Death & Funeral of Richard, 6th Prince zu Sayn-Wittgenstein-Berleburg: March 2017

[Marc23]

It depends on the Will. We don't know if only the heir of Fürst Gustav Albrecht is required to marry a noble, protestant and arian lady or ar also the second heir like it was in the Prussia Case. If it is only his heir then Prince Robin and his descendantsd would not be excluded.

I think we still don't know...someone says it only implies only to Prince Gustav and others that implies for anyone further who wants to be heir to his wast wealth.

 

[Stefan]

Excuse me, but what is an "Aryan lady" exactly ? Was Prince Richard's father a Nazi or something like that ?

Probably means from German/Austrian noble family...

It means not jewish. We have to remember that the Will was written during the NS-time in Germany. during that time people had to proofe that they didn't marry jewish or part-jewish persons.

 

[jen121419]

So very sorry to hear the news.

 

[Marc23]

It means not jewish. We have to remember that the Will was written dzuring the NS-time in Germany. during that time people had to proofe that they didn't marry jewish or part-jewish persons.

Oh yes, I think I remember that Marie Valerie zu Schleswig-Holstein had to prove that she is not of Jewish origin before her marriage to the Duke von Arenberg.

To prove that her aunts had to write letters from Great Britain in order to confirm it.

 

[JR76]

Oh yes, I think I remember that Marie Valerie zu Schleswig-Holstein had to prove that she is not of Jewish origin before her marriage to the Duke von Arenberg.



To prove that her aunts had to write letters from Great Britain in order to confirm it.

That's correct, since she was born out of wedlock and raised by a Jewish family her aunts Princesses Helena Victoria & Marie Louise signed an affidavit confirming her parental lineage the result being she could marry an Aryan and also, more importantly, probably saved her from the horrors of the Final solution.

As someone stated here somewhere, some time ago, during the time when the will was written it was quite a common clause to include bans against non-aryan marriages since that could mean that the family estate was confiscated by the German government.

 

[COUNTESS]

Excuse me, but what is an "Aryan lady" exactly ? Was Prince Richard's father a Nazi or something like that ?

Yes, that is Nazi talk and he was a Nazi. So, all the hemming and hawing, he didn't want any 'inferior races or religions".

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

Yes, that is Nazi talk and he was a Nazi. So, all the hemming and hawing, he didn't want any 'inferior races or religions".

It is way too easy to claim someone is a Nazi. Note that the grandfather of Prince Gustav was custodian of an immense estate with historic heirlooms and large properties. He had hundreds of tennants and workers he felt responsible for.

Without symbolic statements like such a clausule, the Nazis could have blamed the Sayn-Wittgensteins of Deutschfeindlichkeit (hostility towards the true German patriottic cause) and therefore an enemy of the Nazi state. With this they would have an excellent "excuse" to extend their greedy hands towards the possessions of the House. With all consequences for the workers and tennants. McCarthyism in the USA of the 1950's was based on exactly the same sentiments (of someone not being a true US patriot and therefore a potential enemy to the state).

The grandfather of Prince Gustav started his career in the Army during the Weimar Republic and found himself transitioned into a Nazi Germany after Hitler's (democratic) victory. That he was a Rittmeister (Captain) of the Reserve of the 23. Panzer-Division of the Wehrmacht might sound impressive, but it would not have protected him or his family when the Nazis would have found an excuse to eliminate aristocrats.

 

[Marc23]

Yes, that is Nazi talk and he was a Nazi. So, all the hemming and hawing, he didn't want any 'inferior races or religions".

Loving your nation or religion doesn't always mean you hate others...

Gustav Albrecht zu Sayn-Wittgenstein-Berleburg never was a member of the Nazi party. He even bought and privatized the local Jewish cemetery in Berleburg in order to save it from being destroyed by the Nazis.

 

[WreathOfLaurels]

Prince Gustav's grandfather had plenty of time to change his will after the war, but he didn't do it, I don't buy the version that the controversial "Aryan " clause was inserted under duress.

Prince Gustav Albert was decelared MIA on the eastern front in 1944 and was only legally dead from 1969. Once a will has been made only the person who made it could change it meaning Richard could in reality do very little about it.

