Languages spoken by Nicholas, Alexandra and Family

[Russophile]

Princess Alice has passed. Louis, her father has just given Alix a French tutor. She's 6 years old. So she was learning French. (This from the Christopher Warwick book.)

 

[Menarue]

I think there is a little confusion about this learning of languages and having a tutor in them. English children speak English but they learn English at school as do French children and other nationalities. To have lessons in a language doesn´t mean that they don´t speak that language, it is, as was said above, to learn an elegant turn to their conversation and writing and how to express themselves in a way appropriate for educated children and in this case royal children.

 

[Russophile]

But they weren't English children. They were born German.
In fact, Princess Alice, and English Princess, according to Warwick, when she knew she had diphtheria said "Ich bin mude." to her family. I'm just trying to get my research handled here.

 

[AGRBear]

As I've explained, the only reason the British and Russian links to the Germans has been down played was because the English and the Russians fought the Germans in WW I and WWII. The British royal house even changed their title from the German House of Hanover to Windsor.

I think, the majority of us on this forum read mostly information about the European royals which is written in English which means we've read a lot more information produced by the English speaking countries than the Germans, therefore, we've been lead into thinking that the Windsors were completely English by the turn of the 20th century. Wrong. They were still carrying their German language, culture and gene pool until WWI when they had to distance themselves from "cousin Willie", the German Kaiser Wilhelm II and, later, WWII, Hitler's German Nazi Party, and, anything else that indicated they were German. There are some good genealogy sights that carry even more information. Somewhere over on AP I provided a pedigree chart showing all the Germans on the royal trees of the Windsors and the Romanovs. It might surprise many of you who are in high school just how German they two royal houses actually were.

AGRBear

 

[ferrymansdaughter]

Bear, you are absolutely right. In WW1 members of the family fought on both sides, German and British. Several members of Queen Victoria's family were stripped of their British titles for having done so, one of them being Prince Charles Edward, Victoria's youngest grandson, who became Duke of Coburg at the age of 14. He then lost his German titles just after the war of course. He turned to the far right and was well in with Hitler. The house of Saxe Coburg Gotha (as it was called before Windsor) was German to the core.

Also, Prince Phillip's mother was a Mountbatten (originally Battenburg of course until WW1) and his father was a Schleswig Holstein Gluckstein. All of Prince Phillip's sisters married Germans and they were not allowed to come to his wedding in 1947.

The idea that members of this extended family didn't speak German fluently and regularly is not feasible.

 

[Menarue]

They spoke German but I believe they conversed with each other in English and French. I have read that King Edward VII spoke English with a heavy German accent and the Duke of Windsor liked to show off his German but from all accounts I believe that the IRF spoke English and French at home except when they were addressing the servants. French was the language of the Court and considered the polite language among the aristocracy.
Queen Victoria and her husband spoke German to each other but she was very proud of being the English Queen and was once said to say she disliked the Prussians, that was because of Willy, but it amused the courtiers.
There is no doubt that the British Royal family up until the marriage of the Queen and Prince Philip were, except for the tiniest drop of blood, purely German. This made some anti monarchist wit in a newspaper say that instead of getting rid of the royal family they should be expatriated to Germany.
BTW the name Windsor was a wonderful choice and Mountbatten works well too.

 

[Furienna]

One of our Swedish queens actually was a Mountbatten. She was born as "Louise of Battenberg" though, and as a matter of fact, she only became "Louise Mountbatten" after her father decided to become Brittish instead of German. So yes, the Brittish royal family was very German for a long time, and almost all of their spouses were German too. And even Alexandra of Denmark, Edward VII's queen, who should be the one big exception to this rule, had noticable German ancestry.

 

[OlgaNikolaievna]

The idea that members of this extended family didn't speak German fluently and regularly is not feasible.

Some of you seem to be missing the boat. No one has ever said that they didn't know German or speak it fluently, they spoke a lot of languages fluently, only they chose to use English. This tells us it had to have been their better and preferred language, proving they obviously felt more comfortable using it than German. When their diaries are in English, their personal letters to each other were in English, and they spoke English to each other in person, this tells you something. You may like to speculate and surmise that the Hessian branch must have used German because of your reasonings, but the evidence exists that they did in fact use English as the main language. Olga Alexandrovna did not say they didn't know German she said they never used it. It is also not to say so much that the older generations didn't know it well but it was the younger ones such as the Russian Imperial children who knew it less. People who knew them tell us the children learned Russian and English as babies, not German, this is meaning these were the familiar and used languages of the Imperial family. French lessons came later and some German lessons but all the evidence shows us the children were bilingual in Russian and English, learned French well and German not so well. Assuming based on what you guess does not eliminate the facts delivered by those who knew.

