Discussion about Sofia Hellqvist's Past & Future Role in the Royal Family

[Cris M]

It's clear that everyone is entitled to a second chance, unless you're Sofia Hellqvist. And everyone can be sincere, unless you're Sofia Hellqvist.

The girl has made some terrible choices on her past, but she's "clean" for almost a decade now. Since then, she has dedicated herself to charity work and to build a future with the man she loves.

But who cares? Let's judge and condemn her forever, we're armchairs judges hidden by usernames and avatars, our trash is well hidden. Her charity work is not sincere, she just wants to look nice. Oh, and "she loves the press", perhaps she should be unsympathetic so you'd be able to blame her for being unsympathetic.

I suppose it's quite difficult to live such a perfect life as the ones of some of the posters here, I can't imagine how they manage to live in such a sinful world. I prefer to live my imperfect life, believing in regret and forgiveness.

 

[LadyFinn]

It's clear that everyone is entitled to a second chance, unless you're Sofia Hellqvist. And everyone can be sincere, unless you're Sofia Hellqvist.

The girl has made some terrible choices on her past, but she's "clean" for almost a decade now. Since then, she has dedicated herself to charity work and to build a future with the man she loves.

But who cares? Let's judge and condemn her forever, we're armchairs judges hidden by usernames and avatars, our trash is well hidden. Her charity work is not sincere, she just wants to look nice. Oh, and "she loves the press", perhaps she should be unsympathetic so you'd be able to blame her for being unsympathetic.

I suppose it's quite difficult to live such a perfect life as the ones of some the posters here, I can't imagine how they manage to live in such a sinful world. I prefer to live my imperfect life, believing in regret and forgiveness.

Sofia has got her second chance when she met her mentor Barbro Ehnbom, who made her suitable to better circles that she had been used to. She got another work, in a charity business. No one has denied the second chance, she has already got it. This would be her third chance.

 

[Cris M]

Sofia has got her second chance when she met her mentor Barbro Ehnbom, who made her suitable to better circles that she had been used to. She got another work, in a charity business. This would be her third chance.

I see nothing wrong with her since her second chance.

 

[LadyFinn]

And this applies only for Sofia does it? They have allowed other royals, not just Swedish, to be bullied for years.

Yes, it applies only for Sofia.
A long time ago Svensk Damtidning was a good magazine, now it just a gossip magazine. Their reporter Åsa Bönnelyche wrote in March 2010, that queen Silvia is very ill, she has Alzheimer. Well, Svensk Damtidning had to apologize from the queen and Bönnelyche was suspended from royal reporting for some time. The members of the royal family meet reporters of Svensk Damtidning at their work duties and talk with them like with all the reporters.

Svensk Damtidning has also during the years bullied Letizia. She is thin, does she have anorexia, why her hair is like that, she looks unhappy, is everything well with their marriage. Letizia and Madeleine are the royals of whom they write a lot of negative articles. Although now when Letizia became queen, they have changed the tone in their articles.

 

[traceeb123]

Here is something I hope - I hope that Sofia can come out now, - and use her new position to create something positive from her past experiences.

I think if she can admit - hey I was young, I did something stupid. It would go a long way.

She is going to be a public figure that a lot of girls look up too. She should use that platform to teach them that selling their bodies in that way - disrespecting themselves in that way is wrong.

Right or wrong..that is what I hope.

 

[Empress Merel]

Here is something I hope - I hope that Sofia can come out now, - and use her new position to create something positive from her past experiences.

I think if she can admit - hey I was young, I did something stupid. It would go a long way.

She is going to be a public figure that a lot of girls look up too. She should use that platform to teach them that selling their bodies in that way - disrespecting themselves in that way is wrong.

Right or wrong..that is what I hope.

Oh please stop it. If a woman makes the decision to be a prostitute/glamour model/escort etc that is on her. It's not disrespecting your own body, it's taking matters into your own hands. That is making the choice to do what you want and how you want to achieve what you set out to do. Now if she was forced into it, that's another story but there are plenty of women who made the decision to do the type of work they do and are contributing people.

People need to get over the stigma that every woman who works in an industry related to that of the sex industry, is an unworthy person.