Can anyone explain why German estate law regarding wills is so strict? In some other countries a clause like that would be eaisly overturned as unreasonable. Doesn't it breach some anti-discrimination legalisation of some kind?

 

[Nordic]

Prince Gustav's grandfather had plenty of time to change his will after the war, but he didn't do it, I don't buy the version that the controversial "Aryan " clause was inserted under duress.

The grandfather disappeared and was declared missing in action June -44 in Belarusia. He was officially declared dead January 1969.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gustav_Albrecht,_5th_Prince_of_Sayn-Wittgenstein-Berleburg

 

[Mbruno]

The grandfather disappeared and was declared missing in action June -44 in Belarusia. He was officially declared dead January 1969.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gustav_Albrecht,_5th_Prince_of_Sayn-Wittgenstein-Berleburg

I see. Thanks for the information.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

Prince Gustav Albert was decelared MIA on the eastern front in 1944 and was only legally dead from 1969. Once a will has been made only the person who made it could change it meaning Richard could in reality do very little about it.

Can anyone explain why German estate law regarding wills is so strict? In some other countries a clause like that would be eaisly overturned as unreasonable. Doesn't it breach some anti-discrimination legalisation of some kind?

The Will does not bar Prince Gustav to marry Ms Carina Axelsson, they can go to the municipal registrar right now. So they are not infringed in any right at all.

Carina is not Standesgemäß, a requirement set by the deceased. The question pops up whether it is unlawful when a deceased owner of a fortune has set a condition that the benefactors of his Will must contract a marriage which is in line with the longstanding tradition of his House?

What would we say when Prince Gustav is still unmarried but a younger brother had married indeed, with a lady meeting every requirement as set down by his grandfather in his Will? The deceased has left an imposing castle, a gigantic estate (the prince is one of Germany's largest private landowners) and a vast portfolio with real estate and investments. You can see why a younger brother would have challenged Gustav, like also his cousins from the Sayn-Wittgenstein-Hohenstein branch can do. It is not exactly about a fancy title, it is about real wealth, then we know enough...

 

[polyesco]

"His Highness Prince Richard's funeral
His Highness Prince Richard interred Tuesday, March 21 at. 14.00 from Evangelische Stadtkirche Bad Berleburg, Germany."
Hans Højhed Prins Richards bisættelse | Kongehuset

We'll see who of the DRF attends, so far in the calendar on the 21st, Mary and Joachim have events listed

 

[Stefan]

An interesting documentary about the Family from a few years ago
https://vimeo.com/87259683?ref=fb-share&1

 

[FasterB]

Sorry, but all the magazines here in DK keeps writing that Prince Gustav now has inherited the Berleburg Estate. But wasn't it his (Prince Gustav) from birth? IIRC then Prince Richard's father did the will so it wasn't Prince Richard who inherited the estate, but the first male grand child i.e. Prince Gustav.

 

[WreathOfLaurels]

The Will does not bar Prince Gustav to marry Ms Carina Axelsson, they can go to the municipal registrar right now. So they are not infringed in any right at all.

Carina is not Standesgemäß, a requirement set by the deceased. The question pops up whether it is unlawful when a deceased owner of a fortune has set a condition that the benefactors of his Will must contract a marriage which is in line with the longstanding tradition of his House?

What would we say when Prince Gustav is still unmarried but a younger brother had married indeed, with a lady meeting every requirement as set down by his grandfather in his Will? The deceased has left an imposing castle, a gigantic estate (the prince is one of Germany's largest private landowners) and a vast portfolio with real estate and investments. You can see why a younger brother would have challenged Gustav, like also his cousins from the Sayn-Wittgenstein-Hohenstein branch can do. It is not exactly about a fancy title, it is about real wealth, then we know enough...

I was talking about the aryan clause not the equal birth one, given that the concept of Aryanism it's basically pseudoscience. I was raising the point that the marriage clauses in a lot of these wills are often based on shaky logic by today's standards and that in some cases unreasonable clauses can be overridden with out necessary invalidating the entire will - meaning the estates would not be split up under current inherentance law; or that they might be overriddedn by certain elements of EU human rights law or German constitutional law which would take precedent over the will - the fact the will was made under the nazi's must count for something under German law as there is often a lot of clauses over the nullity of certain things done under 'criminal regimes' i.e. The nazi's and East German communists.

