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  #41  
Old 04-06-2013, 05:28 AM
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But would anyone (i.e. media or publishing house) seriously consider publishing any medical documents?

Wouldn't that be a criminal offence in Spain?

Also, I believe the EU legislation regarding files containing personal information is pretty strickt.
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  #42  
Old 04-06-2013, 05:31 AM
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People, we were all wrong. This isn´t an attack to Letizia. This isn´t even an attack to the Monarchy. According to the editor, this is an attack to the Catholic Church and its hypocrisy. Oh, right. I understand

http://translate.google.es/translate...-vs-letizia%2F

Another circus going around for the SRF. In fact, everything related to the SRF lately has become a circus.

I wouldn´t mind it so much if it wasn´t Spain what is considered a circus as a final consecuence

My poor, poor country. And it´s still a year before the next WC. This is a mess.
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  #43  
Old 04-06-2013, 05:51 AM
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Thanks, Annie-S

This sentence struck me immediatly: Goodbye, Princess is fictionalized memoir of Rocasolano,

Is that his defence? Oh, this isn't slander, it's critisism of the church and anyway it's all fiction.

How the bloody hell can memoirs by a real living person, containing very sensitive and potentially damaging information about another real living person possibly be fiction?

Fictionalized memoirs are in my eyes something akin to the Flashman saga. I.e. memoirs by a fictional person. - I give up!
I say again, sue him. Just because the SRF have enough problems as it is, there is no reason to take something like this lying down.
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  #44  
Old 04-06-2013, 06:03 AM
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I think all three of JC&S's children made really bad choices for marriage.
Elena's husband turned into a clown, Cristina's into a criminal (suspect).
I wonder if that's what they were from the beginning or what the close contact with the SRF turned them into?

And Felipe married a woman who IMO simply is not the stuff Spanish queens are made of. I admire Letizia for her pre-royal career and never quite understood why some people seem to hate her so much but I see her as a problem not an asset for the SRF. From the beginning she seemed to polarize the Spanish people which is not a good thing for a future queen. And for me she worked like a catalysator, somehow she made it visible how dysfunctional and hypocritical this family is.

It also seems to me ever since a journalist married into the SRF the attitude of the press towards the royals changed. A barrier fell. (I am not blaming Letizia personally.)

I don't think this book will change the perception of Letizia fundamentally. She never had that "clean" image and general approval, unlike JC.
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  #45  
Old 04-06-2013, 06:19 AM
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It is not that Letizia is not good enough to be princess of Spain. It is that there is no woman good enough to please everybody here.

This is a complicated country. You know even Queen Sofia is disliked by liberals and homosexual colectives since she talked on that infamous book.

Spain is quite a divided country. We have had better times but I dare to say that we have never been very united as a country. We are not Sweden or Norway.

Spanish social, political and economical reality is much more difficult to understand.
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  #46  
Old 04-06-2013, 06:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
This sentence struck me immediatly: Goodbye, Princess is fictionalized memoir of Rocasolano,

Is that his defence? Oh, this isn't slander, it's critisism of the church and anyway it's all fiction.
The author and publisher do indeed come off as great hypocrites themselves.
And I find the title very telling regarding the true intention of this book. Looks like kicking someone who is already on the ground to me.
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  #47  
Old 04-06-2013, 06:29 AM
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^^I agree, they would have moaned about every wife of Felipe. Eva Sannum can be lucky to have escaped this
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  #48  
Old 04-06-2013, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Kataryn View Post
I hope the story is not true, because for me (speaking strictly for me) aborting a child means murder. But I accept that it happens just like I accept that eg Prince Harry has blood on his hands due to being a soldier who saw combat. That's the way it is and who am I to judge, not knowing what really happened?

As for the abolishing of the monarchy: you need a serious and powerful political wish for it, which I don't see at the moment with Spain in so much turmoil and the monarchy still seen as uniting and calming.

The difference between the soldier in combat and an innocent child is pretty vast though.

If she did have an abortion she could be forgiven of that sin (someone mentioned her being married to a Catholic monarch and traveling to the vatican), assuming she was repenant.

It's possible (if she really were pregnant) that she had a miscarriage or etopic pregnancy ...and someone else has assumed she had an abortion.