 

[ferrymansdaughter]

No one has ever said that they didn't know German or speak it fluently, they spoke a lot of languages fluently, only they chose to use English. Olga Alexandrovna did not say they didn't know German she said they never used it.

Actually, that seems to be what some people ARE trying to say.

 

[bbb]

from everything i've read the family mostly used english (letters, diary's etc) the empress was reviled because of her german roots, i doubt it was spoken much, especially at court.
quoting from "The Lost Fortunes of the Tsars" by William Clarke pages 44-45
during captivity "the children, grown up though some of them were, still had regular lessons from 9 to 11 every morning, only Olga was excused. Lessons in Russian, mathematics and English were given by tutors, As in Tsarskoe Selo, Alexandra gave lessons in theology, history and german. Nicholas also helped Alexis with his history."

 

[Martha]

I believe Alexandra never learned Russian.She spoke English very well, She lived a long time in England with her grandmother Queen Victoria.

 

[Russophile]

I believe Alexandra never learned Russian.She spoke English very well, She lived a long time in England with her grandmother Queen Victoria.

Well gee, it was rather expected for a future Empress to learn the language of the country she was going to rule. Alexandra certainly had lessons in Russian when she was converting to Orthodoxy (see Massie's N & A) but it is true she had a very difficult time with Russian.

 

[COUNTESS]

They all spoke English, because, German, Russian or whatever, the nannies were Englishwomen. They ran the nurseries and the language the children were spoken to, was English, so, yes, they often spoke more English than anything else.

 

[Michael HR]

Like others my understanding is that the Empress spoke English with the tsar and the Children, the children spoke Russian with the Tsar therefore two languages were used in the family on a day to day basis. French was known and spoken ( a diplomatic language across all courts) but the Empress must havek known German as she was brought up partly in that County but do not know that she used it in Russia.

 

[AnastasiaEvidence]

Actually, that seems to be what some people ARE trying to say.

It is true, that the imperial children did know some German, but they didn't use it officially. It wasn't nessesary because they weren't living in a German country. In Russia, French was spoken by the court and Russian was a native language spoken in the Romanov family. English was spoken with OTMAA because it was the language Alix usually corresponded in.

Yes, Alexandra learned Russian and French at the time when she was married to Nicholas. Her original language was English. She was born in Germany, but grew up in England with Queen Victoria. So, she mainly spoke English, at the time! I read that she was struggling with French, in a couple of her letters. Nicholas corrected her mistakes in French. But, she did improve in French a couple of years later. Alexei spoke only Russian and French fluently. He later learned English, and wrote his first English letter to Alexandra in 1916. He spoke to Alexandra all a long in French, there are many letters of them writing in French. OTMA just knew English, French and Russian fluently. Nicholas spoke to Alix in English. OTMA spoke to Nicholas in Russian and Alix in English. Alexei, OTMA spoke to him in Russian.

 

[AGRBear]

All the yellow dotes show direct lineage that are German. Others like Dagmar, the mother of Nicholas II, also, have German lineage through their mother's side which isn't shown in this particular pedigree chart.

Each and everyone spoke German as their first language. Some, also, learned other languages through their nanny's in the nursery.

AGRBear

 

[JPhinala]

Nicholas spoke Russian, French, and English in probably that order. Alexander III was very keen on using Russian and it is quite probable that he only ever spoke to Nicholas in Russian. The letters between Nicholas and Marie Feodorovna are almost all in French and Nicholas was known to speak French very well. French being the langauge of the Russian aristocracy. Nicholas probably spoke a minimal amount of German because Alexander III and Marie Feodorovna HATED Germany. It is possible that he could read Danish though it seems highly doughtful that he spoke it.

Alexandra was taught English and German probably simultaniously. She spoke French but while she was conversational she was often mocked for her lack of nuance, especially when it came to the use of the French idiom. As such she never felt comfortable in French. She began learning Russian from a tutor sent by Alexander III immediately after the engagement. While she spoke passable Russian her accent was thick and sealed her place as a foreigner in the eyes of Russians.

As for OTMAA there is some controversey over fluency though it seems likely that they all spoke English, Russian, and French. Some better than others. Also probably German in varying levels of adequacy, though I doubt any of them spoke it well. As for someone's comment that they spoke Danish... this seems unlikely. Danish was not a common language in Europe and if Nicholas didn't use it, it seems unlikey that they would. Especially when it is taken into account that the Dowager Empress rarely saw OTMAA, because of the strained relationship with Alexandra. She spent much more time with Sandro and Xenia's children, Irina being her favorite.