 

[Hans-Rickard]

I thought the swedish King and Queen would attend Prince Richard's funeral but they are both busy on Tuesday. The swedish RF is close to the Berleburgs so i would be quite surprised if no one attends.

 

[maria-olivia]

Thanks for the Documentary of the whole Family. Father and Son were close to-gether.
Now I may understand that Prince Richard did not like the Royal Danish Protocole.

 

[GömdNatt]

I thought the swedish King and Queen would attend Prince Richard's funeral but they are both busy on Tuesday. The swedish RF is close to the Berleburgs so i would be quite surprised if no one attends.

to be fair, it was only just announced. We'll see as the week goes on if they reschedule or if someone will be announced to attend.

 

[WreathOfLaurels]

Î*Î*θανε ο πρίγκιπας Ρίτσαρντ, σύζυγος της πριγκίπισσας Βενεδίκτη της Δανίας ‹ The Royal Chronicles

Royal Chronicals article on Prince Richard's death

 

[Fürstin Taxis]

An interesting documentary about the Family from a few years ago
https://vimeo.com/87259683?ref=fb-share&1

Fantastic docu and I had to chuckle several times about Richards story times and language. He was a typical old, Westphalian man

 

[Countessmeout]

I thought the swedish King and Queen would attend Prince Richard's funeral but they are both busy on Tuesday. The swedish RF is close to the Berleburgs so i would be quite surprised if no one attends.

Considering the ties between the Swedes and Benediktes family, I would think some showing. If the king can't reschedule, I'd think he will send a child. Possibly Madeleine if she is able. Benedikte is her godmother, she may go to support her and represent her parents.

Was Richard close to his Swedish family? I read that while they were in exile, he was raised at the castle if his maternal grandfather in Sweden. His mother had three siblings, and they all seem to have living children.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

I was talking about the aryan clause not the equal birth one, given that the concept of Aryanism it's basically pseudoscience. I was raising the point that the marriage clauses in a lot of these wills are often based on shaky logic by today's standards and that in some cases unreasonable clauses can be overridden with out necessary invalidating the entire will - meaning the estates would not be split up under current inherentance law; or that they might be overriddedn by certain elements of EU human rights law or German constitutional law which would take precedent over the will - the fact the will was made under the nazi's must count for something under German law as there is often a lot of clauses over the nullity of certain things done under 'criminal regimes' i.e. The nazi's and East German communists.

But the Aryan clause (= no Jewish partner) is only a theory. It is written on paper. And we all know that paper has a lot of patience. There needs to be a real case first to contest this clause.

With other words: Prince Gustav needs to find a Jewish fiancée which meets the aristiocrat requirement. Then the couple has grounds to start a lawsuit against this condition, most likely with success

When Ms Carina Axelsson was Jewish, then Prince Gustav could have fought the "Aryan clause" but still the condition set by the deceased owner of the properties that the benefactor of his worldy goods must contract a marriage in line with the House Laws to enjoy inheritance still stands.

There are a plenty of Jewish nobles: Rotschild (France/Germany), Teixeira de Mattos (Dutch), Hofmann von Hofmannstal (Austria), Cholmondeley (UK), etc.

 

[WreathOfLaurels]

But the Aryan clause (= no Jewish partner) is only a theory. It is written on paper. And we all know that paper has a lot of patience. There needs to be a real case first to contest this clause.

With other words: Prince Gustav needs to find a Jewish fiancée which meets the aristiocrat requirement. Then the couple has grounds to start a lawsuit against this condition, most likely with success

When Ms Carina Axelsson was Jewish, then Prince Gustav could have fought the "Aryan clause" but still the condition set by the deceased owner of the properties that the benefactor of his worldy goods must contract a marriage in line with the House Laws to enjoy inheritance still stands.

There are a plenty of Jewish nobles: Rotschild (France/Germany), Teixeira de Mattos (Dutch), Hofmann von Hofmannstal (Austria), Cholmondeley (UK), etc.

