The Royal Forums Coat of Arms

Go Back   The Royal Forums > Non-Reigning Houses > The Imperial Family of Russia

Join The Royal Forums Today
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #261  
Old 06-19-2008, 02:08 PM
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Posts: 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnastasiaEvidence View Post
My point is that all the seven remains of the Romanovs have been found! There shouldn't be any questions asked. End of Story.
But...

The fact now is that the leading spokesman for the current investigation, Nikolai Nevolin, has just admitted publicly .. as it was reported by the Russian news agency Interfax just two days ago... that they have *not* found have enough remains for two among the 40-odd bone fragments that were found last summer.

That can only mean that one of those seven Romanovs is *still* missing!

... and therefore the basic point of your argument is not, in fact, true.

JK
__________________

__________________
  #262  
Old 06-19-2008, 02:15 PM
Nobility
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: -----------, United States
Posts: 467
Quote:
Originally Posted by J Kendrick View Post
But...

The fact now is that the leading spokesman for the current investigation, Nikolai Nevolin, has just admitted publicly .. as it was reported by the Russian news agency Interfax just two days ago... that they have *not* found have enough remains for two among the 40-odd bone fragments that were found last summer.

That can only mean that one of those seven Romanovs is *still* missing!

... and therefore the basic point of your argument is not, in fact, true.

JK
That's very strange. So the remains are of only one person? All this time, I thought it was two remains of Alexei and Maria or Anastasia.

Quote:
What he has now said here to Interfax is just another way of saying that they have only found evidence of one.... and not two.

Of Course.... Everyone here is completely free to draw his or her own conclusions.

JK
You are right. If that is so, then only one of the remain are missing. Six out of the seven remains been discovered??? I don't know. It could be something else.
__________________

__________________
  #263  
Old 06-19-2008, 02:36 PM
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Posts: 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnastasiaEvidence View Post
That's very strange. So the remains are of only one person? All this time, I thought it was two remains of Alexei and Maria or Anastasia.


You are right. If that is so, then only one of the remain are missing. Six out of the seven remains been discovered??? I don't know. It could be something else.

The leading spokesman for the investigation, Nikolai Nevolin, was quoted by Interfax on June 17th as just having said these words:

"... the quantity of the remains which have been found in "the second burial place" is not enough of that what should remain at burning two bodies".

That can only mean one thing. There is only enough for one... and, therefore, one must still be missing.

... and that is why they are now going back for yet another search again this summer in Koptyaki.

JK

__________________
  #264  
Old 06-19-2008, 03:07 PM
Russophile's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Portland, United States
Posts: 4,077
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnastasiaEvidence View Post
According to Yurosvosky's note he states that he buried two bodies in a different section. He said it was those of Alexei and Demidova (mistaken for one of the grand duchesses). The remains discovered in July of 2007 are of Alexei and his sister. The remains were found in a different section, from the 9 others discovered in 1991.

YUROVSKY'S ACCOUNT
It was mentioned that the ties had been laid there to let a truck pass. So, having dug up the entire area, they did not think to look under the ties. It is necessary to say that all our men were so tired. They did not want to dig a new grave. But as it always happens in such cases, two or three men started working, then the others began. A fire was made and while the graves where being prepared we burned two corpses: Alexei and Demidova. The pit was dug near the fire. The bones were buried, the land was leveled. A big fire was made again and all the traces were covered with ashes. Before putting the other corpses into the pit we poured sulpheric acid over them. The pit was filled up and covered with the ties. The empty truck drove over the ties several times and rolled them flat.YUROVSKY Acidently mistaken Anna Demidova for one of the grand duchesses (Anastasia or Maria)
< ed Warren: patronising remark > Yurovsky's a known liar just like that freak Ermakov.
This is why we keep going back to this subject: to uncover more evidence.
__________________
  #265  
Old 06-19-2008, 03:36 PM
Nobility
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: -----------, United States
Posts: 467
Quote:
< ed Warren: patronising remark > Yurovsky's a known liar just like that freak Ermakov.
This is why we keep going back to this subject: to uncover more evidence.
Yes, Ermakov, and Yurovosky are terrible for murdering the imperial family. There is this photo of Ermakov taken around where the mindshaft where the remains were. I already know all of this. It would be a good idea to keep the murderer's account in what happened because these are his personal records. It is very ample pieces of evidence. I've been studying this case for many years now!
Quote:
The leading spokesman for the investigation, Nikolai Nevolin, was quoted by Interfax on June 17th as just having said these words:

"... the quantity of the remains which have been found in "the second burial place" is not enough of that what should remain at burning two bodies".

That can only mean one thing. There is only enough for one... and, therefore, one must still be missing.