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  #49  
Old 04-06-2013, 08:44 AM
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Originally Posted by ANNIE_S View Post
It is not that Letizia is not good enough to be princess of Spain. It is that there is no woman good enough to please everybody here.

This is a complicated country. You know even Queen Sofia is disliked by liberals and homosexual colectives since she talked on that infamous book.

Spain is quite a divided country. We have had better times but I dare to say that we have never been very united as a country. We are not Sweden or Norway.
You mean it's not Letizia who is polarizing but the country which is polarized? That might be true but on the other hand e.g. Belgium is not a very united country as well, yet Mathilde does not have such a dividing effect.
Of course you never can please everybody. Not even the very popular Maxima is liked by all Dutch people.

Quote:
Fürstin Taxis
I agree, they would have moaned about every wife of Felipe. Eva Sannum can be lucky to have escaped this
I sometimes wonder if a gentle noble woman like Mathilde of Belgium or Stephanie of Luxembourg, well educated and with a profession but not particularly career-women, would have the same difficulties as Letizia. Perhaps they would not be that popular but also not that unpopular.

And sorry, but IMO Eva Sannum was a terrible choice and would have been for any crown prince in any country (except Norway perhaps).
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  #50  
Old 04-06-2013, 08:56 AM
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Letizia is not a praticant catholic, and she was rumoured to be from quite "leftish" political position. If she got pregnant at this period of her life she had done the abortion without doubt. After her marriage, because of her new position she realises acts like visiting the Pope or presenting her baby to the virgin of Atocha, but the previous Letizia would never do any of this. The previous Letizia wed to the City Hall, not to the Church. This detail speaks a lot about her.
But i thing that is very disgusting, to criticize her now. If the Palace and the Spanish people did not want a woman like her (coming from ordinary people, with a past and worling to live and not to spend her time like a young aristocratic girl might do) they should not accepting her THEN. Now she is 9 years married and she is irreprochable on her duties. Why criticizing now for what she was before? It is unfair.
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  #51  
Old 04-06-2013, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by fandesacs2003 View Post
But i thing that is very disgusting, to criticize her now. If the Palace and the Spanish people did not want a woman like her (coming from ordinary people, with a past and worling to live and not to spend her time like a young aristocratic girl might do) they should not accepting her THEN. Now she is 9 years married and she is irreprochable on her duties. Why criticizing now for what she was before? It is unfair.
There was no time to critizise her, because she was straight away presented as fiancee, not as girlfriend. Felipe knew that if Letizia had been presented as girlfriend, the relationship would not have survived a public discussion. The press would have come up with these issues (divorce, abortion) straight away. As a finacee, Letizia had the (at least for the public) backing of the Kings, what gave her a certain protection for the press. It was all very rushed.

As ricarda already said, with Letizia coming into the family she polarized from the beginning, and a barrier fell. This is a new low after the failure of the King, the Dukes of Palma.

By the way, I do not find any actions of Letizia questionable that she did as a private citizen but what does it say about the actions of Prince Felipe, trying to fool his parents and believing that he could keep Letizia's past, that is clearly not Princess/Queen material for a Spanish Royal Family, from the public. How arrogant or naive one must be to believe to get away with something like that, but then, he is the King's son who has gotten away with much more.

In the book, Rocasolano says that Letizia called him to the palace to read through the pre-nup agreement, a document of 40 or 50 pages, stating her rights in case of divorce, including losing custody of future children. Letizia became furious when he advised not to sign it, because giving up custody is illegal, always decided by a judge instead. Letizia finally signed the agreement after calling in Jaime Del Burgo, now married to her sister Thelma, who advised her 'to try to get a better deal than Diana'.

Vozpópuli - David Rocasolano:
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  #52  
Old 04-06-2013, 01:30 PM
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I really don't like the idea that someone's very private medical decisions should be something that disqualifies them from holding a public role. I don't consider her alleged abortion to be anyone's business but her own, and not only am I horrified that this information was released, I'm horrified by the implication that this makes her unfit to be a member of the Spanish royal family.

I can't think of anything more deeply personal than sexual health, and I don't see what business it is of anyone else's or why it should have prevented her from marrying Prince Felipe.
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  #53  
Old 04-06-2013, 01:38 PM
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I really don't like the idea that someone's very private medical decisions should be something that disqualifies them from holding a public role. I don't consider her alleged abortion to be anyone's business but her own, and not only am I horrified that this information was released, I'm horrified by the implication that this makes her unfit to be a member of the Spanish royal family.

