The Royal Forums Coat of Arms

Go Back   The Royal Forums > Royal Highlights > Royal Library
Click Here to Login

Join The Royal Forums Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #21  
Old 03-21-2017, 12:49 AM
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 2,459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
It will only get worse as the anniversary approaches and the Diana fanatics demand that everyone wears sackcloth and ashes and moans and groans about the passing of the Sainted One and that includes demonising Charles and Camilla as the Devil Incarnate.



Fortunately these days most intelligent people have figured out that Diana was the innocent she portrayed herself as and that Charles wasn't quite as evil as Diana would like us to believe.



However the Diana fanatics are a very vocal minority and insist that everyone sees the main players in the same way that they do rather than admit that they were wrong in their interpretation Diana.


Really is there any need to use language like that . You can have your views of Diana without being rude to others who don't share your view. If you dislike her and as you say it's 20 years why can't you let it go too
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 03-21-2017, 02:30 AM
MARG's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Christchurch, New Zealand
Posts: 6,675
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nico View Post
Oh please, are we back in 1992 ?
And still 6 months to go ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daenerys Targaryen View Post
I understand that you have strong opinions on this subject, but I think this might be an overstatement.
No Nico, it's not the 1992 separation but the 20th anniversary of the death of Diana that will give rise to this sort of OTT rubbish.

Daenerys Targaryen, you may find Iluvbertie's statement strong but really, after the marriage ended in 1992, are we not all overdue for a little sanity. And here's yet another story . . . Diana smacking Charles around the swede every time he knelt to pray. Really?
__________________

__________________
MARG
"Words ought to be a little wild, for they are assaults of thoughts on the unthinking." - JM Keynes
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 03-21-2017, 03:07 AM
HRHHermione's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Boston, United States
Posts: 2,884
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katrianna View Post
Judging by the DM article, I'm not too impressed and don't plan to read it. Nothing new indeed.


The Kirkus review was really good though, and I can't imagine the Daily Mail choosing to excerpt the complicated parts or anything that didn't focus on salacious derails. I've liked her other books so I'm going to read it.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 03-21-2017, 03:32 AM
WreathOfLaurels's Avatar
Nobility
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Posts: 433
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katrianna View Post
Judging by the DM article, I'm not too impressed and don't plan to read it. Nothing new indeed.
It's the DM, I personally don't place too much stock in what they say. SBS's biography of the queen was very good and although her Diana biography was flawed (to say the least) it was still one of the first attempts at a critical look at Diana in the round, and personally I didn't think it was too bad - Sarah Bradford had good things to say of it and that's a good endorsement as far as I'm concerned. The other non-DM reviews have said that there's a lot more about his public activities as PoW and its much broader than the "Chuck 'n Di" show it's made out as being, as well as a look at his approach to being king when the time comes, SBS has contacts and the palace regard her as a safe pair of hands following her queen biography so from what I've heard she can go further than Catherine Meyer's 2015 book was able to.

I, for one, am keen to read it.

Edit: I need to clarify about the SBS bio of Diana, although SBS shouldn't have tried to posthumously diagnose Diana as it's very poor journalism ethics unless you have supporting evidence from medical records and expert opinion, it wasn't the worst bio on aher and some of SBS's observations I felt were valid and worth taking into consideration.

I do wonder how much of the reaction to the idea that Diana was BPD - an idea that was given serious consideration in her own lifetime by some who knew her and a number of experts - has to do with the sigma of personality disorders and how much with the presumption of diagnosis at a distance (see the Goldwater rule).

(Just for the record - I don't think D was BPD)
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 03-21-2017, 02:34 PM
Moonmaiden23's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Los Angeles, United States
Posts: 7,180
I read SBS's biography of the late Princess of Wales years ago. I was concerned that she seemed to make a diagnosis of borderline personality disorder on a woman she never treated-indeed she has no MD or psychiatric training at all.

By Bedell's own admission only met the late princess once in the 90's during a visit to Martha's Vineyard.

Now she rehashes almost the identical comments and phrases in this new study of Prince Charles that she used in her Diana bio.

