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  #521  
Old 10-10-2013, 07:24 AM
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God is the one who set it up as it is. Jesus ordained no men. If women leave because they aren't getting their way then they have no idea why they are going to Mass to begin with. LaRae
You are welcome to your beliefs but that does not make the beliefs of others invalid and many people understand the bible needs to be viewed within the social and historical context of the time it was written in, and that quite a lot of human editing shaped the church and the bible.

There is no good reason to believe Jesus thought women were unfit to be priests.
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  #522  
Old 10-10-2013, 07:20 PM
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Originally Posted by HRHHermione View Post
You are welcome to your beliefs but that does not make the beliefs of others invalid and many people understand the bible needs to be viewed within the social and historical context of the time it was written in, and that quite a lot of human editing shaped the church and the bible.

There is no good reason to believe Jesus thought women were unfit to be priests.

I don't recall saying other people's beliefs are invalid. I am stating my beliefs and those of my Faith.

It has nothing to do with being unfit. Being able to do X does not make you equal. We are all equal in human dignity. Being able to do what a man does, does not prove or change your status.

When it comes to the issue of ordination, the Church does not have the authority to ordain women. Christ who was quite radical in His time on earth had a lot of dealings with women, yet raised none of them to a priestly status.

I am all for viewing the Bible in it's proper context...a changing society does not make Biblical/Church teachings invalid or outdated.


LaRae
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  #523  
Old 10-10-2013, 08:02 PM
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The concept of 'equality' is a big lie, invented by those bloody revolutionaries during the French Revolution.

We are all different, there's no equality - except that we are all children of God Our Lord, but that's all. Society needs hierachy and rules.

If a woman can be a Rabbi or a shepherdess, that's great, but the Roman Catholic Church will not ordain any woman.

If we change things too much, we'll end up destructing the our society, and some people (not here) are trying to do that.
  #524  
Old 10-10-2013, 10:14 PM
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Christ did not ordain priests, as far as I know, of either sex. He said to have communion in memory of His sacrifice, but I can't recall Him saying who was to preside over communion. The church members met in homes at first, and there were several homes where both husband and wife were mentioned as hosts. Paul the Apostle mentioned these homes, one of them being where a woman named Priscilla lived. I can't remember her husband's name or the names of the other hosts of Paul the Apostle on his journeys.
The original disciples, the 12 closest, were called Apostles, not priests, as far as I know. I say "as far as I know" because I don't know everything about it.

This does not mean that I consider the ordination of women to be something easily undertaken. I know a VERY fine female priest in the Episcopal Church, one who would satisfy your need for tradition on other issues, Brazillian. But she is often busy with her two young children, and so she is not available for full time work. She donates her time as an assistant priest, and is probably the most effective priest I have ever met.
But she is also a wife and mother, and she realizes she can't be full time until the children grow up, if ever, for she may not have an opportunity to serve in another community, since her husband has a job here. She has given the best sermons I have heard in a church. To deny her the right to contribute in this way would be a loss to the church. An enormous loss.
  #525  
Old 10-10-2013, 10:39 PM
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Originally Posted by BrazilianEmpire View Post
The concept of 'equality' is a big lie, invented by those bloody revolutionaries during the French Revolution. We are all different, there's no equality - except that we are all children of God Our Lord, but that's all. Society needs hierachy and rules. If a woman can be a Rabbi or a shepherdess, that's great, but the Roman Catholic Church will not ordain any woman. If we change things too much, we'll end up destructing the our society, and some people (not here) are trying to do that.
You make a good point here.

Not all religions don't allow women to enter into the hierarchy. I agree that hierarchies have a purpose and shouldn't be destroyed - at least not without reason. I disagree that allowing women to enter into a religious hierarchy is a bad thing - it hasn't destroyed Judaism (I don't think anything well ever destroy Judaism), or the many Christian faiths that allow for it.

Within Catholicism, or really any religion, changing too fast can destabilize things but so can refusing to change. Perhaps the RC church wouldn't benefit from having a female pope right now, but it would benefit from altering it's stance towards women. Having equal rights towards women isn't the same as abolishing the hierarchy, it's simply evolving to adapt to the modern era - something that is desperately needed within the Catholic Church.
  #526  
Old 10-11-2013, 02:48 AM
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I was born a Catholic and raised a devout Catholic and I left the church when I realized the church only "honors" women as far as we're able to produce children. No recognition of our academic or intellectual contributions and this archaic idea that spiritual leaders must be men, coupled with the idea that women don't even have the right to use birth control- which more than any other invention has given women the ability to be financially and professionally on par with men.