Also, people need to stop it with not willing to give her a chance. Firstly of all, it's not up to you to give her another chance. She is not marrying into your family now is she? Secondly of all, these are two adults who have decided to get married and really start a family/life together. They are not killing anybody nor is that decision affecting anyone in any way. Please cry some more over it.

 

[HRHHermione]

Oh please stop it. If a woman makes the decision to be a prostitute/glamour model/escort etc that is on her. It's not disrespecting your own body, it's taking matters into your own hands. That is making the choice to do what you want and how you want to achieve what you set out to do. Now if she was forced into it, that's another story but there are plenty of women who made the decision to do the type of work they do and are contributing people.



People need to get over the stigma that every woman who works in an industry related to that of the sex industry, is an unworthy person.



Also, people need to stop it with not willing to give her a chance. Firstly of all, it's not up to you to give her another chance. She is not marrying into your family now is she? Secondly of all, these are two adults who have decided to get married and really start a family/life together. They are not killing anybody nor is that decision affecting anyone in any way. Please cry some more over it.

I kind of want to give this post a standing ovation. I am so over the pious slut-shaming and the narrative that a woman becomes an irredeemable, broken human being if she poses nude.

It's far more damaging to young women to be told that not being "chaste" makes them broken and worthless than it ever could be to have Sofia as a princess.




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[Skippy]

I don't understand what you mean. Since we in Finland don't have our own royal family, we have always felt like the swedish royal family is like our own. I have followed the swedish royal family since the king and queen got married. I think that to become a member of the royal family, or a member of the Head of State, the person must be one people can respect and look up to. And miss Hellqvist certainly isn't like that, at least to me. People say she made a mistake when she was young. She didn't make a mistake, she had a way of life, in which the main goal was to get famous and get publicity as much as possible by posing in photos and attending a reality show and so on. That lasted about 8 years. Then she met Carl Philip, and her main goal was still to get famous. After they started dating she decided that it is good to get involved in charity business, because queen Silvia has started many charity organisations. I think that she hasn't changed at all essentially, just bought a lot of expensive clothes and learned how to do a good make up. At least her love for the press and publicity hasn't changed a bit.

And about Sofia and her family, if I was the king or queen, I wouldn't want my grandchildren to have other grandparents, who allowed their daughter to pose in provocative photos when she was a minor and urged her to pose in Slitz. I wonder what queen Silvia thinks about that, since she has done so much for the children getting sexually abused and talked about trafficking.

What I mean is that you sound so fierce in your dislike of her that, in my opinion, it bothers on hatred and a hostile attitude towards her - as in how dare she enter the Royal Family that you have followed for so many years. She doesn't have the right to enter it and she has to prove to you personally that she does have good qualities and is worthy of a married position next to Prince Carl Philip. If you would ever allowe her to prove it, that is, which I doubt very much. I think that you see her as an intruder.

And I get the idea that since you dislike her so much, you are trying to look for signals/information/gestures from the Royal Family that would indicate that you are not alone in your feelings. I get this idea from other posters as well. If it is so in your case, I think you have a very long road ahead. If it is not so, then I am wrong.

I do understand that, with a long history of following a particular royal family that may even feel a bit like your own family after such an extended time, that not every chosen partner will evoke cheers and hurrahs, but your opinion (along with SElizabeth's) on Sofia Hellqvist goes - again, in my opinion - very, very far.

That is what I meant with my original comment.

 

[Marengo]

It's clear that everyone is entitled to a second chance, unless you're Sofia Hellqvist. And everyone can be sincere, unless you're Sofia Hellqvist.

The girl has made some terrible choices on her past, but she's "clean" for almost a decade now. Since then, she has dedicated herself to charity work and to build a future with the man she loves.

But who cares? Let's judge and condemn her forever, we're armchairs judges hidden by usernames and avatars, our trash is well hidden. Her charity work is not sincere, she just wants to look nice. Oh, and "she loves the press", perhaps she should be unsympathetic so you'd be able to blame her for being unsympathetic.

I suppose it's quite difficult to live such a perfect life as the ones of some of the posters here, I can't imagine how they manage to live in such a sinful world. I prefer to live my imperfect life, believing in regret and forgiveness.

