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  #121  
Old 03-15-2013, 02:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
The focal point is on the Catholic faith at ANY celebration of Mass...whether it's for a funeral, a wedding, or a Pope's Inaugural.
Yes, but doesn't the Inauguration of the pope install him as the head of the Catholic church? I don't know if there will be some kind of "swear loyalty to the pope as the head of the Catholic church" by the congregation. but if there is something like that during the mass, I can understand if non-catholic royals would find it a bit difficult to do that, and to not participate in such a part could be seen as disrespectful by others at the mass. For example the members of the Swedish royal family (with the exception of in-laws) have to be "of the pure Lutheran faith" and I don't think that any kind of swearing loyalty to a Catholic pope, even if only symbolically, would be popular among the Swedish Lutheran clergy.
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  #122  
Old 03-15-2013, 02:55 AM
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Yes, but doesn't the Inauguration of the pope install him as the head of the Catholic church?
Yes,that's why it is called an Inauguration.

No one not of the RCC Faith is forced to do anything,and as for Royals attending,regardless the Faith,they just adjust to the occasion as Royals are used to do.No-one has to swear anything else then for the weather to remain dry while this event takes place on St.Peter Square this coming tuesday....

http://www.ppe-agency.com/show.php/z...03-2013%20Paus
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  #123  
Old 03-15-2013, 05:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
Thank you for an incredibly honest and insightful post Lucien...
I agree with everything you say and also thank Lucien for what must be one of the most open and honest posts I've ever read.
Most importanty for me personally are Lucien's words " He is Pope for all,and all includes gays" and Osipi's words " a humble cardinal from Argentina has become Pope to millions of Catholics and a world figure to the rest of the world watching". I don't have much religious faith at this point in my life, but for some reason I do have faith in Pope Francis because somehow I feel confident about him. The more I hear of his humility (such as refusing the white chair after the election, paying his hotel bill etc) the more I feel he is a great religious person upon whom anyone, anywhere can connect with and take comfort from.

There will be a great deal of coverage for the inauguration from BBC News and Euronews and it will probably start hours before the main event. So I'm quite sure we will have clear images of who will attend. I do hope Charles and Camilla will go - Charles is very open in his religious thoughts having had the Russian Creed sung at his wedding and it would be a great symbol of inter-faith unity for the future head of the Church of England to attend the inauguration of the head of the Catholic Church.
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  #124  
Old 03-15-2013, 07:23 AM
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And the answer is: @RegalEyes: Queen's representative at the Inaugural Mass for Pope Francis will be Duke of Gloucester. He will be accompanied by Duchess of Gloucester.
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  #125  
Old 03-15-2013, 08:59 AM
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Originally Posted by lucien View Post

The present Pontiff however doesn't as much have the wrong views,no,he teaches by the official guidelines of the church,BUT...with a immensely human touch.He is Pope for all,and all includes gays.They are,we are,nothing special,there are tens of millions of us,everywhere,it's a every family has one sort of thing...and should be happy with them,they add some colour to life...well,most...
Those are really wise and beautiful words Lucien! Pope Francisco says the base of the Church is Jesus Christ and what the cross represents. Jesus accepts and loves all. We are all his children and all built in God's image. And yes, big changes are coming!
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  #126  
Old 03-15-2013, 09:16 AM
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Those are really wise and beautiful words Lucien! Pope Francisco says the base of the Church is Jesus Christ and what the cross represents. Jesus accepts and loves all. We are all his children and all built in God's image. And yes, big changes are coming!
That´s true! We also cannot underrate his choice of name-it says a lot about the pope e.g. Benedict 15 was known as "the pope of peace" (he had diplomatic skills that earned him respect in religious and also secular circles) and Cardinal Ratzinger probably wanted to use his name because he wanted to consolidate the church and solve problems that were within the church.

Franz/Francis from Assissi was a devout catholic who took the words of the Bible very serious and didn´t like any pomp or ostentatious behaviour and lifestyle.He helped the poor and spent a lot of time outside,he also critisised the Catholic church who was living like some royals from the past centuries-lavish,glamourous and with lots of concubines and excessive eating & drinking.Look at the churches from the Baroque time or St. Peter´s Cathedral in Rome and you will know what I am talking about-everything was too big,too luxurious,too much gold and far too expensive while at the same time many people didn´t even have enough food to fill their stomach.