I can't think of anything more deeply personal than sexual health, and I don't see what business it is of anyone else's or why it should have prevented her from marrying Prince Felipe.
I quite agree. It was not an illegal act and is no ones business but her own if it is true. Her cousin should also be prosecuted/disbarred for violating lawyer/client privilege if he has not already been given his own legal difficulties. What a scumbag. She obviously made a very good judgement in distancing herself from him. He can justify his decision to write the book any way he wants but this clearly is about money and revenge.
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  #54  
Old 04-06-2013, 01:45 PM
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I agree with this. I can't imagine anyone who has acted as her attorney revealing ANY of this. If an attorney would do this in the US, his career is OVER.

Her actions as a private citizen, unless criminal, are nobody's business.
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  #55  
Old 04-06-2013, 01:55 PM
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Agreed, Hermione, concerning private medical issues. The whole subject of "deliberate abortion," "accidental abortion" (caused by taking medications for another condition) miscarriage, ectopic pregnancy, etc. is so complex that it cannot be fully understood what has happened without a detailed medical record, which cannot legally be produced and made public. The Countess of Wessex had an ectopic pregnancy, which usually involves removal of conceived tissue to save the life of the mother, as the fetus is already 100% doomed; did this prevent her from being respectable, and would it do so even in Catholic Spain? Rick Santorum's wife (he was a Catholic presidential candidate in America this last go-round) took an anti-biotic which caused premature delivery of an already compromised fetus that they had tried to save through surgery; see how complex it gets? Any time science gets involved with reproductive matters, there are complex conditions which may materialize, if physician help is sought at all. Even Duchess Kate sought medical help to get her through Hyperemissis gravidus, which must have involved intravenous intervention. In the old days, women just lived or died by natural happenstance.
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  #56  
Old 04-06-2013, 01:55 PM
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the reason publishing that book of "that cousin" David is obviously: publicity, public attention and money. but nevertheless the content of the so called "secrets" he tells the public about a future queen of Spain are not that you want to know as an ideal. we should not judge, but these news are not fitting to the public exspectations to a royal family. ergo: royals seems to to be as ordinary than everybody else (exception: queen sofia - she seems to be a real hero)
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  #57  
Old 04-06-2013, 02:01 PM
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The righteous indignation and fuming in this thread are quite amusing.
Given the freedom of speech, the authour in question is within his rights to publish the damaging information and receive a harsh backlash or accolades. If the book in question breaches any laws, the authour will face a professional panel that deals with such situations. Just because one finds the book immoral, it does not mean that the book is illegal. The members of the Spanish royal house can pursue legal actions against the authour.
It appears it would be better from a PR standpoint for a reigning royal house to have a Princess without a colourful past.
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  #58  
Old 04-06-2013, 02:19 PM
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In most developed nations these are not issues of free speech, they are issues of legal and medical privacy to which all citizens are entitled no matter if they are commoners or royals.
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  #59  
Old 04-06-2013, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade View Post

There was no time to critizise her, because she was straight away presented as fiancee, not as girlfriend. Felipe knew that if Letizia had been presented as girlfriend, the relationship would not have survived a public discussion. The press would have come up with these issues (divorce, abortion) straight away. As a finacee, Letizia had the (at least for the public) backing of the Kings, what gave her a certain protection for the press. It was all very rushed.
/URL]
You are rîght. Felipe had twice the bad experience with the press who destroyed his relationship with Isabel Sartorius and Eva Sannum. He would not take the risk to have this again, especially with a bride like Letizia. So he did all to avoid this. Furthermore if it is true that he had very strong fightings with his parents, he could not fight 2 fronts in the meantime.
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Old 04-06-2013, 02:30 PM
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In most developed nations these are not issues of free speech, they are issues of legal and medical privacy to which all citizens are entitled no matter if they are commoners or royals.
If the authour broke any laws, he should face the professional panel. One might assume that the authour was fully aware of the adverse legal/professional consequences the book might entail and took precautionary measures. He is a lawyer. The Crown Princely couple have got a choice of taking legal action against the authour.
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