I am afraid that you are making a caricature out of the objections that some people have. I think that it is legitemate to ask some questions. I have listed some points that I found striking :

- if with 'clean' you mean that she stopped posing for pictures in the nude, you have the time span wrong. The last posing was 6-7? years ago. Not that it matters much, posing in the nude is not illegal, neither is appearing naked in magazines (in most countries that is). But those repeated choices over an extended period of 10 years or so make some people wonder if her values about this issue makes her an appropriate person to represent a country. Not an odd idea IMO.

- 'she loves the press': she does. If you have followed her CE thread over the years you must have seen this too. She often talks to the press, very often. And the press loves her. Now if that is a good or a bad thing is open for debate of course. I don't like unofficial partners of any royal talking to the press, but you might like it, and many others will.

- Why is it 'condamning' if people just say, we don't think she is suited for this particular position? Let's be honest, she is far from an ideal candidate for representing Sweden. If the RF would be a company she would never in a million years be hired for this particular 'job'. But of course it isn't only a company, but also a family. So that changed the matter. Still, it is legitemate to wonder why on earth she is qualified for this position, esp. if you are a Swede and paying tax. It is true that our skeletons are safely hidden, at least on this forum, but AFAIK none of us is seeking a position in the public eye, representing a country. The RF serves as a symbol, and if the symbol is something that the country does not want to be associated with, that may cause problems. It happened in many cases btw, not in this one in particular.

- about being perfect: very few actually mentioned perfection, nobody IIRC. She doesn't need to be perfect, nobody is.

- your remark 'perhaps she should be unpleasant to the press' seems an awnser to no particular issue. Nobody wants her to be unpleasant. But posing for minutes for the press while the RF does not, seems odd. Esp. since the previous and present partners of the princesses (and Emma Pernald) never posed for the press. Neither did most other royal partners, apart from Charlene (but Monaco is a completely different story). Not that she should be stoned for doing it, but it adds to an impression that people have. Which has a certain logic.

- about (not) being sincere: people gave a lot of reasons why they think that she wasn't (or isn't). Often they just use simple facts and exposed lies. Fact is that one of her ambitions was to seek fame. Why else would she pose for magazines, go to reality shows, brag about kisses with porn actresses etc? Since she was looking for fame, some think that it gives the impression that that may have been a motivation for her present relationship. Not an absurd logic I would say, although it is very well possible that she was looking for fame ánd started this relationship for honest reasons.

- about the charity: fact is that she joined it after she met the prince. Her interest may or may not have been sincire. The logic that after meeting the prince this was her way to make her acceptable to the public is not farfetched. But that doesn't exclude her sincerity about the matter perse.

Concluding: the argument why she is not suitable has a certain logic, there are certainly a lot of questions. The argument why she will be a suitable princess fails most logic to me. As it mainly seems to consist of the arguments "you are biased, jealous and sexist, people can change, why does it matter, they are in love, and why do you care anyway?'. Not the strongest points.

Of course she is not the devil in sheeps clothes either. Most mistakes with her charity seemed more due to amateurism -as happens with many new organisations- of do-gooders than intentional harm. And not all gestures and moves she makes are a sign of some evil part in her character: I didn't see anything wrong in her showing of her ring to the press f.e. I am also happy that she did not make a tearful apology to the press about her wild past, it was not needed as she did nothing illegal. The white washing of her cv is not that shocking either. Most people adapt their resume if they apply for a job, why not Sofia. But of course the gaps in the cv are obvious as we have followed the information of various magazines and newspapers over the years (much of the information coming form Sofia herself btw). She is also not alone in damaging the institute, many have done it in the past and many will do it in the future. Her father-in-law being one of the more recent examples. This doesn't mean that with time, things can not alter of course. CG may recover from his exposed incidents, Sofia may prove to be an asset. Who knows?

I wish them all the best on a personal level. But if she would be joining my own RF I would be sprinting to the office of the republican movement to enlist. I don't want my country to be represented by people who I think do not stand for some core values in our society (with that I do not mean the nude pictures, about which I do not care all that much since it was indeed in the past). Her entry in the RF also makes it painfully obvious that the system of a monarchy is outdated. An anachronism to which I am attached and a fact which I try to ignore, but an anachronism nontheless.

