The Monarchy in Greece


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Nikolopoulus,allow me to tell you that Greek Republic isn't built on the foundations of hatred of the monarchy.After centuries under Ottoman rule and major fights in order to obtain indipendence at last,Greeks won't accept a foreign family to rule.As far as i've read Glucksburgs are of German,Danish and Norwegian origin.The issue isn't about Greeks denying monarchy but about the family's Greekness.I've said in an other thread that Constantine was born,raised etc here so he has the same rights with a Greek who's born in USA for example.But rule the country?Drive Greece to courts and demand public wealth?Come freaking on!
 
Nikolopoulos: the referendum in Serbia was on a new constitution after the dissolution of Serbia & Montenegro, not a monarchy/republic one, and the new constitution narrowly passed. Yes, monarchist sentiment is present in Serbia's political class and discourse, there are a couple of parties (one currently in the coalition government) that openly support it. Similarly some of the opposition parties in Georgia advocate monarchy too.

I think the difference is, countries like Serbia and Georgia have been looking for a rallying point and unifying symbol after recent demoralisations, while Romania and Bulgaria like those also experienced Communist oppression and many problems after that. The other difference is that Greece rejected its monarchy in a democratic referendum, so its deposition was legal and accepted. This was not the case in Yugoslavia, Albania, Romania or Bulgaria, where their deposition and hence the imposition of the regimes that followed was certainly not legal.

Kastalia: well said, except that we can also point out that royal families of foreign origins assimilated into other countries. This did not happen in Greece (despite the fact that King Alexander and Prince Michael married Greek women), even though Constantine II was "the most Greek" of the kings and had every chance to be a decent king and win popular support for the monarchy, which he singularly failed to do (though not entirely his own fault).
 
In the referndum occurred in Greece, the King did not participate, was not allowed entry ... Today Serbia is a republic.
Kastalia you know that the cemetery of Tatoi is public, in this cementery is buried former Heads of State of Greece ... Their graves lie abandoned ....¿ why? Why?
because they are part of that foundation on which rose the Greek republic ...

And stop of "Glubsurg" There is no reason to continue the joke, and he has no Greek passport is no longer a Greek national, we can not continue with the nonsense ... This is not a problem of Greece ....
 
David V, I’m not one of those people who move forward carrying their clichés with them so I won’t focus at the fact that Greece gave birth to ideas like democracy,etc. Greece was never a kingdom so none royal family could ever be assimilated because Greeks were fed up by longtime oppression and wouldn’t tolerate any dynasty.There’s no problem with foreign or mixed/multiracial people,the current Prime Minister is half-American and has a half-sister who was born out of wedlock and she’s half-Greek half-Swedish.So Greece isn’t a conservative society stuck in retrograde ideas. The issue is clearly financial to me.They demanded something that never belonged them from a country that had never nothing to do with Monarchy.
Nicolopoulus, I have no problem with Monarchy in general or foreigners .If Constantine was self-sufficient and didn’t expect dowry from a poor country who was clearly trying to survive Ottoman rule,Civil War,World Wars and Invasion (Katoxi) he would have been ok. But he was unlucky because he had no alternative choice,i don’t know the size of his fortune but i’m sure he’s not hungry and that he doesn’t have the right to demand anything,that’s what i’m saying. His wive’s sister became a Queen by accessing her father, his sister became Queen by marriage,every single relative has a title and he ended in London boiling with anger. Who’s fault is that?If his ancestors were Greeks,and Greece was traditionally a kingdom and they would have fought for Greek Independence when needed be sure that he would have been in his place now. Great Powers have established Monarchy in Greece in 1832,in a country that was massacred to ensure after centuries it’s borderlines. Do you think that it was fair? Surely not.When Sofia was about to marry the whole country was hungry but was forced by Frederika to embroider for her dowry.Not to mention the cost of her wedding. So please don’t tell me what’s funny/joke or not. Greece’s problem right now should be how to surpass microeconomics and craft level in order to pass to macro and instustrial level.We live in 2010,we are in the middle of a hardcore economic crisis and we still talk about wrong decisions taken by some anti-Hellenic ignorants due to their benefits.Their 4 million euro compensation was the best thing this awful former socialist government did.
 
I think the opinions of those who are Greek are the most valid. It is their nation and should be run their way. It is always disconcerting to me, in my many years studying history, that a totally foreign family could ascend to a throne and try to become the new nationality. You can in melting pot societies such as ours, the U.S. Those being elected to a "throne" and mostly marrying other Europeans, does not a Greek make. Prince Phillip is no more Greek than the man in the moon, nor is King Constantine. And, I can see, that the issue of money would be a very sensitive one. There is no Greek Monarchy and I can see how citizens of Greece take umbrage to this thought.
 
I believe that it is quite hard to estimate the true number of the monarchist or pro monarchist Greeks inside and outsied the country. I doubt that there has been a gallop or research for many years and so there can be only guesses. To me , it seems een harder to estimate the monarchist among the expatriate Greeks who live all over the world .
 
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Discussion concerning the lack of surname of the Royal Families of Denmark and of Greece has been moved to the Titles & surnames... thread where the subject has been covered repeatedly and at some length.
 
Sad but true.You made some very good points although i wouldn't encourage his envolvement with politics.This if of course my personal opinion..
When the Greeks got rid of the American Naval bases and business presence in Greece they got rid of the nation that used to pick up their debt when they defaulted.But now as you say Kastalia I agree with you and would not encourage the King to involve himself with politics at all. King Constantine has his health and family to look after.Again just my opinion too.
 
I suppose many greeks are not against the Monarchy but they still pay tribute to a leftist mentality.
 