She admitted(in the forward to the Diana book) that she was disappointed when Diana sort of blew her off on Martha's Vineyard during that 1990's meeting. If only Diana had been a little friendlier we might have all been spared this continuing post mortem armchair analysis of the late princess as a certifiable nut case.
__________________
"Be who God intended you to be, and you will set the world on fire" St. Catherine of Siena

"The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice". Martin Luther King Jr. 1929-1968
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 03-22-2017, 01:06 AM
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Omaha, United States
Posts: 1,771
What dismays me is that so much has been written about Charles, Diana and Camilla, that there's very little "new" information about the relationship, marriage and divorce, and with Camilla's role. All that come bash Charles, Diana, or Charles and Camilla. It's an endless line of taking advantage of events such as the 20th anniversary of Diana's death. The press also takes advantage of the situation by plugging the books as containing "shocking new facts" when there is not that much to write about except one incident that happened that may not have been reported before. It's an endless circle that after 36 yr. there's nothing new to discuss. Everyone has their argument for or against C/C/D.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 03-22-2017, 01:44 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 4,462
Yes, I do agree that it was very irresponsible of Bedell Smith with no medical training at all to make a diagnosis of borderline personality disorder with regard to Diana. As a fan of Diana's though, I never felt there were gratuitous digs at her in the book as I have noticed with Penny Junor, for example.

Moonmaiden quote
She admitted(in the forward to the Diana book) that she was disappointed when Diana sort of blew her off on Martha's Vineyard during that 1990's meeting. If only Diana had been a little friendlier we might have all been spared this continuing post mortem armchair analysis of the late princess as a certifiable nut case.
End Quote __________________

On the other hand, MoonMaiden, Tina Brown, in her biography of Diana, made rather a lot of Charles cracking his knuckles and seeming anguished when she met him in the US.

I suppose all authors of biographies of royals seek for a hook on which to hang their book, some personal anecdote, especially with such well-worn ground as the Wales marriage. Nevertheless, Borderline misdiagnosis excepted, I do like Sally Bedell Smith's style of writing and I have the new biography of Charles on pre order on Kindle.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 03-22-2017, 09:45 AM
Moonmaiden23's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Los Angeles, United States
Posts: 7,180
I agree that Bedell-Smith is an easy, engaging read Curryong. I flew through her Diana book in a couple of days.

I also agree about Penny Junor's gratuitous digs at Diana. The woman appalls me. I won't have anything to do with her books anymore.
__________________
"Be who God intended you to be, and you will set the world on fire" St. Catherine of Siena

"The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice". Martin Luther King Jr. 1929-1968
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 03-31-2017, 05:46 PM
eya eya is online now
Majesty
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: -, Greece
Posts: 8,421
"How Diana's emotional instability sent Charles into therapy for 14 years: Eminent royal biographer claims Prince was in a 'terrible trap' after his 'tormented' wife refused help and continually sparked rows even when he was trying to pray.
The couple were already facing difficulty when they honeymooned at Balmoral. The princess was prescribed Valium but she refused to take it, convinced the family were trying to sedate her."

How Diana's instability sent Prince Charles into therapy | Daily Mail Online
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 03-31-2017, 06:25 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 4,462
These snippets in the DM article seem terribly unbalanced, and full of statements by Charles's relatives and friends, including some who have already stated publicly that they disliked Diana. Pamela Hicks has even complained about Diana sending Charles for her handbag when she first met her. Where are Diana's friends? They're certainly not quoted here. These extracts almost make Charles appear a saintly martyr in charge of a 'mad' wife. I want to be fair, which is why I've pre-ordered this book but this all reads like a Junor piece. I hope the DM are just cherry picking.
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 03-31-2017, 07:16 PM
Moonmaiden23's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Los Angeles, United States
Posts: 7,180


Amen. As if being barely out of ones' teens and married to a man whom you have suspected from the beginning is in love with another woman is not enough of a reason for "instability".

I do wish the DM would provide some opposing views in the name of balance if nothing else, but knowing who the author is does not give me hope...Junor and Bedell-Smith are cut out of the same cloth when it comes to the Wales marriage and Diana's culpability in it's ultimate failure.
__________________
"Be who God intended you to be, and you will set the world on fire" St. Catherine of Siena

"The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice". Martin Luther King Jr. 1929-1968
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 03-31-2017, 07:40 PM
Dman's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Midwest, United States
Posts: 13,066
People really need to stop trying to rewrite this saga. It's all done for money, but it's all tiring now. It's time to leave this stuff in the past.
__________________
"WE CANNOT PRAY IN LOVE AND LIVE IN HATE AND STILL THINK WE ARE WORSHIPING GOD."

