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  #461  
Old 02-28-2013, 04:49 PM
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I'm glad he's finally gone and I hope whoever is next was not someone who actively worked to conceal criminal child abuse and someone who has a much more enlightened view on those of other faiths.
You are not very knowledgeable about the Catholic faith, otherwise you would know that Joseph Ratzinger in his work as a cardinal never tried to conceal child abuse. Anyone who ever read anything by him could tell you that he would be the first to alarm police if something was wrong and he learned of it outside the confession. But - he was the defender of the doctrine of the Catholic faith. A fundamental idea of that is the confidentiality of the things a priest is told during confession. Ratzinger of course decreed that no matter how earnest the content of the confession, the priest still has to maintain the confidence of it. But the priest of course can ask of the person confessing to go to the police before he or she is granted absolution before God.

You are either a Catholic and accept that or you aren't. But that's the way this faith handles things and one has to see that in his position his reaction was right, even though he personally never condoned child abuse. I have yet to hear of one case where he knew what was going on and didn't act. He has always been a very conservative Catholic and his fellow cardinals knew that and still voted for him, so it was not him alone responsible for being not overly open to other faiths.

But I have to laugh a bit because he is such a consequent German in his reaction: he decided to resign for the good of the church against the chance that God might punish him for it in the afterlife. He sacrificed his own spiritual good for that of the church he had promised to serve and all others be damned! Very Bavarian kind of character:
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  #462  
Old 02-28-2013, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Kataryn View Post
You are not very knowledgeable about the Catholic faith, otherwise you would know that Joseph Ratzinger in his work as a cardinal never tried to conceal child abuse. Anyone who ever read anything by him could tell you that he would be the first to alarm police if something was wrong and he learned of it outside the confession. But - he was the defender of the doctrine of the Catholic faith. A fundamental idea of that is the confidentiality of the things a priest is told during confession. Ratzinger of course decreed that no matter how earnest the content of the confession, the priest still has to maintain the confidence of it. But the priest of course can ask of the person confessing to go to the police before he or she is granted absolution before God.
I'm not going to turn this into a huge off topic fight, but I know quite a bit about the Catholic faith, having been raised Catholic, confirmed Catholic, and having gone through 12 years of Catholic catechism classes, plus taken on quite a few personal studies of the faith.

As someone who no longer considers herself Catholic but who recognizes the inherent good in some church doctrine, it is my personal opinion that Pope Benedict was not a good man, not a good pope, and I personally am quite glad to see him gone and hope that the next pope will be someone I think is more enlightened and more kind.

This is purely my personal opinion. I'm also aware that later in his career, Cardinal Ratzinger tried to clean up some of the early abuses, but he still insisted they be handled by the church and not turned over to secular authorities and I still think this is morally bankrupt. I hope the church moves forward from this chapter in its history in a positive way.
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  #463  
Old 02-28-2013, 05:22 PM
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The church have to change but I feel there's more trouble ahead.
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  #464  
Old 02-28-2013, 07:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Kataryn View Post
You are not very knowledgeable about the Catholic faith, otherwise you would know that Joseph Ratzinger in his work as a cardinal never tried to conceal child abuse. Anyone who ever read anything by him could tell you that he would be the first to alarm police if something was wrong and he learned of it outside the confession. But - he was the defender of the doctrine of the Catholic faith. A fundamental idea of that is the confidentiality of the things a priest is told during confession. Ratzinger of course decreed that no matter how earnest the content of the confession, the priest still has to maintain the confidence of it. But the priest of course can ask of the person confessing to go to the police before he or she is granted absolution before God.

You are either a Catholic and accept that or you aren't. But that's the way this faith handles things and one has to see that in his position his reaction was right, even though he personally never condoned child abuse. I have yet to hear of one case where he knew what was going on and didn't act. He has always been a very conservative Catholic and his fellow cardinals knew that and still voted for him, so it was not him alone responsible for being not overly open to other faiths.

But I have to laugh a bit because he is such a consequent German in his reaction: he decided to resign for the good of the church against the chance that God might punish him for it in the afterlife. He sacrificed his own spiritual good for that of the church he had promised to serve and all others be damned! Very Bavarian kind of character:

Well said. Unfortunately most of the Catholics I've run into here tend to be of the more progressive variety, if you are in any way orthodox minded... gird your loins.


