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  #1021  
Old 04-13-2015, 05:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Dman View Post
I don't think the family have any problems with Sofia. I think the problems are with the folks on the internet. Obviously, she will get to know many royals over time and they will get to know her.
A wise comment.
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  #1022  
Old 04-13-2015, 06:21 PM
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Most current royals are pretty practical and pragmatic... As long as you don't talk to the press or do something totally outlandish or boorish to embarrass people I'd think they live and let live. If she can be discreet and toe the line from now on it will work and I bet she had been told and understands one screw up by her will be blown up and worth 10 of everyone else's because many many people are just looking for a reason to see her as unsuitable or a fail!princess.
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  #1023  
Old 04-13-2015, 07:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Archduchess Zelia View Post
Wow, ok. I didn't know there was a special rule that dictates that you must have a specially pious past to be "a sweet and well-mannered girl". Good to know.
That is because some people still have a hang towards the old days of royal glory. When being royal and entering a royal family actually "still meant something" and had an elevated status.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xenobia View Post
Of course they know. I don't think they have seen all of them, but they have a rough idea. Sofia has also talked openly about her background, saying (in short) that she doesn't regret anything, but she would have chosen differently today.

The court is trying to give us the impression that Sofias way into the family was an easy ride. I'm sure that's not true. But I'm also sure that they have gotten to know her over the years (they've been together for five years now) and that she is fully accepted.
You can't know that for sure and neither can anyone else here - we weren't there.

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Originally Posted by Dman View Post
I don't think the family have any problems with Sofia. I think the problems are with the folks on the internet. Obviously, she will get to know many royals over time and they will get to know her.
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Originally Posted by French Toast View Post
A wise comment.
Agreed.

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Originally Posted by amaryllus View Post
Most current royals are pretty practical and pragmatic... As long as you don't talk to the press or do something totally outlandish or boorish to embarrass people I'd think they live and let live. If she can be discreet and toe the line from now on it will work and I bet she had been told and understands one screw up by her will be blown up and worth 10 of everyone else's because many many people are just looking for a reason to see her as unsuitable or a fail!princess.
For example many people who post in this thread but disguise it by using careful phrases as "time will tell", "let's wait and see", "I hope she'll prove me wrong" etc.. It's really the same feeling expressed through another tone. Because one may hope that no one wants to read the same comments that were made on June 27th and the ensuing days last year - some of them were really mean and spiteful (even hinting towards broken engagements not being uncommon in Sweden, how petty to wish someone something like that).
  #1024  
Old 04-13-2015, 08:18 PM
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I don't think expressing some reservations- this is an unusual marriage for a senior Royal and she is an unusual type of Royal bride after all-makes one petty mean or spiteful just cautious and realistic. To expect everyone to treat this as some awe inducing fairy tale we must wholeheartedly gush over and celebrate or we are big meanies is unrealistic and very unfair.
  #1025  
Old 04-13-2015, 09:09 PM
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Originally Posted by amaryllus View Post
I don't think expressing some reservations- this is an unusual marriage for a senior Royal and she is an unusual type of Royal bride after all-makes one petty mean or spiteful just cautious and realistic. To expect everyone to treat this as some awe inducing fairy tale we must wholeheartedly gush over and celebrate or we are big meanies is unrealistic and very unfair.
I don't see why we, anonymous people on a forum, need to express reservations. It equals doubting Carl Philip's judgement and perhaps even more King Carl Gustaf's and that of the government. As in "how dare they approve of *her* and cloud my view of how royalty should be"?
We don't have to deal with her and we won't be marrying into the family. Yes, she may be "unusual" in terms of that we haven't seen "a girl like her" marrying into royalty before, but it doesn't mean she is less qualified or ill-suited to start with. For some she is ill-suited and less qualified exactly because of her being "unusual" and even more, should not even be allowed near a royal family.

I do think some people expressed themselves in a petty way and made some nasty comments - I hope you don't think wishing him a broken engagement (or hinting at it, which did happen) is a very nice thing to do simply because his intended is "not traditional princess material".