I know some of this info is recycled from the posts above but I thought it might be helpful to have it all in one place. I haven't sited sources for the above because I don't have two or three hours to do it. Since there is so much dissention about the topic, I've taken what seems to ME to be the mostly likely answers from a variety of books.

 

[nikkola]

she was a german princess. her brother was then german king i think. they wrote in diaries in english as well as their letters to each other. they spoke english to their children.all though they all spoke all three. a good book to listen to or read is the romanov prophies by steve berry. i could go on for hours but i wont.

 

[AnastasiaEvidence]

From the 'Life and Tragedy of Alexandra' CHAPTER II childhood
Samples of her handwriting at seven years old show it to be wonderfully neat and firm, and she had a very retentive memory. By the time she was fifteen, she was well grounded in history, literature, geography and all general subjects, particularly those relating to England and Germany. According to her letters to her eldest sister, she toiled without a murmur at dry works like Guizot's Reformation de la Litterature, the Life of Cromwell and Raumer's Geschichte der Hohenstaufen in nine volumes: compared with these, Paradise Lost, which she read in the intervals, must have seemed quite light reading! She had a French teacher, and though her accent was fair, she never became thoroughly at home in that language and always felt "cramped," as she said, in it, being at a loss for words. This hampered her later in Russia, where French was the official language at Court. English was, of course, her natural language. She spoke and wrote it to her brother and sisters, and later to her husband and children and to all those she knew well.

Listening to their conversation at luncheon, her interest in matters beyond her years was unconsciously awakened, and at thirteen Princess Alix looked and spoke like a much older girl. Her English point of view on many questions in later life was certainly due to her many visits to England at this most impressionable age.

 

[AGRBear]

>>English was, of course, her natural language.<<

After she joined her grandmother's, Queen Victoria's, she undoubtedly spoke English more than German, however, this was not her first language. German was. English came second in the royal German families. However, most of the royal children spoke many languages, therefore, they switched back and forth as those who know more than one language often do. What is meant that >>English ...her natural language...>> is that she personally felt more comfortable with English by the time she was engaged to the future Nicholas II. Why? She was surrounded by the English and hadn't been living in her father's Hesse, a German state.

You must realize that Queen Victoria's husband was German through and through. He prefer speaking German and the family did so behind closed doors.

The House of Hanover was German, not English. And, do take a closer look at the pedigree chart with all those yellow dots which show you the Germans walking around with grand titles.

During WWI there was a huge down play of the German heritages, including the use of German, in all the royal houses who were part of the countries fighting the Germans.

The House of Hanover was changed to an English name "Winsdor" which they borrowed from the royal residence [ The Royal Residences > Windsor Castle ]. It didn't make them less German it just made them appear English.

AGRBear

 

[Anna was Franziska]

Bear, we aren't talking about Victoria, we're talking about Alexandra. ALL the people who knew Alexandra personally and wrote books about her said English was her main and natural language. Alexandra used English with her children and friends, though they were Russian. The fact that she and her siblings corresponded in English is further proof. If they were speaking German 'behind closed doors' they'd have preferred to use that language in letters and diaries, however, they didn't, they used English. That should tell you something.

 

[AnastasiaEvidence]

>>English was, of course, her natural language.<<

After she joined her grandmother's, Queen Victoria's, she undoubtedly spoke English more than German, however, this was not her first language. German was. English came second in the royal German families. However, most of the royal children spoke many languages, therefore, they switched back and forth as those who know more than one language often do.

Either way, English was the language Alexandra mostly spoke and knew fluently. She used it to write letters to Nicholas, Queen Victoria, her brother and sisters and children. German was not a language she used as frequently.

What is meant that >>English ...her natural language...>> is that she personally felt more comfortable with English by the time she was engaged to the future Nicholas II.

She was raised in England for a long time, that's why she knew English mostly. She may have been German-born but, she didn't know German as well as English, because she didn't live in Germany as long as she did in England.

You must realize that Queen Victoria's husband was German through and through. He prefer speaking German and the family did so behind closed doors.

Behind closed doors? there really isn't no evidence of this, this is totally made up. So you believe that they were secretly speaking German? If they were speaking German behind doors,why didn't they use it more often, then? Instead they corresponded in English to others.

Yes, this was mentioned many times in books about Alexandra. When the Alexandra and the Russian relatives would visit their German cousins in Germany they would speak English because that was the language in which the German relatives also spoke fluently. They knew Alexandra's natural language was English.

English was, of course, her natural language. She spoke and wrote it to her brother and sisters, and later to her husband and children and to all those she knew well.