A.W. TOZER
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 03-31-2017, 07:44 PM
Lady Nimue's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Pacific Palisades, United States
Posts: 2,729
Quote:
Originally Posted by eya View Post
"How Diana's emotional instability sent Charles into therapy for 14 years: Eminent royal biographer claims Prince was in a 'terrible trap' after his 'tormented' wife refused help and continually sparked rows even when he was trying to pray. The couple were already facing difficulty when they honeymooned at Balmoral. The princess was prescribed Valium but she refused to take it, convinced the family were trying to sedate her."

How Diana's instability sent Prince Charles into therapy | Daily Mail Online
Engrossing read, pretty much on a par with what I have read over the years. IMHO it is even-handed in giving Charles' experience. We all know what Diana said. Her spin on the whole marriage is legend and what has usually been held up as 'fact'. Now we have some other 'facts' to make a whole. Sounds about right to me.
__________________
Russian National Anthem: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGoNaLjQrV8
O Magnum Mysterium: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWU7dyey6yo
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 03-31-2017, 07:49 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 4,462
There we will have to agree to disagree. I found that article distinctly uneven-handed and unbalanced. Not all fault was on Diana's side by any means. However I believe it is the DM cherry picking and stirring the pot as usual. I look forward to reading the entire book.
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 03-31-2017, 08:37 PM
Dman's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Midwest, United States
Posts: 13,066
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Nimue View Post
Engrossing read, pretty much on a par with what I have read over the years. IMHO it is even-handed in giving Charles' experience. We all know what Diana said. Her spin on the whole marriage is legend and what has usually been held up as 'fact'. Now we have some other 'facts' to make a whole. Sounds about right to me.
Over the years people have tried to rewrite the story about the Wales time and time again. It's been pretty much about money and putting their own take on the saga. Once someone can think of another twist and narrative, another book will be written.
__________________
"WE CANNOT PRAY IN LOVE AND LIVE IN HATE AND STILL THINK WE ARE WORSHIPING GOD."

A.W. TOZER
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 03-31-2017, 09:11 PM
Nobility
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: TX, United States
Posts: 416
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dman View Post
People really need to stop trying to rewrite this saga. It's all done for money, but it's all tiring now. It's time to leave this stuff in the past.
I couldn't agree more! Until/unless there is new verifiable information, the whole story has been told time & time again, and at this point is tiring.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
There we will have to agree to disagree. I found that article distinctly uneven-handed and unbalanced. Not all fault was on Diana's side by any means. However I believe it is the DM cherry picking and stirring the pot as usual. I look forward to reading the entire book.
I am not Lady Nimue, but I think her point was that Diana's version of the story has been canon for the past 2.5 decades. The DM article, and maybe the entire book, may be more favorable to Charles, but perhaps put together with Diana’s version, will present a more complete, balanced story.

Honestly, I think the whole truth lies somewhere in the middle, but mileage varies.

Lady N - I hope I have interpreted your post accurately.

Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 03-31-2017, 09:35 PM
Nico's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Paris, France
Posts: 1,868
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Nimue View Post
Engrossing read, pretty much on a par with what I have read over the years. IMHO it is even-handed in giving Charles' experience. We all know what Diana said. Her spin on the whole marriage is legend and what has usually been held up as 'fact'. Now we have some other 'facts' to make a whole. Sounds about right to me.
Hear ! Hear ! It's about time for some balance indeed.
The Morton book is still seen as the untouchable and one sided truth and now, surprise, surprise, some authors are trying to put some grain of salt in that mythology. I say well done !
Enough with the double standard.
Of course it will be crass, one sided, unbalanced and unfair. FOR ONCE i would say. For decades we had ad nauseam the same crass, one sided, unbalanced and unfair story about the victim Princess vs the aloof Prince.
At the end is this kind of litterature useful ? To be honnest i don't think so, because i guess the truth is somewhere in between the two versions.
BUT i can't wait to see the usual brigade forming the ranks and screaming scandal . NOW that's entertaining !
And yes it's official, we are a back in 1992 ...
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 03-31-2017, 10:16 PM
Lady Nimue's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Pacific Palisades, United States
Posts: 2,729
Quote:
Originally Posted by QueenPenny View Post
I am not Lady Nimue, but I think her point was that Diana's version of the story has been canon for the past 2.5 decades. The DM article, and maybe the entire book, may be more favorable to Charles, but perhaps put together with Diana’s version, will present a more complete, balanced story.

