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  #261  
Old 09-11-2011, 09:45 AM
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Firstly, I don't see that Maria is at all delusional. Her words and actions are actually akin to many of the actions taken by former heads of state or pretenders and I notice that nobody levels those criticisms at them (CP Alexander II, King Constantine II) etc etc. She has repeatedly said that her only desire is to serve Russia in any way she is able to which she does. She doesn't bang on about a restoration, she doesn't use any titles etc she isn't entitled to - she just does her own thing. Neither is there any evidence of her antagonizing the rest of the Romanovs, indeed she publically won't even mention them. On the other hand, Nicholas and Dmitri make a point of always attacking Maria when the opportunity arises.

As I see it, she's only asking them to stop making claims they know to be false. I doubt she cares much what they think though as they're not members of the Imperial Family, the IF only includes GD Maria and GD George. Nobody else. Lucien, I'm not sure why this Madrid thing is an issue with you or why you use it as a negative. How many living Russian royals do you know that reside or were raised in Russia?
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  #262  
Old 09-11-2011, 11:00 AM
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How does she serve Russia?all she serves are the sumptious meals on her plate.Oh.And herself ofcourse.She can't be compared with Alexander and Constantine,two totally different styles and manners.And Alexander actually does serve Serbia while Constantine does what he can for Hellas.The woman from Madrid just pops in on the next Patriarch with his own agenda that is serving nothing except the ego's of these two....

Oh,I just call her that,always,the woman from Madrid,as an indication of whom I talk about and my absolute dislike of her,that's all.:)
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  #263  
Old 09-11-2011, 11:36 AM
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and my absolute dislike of her,that's all.:)
Then your opinion, although rightfully expressed, is not one that can be taken seriously for you have yourself admitted your 'absolute dislike' of her.

Evidently it would not matter what the woman did or didn't do as your no doubt 'qualified' contempt for her incapacitates your ability to think beyond your own prejudice.

There's nothing but ill will to draw from your post. Nothing constructive, just a character assassination of someone I'd imagine you do not know but believe you know well enough to insist they are the way you describe them.

This discussion seems to serve more as a platform for your digression down a path of cheap insults which is a shame and add's nothing to the subject.
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  #264  
Old 09-11-2011, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by lucien View Post
How does she serve Russia?all she serves are the sumptious meals on her plate.Oh.And herself ofcourse.She can't be compared with Alexander and Constantine,two totally different styles and manners.And Alexander actually does serve Serbia while Constantine does what he can for Hellas.The woman from Madrid just pops in on the next Patriarch with his own agenda that is serving nothing except the ego's of these two....

Oh,I just call her that,always,the woman from Madrid,as an indication of whom I talk about and my absolute dislike of her,that's all.:)
If you dislike her, fair enough but she has a name and it'd be more respectful to call her by her name. I think you may be overlooking certain things. Maria now undertakes official visits to various countries, not to represent herself but to represent Russia. She attends Russian cultural events, she gives speeches, she visits Russian communities and these events in some cases are attended by Russian government ministers who obviously have no problem with Maria doing what she's doing. It may not be official recognition and it may not mean the government is asking Maria to represent Russia but she does it to the best of her ability and is always welcomed with affection.

I think she's got alot in common with what Alexander and Constantine are doing. Let's look at it on face value. All three lived in exile but continued to show their allegiance to their homelands, just not to the system of government. In the past decade as the administrations have softened towards all three, they have returned to their homelands. They undertake national charity work, they are able to move freely in their countries of origin, they meet with national VIPs - it shouldn't be overlooked that Maria has met Putin and Medvedev on several occasions (and at their invitation). So I think to simply say she attends big dinners and meets with Russian Orthodox leaders is a little unkind. Her good work can't be overlooked simply because you don't like her very much.
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  #265  
Old 09-11-2011, 05:25 PM
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"the IF only includes GD Maria and GD George"......well that is the corner that Maria and her clan have backed the family into. When dear George marries a commoner of no royal background the IF will cease to exist. There really isnt much wiggle room for Maria here even though she has stated she can change the Pauline rules, since changing the rules merely highlights that there are many other males in the Romanoff family that her clan excluded after exile for marrying mere Russian aristocrats.

Actually having the IF cease to exist probably is not a bad thing. They can all live as commoners around the world and be proud of having an interesting set of ancestors while getting on with their lives. Its kind of sad that nearly 100 years after the revolution a family, or at least part of the family, go on living their lives as if a call from Moscow is imminent saying pack your bags we want to set you on the throne.
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  #266  
Old 09-11-2011, 06:41 PM
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They can all live as commoners around the world and be proud of having an interesting set of ancestors while getting on with their lives. Its kind of sad that nearly 100 years after the revolution a family, or at least part of the family, go on living their lives as if a call from Moscow in imminent saying pack your bags we want to set you on the throne.
I largely agree with the above comment.

Talk of restoration is futile, imo.
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  #267  
Old 09-11-2011, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by BeatrixFan View Post
If you dislike her, fair enough but she has a name and it'd be more respectful to call her by her name.
Yes quite. For some reason of late many of the Imperial Family of Russia threads have been infected by a degree of personal spite and nastiness which we rarely see outside of the larger Forums. Name-calling and cheap shots are rude, graceless and add nothing of substance or interest when other members are attempting to have an intelligent discussion.

If a member's personal dislike of a royal figure means they are unable to post without resort to name-calling and invective they are advised to not post in the thread at all.