And I did not say anything about gushing over and treating it like a fairytale, but I did say something about the general attitude towards her - which has not been of the kindest. Would you like to endure the cr*p that she has, simply because some outsiders disagree with what you did?
That is not unrealistic or unfair, it is exactly what happened here. It's considering what's worth it and what's best to let go, and some people can't let go.

In the end I guess it all depends on how you look at it. Either from the royal point of view, or from the human point of view. I look at it from the latter point. The biggest success can come from the most unexpected person/place/corner.
  #1026  
Old 04-13-2015, 09:37 PM
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Royal is just a made up word from times ago. She is just as suitable as anyone. They are no more special nor have anything special flowing through their veins. Just a bunch of people whose forebears had a big sword. She is just as suitable as Queen Sylvia, whose father was a Nazi. Sylvia is lovely and wonderful. And just as suitable as the King who has had some tawdry affairs. No films included. Or Daniel who is a personal trainer, now a prince. She will do just fine. Made better than some.
  #1027  
Old 04-13-2015, 09:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skippy View Post
I don't see why we, anonymous people on a forum, need to express reservations. It equals doubting Carl Philip's judgement and perhaps even more King Carl Gustaf's and that of the government. As in "how dare they approve of *her* and cloud my view of how royalty should be"?
We don't have to deal with her and we won't be marrying into the family. Yes, she may be "unusual" in terms of that we haven't seen "a girl like her" marrying into royalty before, but it doesn't mean she is less qualified or ill-suited to start with. For some she is ill-suited and less qualified exactly because of her being "unusual" and even more, should not even be allowed near a royal family.

I do think some people expressed themselves in a petty way and made some nasty comments - I hope you don't think wishing him a broken engagement (or hinting at it, which did happen) is a very nice thing to do simply because his intended is "not traditional princess material".

And I did not say anything about gushing over and treating it like a fairytale, but I did say something about the general attitude towards her - which has not been of the kindest. Would you like to endure the cr*p that she has, simply because some outsiders disagree with what you did?
That is not unrealistic or unfair, it is exactly what happened here. It's considering what's worth it and what's best to let go, and some people can't let go.

In the end I guess it all depends on how you look at it. Either from the royal point of view, or from the human point of view. I look at it from the latter point. The biggest success can come from the most unexpected person/place/corner.
Skippy, your post is right on point and I agree with everything you've written.
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  #1028  
Old 04-13-2015, 09:45 PM
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What if she was a recovered alcoholic or drug addict? Would she then be barred for life from marrying, afraid she would relapse?
  #1029  
Old 04-13-2015, 11:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skippy View Post
I don't see why we, anonymous people on a forum, need to express reservations. It equals doubting Carl Philip's judgement and perhaps even more King Carl Gustaf's and that of the government. As in "how dare they approve of *her* and cloud my view of how royalty should be"?
We don't have to deal with her and we won't be marrying into the family. Yes, she may be "unusual" in terms of that we haven't seen "a girl like her" marrying into royalty before, but it doesn't mean she is less qualified or ill-suited to start with. For some she is ill-suited and less qualified exactly because of her being "unusual" and even more, should not even be allowed near a royal family.

I do think some people expressed themselves in a petty way and made some nasty comments - I hope you don't think wishing him a broken engagement (or hinting at it, which did happen) is a very nice thing to do simply because his intended is "not traditional princess material".

And I did not say anything about gushing over and treating it like a fairytale, but I did say something about the general attitude towards her - which has not been of the kindest. Would you like to endure the cr*p that she has, simply because some outsiders disagree with what you did?
That is not unrealistic or unfair, it is exactly what happened here. It's considering what's worth it and what's best to let go, and some people can't let go.

In the end I guess it all depends on how you look at it. Either from the royal point of view, or from the human point of view. I look at it from the latter point. The biggest success can come from the most unexpected person/place/corner.
Doesn't the title of this thread seem to indicate that the sole purpose for being here is to discuss the young woman's past? I understand why her fans are not enthusiastic about that, but it is what it is.

Sofia's own soon-to-be sister in law Princess Victoria uttered a rather terse "no comment" when she was asked about her brother's upcoming wedding during the Korean State visit. How simple would it have been to say "She is lovely, I am happy for both of them" or something equally mild and generic? Do you REALLY believe that if the Royal fiancée was someone without SH's background Victoria would have answered as she did?

