Princely Family current events 3: May 2007-

[Warren]

Arms of Liechtenstein

Welcome to the Princely Family of Liechtenstein current events thread part 3

commencing May 2007

Part 2, covering the period January 2004 to May 2007, can be found here.

[BurberryBrit]

Originally Posted by kerry

Thanks Burberry but I can't take the credit, I just clicked on the more button under smiles and there were a lot of new goodies to choose from.

Have you noticed how many birthdays are to celebrated in our favorite royal family? Quite a few.

Yes, but then, there are a LOT of von Liechtensteins

[HRH Kerry]

There are quite a few of them. I've run across that name on Google but wasn't sure if they had any connection to the Princely Family especially since there wasn't a prefix of HSH. Still makes me wonder though.

[BurberryBrit]

There's a Liechtenstein wedding. Hedwige von Liechtenstien (born Nov 28, 1982) is getting married this summer.

[Warren]

Members of the Princely Family are distinguished by von und zu Liechtenstein; the use of a mere 'von' (unless it's an error) would indicate no relation to the family.

[Warren]

Here's the bio...

Prince Heinrich von und zu Liechtenstein (1916-1991)
married Archduchess Elisabeth of Austria (1922-1993), youngest daughter of the Emperor Karl; issue including:

• Vincenz (1950- )
married 1981 (divorced 1991) Comtesse Hélène de Cossé-Brissac of the Dukes of Brissac; issue:

•• Adelheid (25 November 1981 )

•• Hedwig (28 November 1982- )
to marry 2007 Comte Olivier de Quelen

[HRH Kerry]

I thought I'd read about a royal engagement from another website posted earlier this year. I don't remember a date being set though. Just assumed it was one of those indefinite engagements like with that couple from Greece (?) I don't know why I thought that! Approval must be granted to marry so I'm certain all the details were mapped out as well.

Probably a private affair and we won't see any media attention. I hope that I'm wrong though.

[BurberryBrit]

Yes, we may not see pics. But it seems like Seeger Press covers a lot of the "smaller" weddings in Germany and Austria. Also, with Sophie's sister getting married, we *may* see pics from that wedding. I'm still hoping for pics from Margrethe's and Nikolaus' 25th anniversary ball which I'm sure most of the Liechtenstein clan would attend.

[BurberryBrit]

I've seen some members of the family use only the von and I thought it was for anonimity purposes or simply because it's too long to write out. For instance on thefacebook, there are some of the younger Liechtenstein royals who go by von Liechtenstein. Also, I've seen Wenzeslaus use von Liechtenstein professionally.

Also, I wonder if someone loses his Prince title and becomes a Count, does he still retain the von und zu?

[Warren]

Hedwig's mother is a French aristocrat, as the groom appears to be, so this may attract the interest of Point de Vue.
It depends of course on whether the families allow the magazine access to the wedding.

[HRH Kerry]

Thanks Warren. I have seen von Liechtenstein and the last name standing alone.

[Warren]

The Liechtenstein name seems to be closely guarded. I can only find a very few examples of where a Prince has been 'demoted' to a lesser title and rank:

� Prince Albrecht Johannes (born 1940), who in 1966 married morganatically. His wife became Baroness von Landskron, and in 1971 the Prince became Baron von Landskron.
Prince Franz Josef II bestowed these titles, and I've no idea why there was a six year delay for Albrecht Johannes (private family business?).

� Prince Wilhelm (born 1922) renounced his rights and titles on his marriage in 1950, and was created Count von Hohenau by Franz Joseph II. But in 1980 Franz Josef reversed this decision and Wilhelm, his wife and children were re-established in name and title to the Princely rank. (A reward for good behaviour?)

� Prince Ferdinand (1901-1981) married "not conforming to the laws of the Princely House" in 1925 and 1940 and his wives were created Countesses von Rietberg. His son, Johannes (Hanno) (1941-2003), born a Count von Rietberg, was granted the von und zu Liechtenstein name and Princely title in 1974 by Franz Josef II.

I can't see any Counts von (or und zu) Liechtenstein in any of the descendants of Prince Franz Josef I (1726-1781), from whom the current extended Princely Family descend.

sources: Burke's Royal Families of the World, Vol I, and Almanach de Gotha.

[HRH Kerry]

I should probably ask this in the family thread but since we are on the subject...

So is Dr. Vincenz Liechtenstein a member of the family? He serves as a MP of Austria. I've been wondering about this for months now. Thanks in advance.

[BurberryBrit]

Originally Posted by kerry

I should probably ask this in the family thread but since we are on the subject...

So is Dr. Vincenz Liechtenstein a member of the family? He serves as a MP of Austria. I've been wondering about this for months now. Thanks in advance.

Yes, it looks like he is Prince of Liechtenstein. Vincenz Karl Alfred Maria Michael Prinz von und zu Liechtenstein was born on July 30, 1950, son of Heinrich Karl. It looks like he is Hedwig's father (the young Princess getting married this summer). I imagine it would take a lot of time discovering all the branches of this large and extended family. I wonder if anyone has ever tried or if Hans-Adam would promptly shut such an inquiry down?

Also, what does MP stand for?
(info taken from thepeerage.com)

Regarding the demoted Princes, they were demoted solely based on not marrying someone approved of, right?

[BurberryBrit]

I found some pics of Dr. Vincenz Liechtenstein.

http://www.vincenz-liechtenstein.at/...0E_Kessler.jpg

http://www.vincenz-liechtenstein.at/...0E_Kessler.jpg

[BurberryBrit]

OK, here's how Vincez and Hans Adam are related:

Johann I--Franz--Alfred--Aloise--Franz Joseph II--Hans-Adam

Johann I--Franz--Alfred--Alfred Roman--Henrich Karl--Vincenz Karl

I guess this makes them second cousins?

[HRH Kerry]

Originally Posted by BurberryBrit

Also, what does MP stand for?
(info taken from thepeerage.com)

Regarding the demoted Princes, they were demoted solely based on not marrying someone approved of, right?

Member of Parliament.

[Warren]

Originally Posted by BurberryBrit

I imagine it would take a lot of time discovering all the branches of this large and extended family. I wonder if anyone has ever tried or if Hans-Adam would promptly shut such an inquiry down?

This information is publicly available and easily accessible: Burke's Royal Families of the World Vol 1 has the extremely detailed family tree from Prince Johann Adam (1699-1712); the Almanach de Gotha has living descendants of Prince Johann I (1760-1836).

Online, check out The Theroff Files, which starts with Prince Emanuel Joseph Johann (1700-1771). The entire family is there.

Regarding the demoted Princes, they were demoted solely based on not marrying someone approved of, right?

Not necessarily disapproved of, but for a marriage "not conforming to the laws of the Princely House." The spouse may have been deemed unsuitable, or the Prince in question didn't seek approval in the manner laid down in the family laws, or worse, didn't seek approval at all! It is perhaps noteworthy that there have been very few instances of such "non conforming" marriages over the past 150 years.

[HRH Kerry]

Thanks Warren and BurberryBrit for the help and education. I know I went on a tangent in this thread. If I have any more questions I will surely post them under the Princely Family Thread.

[BurberryBrit]

Thanks for the info.