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  #465  
Old 02-28-2013, 07:35 PM
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Benedict XVI leaves the Vatican


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  #466  
Old 02-28-2013, 07:37 PM
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Benedict XVI arrives to Castel Gandolfo, where he will retire temporarily

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  #467  
Old 02-28-2013, 07:38 PM
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The Vatican Apartments will be Sealed shortly


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  #468  
Old 03-01-2013, 07:09 AM
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Doors close at Castel Gandolfo, Sede Vacante period begins

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  #469  
Old 03-01-2013, 09:58 AM
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The Cardinals will meet on monday morning march 4th at 09.30AM local time for a pre-conclave to set the date for the Conclave to start.It will depend on as to when ALL Cardinals eligible for election are in Rome as to if the Conclave is pulled forward,as it stands the date is till march 15th.That might change after monday.

The doors at Castel Gandolfo were closed at 20.00PM last night and that is when the Swiss Guard retreated too and were replaced by the Vatican gendarmerie instead.The Swiss Guards are solely to guard the Pontiff,as of 8PM last night,there is none.

A very quiet and yet very symbolic transition.
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  #470  
Old 03-01-2013, 11:35 AM
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'Time of responsibility' arrives as Papal Household is sealed for Sede Vacante


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  #471  
Old 03-01-2013, 11:36 AM
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Emotion fills St. Peter's Square as Pope flies overhead as he leaves Vatican


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  #472  
Old 03-01-2013, 12:00 PM
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I am looking for great HQ pics of yesterday, specially of the Pope delivering his last speech in Castel Gandolgo...Please, can anyone help me ??
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  #473  
Old 03-01-2013, 03:15 PM
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Originally Posted by HRHHermione View Post
I'm not going to turn this into a huge off topic fight, but I know quite a bit about the Catholic faith, having been raised Catholic, confirmed Catholic, and having gone through 12 years of Catholic catechism classes, plus taken on quite a few personal studies of the faith.

As someone who no longer considers herself Catholic but who recognizes the inherent good in some church doctrine, it is my personal opinion that Pope Benedict was not a good man, not a good pope, and I personally am quite glad to see him gone and hope that the next pope will be someone I think is more enlightened and more kind.

This is purely my personal opinion. I'm also aware that later in his career, Cardinal Ratzinger tried to clean up some of the early abuses, but he still insisted they be handled by the church and not turned over to secular authorities and I still think this is morally bankrupt. I hope the church moves forward from this chapter in its history in a positive way.
I could not agree more. As far as Ratzinger not being involved in the pedophilia scandal, as Prefect for the Congregation for the Doctrine of Faith, he absolutely was involved in the 'diciplining' of child molesting priests. There has been much discussed in the media that 30,000 pages of correspondence to and from Ratzinger at that time is about to be released by the courts in the RI and CA ongoing cases. By some, it is considered to be the likely reason he has stepped down; as well as the announcement that he will never gain set foot outside the Vatican. As he is no longer pope, he no longer njoys diplomatic immunity and could be arrested if he leave the Vatican. BTW a little trivia....the Congregation for the Doctrine of Faith used to have a much more recognizable name...The Inquisition. Kind of like putting Torquemada in those white robes and red slippers. I really hope that the Conclave has the good sense to elect someone with clean hands on the pedophilia cover up.
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  #474  
Old 03-01-2013, 04:02 PM
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^^^^
I agree. If this Papacy is remembered for anything it will be remembered for its handling/mishandling of the sex scandals and for the Vatican Bank problems and perhaps for Vatilieaks.
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  #475  
Old 03-01-2013, 04:03 PM
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One can say and think about the Catholic Church and its Cardinals what one wants and yes we are all aware Ratzinger was nothing more than the Head of the Inquisition but one thing that will never happen is that a former pope will be arrested. This is not a thriller by Dan Brown.
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  #476  
Old 03-01-2013, 04:45 PM
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I am looking for great HQ pics of yesterday, specially of the Pope delivering his last speech in Castel Gandolgo...Please, can anyone help me ??
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  #477  
Old 03-01-2013, 04:49 PM
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Whatever scandals or rumors are brewing behind the scenes, this pope's goodbye was elegant, gracious, compassionate and very humble. Inspiring.
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  #478  
Old 03-01-2013, 04:52 PM
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All Cardinals called to Rome, to decide date of Conclave


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  #479  
Old 03-01-2013, 04:57 PM
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I agree with your post Shelo. Other members of the Vatican should take an example IMO. Unfortunately many powerful groups within the RC still exist and will continue to exercise their influence.
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  #480  
Old 03-02-2013, 11:50 AM
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Thanks al ot An Ard Ri
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