... and that is why they are now going back for yet another search again this summer in Koptyaki.
That's very interesting. I'll have to do further research into this, then.
__________________
  #266  
Old 06-19-2008, 11:47 PM
OlgaNikolaievna's Avatar
Gentry
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: New York, United States
Posts: 64
I have questions for all of you who keep saying there are lies and a coverup. WHY. Why cover it up? There is no good reason this is why using this as an excuse makes no sense. It is only a conspiracy theory. WHO. Who do you think covered it up and for what reason? There is no reason! Why is it important to you to continue to cast doubt on the scientists and all officials involved to make it look like somebody is lying? I do not believe anyone is lying and this case is solved. My last question is why can't people accept reality and only want to make up strange versions of fantasy for themselves and to try to make others fall for it. That is fine for a fiction movie but please do not degrade the final rest of dead people for your own thrill because this is sad.
__________________
  #267  
Old 06-20-2008, 12:03 AM
Russophile's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Portland, United States
Posts: 4,077
Well ON, this is one of the things we're trying to figure out here. There are a myriad of reasons, one main one being that a heir or survivor could have claim to the throne of Russia. Though there isn't one at this time--and obviously the blood would be thin from merging with those not of a Royal Household, the popularity of one so-called survivor would put a mighty bee in the bonnet of the current regime of Russia, don't you think?
Then there are the crown lands, the resources, the money, speculations of deposits in off shore accounts. It's a big mystery.
You are very much entitled to feel the way you feel, and those of us trying to figure out the truth are very well entitled to feel the way we feel and will keep researching this subject to our hearts content.
__________________
  #268  
Old 06-20-2008, 02:27 AM
Marengo's Avatar
Administrator
Royal Blogger, TRF Author
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands
Posts: 14,319
The popularity of a survivor? Do you actually think the grandson/daughter of a supposed survived Grand Duchess would be popular? Why? I highly doubt many Russians will care one hoot about it. And Anna Anderson does not have any descendats anyway, so what would be the catch there?

There is no money, crownlands etc. nothing. All was confisdcated by the state. Even if there was something left I suppose it could have been claimed by other relatives for many years now, which did not happen. Where did you hear stories about all this money being kept somewhere? Apart from in some boulevard magazines I never read anything about it.
__________________
TRF Rules and FAQ
  #269  
Old 06-20-2008, 02:36 AM
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Posts: 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by OlgaNikolaievna View Post
I have questions for all of you who keep saying there are lies and a coverup. WHY. Why cover it up?
Who here has been using the words lies or cover up?

Why should there ever be any problem with questioning what people have been told?

.. and to answer your question...

One word: Politics

Politics were the reason that the murders took place in July of 1918... and politics are the reason for the way that the investigation is now being handled in June of 2008.

JK
__________________
  #270  
Old 06-20-2008, 02:40 AM
Marengo's Avatar
Administrator
Royal Blogger, TRF Author
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands
Posts: 14,319
So how would politics today benefit from all the above?
__________________
TRF Rules and FAQ
  #271  
Old 06-20-2008, 02:49 AM
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Posts: 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marengo View Post
So how would politics today benefit from all the above?
Surely, answering that question here would be straying off-topic and require starting a new thread.

Would it not?

JK
__________________
  #272  
Old 06-20-2008, 06:16 AM
Menarue's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Cascais, Portugal
Posts: 2,155
Quote:
Originally Posted by Russophile View Post
Well ON, this is one of the things we're trying to figure out here. There are a myriad of reasons, one main one being that a heir or survivor could have claim to the throne of Russia. Though there isn't one at this time--and obviously the blood would be thin from merging with those not of a Royal Household, the popularity of one so-called survivor would put a mighty bee in the bonnet of the current regime of Russia, don't you think?
Then there are the crown lands, the resources, the money, speculations of deposits in off shore accounts. It's a big mystery.
You are very much entitled to feel the way you feel, and those of us trying to figure out the truth are very well entitled to feel the way we feel and will keep researching this subject to our hearts content.
[quote] From Wikipedia.
Grand Duchess Maria Vladimirovna of Russia, (Mariya Vladimirovna Romanova, Cyrillic: Мари́я Влади́мировна Рома́нова) (born December 23, 1953) has been a claimant to the Headship of the Imperial Family of Russia and title Titular Empress and Autocrat of All the Russias since 1992. Throughout her life she has used as her title and style of pretension Her Imperial Highness Grand Duchess Maria Vladimirovna of Russia.
[quote]

Here it says she is a claimant to the throne. Who supports her in this claim?
__________________
  #273  
Old 06-20-2008, 06:20 AM
Nobility
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Belleville, United States
Posts: 400
Quote:
Originally Posted by J Kendrick View Post
Surely, answering that question here would be straying off-topic and require starting a new thread.

Would it not?