I was under the impression that Aryan meant Northern European not just 'not-Jewish', and that Carina Axelsson's heritage not just her birth was part of the problem. I am aware that other families still follow this pattern and have similar clauses in their wills, but the fact that the late Prince Richard and Gustav himself have tried previously to have these clauses nullified in the German courts, and that it wasn't successful is interesting.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

In general a lawsuit to challenge the validity of a testament can only be filed by people who would be personally and financially affected by the terms of it. The late Prince Richard and Prince Gustav enjoy(ed) greath wealth due to the very same testament of their grandfather. Neither the late Prince nor the current Prince have been cut out nor has seen their share of the estate reduced.

So while already enjoying the (rich) fruits of the testament for decades, the Princes had to establish before Court that the very same testament is invalid for some reason. As Courts and legislation generally feel a strong obligation to uphold the final wishes of a deceased owner of a fortune and that a testament accurately reflects the wishes of the person who wrote it, the chances on success are minimal.

The testament was (and is) enjoyed to the fullest and the only "problem" came when Prince Gustav found a partner who was not meeting the condition as set down in the testament: that the House Treaty has to be respected. That Erbverbrüderungvertrag (Hereditary Confraternization Treaty) of 20 November 1607 between the branches of the House says: no marriage is allowed with geringeren Standespersonen (read: non-noble partners).

The grandfather of the current Prince conditioned in his testament that this legal document, which has been enforced for generations, must be respected. It will be very hard to convince a Court that this is an illegal condition, that the testament is unlawful and that the House Treaty has no jurisdiction anymore.

 

[Mbruno]

I was under the impression that Aryan meant Northern European not just 'not-Jewish', and that Carina Axelsson's heritage not just her birth was part of the problem. I am aware that other families still follow this pattern and have similar clauses in their wills, but the fact that the late Prince Richard and Gustav himself have tried previously to have these clauses nullified in the German courts, and that it wasn't successful is interesting.

"Aryan", technically speaking, is someone who, thousands of years ago, was, I suppose, from the region which now includes parts of northern India, Pakistan, Afghanistan, and Iran. Whatever "Aryan" means in Nazi pseudoscience is, however, open to interpretation. That is why I find it odd that such clauses are still found in post-Nazi Germany.

 

[crm2317]

Princess Maria Olympia of Greece posted a photo of herself today in Copenhagen. I wonder if she is accompanied by her parents and if they will continue on to Germany for the funeral of their uncle/great-uncle.

 

[polyesco]

from the DRF, the Queen and Prince Henrik, Crown Prince Couple Frederik and Mary, and Prince Joachim and Princess Marie will attend the funeral on Tuesday, March 21st
Regentparret, Kronprinsparret og D.K.H. Prins Joachim og Prinsesse Marie deltager i bisættelsen af H.H. Prins Richard | Kongehuset

according to this article in Billedbladet, As long as the Queen or regent return the same day, there is no need for another regent to be named
Dronning Margrethe tager hele familien med til prins Richards bisættelse | BILLED-BLADET

 

[IRIS1983]

Princess Maria Olympia of Greece posted a photo of herself today in Copenhagen. I wonder if she is accompanied by her parents and if they will continue on to Germany for the funeral of their uncle/great-uncle.

I believe that King Constantine and Queen Anne Marie should be in Copenhagen this weekend, obviously the reason is to give condolences and accompany Princess Benedikte and her family in these sad moments ,Taking advantage of the fact that her grandparents are in Denmark, and accompanied by her parents, she is mainly visiting her grandparents and also presenting her condolences. I do not think she will be in funeral, I think in funeral will be Queen Anne-Marie and her children

 

[Muhler]

BB has compiled a well-illustrated obituary of Prince Richard, which you can find here: https://app.box.com/s/1ac1ed7rkzxv6r9p9tdcvc938fgozsqx

There are a number of brief details about Prince Richard's life, but mainly about his affiliation with the DRF.
The problems about the will and who will eventually inherit Berleburg is also mentioned, but members here on this thread are much more well-informed and can provide much more comprehensive information than a summary from me.
The article does mention that Princess Nathalie with family also live at Berleburg. I was under the impression that they lived some distance away.
However Princess Alexandra and family live near Mainz.