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  #268  
Old 09-12-2011, 12:21 AM
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I largely agree with the above comment. Talk of restoration is futile, imo.
I rather agree; the Russians made it fairly clear that they don't want the Romanovs back, restored at the head of government and the Romanovs blew it big time when they had the chance to live better and treat the Russian people better. Russians were exploited by the Romanovs in a lot of ways and they also suffered a lot more than they ahd to. The Romanovs could have made working conditions easier and could have really made a substantial effort to do more for Russia, but they didn't.
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  #269  
Old 09-12-2011, 11:15 AM
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A restoration won't happen but HIH has carved out a little role for herself which pleases most people I think. But why give up what's rightfully hers? She has some position at least, look at how she fought to get the Tsar rehabilitated. She is a Grand Duchess by birth, she is the Head of the family so why give all that up?
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  #270  
Old 09-12-2011, 12:38 PM
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I admire her spunk and determination to do that, plus the determination of hers to have a proper funeral.
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  #271  
Old 09-24-2011, 04:14 PM
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Contrexéville : le retour des Romanov
17 septembre 2011

Maria Wladimirovna de Russie est ce week-end, à Contrexéville, refuge vosgien de son arrière-grande mère, la Grande Duchesse Maria Pavlovna, figure d’une dynastie des Romanov à la destinée tragique début XX e...

Full article with photo - Région | Contrexéville : le retour des Romanov - Le Républicain Lorrain
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  #272  
Old 09-24-2011, 11:46 PM
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Originally Posted by BeatrixFan View Post
A restoration won't happen but HIH has carved out a little role for herself which pleases most people I think. But why give up what's rightfully hers? She has some position at least, look at how she fought to get the Tsar rehabilitated. She is a Grand Duchess by birth, she is the Head of the family so why give all that up?
Well the legitimacy of her usage of the title of Grand Duchess and Head of the Family are disputed by other members of the Romanov family, although she does not recognize their membership in the Romanov family.
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  #273  
Old 09-25-2011, 11:18 AM
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I'm more than sure that the rest of the Romanovs would actually, happily, end up accepting her (and her son) as head of house if she didn't so blatantly exclude the rest of them from being considered Romanovs. They are members of the Imperial Family and they are also more closely descended from Nicholas II than Maria herself is. I think that Rotislav is a more appealing Head of House since after all, he is descended from Grand Duchess Xenia (who is is great grandmother no less) and seems a lot less antagonistic.

Maria must let this antagonism pass and then stop trying to take all the control and power for herself. What if Georgi never marries as a result of her antagonism? She has more than enough and the rest of the Romanovs need peace and stability and their family and I find it disgusting that Cyril practically seized power and Maria keeps this rivalry going. Pride, if you don't mind my saying, will ruin her life the same as it will her son's life if this doesn't end. The rest of the family are undisputed descendents of the Romanovs, among them Rotislav who is considered by them to be the Head of House via
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  #274  
Old 09-25-2011, 12:45 PM
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If you look at Russia at the moment and this ridiculous power play by Putin and Medvedev, I think a constitutional monarchy would be more democratic under an Empress Maria. Just IMO of course.
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  #275  
Old 09-25-2011, 03:40 PM
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To be honest, I don't blame Maria for enjoying banquets and receptions, and balls; who doesn't enjoy that sort of thing? She isn't piously denouncing it while enjoying it, I give her that much credit. She's a tough woman, but I wonder if she could be made to be more cooperative with the other Romanovs.
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  #276  
Old 09-30-2011, 04:30 PM
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If you look at Russia at the moment and this ridiculous power play by Putin and Medvedev, I think a constitutional monarchy would be more democratic under an Empress Maria. Just IMO of course.
This could well be the time Maria can make a case for constitutional monarchy and have it heard. Then again, she can't overstep the political boundaries which would negate the argument.
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  #277  
Old 09-30-2011, 07:12 PM
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If she doesn't want to be supported by taxpayers, I easily see the Romanovs being welcome to represent Russians. Taxpayer support is simply impossible.
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  #278  
Old 10-01-2011, 06:10 AM
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Is it? In Britain we support our crown with tax and the majority consider it money well spent. And let's not forget that the Russians support the presidency through taxes, would supporting an Empress be that much of an impossibility?
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  #279  
Old 10-01-2011, 04:25 PM
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Supporting the President and an Imperial Family on taxation would be a killer financially. Besides, there are the other Romanovs to take into account and they are for the moment happy as things are. They know who they are, they are happy just to be able to live and work in Russia with no problems and they are also make their own way. Maria might be too old, but Georgi has the ability to make his own way and he should. Maria isn't the only Romanov and she isn't the only one who cares about Russia.
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  #280  
Old 10-01-2011, 05:15 PM
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It's pretty much one or the other which is what I meant. Let's face it, the whole notion of a restoration is more than a little unlikely but as the Kremlin doesn't bother to deal with any of the other Romanovs than Maria (who they obviously regard as the IF representative), I couldn't see them dishing out funds to random Romanovs with a distant claim. The IF at the moment (as the Kremlin seems to see it) is Maria and George. Let's say that Greece restored it's monarchy, they'd fund Constantine and his family but Prince Michael is unlikely to get anything because he isn't considered the numero uno. Does that make sense?

And if the other Romanovs are happy with the way things are....why not drop their claim altogether and leave it to Maria who isnt?
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