JK
Yes, I think it would. But it would make a good topic.
Have any of you read Has anyone here read Sisu, the autobiography of Oskari Tokoi? While not about the IF or their murders at all, it does give a good idea of the lengths the Bolshiveks went to to search for survivors. What he write is only a mention but a good indicator nonetheless.
It's a good book. I highly recommend it.
__________________
  #274  
Old 06-20-2008, 09:23 AM
OlgaNikolaievna's Avatar
Gentry
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: New York, United States
Posts: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marengo View Post
So how would politics today benefit from all the above?
This is what I keep asking too. What is supposed to be the big coverup, by who and why? If there's this big conspiracy of hiding that Anderson really was Anastasia please explain your reasons for believing this and why it would still be relevant today because to me it makes no sense at all. All I can see is the facts came in that Anderson wasn't really Anastasia and some people don't like that and want the mystery to continue so they keep coming up with strange theories of why it's all a conspiracy but so far I have seen no evidence or even any realistic theories to back this up. Please explain what you think happened and give names and reasons for your suspicions please.
__________________
  #275  
Old 06-20-2008, 12:39 PM
Russophile's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Portland, United States
Posts: 4,077
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marengo View Post
And Anna Anderson does not have any descendats anyway, so what would be the catch there?
I'm shocked you haven't read your Anna Anderson history. I thought everybody knew that when she was Mrs. Tchaikovsky she claimed to have a son, was examined and found indeed to have had a child. < ed Warren: spruiking >
__________________
  #276  
Old 06-20-2008, 04:25 PM
Marengo's Avatar
Administrator
Royal Blogger, TRF Author
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands
Posts: 14,319
I didn't know that she was examined and that she actually gave birth to a child. Still, the childs identity is unknown to the world and there is no evidence that Mr. Tchaikovsky ever existed either, Greg King and Penny Wilson established the names of the executioners and Tchaikovsky was not one of the names.
__________________
TRF Rules and FAQ
  #277  
Old 06-20-2008, 04:28 PM
Russophile's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Portland, United States
Posts: 4,077
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marengo View Post
I didn't know that she was examined and that she actually gave birth to a child. Still, the childs identity is unknown to the world and there is no evidence that Mr. Tchaikovsky ever existed either, Greg King and Penny Wilson established the names of the executioners and Tchaikovsky was not one of the names.
And who's to say that they weren't lying about their names? If the survival story is true who wants it to be known that they plucked a surviving Grand Duchess up from a botched execution to go traipsing all over the Russian countryside with?
__________________
  #278  
Old 06-20-2008, 07:06 PM
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Saint-Petersburg, Russia
Posts: 186
Tchaikovsky

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marengo View Post
I didn't know that she was examined and that she actually gave birth to a child. Still, the childs identity is unknown to the world and there is no evidence that Mr. Tchaikovsky ever existed either, Greg King and Penny Wilson established the names of the executioners and Tchaikovsky was not one of the names.
Recently Ekaterinburg researcher Vladimir Momot has found in military archives the list of the soldiers of protection of Ipatiev’s House. The soldier of 1-st command Anton Chaikovsky (Tchaikovsky) was registered in this list! It was 1-st command (rota - in Russian) of 1-st Ural shooting division (polk - in Russion), created in Ekaterinburg in March, 1918.
Just yesterday (!!) V.Momot has published the article about it («Ночь без рассвета» - “Night without a dawn”):
http://www.arimoya.ru/ (in Russian)
__________________
  #279  
Old 06-20-2008, 08:09 PM
Anna was Franziska's Avatar
Courtier
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Richmond, United States
Posts: 823
There is a new book out called "Ekaterinburg: The Last Days of the Romanovs" by Helen Rappaport. It's already available for those of you in Britain, US release is next year. If someone has this book perhaps they can read the accounts of Sir Thomas Preston, the British counsalate in Ekaterinburg. In his memoirs, he explained how everyone was forbidden to be on the streets that night, under penalty of death. There is no way anyone could have sneaked out unnocticed, and this especially shoots holes in the 'hidden in the house across the street' theory.
__________________
  #280  
Old 06-20-2008, 08:24 PM
Courtier
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Los Angeles, United States
Posts: 795
I may be wrong, but I have also read that Thomas Preston was nowhere near Ekaterinburg that night.
__________________

__________________
Closed Thread

Tags
dna, ekaterinburg, imperial family, romanov remains


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





Additional Links
Popular Tags
abdication birth charlene chris o'neill crown prince frederik crown prince haakon crown princess letizia crown princess mary crown princess mette-marit current events engagement fashion genealogy grand duchess maria teresa grand duke henri hohenzollern infanta leonor infanta sofia jewellery jordan king abdullah ii king carl xvi gustav king constantine ii king felipe king felipe vi king harald king juan carlos king philippe king willem-alexander luxembourg nobility olympics ottoman pom president hollande president komorowski prince albert prince albert ii prince carl philip prince constantijn prince felipe prince floris prince maurits prince pieter-christiaan princess aimee princess anita princess astrid princess beatrix princess charlene princess claire princess letizia princess marilene princess mary princess mary fashion princess of asturias queen anne-marie queen letizia queen mathilde queen maxima queen rania queen silvia queen sofia royal royal fashion russia sofia hellqvist spain state visit the hague wedding



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:41 PM.

Social Knowledge Networks

eXTReMe Tracker
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2014
Jelsoft Enterprises

Royal News Delivered to your Email!

You can get the latest Royal News right in your inbox.

unsusbcribe at anytime with one click

Close [X]