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  #41  
Old 02-09-2008, 09:00 PM
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Originally Posted by lexi4 View Post
That is an interesting thought about Dagmar marrying Nicholas. He was more prepared to become tsar than Alexandar because no one though Alexander would be the tsar. Nicholas did really display any signs of illness. However, I do think the marriage between Alexandar and Dagmar was a happy one. But Alexandar didn't posess his father's temperament and therefore was unable to bring about reforms that were badly needed in Russia at the time. It all paved the way for the dismal failure of Nicholas.
Lexi
A lot of the mess in Russia was said also to be due to the fact that Alexander III did not have his father's learning and enlightenment so one can take one's pick as to which was the more successful czar.

Apparently Alexander III's mother didn't want her younger sons to compete with the tsarevich Nixa and therefore she kept them uneducated. It has been said that the spirit of enlightenment and reform which had been the hallmark of Alexander II's reign and which many had hoped his son Nixa would with his learning and intelligence would continue died out when first Nixa and then Alexander II died.
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  #42  
Old 02-09-2008, 10:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Russophile View Post
Holy Schnickies! I'd like to know the name of that book cuz I have a hard time thinking that Alix would have let that slide!!! I am of the opinion that she had a very strong sexual hold on her husband.
Same here Russo. I want to see the sources. In all of my studies, I have never read that. Quite the opposite.
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  #43  
Old 02-09-2008, 10:07 PM
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And Other Thing More, In This Books, The Writers Talk About A Secret: The Posibility Of That Alix Wasnt Virgin When She Was Married With The Tzar. Is A Secret That Probably We Dont Know. Is A Theory.
Please, tell us your source.
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  #44  
Old 02-10-2008, 09:49 PM
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Please, tell us your source.
Ditto from here. That would be very, VERY interesting indeed!!
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  #45  
Old 03-11-2008, 05:36 PM
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[snipped]
The Helene option was more serious because it was backed by Nicky's parents, but still.... And even with a more sensible wife like Helene things might have turned out pretty much the same.
Pikul in his book " Nechistaya sila" [Evil power] mentioned that Helene of Paris was deemed more suitable almost perfect for Nicholas II because she was more worldly and not overly religious (i.e., she knew her limits with spirituality and religion). Helene of Paris was believed to fit well into the Russian court. When it came to Alix of Hesse, Maria Fedorovna was concerned about her religious ardour from the very beginning. As pointed out by Pikul, these concerns stemmed from the fact that Alix's mother[Grand Duchess Alice of Hesse and by Rhine (born Princess Alice of United Kingdom and Ireland)] was absorbed too much into mysticism and religion. I am not sure whether the above mentioned is true or not. Neither Alexander III nor Maria Fedorovna expected that Nicholas would persist in marrying Alix of Hesse.
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  #46  
Old 03-13-2008, 07:10 PM
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Helene d'Orleans wasn't against, and willing, to marrying Eddy. Based on the photos, I think she's prettier than Alix. I guess Alix is someone I'm just apathetic about.
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  #47  
Old 03-13-2008, 07:41 PM
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I think Nicholas's parents thought the he would get over his "crush" on Alexandra. I'm not sure why they gave in to his desire to marry her.
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  #48  
Old 03-13-2008, 10:42 PM
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He was really smitten with her. And, however, history has judged them, they loved each other very much. In royal circles, often rare. Plus, she was Queen Victoria's granddaughter and I am sure Ella pushed for it, too.
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  #49  
Old 03-14-2008, 05:32 AM
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Didn't Grand Duchess Miechen push for it too, in Gotha? Probably hoping that Alix would be willing to become some kind of protege?
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  #50  
Old 03-14-2008, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Russophile View Post
Holy Schnickies! I'd like to know the name of that book cuz I have a hard time thinking that Alix would have let that slide!!! I am of the opinion that she had a very strong sexual hold on her husband.
Ditto. What is the name of the book that implies Alix wasn't a virgin?
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  #51  
Old 03-14-2008, 04:33 PM
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Given her religious fanaticism I find it difficult to believe that Alix wasn't a virgin, especially given the expectations for her position as future royal wife. Not that some Victorians didn't enjoy themselves any less than people do now, I just do not think Alix would have taken that risk.
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Old 03-14-2008, 05:11 PM
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I think you are right. I can't imagine it, she was so prudish and religious.
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  #53  
Old 03-14-2008, 05:23 PM
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If Nicholas hadn´t married to Alix, He could have had a stable monarchy.
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  #54  
Old 03-15-2008, 10:59 AM
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If Nicholas hadn´t married to Alix, He could have had a stable monarchy.
Maybe, maybe not. She didn't help. But the forces of nationalism and ideology were very potent then.