I still find the church's stance deeply hurtful and wrong. I love Catholic social justice theories and catholic spirituality but the church's official position on women makes me feel devalued and unwelcome and I don't know that I'll ever be able to forgive that.
  #527  
Old 10-11-2013, 05:55 AM
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There are several women who have been declared doctors of the Church, this is a very high honor to women...so to say women are only honored because of childbirth (only childbirth...seriously what honor could be higher than to give life) is a gross error.

Women have held various positions of power for centuries in the Church. Abbesses controlled virtual kingdoms in some cases.

As far as birth control goes yes women do have the right to use birth control. You can control who you sleep with and when you sleep with them and if you need to prevent and/or space births there are natural methods to use. They are very effective when used properly.

Oh and about the ordination of priests. When Christ gave the power to Bind & Loose it was given to the men. There were no women given this power.


LaRae
  #528  
Old 10-11-2013, 06:05 AM
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Since this thread quickly spiraled from praise for the pope downwards to the reactionary observation that after 224 years the French revolution is still ruining our society, I think it is time to call it a day and end this discussion. I think that both sides have made their points of view clear. This is a royalty forum after all, some OT is allowed but religious debates tend to get heated rather quickly. For those interested to discuss the matter further, I suggest the following forums:

Atheist Forums
http://forums.catholic.com/
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/index.php
http://www.debate.org/forums/religion/
Religious Education Forum - Discuss, Compare and Debate Religions in Our Online Community
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  #529  
Old 10-13-2013, 02:08 AM
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Indeed!!!!!!!!!!!!

Meanwhile at The Vatican,the original statue of Our Lady of Fatima arrived amidst a ceremony ahead of the celebrations and Holy Mass on St.Peter Square on occasion of the Marian Day headed by the man & in the place this thread is all & only about:Pope Francis & The Vatican.

http://player.rv.va/rv.player01.asp?...e=en&visual=Tv

And on another note,Pope Francis donated a Harley Davidson he got on the 110th anniversary of the manufacter,the Harley will be auctioned of and the proceeds will go to the restructering of the Caritas Don Luigi Di Liegro Hostel in Rome.
  #530  
Old 10-15-2013, 02:08 PM
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Wanna go for a ride? Pope Francis has a Harley for you!

Seems that HH is going to auction off a Harley he recently was given. You have to know this guy's heart is in the right place.

Pope Francis to sell off his Harley Davidson - Telegraph
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  #531  
Old 10-16-2013, 06:12 AM
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Seems that HH is going to auction off a Harley he recently was given. You have to know this guy's heart is in the right place.

Pope Francis to sell off his Harley Davidson - Telegraph
More on H.H. The Pope donating his 'Harley Davidson' bike to charity

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4th of June 1246:Death of Isabelle d'Angoulême,Queen of England and Countess of Angoulême
  #532  
Old 10-16-2013, 06:15 AM
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H.H. The Pope meets Greek Orthodox Patriarch of Alexandria

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4th of June 1246:Death of Isabelle d'Angoulême,Queen of England and Countess of Angoulême
  #533  
Old 10-20-2013, 07:04 AM
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H.H.Pope Francis welcomes the president of Cameroon and his wife Chantal at the Vatican

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4th of June 1246:Death of Isabelle d'Angoulême,Queen of England and Countess of Angoulême
  #534  
Old 10-21-2013, 12:08 PM
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Ken Hackett, new U.S. Ambassador presents his credentials to H.H The Pope

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4th of June 1246:Death of Isabelle d'Angoulême,Queen of England and Countess of Angoulême
  #535  
Old 10-26-2013, 06:37 AM
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H.H The Pope receives TRH The Hereditary Grand Duke & Duchess of Luxembourg at the Vatican.

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4th of June 1246:Death of Isabelle d'Angoulême,Queen of England and Countess of Angoulême
  #536  
Old 10-30-2013, 04:07 PM
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H.H The Pope receives representatives of all religions in Iraq.

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4th of June 1246:Death of Isabelle d'Angoulême,Queen of England and Countess of Angoulême
  #537  
Old 10-31-2013, 05:27 PM
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Pope declares martyr a Romanian bishop who was a victim of the Communist regime.

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4th of June 1246:Death of Isabelle d'Angoulême,Queen of England and Countess of Angoulême
  #538  
Old 11-01-2013, 01:17 AM
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And then there was a little boy...:...Too Funny!!

  #539  
Old 11-01-2013, 06:36 PM
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H.H.The Pope meets The president of Panama, Ricardo Martinelli at the Vatican

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4th of June 1246:Death of Isabelle d'Angoulême,Queen of England and Countess of Angoulême
  #540  
Old 11-06-2013, 06:36 AM
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A privileged spot for Newlyweds at the Pope's General Audience

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4th of June 1246:Death of Isabelle d'Angoulême,Queen of England and Countess of Angoulême
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