Possible Brides for Nicholas II


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Russophile

Russophile

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If Nicholas hadn't married Alix of Hesse and his parents, Alexander III and Marie had chosen another "more suitable" bride for him. Whom do you think it would be??
 
Wasn't one of the Orleans princesses considered for Nicholas? I think I read somewhere Marie and Alexander were rather keen on a french bride for their son.
 
Drottning said:
Wasn't one of the Orleans princesses considered for Nicholas? I think I read somewhere Marie and Alexander were rather keen on a french bride for their son.
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Weren't they Catholic? Did Catholicism pose a problem for the Imperial Family? I know it was a BIG issue for Alix.
 
I believe his parents wanted him to marry Helene d'Orleans, to underline the Russian-French alliance. But Nicholas had his mind on Alix and was rather sure about his choice. The religion would have been an issue of course, as Helene would have had to convert, something she (or her father) wasn't willing to do for Albert-Victor Duke of Clarence either. Anyway, this possibility was never in a stage that a coversion of Helene was required but failed as soon as Alexander III and Dagmar mentioned it.

Another candidate was Margarethe of Prussia, sister of Kaiser Wilhelm II, but I believe Nicholas didn't find her attractive enough.
 
You know, it would be really cool if we had pictures of these ladies in here!
 
 
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Marengo said:
I believe his parents wanted him to marry Helene d'Orleans, to underline the Russian-French alliance. But Nicholas had his mind on Alix and was rather sure about his choice. The religion would have been an issue of course, as Helene would have had to convert, something she (or her father) wasn't willing to do for Albert-Victor Duke of Clarence either. Anyway, this possibility was never in a stage that a coversion of Helene was required but failed as soon as Alexander III and Dagmar mentioned it.

Another candidate was Margarethe of Prussia, sister of Kaiser Wilhelm II, but I believe Nicholas didn't find her attractive enough.
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Religion was an issue with Alix too. I think the decision to convert was difficult for her. I wonder if Alexander III and Dagmar had other candidates. Surely they would have. Initially they were dead set against Alex.
Here is what Nicholas had to say about a possible marriage to Helene: "Mama made a few allusions to Helene, daughter of Comte de Paris. I myself want to go in a different direction and it is evident that Mama wants me to chose the other one."
It was only when Alexander's health began to fail that they condeded and allowed Nicholas to marry Alix.
 
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I've always been under the impression that Helene was willing to marry Eddy, and even went to meet Queen Victoria for inspection, but that her father and the Pope were both adamantly against it.
 
I know very little about Helene. Has anyone read any books about her?
Lexi
 
What If

It would have deeply influenced history if Nicholas had married Margarethe - Romanov had married Hohenzollern!

I don't know if World War I would have occurred the way it did (I believe the root causes of nationalism, class conflict, and fundamental ignorance of what technological war meant guaranteed a big war) and Nicholas would have faced even more Germanophobia towards a Hohenzollern wife.

Its pretty clear that at least some people were giving up old religious prejudices in the case of Helene and those who first sought her out.:)
 
gogm said:
It would have deeply influenced history if Nicholas had married Margarethe - Romanov had married Hohenzollern!

I don't know if World War I would have occurred the way it did (I believe the root causes of nationalism, class conflict, and fundamental ignorance of what technological war meant guaranteed a big war) and Nicholas would have faced even more Germanophobia towards a Hohenzollern wife.

Its pretty clear that at least some people were giving up old religious prejudices in the case of Helene and those who first sought her out.:)
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That would have been an interesting alliance. She was a cousin to Alix, wasn't she?
 
lexi4 said:
That would have been an interesting alliance. She was a cousin to Alix, wasn't she?
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Yup. Margarethe was the daughter of Victoria (Vicky), Princess Royal aka the Empress Frederick and Alix was the daughter of Princess Alice. Thus their mother were sisters making them first cousins.

Also, do you really think Helene ever stood a chance of actually marrying Eddy? I believe the Act of Succession forbids (I'm paraphrasing) anyone who is or ever was a "Papist." So converting would not have cleared Helene, who was born Catholic. It is interesting that the Act only prohibits Catholics. She could have been Orthodox, even Jewish, Muslim, Buddhist, etc., and could (legally) become queen as such and not convert (although she probably would have for acceptance).
 
Thank you EmpressRouge,
I am not that familiar with the Act of Succession. It would be intereting to know.
Lexi
 
 
lexi4 said:
Thank you EmpressRouge,
I am not that familiar with the Act of Succession. It would be intereting to know.
Lexi
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Lexi, I think you can find that over on some of the threads with Princess Michael. She was/is Catholic but Prince Michael is not.
 
gogm said:
It would have deeply influenced history if Nicholas had married Margarethe - Romanov had married Hohenzollern!

I don't know if World War I would have occurred the way it did (I believe the root causes of nationalism, class conflict, and fundamental ignorance of what technological war meant guaranteed a big war) and Nicholas would have faced even more Germanophobia towards a Hohenzollern wife.

Its pretty clear that at least some people were giving up old religious prejudices in the case of Helene and those who first sought her out.:)
Click to expand...

We will never know what would have happened, but Margrethe's sister Queen Sophie of Greece certainly paid a price for having such a brother. She disliked Wilhelm intensely (Margerethe shared that feeling) but still during the war some Greeks said that she was a German spy, drugging her husband and sending secret messages to her brother and to the German navy. In the end they burned down the Tatoi estate and the RF had to flee the country.