The striking class divisions were also a serious problem. Russia does not seem to want a Romanov restoration nowadays and that's probably why. And besides, doesn't Vladimir make a wonderful Tsar? Maybe he'll set his kid up like Kim Il Sung did in North Korea! The Putin dynasty!
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  #55  
Old 03-15-2008, 01:40 PM
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If Nicholas hadn´t married to Alix, He could have had a stable monarchy.
Possibly. But I think Nicholas's beliefs and personality prevented him from making the changes he needed to make so establish a stable monarchy.
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  #56  
Old 06-13-2008, 08:57 PM
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Question...

If I am correct, the rules that govern the marriages of the Russian royal family state that a Russian heir to the throne can only marry a woman from a current ruling royal house. If this is the case, then how could Tsar Nickolas II’s parents desire him to marry Princess Helene, the daughter of Count Philippe of the House of Orleans. The French royal family was not reigning or ruling at the time. Wouldn’t Princess Hélčne been unable to marry the future Tsar because of this?

Thanks if you can answer my question.
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  #57  
Old 06-13-2008, 11:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Melania View Post
If I am correct, the rules that govern the marriages of the Russian royal family state that a Russian heir to the throne can only marry a woman from a current ruling royal house. If this is the case, then how could Tsar Nickolas II’s parents desire him to marry Princess Helene, the daughter of Count Philippe of the House of Orleans. The French royal family was not reigning or ruling at the time. Wouldn’t Princess Hélčne been unable to marry the future Tsar because of this?

Thanks if you can answer my question.

Hmm...I don't know the answer to that question but couldn't one count Alix as coming from a non-reigning family too? The Grand Duchy of Hesse was incorporated into the German empire in 1866, so by 1894, they were technically no longer a ruling family.

But I do believe you are correct, Melania. One of the issues of contention about Grand Duchess Maria Vladimirovna's claim as head of the Romanovs is that some consider her a product of a morganatic marriage (among other issues of dispute). Her mother,
Leonida Bagration of Moukhransky, was from demoted former royal family.
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  #58  
Old 06-14-2008, 01:34 AM
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If Nicholas hadn´t married to Alix, He could have had a stable monarchy.


I'm not so sure about that. I do believe she was completely unstable herself; however, he was unfit to rule since birth. A weak man with no leadership skills; caught in a time of extreme change and social unrest that had been building up for years... NO WAIT! Decades or centuries even with the exception of two decent Tsars in the history of Russia.
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  #59  
Old 06-14-2008, 02:01 AM
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The German families were still ruling families. Most of them were constitutional monarchs, had some executative powers within their states etc. The German Empire was a federation of states under the 'leadership' of Prussia.
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  #60  
Old 06-14-2008, 05:43 AM
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If Nicholas hadn´t married to Alix, He could have had a stable monarchy.
Honestly, I think the situation in Russia by the time Nicholas took over was too far gone for anything stable - Alix or no Alix. Several attempts on the life of Alexander III before him, a successful attempt on the life of Alexander II, assassination of Paul I… various riots, it doesn't really advertise a stable form of government. The long lines, as my old history professor would say...

Alix was a factor, but not the whole reason. Another bride might have helped to patch things up a bit, but not necessarily.
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