 

[kell]

Alexandra also hated germans because of her fathers grand duchy was aborbed into germany and her father was rather admiant about it since it took his states rights away but a exmple is one of the disagreement they had where nicholas was giveing a captainship or something to his german cousin willy where Alexandra didnt want him to do so but he said but sunny they made me a general in their army i have to return the favor dont quaote me on the line but thats from 2 soruces plus she was raised to be a english lady she had a english nanny and spent months - years in england with her grand mother queen victoria

forgot to add this she spoke english with the family only since her russain very bad in writeing n speaking russain was just as bad so the family with her spoke english while her husband spoke russains to the childern

 

[AnastasiaEvidence]

Alexandra was unpopular at court and with the Russian people. She didn't know much Russian and didn't speak French as fluently. But, she did learn French and wrote about it in many letters to Nicholas. She was improving her French during the late 1890's.Nicholas would correct her errors in French. French was the other language Alexandra used more so than Russian. She didn't fully master Russian, but she only knew Russian somewhat. She wrote and spoke in French with Alexei and Anya V.When she appeared she was silent, seemingly cold, haughty and indifferent. She was hurt by their unenthusiastic reception, and declared herself to be tired of the loose morals and etiquette of the Russian court. Alexandra was called prim and dull, provincial, uninteresting and haughty by the Russian court.

 

[kell]

this kind of argueement is pointless on these fourms since 3 langaunes spoken by all royals in those days were german english french and if need be his or her own native
tounge
and hence why everyone spoke it but this is pointless to talk about since she wrote everything in english and alexandra husband wrote to her in english as well so i highly doubt every text i read on her and also her own dairy but both anastasiaevidence is right and annawas whats her name excuse me forgetting her name but knowing and speaking them daily are 2 differant things i personally forgot my german and french

 

[AnastasiaEvidence]

Some people feel they need more further evidence to prove what I was trying to say, when I said the Imperial family didn't use German. I already showed them information from a biography of Alexandra. But, people still want more evidence such as actual writings of the imperial family.
There are many other books that prove that Alexandra wrote in English usually. People already said that many times.

 

[kell]

did u try posting links to their diaries love letters how about corrspands from the front to his wife or how about the letters from sunny to the childern how about when her mother died and how many years she spent in england with queen victoria theres many of these things online but anastasiaevidence just go with what the tsars sister said once i tell them the truth they will never belive me

 

[AnastasiaEvidence]

http://www.alexanderpalace.org/letterstsaritsa/Here is an good website that shows the hundreds of letters the Tsarina wrote to the tsar Nicholas.

 

[AGRBear]

Goodness gracious. You are making a mountain out of a mole hill. The royal families of Europe spoke three main languages, French, German and English, accept Austrians who liked Italian or the Scandinavians so add their languages to their own mix. So what if Alexandra only wrote in English? This doesn't mean she didn't speak French, which most of you say she did but not fluently. This doesn't mean she didn't speak German, which she did since she was the daughter of a German Duke of Hesse.

As for her use of German after she left her father's home, she apparently preferred English.

German is a guttural language and it takes great effort to speak it and all my relatives prefer using English, as well. Those who stopped using it after their parents, who spoke nothing but German in their home, passed away, have forgotten most of their German. However, if forced to speak it, again, I'm sure most of them would pick it back up and be able to speak it somewhat or fluently.

What is apparent to me AnastasiaEvidence is your lack of understanding of the royality behind closed doors before WWI. When speaking to each other they didn't speak a complete sentence in just one language. They plucked words out of English or German or French or whatever language so one sentence might contain all three languages. Our family use to joke: When we talked politics it was in English. When we made love we spoke in French. When cursing our horse we cursed in German. We spoke Russian to our maids, cooks and stable boys. Of course, saying this might left some eyebrows but before WWI there was a huge social order and people knew what rung of the social ladder they were born. Young people here in the USA today can't even imagine the hard lines drawn between these old social classes. Sure, you've seen some of it in the Jane Austin movies or other PBS specials but until you've actually experienced it, you can't fully understand it.

AGRBear

 

[kell]

wasnt jane austin movies set in the early 1800 plus movies settings and place in the world for a woman in those days are differant then what ae saying shes saying she didnt speak it which is comfrimed by dr gildard i hope the spelling is correct also the memoris of a host of people bear honestly read up on the person and the hasburgs had to learn hungrain too but if you doubt me check otto hasburg and his speech when he 1st arrived in hungary after 40 years or something issue at hand is you say potato she says potateo lets call the whole thing off honestly this has no bareing on the fact she was shy and spoke french and english mainly english she hated germany with venom bear you forgetting she also was remember what year germany was founded a year after the fanco prussain war her nation was aborbed into the greater prussain state her mother died of yellow fever at a early age for her she grew up mainly with her grand mother queen victoria she had a britsh nanny but meh i give up