The new pope also comes from a region with huge discrepancies between poor & rich people and that obviously made a lasting impression on him.
The Jesuits (people who are working and living after the words of Jesus Christ) are doing a lot of charitable work that should be done by the respective countries government (but the money goes to a few private people instead)-like building schools,unis,hospitals and giving health care accessible to every citizen!
They (and many other charities and religious groups) are doing a lot for the poorest of the poor who don´t have much choices in life and try to do everything to create a better life for underprívileged people.
Pope Francis also chose a bright red flag which may imply his connection to social-democracy (just my interpretaion) and his belief that everyone is created equal and should get the same opportunuties and rights.

some infos on Pope Benedict 15:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Benedict_XV
articles about the current pope and new pontiff are also widely available online :-)
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  #127  
Old 03-15-2013, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by cmbruno View Post

Those are really wise and beautiful words Lucien! Pope Francisco says the base of the Church is Jesus Christ and what the cross represents. Jesus accepts and loves all. We are all his children and all built in God's image. And yes, big changes are coming!
Jesus might love us all but according to his views this Pope doesn't. In 2010 he opposed new legislation to introduce same sex marriage, saying

"In a letter to the monasteries of Buenos Aires, he wrote: "Let's not be naive, we're not talking about a simple political battle; it is a destructive pretension against the plan of God. We are not talking about a mere bill, but rather a machination of the Father of Lies that seeks to confuse and deceive the children of God." He has also insisted that adoption by homosexuals is a form of discrimination against children."

I don't see any big changes in the Catholic Church other than this guy may sort the abuse problem. I doubt it though. This is the Catholic Church we're talking about, Francis seems like a down to earth guy but he's not going to wipe the slate and start a fresh. Catholic Church believes homosexuality, abortion, Euthanasia and a whole load of others things are wrong and just because Francis takes the bus to work I doubt he's going to change it.
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  #128  
Old 03-15-2013, 09:38 AM
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I disagree with your assertion that this pope doesn't love all. While he is against all that you mentioned, he has also stated that we should love gays, and he ripped a new one into his priests who were denying baptism to children born out of wedlock.

It seems that HH believes in "dislike the sin BUT love the sinner."
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  #129  
Old 03-15-2013, 10:10 AM
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The Prince of Orange and Princess Máxima will attend the inauguration.

Source: RVD
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  #130  
Old 03-15-2013, 10:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Duchess of Durham View Post
I disagree with your assertion that this pope doesn't love all. While he is against all that you mentioned, he has also stated that we should love gays, and he ripped a new one into his priests who were denying baptism to children born out of wedlock.

It seems that HH believes in "dislike the sin BUT love the sinner."
I was trying to post something on Lumutqueen's remarks but I will make your words mine.

Everybody is accepted at the bossom of the Church. All of us are sinners.
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  #131  
Old 03-15-2013, 11:05 AM
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Add president de Kirchner and Messi and it will be a grand Argentine party going on there...Viva...LOL...
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  #132  
Old 03-15-2013, 11:11 AM
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Could Pope Francis accord the privilege du blanc to the Catholic wifes of protestant kings? Or just to Maxima, even though she is not yet the queen?

The "privilege" allows wifes of the successor of a monarch who was granted the title of "Catholic" monarch to wear white on visiting the pope. You get that title if the pope decides that in your reign and private life you live "catholic values". In a modern interpretation it need not necessary be that a "Catholic queen/Crown princess" reigns as a Catholic but that she supports the positive values of her faith in her position. Kind of an papal order, which even spouses of protestant monarchs could accept IMHO.

I believe Princess and future queen-to-be Maxima has shown that she lives by the positive values of her faith in her work as a Royal, so she could IMHO be granted that privilege if it still means somthing to her and the pope.

Waht do you think?
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  #133  
Old 03-15-2013, 01:24 PM
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Could Pope Francis accord the privilege du blanc to the Catholic wifes of protestant kings?
I don't think so...she isn't the Catholic wife of a Catholic Monarch nor is she a Catholic monarch.
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  #134  
Old 03-15-2013, 01:27 PM
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Add the President of Ireland to the list also!
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  #135  
Old 03-15-2013, 02:29 PM
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Pope Francis visits Cardinal Jorge Mejía in hospital


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  #136  
Old 03-15-2013, 02:30 PM
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Pope greets Cardinals in a relaxed and at ease meeting

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  #137  
Old 03-15-2013, 03:01 PM
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The Austrian president Heinz Fischer will also attend the ceremony. He was already at JPII. funeral as well as Benedikt's inauguration Mass. :-)
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  #138  
Old 03-15-2013, 06:03 PM
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I understand the comments about "loving the sinner but hating the sin", which has been my position since I was too young to know what it meant, i.e., growing up with other "artists" who danced and played music and were "different", i.e. homosexual. This point of view comes perfectly natural to me. The last day I spent in the Catholic Church in a badly oriented diocese, I sat next to a homosexual couple. I did not hate them, I simply wondered why God allowed this to happen to them. I didn't leave the Church for that reason at all...there were a myriad of problems in that diocese, even outright defiance of John Paul II as a "bad man" in one parish. I tried a lot of parishes. I have seen great parishes elsewhere.
This Pope seems like a great one to me, but I doubt he can move the slumberous weight of the Roman Church. Nevertheless, saints have always defied the odds.
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  #139  
Old 03-15-2013, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Mariel View Post
The first female pope would not be a Popess. In Italian, "pope" is Papa", right? So she would be a Mama!
In my Episcopal congregation, as in many New Mexico congregations, the female priests are called "Mother". I think this is just right.
Well, Joan, the woman who, disguised as a man, was elected Pope, is called Popess.
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  #140  
Old 03-15-2013, 07:09 PM
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The whole pope Joan thing is a myth.


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