Or was Victoria being petty and unfair as well?
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  #1030  
Old 04-14-2015, 01:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
Sofia's own soon-to-be sister in law Princess Victoria uttered a rather terse "no comment" when she was asked about her brother's upcoming wedding during the Korean State visit. How simple would it have been to say "She is lovely, I am happy for both of them" or something equally mild and generic?
I'm going to guess, given some of the truly horrible statement's that were made on Madeleine's Facebook page when she congratulated her brother on his engagement, that Victoria has chosen to avoid speaking about the topic in general. It has to be very hurtful to see a brother you love torn down constantly over his choice of a wife. Better to say nothing and not have to deal with any potential fall out or hateful remarks that might be directed towards yourself and/or your family. If I was Victoria I'd do the exact same thing even if I adored the woman in question.
  #1031  
Old 04-14-2015, 01:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kellydofc View Post
I'm going to guess, given some of the truly horrible statement's that were made on Madeleine's Facebook page when she congratulated her brother on his engagement, that Victoria has chosen to avoid speaking about the topic in general. It has to be very hurtful to see a brother you love torn down constantly over his choice of a wife. Better to say nothing and not have to deal with any potential fall out or hateful remarks that might be directed towards yourself and/or your family. If I was Victoria I'd do the exact same thing even if I adored the woman in question.
Good points, except that by saying nothing you simply add fuel to the already rampant speculation that the SRF are not all exactly thrilled with SH's imminent accession to their ranks. Victoria is not an idiot, she must have realized this.


She could have come up with something more noncommittal yet diplomatic than a terse " I don't want to talk about it"...my goodness! It's a family wedding, not an embezzlement controversy like in Spain or a sordid sex scandal like in England!


Speaking of the nastiness on Madeleine's FB page, she not only didn't object to them she let the derogatory comments about SH stay up.

And no, the negativity is not solely confined to the Internet.
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  #1032  
Old 04-14-2015, 02:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
Doesn't the title of this thread seem to indicate that the sole purpose for being here is to discuss the young woman's past? I understand why her fans are not enthusiastic about that, but it is what it is.
Well no! This thread is actually titled:

Discussion about Sofia Hellqvist's Past & Future Role in the Royal Family

However, thinking that the "sole purpose" of the thread was to discuss Sofia's past does seem to explain the number of negative posts and people firmly grounded in the past. Not to mention people endlessly trawling the net for unsavoury information which can only be alluded to obliquely as the forum rules prevent a full out assault.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
Sofia's own soon-to-be sister in law Princess Victoria uttered a rather terse "no comment" when she was asked about her brother's upcoming wedding during the Korean State visit. How simple would it have been to say "She is lovely, I am happy for both of them" or something equally mild and generic? Do you REALLY believe that if the Royal fiancée was someone without SH's background Victoria would have answered as she did?

Or was Victoria being petty and unfair as well?
Isn't it amazing that two people can read the same thing and come up with two opposite views about it.

Firstly, the words "no comment" cannot be construed as meaning anything other than what they say. Or in this case, what you want them to say.

Victoria, indicated she liked Sofia way back around the time of the engagement announcement. That statement merely engendered a lot of people printing in the rags and posting all over the net that, "she doesn't really but she has to say she does because that's the SRF line". So, saying anything is counterproductive. Your own take on her comment proves the point.

So, when some sleazy journalist tries to blindside her with a question about her personal family life when they are supposed to be following the Korean tour, what else was she ever going to say except, "No Comment". She is a consumate professional and would never allow such "loaded questions" to possibly derail her work for her country. That is, after all, why she was there in Korea and not sunning herself on some tropical beach,

Now me, I thought "No Comment" was pretty unambiguous but, as your post illustrates, that is obviously not the case.
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  #1033  
Old 04-14-2015, 10:00 AM
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Yes, MARG. It is indeed fascinating how two people can sometimes read the same thing and come up with different interpretations.