Honestly, I think the whole truth lies somewhere in the middle, but mileage varies.

Lady N - I hope I have interpreted your post accurately.

Yes, you have, QueenPenny. Thank you.
__________________
Russian National Anthem: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGoNaLjQrV8
O Magnum Mysterium: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWU7dyey6yo
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 03-31-2017, 10:42 PM
Frelinghighness's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: New England, United States
Posts: 4,414
How this woman can sleep at night writing these books on famous people like the queen and prince charles, kennedys,etc. just so money grubbing and all she comes up with is some kind of pastiche.
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 03-31-2017, 11:08 PM
Lady Nimue's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Pacific Palisades, United States
Posts: 2,729
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frelinghighness View Post
How this woman can sleep at night writing these books on famous people like the queen and prince charles, kennedys,etc. just so money grubbing and all she comes up with is some kind of pastiche.
Her books are well-sourced. I would imagine she sleeps very well since she brings a great deal of clarity to muddy waters imo.

Was Diana's Morton book a pastiche? Just wondering.

This is an example of what Bedell Smith clarifies: Diana claimed she was a lamb to the slaughter, among other things. Would you not want to know what people present at the time saw? Consider these sourced quotes -

Quote:
Diana first came sharply into the Prince’s focus during a Sussex house-party weekend in July 1980. Another guest, Charles’s former girlfriend Sabrina Guinness, recalled: ‘She was giggling, looking up at him . . . furiously trying to make an impression.’

Charles then invited Diana to join him aboard the royal yacht Britannia for the annual Cowes regatta in early August.

His ever-vigilant valet, Stephen Barry, observed that she ‘went after the Prince with single-minded determination. She wanted him and she got him.’ The following month, Diana went deer-stalking with Charles, getting covered in mud, and ‘laughing her head off’ in a rainstorm, according to the Prince’s friend, Patti Palmer-Tomkinson.

[...]

As he dithered over whether to propose, three friends voiced their misgivings. Penny Romsey, the wife of Mountbatten’s grandson Norton, cautioned the Prince that he and his new girlfriend had little in common; she also questioned whether Diana’s feelings for him were genuine.

Diana appeared to be ‘auditioning for a central role in a costume drama’ she said — and, much to Charles’s anger, Penny’s husband seconded her concerns.
__________________

__________________
Russian National Anthem: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGoNaLjQrV8
O Magnum Mysterium: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWU7dyey6yo
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
biography, prince charles, sally bedell smith


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Koningsdag 2014-2018 Marengo Dutch Royals 135 09-14-2017 10:31 AM
Col. Henry Abel Smith and Lady May Cambridge - 1931 Marengo Historical Royal Weddings 5 11-05-2016 11:35 PM
Upcoming Royal Weddings: March 2008 - December 2010 HMTLove23 Royal Weddings General Discussion 72 01-02-2011 12:35 PM




Popular Tags
albania best outfit birthday carl gustaf chris o'neill crown princess mary crown princess mary fashion crown princess victoria current events denmark fashion poll general news hereditary grand duchess stéphanie hereditary grand duke guillaume infanta cristina infanta leonor infanta sofia iñaki urdangarín king felipe king felipe vi king philippe letizia monarchy murder news november 2016 october 2016 picture of the week prince alexander prince carl philip prince charles prince daniel prince felix prince gabriel prince nicholas prince oscar princess claire of luxembourg princess estelle princess leonore princess madeleine princess mary princess mary fashion princess of asturias princess sofia princess victoria queen elizabeth ii queen letizia queen letizia casual outfits queen letizia daytime fashion queen letizia fashion queen mathilde queen mathilde daytime fashion queen mathilde fashion queen maxima queen maxima casual wear queen maxima daytime fashion queen maxima fashion queen maxima hats queen maxima style queen rania queen silvia state visit stephanie sweden swedish royal family the duchess of cambridge casual wear the duchess of cambridge daytime fashion the duchess of cambridge fashion the duchess of cambridge hats victoria


Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:48 PM.

Social Knowledge Networks

eXTReMe Tracker
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2017
Jelsoft Enterprises