I suppose many greeks are not against the Monarchy but they still pay tribute to a leftist mentality.

that's a different story. that's more like a culture than mentality or political position. i'm sure we're not allowed to analyse it here.;):flowers:

gregory
 
Well, let's face the reality. I'm a royalist. But Greece has many many other and more important problems at this time to solve. Restoration is out or the question. Not because i wouldn't like to see Greece again as a Kingdom, but because we've lost valuable time since 1974. The King is already 70 years old, an Crown Prince Pavlos doesn't seem to care about his title more than the Fashion. We only want to be able to see the Greek Royal Family to be treated as all the Royal Families, reigning or not. Respectfully and politely, as a part of Greek History. Not in the way they treat them till now the Greek politicians...
 
But Greece has many many other and more important problems at this time to solve. Restoration is out or the question
-Not in the way they treat them till now the Greek politicians...

That's what i'm talking about.Finally.
Nobody said that they're not part of Greece's History.And it's not only the Greek politicians that treat them disrespectfully but also the press.
 
I would fully agree that King Constantine and Queen Anne-Marie are part of Greece's history and only a fanatic would defy that. History cannot be wiped off whether we like it or not.
Thus, I feel that they should be treated exactly like former Presidents of the Republic and they deserve to be receiving pensions like former presidents BUT all that only under condition that they accept the Constitution, adopt a surname of their choice and become Greek Nationals.
 
In Romania King Mihai I was given a Palace in Bucharest to live and receives a pension.
I don't understant the anger against King Konstantinos of some politicians.
 
^ In this case Greek people should pay taxes in order to maintain the Palace and its condition.And to pay the household of course.I can't imagine Constantine and Anna Maria living by themselves in it.Plus,the Palace they used to live is a Presidential residence today (in Athens).The whole thing with them concerns financial issues.It is the way Greeks handled this case Cory you have to understand and accept it.I have never though of the perspective of giving them pension though,you both made a very interesting point here.I guess their 4 million compensation gave an end to all speculations about what could have happened,but it would make sence if they were given pension.
 
I know there are greeks who still hope for the return of the Monarchy.A tiny minority?Even before the return on the Throne of George II in 1935 bobody would have said Monarchy will come back.
 
Yes of course,there is a minority (not that tiny but small) of hardcore monarchists and i'm not against that of course.That's the beauty of dialogue you have to listen everyone.It wasn't Constantine's fault 100% what happened,it is just the way things worked in Greece then.Difficult political circumstances and the one brought the other.I always say that Anna Maria and Marie Chantal deserved a better luck.The one came here very young ready to rule,and the other is blammed of her denial to be more ''Greek'' when Greeks don't want them.
 
How many greeks are in favour of Monarchy?10%?20%?
 
Anne-Marie was truly unlucky and it is a shame because the Greeks liked her and, I believe, no one holds any grudges against her. In fact, many people are still very sympathetic with her. Insofar as the wife of prince Paul is concerned, she is not blamed for anything. She is just of no interest to the Greeks nor is her husband.
 
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I suppose greeks like more prince Nikolaos than Prince Pavlos anyway.
 
Anne-Marie was truly unlucky and it is a shame because the Greeks liked her and, I believe, no one holds any grudges against her. In fact, many people are still very sympathetic with her. Insofar as the wife of prince Paul is concerned, she is not blamed for anything. She is just of no interest to the Greeks nor is her husband.
I fully agree with everything.As for MC i've heard people wondering about her and her kids if they speak Greek,why she gives only Greek names to her kids and what she wants to prove with that since she doesn't speak the language and she doesn't live here (i know the reason,but i'm just mentioning).I've heard people blamming her indirectly and i think it's unfair.
Cory i don't know the exact percentage but 10-20% is way to much,i think it's less.
 
When there was the referendum I suppose Monarchy got more than 30 %.
 
Maybe,but i have to search for that in order to tell you.I was born in 1985 and all i know if from books and old papers.
 
Last century Greece changes different times between Monarchy and Republic.The same can happen even in this century.
 
When there was the referendum I suppose Monarchy got more than 30 %.
According to the greek version of Wikipedia, 69,18% of those who went to vote , voted in favour of the Uncrowned Democracy and 30,82% in favour of the Crowned Democracy. Out of the whole number of registered voters , 75,51% went to vote.
 
If there were more than 30% at the referendum even today there must be at least 20%.
 
Which are the feelings of the greeks towards Monarchy and Royal Family after the wedding of Prince Nikolaos?
 
The referendum was 36 years ago, and the last time there was a de facto king in Greece was in 1967. People under 43 weren't even born then. That's an awful lot of voters for whom monarchy is just irrelevant. And many of the older people who were old enough back in the 60's to remember ... well, in my experience & judging from my own parents & their friends (moderate monarchists back then), they just don't trust the royal family to put the country's good ahead of their own.
 
Which are the feelings of the greeks towards Monarchy and Royal Family after the wedding of Prince Nikolaos?

Since you know, based on your quantitative guess above, even the percentages, why are you asking?

The referendum was 36 years ago, and the last time there was a de facto king in Greece was in 1967. People under 43 weren't even born then. That's an awful lot of voters for whom monarchy is just irrelevant. And many of the older people who were old enough back in the 60's to remember ... well, in my experience & judging from my own parents & their friends (moderate monarchists back then), they just don't trust the royal family to put the country's good ahead of their own.

Your remarks are logical. It is guesstimated that about 10% of the people are still favotable toward the monarchy. Some people are still tied to the past. This is the reason that explains that Greece is the the only European country that has a Stalinist Communist Party amounting to some 7-8% of the popular vote.
So, based on this premise alone, one should expect another 10%+ to be in favor of the monarchy, for reasons of intra-family tradition alone.
 
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I noticed the enthusiam toward the royal wedding and the respect paid by the orthodox clergy and by the people to King Konstantinos IInd the Royal Family.
 
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