Anyway, I believe Margerethe never stood a chance, Nicky found her too thin and wanted Alix anyway while Dagmar was as Anti-Prussian as could be.

The Helene option was more serious because it was backed by Nicky's parents, but still.... And even with a more sensible wife like Helene things might have turned out pretty much the same.
 
Was the Tatoi estate where Grand Duchess George was living??
 
with either possible bride you would not have had the haemophilia factor. Also I beleive either woman would have made a better Empress than Alix, in terms of public appearances etc. Perhaos then, there may have been more popular support for the Romanov couple.
 
fearghas said:
with either possible bride you would not have had the haemophilia factor. Also I beleive either woman would have made a better Empress than Alix, in terms of public appearances etc. Perhaos then, there may have been more popular support for the Romanov couple.
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Good hypothesis. Another bride may have been more outgoing, or at least faked it to give the appearance of being a gracious and gay hostess.
 
I think that if Nicholas had married with a german princess, probably or a sister or a cousin of the Kaiser, Rusia had heirs with haemphilia, as he had his heir with Alix. But, I think that Alix and Wilhelm II were cousins. And I believe, that the kaiser had a son with haemohilia as a brother named Sigfrid, that he died young.

But I know that the zar Alexandr III and his wife belive that Alix didnt to candidate right for wife for the future Zar. For this, They search woman for the zarevich. Nicholas was lover to Matilde Ksenshinskaia, of la bella Otero, he had many affairs before of Alix. His parents belive that so he could thing in other princess.

I am sorry for my bad English.
 
Your English is lovely. Many of us, and I do, speak other languages, find it wonderful when others speak ours. Alix was not a great candidate for Tsar and Tsarina, but Nicholas loved Alix, and that was that. There was haemophilia in the German royal family, too. But they might have gotten a more fun loving and happy princess. Who knows. Alix and Wilhelm were first cousins. Their mothers were sisters. What might have changed, who knows? Nicholas II should have been smarter and seen the handwriting on the wall. Russia needed real reforms, autocracy was the "devil".
 
It seems that Vicky got lucky and didn't inherit the hemophilia gene as none of her male descendants. The German royal family got it from Alice's daughter Irene of Hesse who married her first cousin Prince Heinrich of Prussia, son of Vicky.

Also, it would have been interesting if Alix's sister, Elisabeth (Ella) had married Kaiser Wilhelm. He had intensely pursued her, but she turned him down (then again, who wouldn't). Some speculate whether her liberal ideas would have influenced Wilhelm and possibly prevented World War II had she married him. She might have also introduced hemophilia into the family like her sister Irene, but since she never had children, this is not known.
 
EmpressRouge said:
Elisabeth (Ella) but since she never had children, this is not known.
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Yeah that would have been interesting since GD Sergei was gay, but then again, Felix Youssopov managed it so it could be done. . . .:ermm:
 
An Ella/Wilelm match would probably not have worked as Ella was not the kind of woman that the Kaiser could have tolerated. She ws too much like his mother.
Nicky and Alix were a good match tempermentally AND PROBABLY WERE THE LOVES OF EACH OTHERS LIVES, but neither were up to the job of ruling such a vast/diverse and unstable empire. I sometimes wonder what would have happened if Alexander III older brother (also could Nicholas IO think) had lived and Dagmar had married him as was originally planned. From what I have read he was much more like his father, Alex II, and might have been a much more reforming Tsar. What their children might have been like who knows.
 
fearghas said:
An Ella/Wilelm match would probably not have worked as Ella was not the kind of woman that the Kaiser could have tolerated. She ws too much like his mother.
Nicky and Alix were a good match tempermentally AND PROBABLY WERE THE LOVES OF EACH OTHERS LIVES, but neither were up to the job of ruling such a vast/diverse and unstable empire. I sometimes wonder what would have happened if Alexander III older brother (also could Nicholas IO think) had lived and Dagmar had married him as was originally planned. From what I have read he was much more like his father, Alex II, and might have been a much more reforming Tsar. What their children might have been like who knows.
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That is an interesting thought about Dagmar marrying Nicholas. He was more prepared to become tsar than Alexandar because no one though Alexander would be the tsar. Nicholas did really display any signs of illness. However, I do think the marriage between Alexandar and Dagmar was a happy one. But Alexandar didn't posess his father's temperament and therefore was unable to bring about reforms that were badly needed in Russia at the time. It all paved the way for the dismal failure of Nicholas.
Lexi
 
marian said:
I think that if Nicholas had married with a german princess, probably or a sister or a cousin of the Kaiser, Rusia had heirs with haemphilia, as he had his heir with Alix. But, I think that Alix and Wilhelm II were cousins. And I believe, that the kaiser had a son with haemohilia as a brother named Sigfrid, that he died young.

But I know that the zar Alexandr III and his wife belive that Alix didnt to candidate right for wife for the future Zar. For this, They search woman for the zarevich. Nicholas was lover to Matilde Ksenshinskaia, of la bella Otero, he had many affairs before of Alix. His parents belive that so he could thing in other princess.

I am sorry for my bad English.
Click to expand...

You mention that Nicholas had many affairs before Alex. At the risk of showing my ignorance, could you give examples of some of these affairs? Who were the women? I only know of Matilde.
Thank you,
Lexi
 
That's a good question. I am also only aware of Mathilde.
 
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