And why exactly was the journalist "sleazy" for asking Victoria her brother's upcoming wedding? If you read the interview it was during the course of a relaxed question and answer period when lots of personal questions were being asked....i.e. about Princess Estelle's response to her mother's absence. It was perfectly legit for the reporter to ask about the upcoming wedding...ANY Royal with a family member having a wedding coming up would have been asked that question.

And the question was about the wedding in general...not about Sofia.


The question might be considered "loaded" by some SH fans but that is hardly the fault of the journalist is it?


Finally...what other recent Royal fiancée has had a thread put up to discuss her "PAST, and her future role" within her new family? Catherine Middleton? Stephanie de Lannoy?
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  #1034  
Old 04-14-2015, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Frelinghighness View Post
What if she was a recovered alcoholic or drug addict? Would she then be barred for life from marrying, afraid she would relapse?
I wouldn't think so, but her past will always follow in media and certain circles will always talk behind her back. Look at Mette-Marit and what she has gone through over the years. Not fair, but then most people are not fair, even when a person make a 160 degree change in their life style. Most people seem to enjoy reading and talking about the negative rather than the positive. Sells more papers.
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  #1035  
Old 04-14-2015, 12:31 PM
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I wouldn't think so, but her past will always follow in media and certain circles will always talk behind her back. Look at Mette-Marit and what she has gone through over the years. Not fair, but then most people are not fair, even when a person make a 160 degree change in their life style. Most people seem to enjoy reading and talking about the negative rather than the positive. Sells more papers.
Sad but true. I'll never understand people who feel happy degrading other people. For me, that's an indicative of a very sad and frustrated life.
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  #1036  
Old 04-14-2015, 12:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MARG View Post
Well no! This thread is actually titled:

Discussion about Sofia Hellqvist's Past & Future Role in the Royal Family

However, thinking that the "sole purpose" of the thread was to discuss Sofia's past does seem to explain the number of negative posts and people firmly grounded in the past. Not to mention people endlessly trawling the net for unsavoury information which can only be alluded to obliquely as the forum rules prevent a full out assault.
Indeed, as the thread's opening post says: 'This thread has been created to discuss the Sofia Hellqvist's past, her suitability to be a member of the Swedish Royal Family, and her potential future role within the SRF.'

The reason why we started this thread was that it was obvious that people want to discuss her past life style. We did not want each and every thread about her to be cluttered with the same endless discussion. That is why we created this one thread where such a discussion could take place. A place thread that can be ignored by those who do not find the discussion interesting. At this point a rather large group I would say. It seemed a logical choice to add the 'future' too, so we can look ahead.

Not in reply to you MARG, but a general remark: the atmosphere in this thread & the remarks of some posters to others are at times rather nasty and rude -as we can see these last pages. We do our best to moderate this debate but it feels like the walk to Canossa. The nasty remarks by some posters towards others and the general intolerance of the opinions of others is something we find particulary disappointing. It would be a start to accept that people have different opinions. Not everybody will find her Lucifers daughter, not everbody will find her a saint. Cyberbullying other posters will never convince anybody to alter their views. Neither will rudeness or insults.
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  #1037  
Old 04-14-2015, 01:04 PM
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Well in the end some posters are going to crow they were right that she turned out to be a lovely addition to the family and a model Royal princess or other posters are going to sadly(or not) tsk tsk about how they were right and pronounce she was a bad choice who brought embarrassment and scandal down on their heads...either way it will be interesting to see.
  #1038  
Old 04-14-2015, 01:05 PM
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Sad but true. I'll never understand people who feel happy degrading other people. For me, that's an indicative of a very sad and frustrated life.
Indeed. Such behavior shows their true character.
  #1039  
Old 04-14-2015, 01:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Cris M View Post
Sad but true. I'll never understand people who feel happy degrading other people. For me, that's an indicative of a very sad and frustrated life.
It's a blood sport that I've never liked. We've been through this with the DoC before her marriage to William.
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  #1040  
Old 04-14-2015, 01:21 PM
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I would like to just say that those who have a negative opinion about Sofia have just as much right to express it as those who have a positive view of her as long as every thing is done in a respectable manner, I think its sad that some posters imply that other posters have ill characters or that it reflects what kind of a person they are or souls etc just because opinions differ
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