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Old 08-12-2013, 10:54 AM
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"Anne Neville: Richard III's Tragic Queen" by Amy License

Was Anne Neville Richard III's Lady Macbeth

Anne Neville: Richard III’s Tragic Queen by Amy Licence (Review) | Carolyn Harris: Royal Historian
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Old 08-12-2013, 07:28 PM
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Well, if Anne was as ambitious as this author speculates, could she be added to the list of people who might have had motive to murder the young Princes in the Tower?
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Old 08-13-2013, 05:59 AM
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Well, if Anne was as ambitious as this author speculates, could she be added to the list of people who might have had motive to murder the young Princes in the Tower?
I really like 'Was Anne Neville Richard III's Lady Macbeth'!

I'm sure we'll be reading more and hearing more on Anne following the White Queen Series.
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Old 08-14-2013, 10:19 PM
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I actually like the idea of Anne portrayed as a stronger, more determined and ambitious woman; a true Cousins' War player with backbone! She's been depicted too many times as a hapless pawn for the ambitions of others and to see a streak of ruthless Lady Macbeth in her would be quite illuminating indeed.
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Old 08-18-2013, 03:22 PM
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If there was some truth to that, wouldn't the Tudor propaganda machine have gone for broke? A murderous conniving wife would have been a perfect fit with the malevolent hunchback as usurpers and evil killers of boy-Princes.

As the Kingmaker's daughter it was perfectly feasible to be within her character, neither Elizabeth of York nor Margaret Beaufort would have cared, she predeceased Richard III, her sister Isabel's son Edward, Earl of Warwick, was first attainted and later executed in 1499, there was no-one left in a position to protect her [memory/legacy], so why not throw Anne under the bus as well?
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Old 08-18-2013, 05:10 PM
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I know little about Anne but from what I do know she really wasn't involved in anything. Why would making her Lady Macbeth be a good thing if she really did just live her life as a wife. It's like turning Elizabeth of York into Lady Macbeth just to make things more interesting, but it has zero basis in truth.
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Old 08-18-2013, 05:34 PM
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I've no idea myself, but, asking rhetorically, why wouldn't a daughter of the Kingmaker harbour some ambition and steel? Once she had become Queen, the Princes very existence threatened her husband's legitimacy. She of all people would have understood the power game was for keeps and to come out on top and remain there required a degree of cool ruthlessness.

I'm influenced here by last week's 'The White Queen' where Anne was portrayed as a subtle but deadly power player. But as you suggest, the fact the Tudor's supreme propagandists largely ignored her may indicate her role was no more than that of passive observer and dutiful wife.
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Old 08-18-2013, 05:42 PM
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That's why I like the idea of an Anne Neville with more bite to her, having grown up in the milieu of ambition and power. Granted, she as a female would always be a pawn but given that she was a Neville and the Kingmaker's daughter, I wonder if she'd harbor aspirations of her own for herself and her husband.

But, of course, the Tudor propaganda machine would have made absolute hay of her reputation to benefit the current ruling house, unless Anne was very subtle and insidious in her approach. Philippa Gregory's novel, "The Kingmaker's Daughter," certainly gave her character some more backbone than how she's usually portrayed.
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Old 08-20-2013, 05:34 PM
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I haven't seen the White Queen BBC/Starz series yet, but after watching the documentary Philippa Gregory hosted, I am very intrigued by Anne Neville. It's likely that her true character fell somewhere in between the hyperbole: not Lady Macbeth but not a passive pawn either.
But I can see where Tudor propaganda would have benefited by portraying her as an unwitting pawn. Richard III does seem that much more evil if he
1. killed Anne's first husband, then forced her to marry him so he can get her inheritance
2. poisoned Anne to death for a younger niece who give him surviving children and more status on the throne.
I don't think portraying Anne as a schemer would have done much for the Tudor cause, but by making her a weak pawn, they use it to blacken Richard III. I personally welcome this new take on Anne and more interest and research into her character.
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Old 08-21-2013, 02:45 PM
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Anne must have been a shrewd woman to get along with her formidable mother in law Lady Cecily Neville,Duchess of York!
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Old 08-21-2013, 02:52 PM
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Absolutely, I find Anne a dark horse and am absolutely intrigued by her. I think she and Richard were childhood playmates, so she must have been accustomed to Proud Cis' ways from a young age.
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Old 09-01-2013, 03:02 PM
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Absolutely, I find Anne a dark horse and am absolutely intrigued by her. I think she and Richard were childhood playmates, so she must have been accustomed to Proud Cis' ways from a young age.
Dark horse is a good description,she was the Kingmakers daughter so I'd be interested in reading this biography.
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Old 09-13-2013, 02:48 PM
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Well, if Anne was as ambitious as this author speculates, could she be added to the list of people who might have had motive to murder the young Princes in the Tower?
Now that's a good thought! I've always read Anne being helpless. I have never seen anything that listed Anne as possibly responsible for the disappearance of the Princes in the Tower, although I've come across books saying it's possible Margaret Beaufort did it because they would be in the way for her son to become king.
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