony.....
Link

BeatrixFan · #58 08-12-2006, 02:29 PM

Thanks for that link Lady Jennifer. Interestingly, I found this photograph from the reburial of Grand Duchess Alexandra Pavlovna. Notice that in the article, it says that the coffin of Marie will remained closed but for Alexandra it was opened and Michael von Habsburg-Lothringen is shown attending to her body. It'll be interesting to see what form the reburial service takes.

Pic from Corbis.

zarat · #59 08-13-2006, 05:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by norwegianne

The Danish Ministry of Foreign Affairs have made a web-page for those who want to follow the Reburial of Empress Marie Feodorovna, from 23.- 28. September, 2006, in Denmark and Russia.

http://www.reburial.um.dk/en - The English version (is very poor in links/material at the moment)
http://www.reburial.um.dk/da - The Danish version
http://www.reburial.um.dk/ru - The Russian version - or I'm assuming it is Russian, since I don't actually know it.

Yes, it's Russian version- in Cyrillic alphabet