What I find the most irritating about this matter is not so much Sofia herself -she may be a lovely woman, I don't know her- but the articles in the press which just make up a fairy tale. While, by following the information posted on this forum over the years, it is obvious that they lie, over and over again, and they have done so for years. I also follow my own press in other aspects, and it is difficult not to become a cynic about the way the press deals with things. In the end it is a business.

Anyway, I am sure that with the years the opinions wil soften. Things will be forgotten, they always are.

 

[Empress Merel]

I kind of want to give this post a standing ovation. I am so over the pious slut-shaming and the narrative that a woman becomes an irredeemable, broken human being if she poses nude.

It's far more damaging to young women to be told that not being "chaste" makes them broken and worthless than it ever could be to have Sofia as a princess.




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I'm glad there are a few more people here who can reason with an open mind. We should tell young girls/women to take their sexuality into their own hands and embrace it. Not to be controlled by what society/conservative people deem right/wrong and make of it what you feel makes you happy. And if that decision makes you cringe a little a decade later? Well, take responsibility, own up to it and make the changes you feel are needed.

Posing nude does not define a character nor a life. It does not make her unworthy of anyone's affection or love. Let's not pretend here that CP is the greatest man on earth or that her father in law has remained faithful in his marriage (give me a break and a bucket). Seems like most of the people in the Bernadotte family have no room to judge, nor anyone else.

 

[Cris M]

Marengo,

If the last nude picture was taken 6-7 years ago, then it was "almost a decade" ago, as I said.

I don't think she'd be suitable for a Prince if she was still posing naked, but she has changed, she's now dedicating herself to charity. I even think she can be a role model, proving that doesn't matter what you've done, you can always change and start a new life.

Maybe she should learn to behave more properly with the press, but I see no problem with her answering questions - unless the answers put her or the Royal Family in a bad situation - and posing to pictures. People often say that some royals should be more sympathetic towards the press, but Sofia - a royal-to-be - is being criticized for doing that.

I have no problem with people politely saying they don't think she's suitable for whatever reasons, my problem is with the repetitive comments trying to imply she's a farce, that no one like her, that she and Prince Carl Philip as hangers-one and that she deserves no recognition for her good deeds. Perhaps it's a forum policy to allow or ignore these kind of comments depending on the person.

 

[Marengo]

No, the TRF policy has been the same for years. If you have problems with posts you can report them. Still, people are entitled to their opinions and so far very few posts from this thread were reported. TRF does not encourage namecalling or baseless gossip, but it certainly does not want to end up like the online part of Svensk Damtidning where only 1 opinion is allowed to be heard.

Re: press and questions -> the policy in Sweden is more open than in most other monarchies. I can't imagine QEII lowering herself to awnser some idiotic questions on the level of SD. But in Sofia's case the questions are usually empty and shallow, hence are better left unreplied. It 'lowers' royalty to the levels of D-list celebrities. But it is great for the gossip magazines, as they have another page filled.

 

[Icea]

Sofia has got her second chance when she met her mentor Barbro Ehnbom, who made her suitable to better circles that she had been used to. She got another work, in a charity business. No one has denied the second chance, she has already got it. This would be her third chance.

I'd also like to know how she blew this second chance that she got with Barbro Ehnbom? I haven't heard anything about it.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

Sometimes I wonder if posters who are saying Sofia "just" posed nude are being disingenuous?

I certainly wouldn't care if that's all that was involved. The human body is a beautiful creation, and Sofia's in particular is lovely.

It's what she is doing while she is in the nude that I find objectionable. I saw one photo over the weekend where she was semi-nude with her face buried in the lap of some middle-aged gentleman.

If it's "slut shaming" to say that I am surprised that the king and queen of Sweden don't mind someone like that marrying into and representing their family then....oh well!

 

[COUNTESS]

Oh, the drama of it all. No one seems to care that the King has had affairs and done some pretty nasty things. No one cares that other kings during these times have also had affairs or such. The British will have a queen that has a pretty ugly past. She will be anointed. This gal with smile for cameras seems like she is trying. As for us here in the states, we still revere President Kennedy and his family, even after all the dirt came out. And Bill Clinton certainly has had some indiscretions, but is the most popular former president here, today. People forgive and forget. Prince Ernst August is obnoxious. And the two princesses of Monaco had very checkered pasts. So cut the silliness. She is a person and he loves her and the world will not end, in a few months no one will care.

 

[Marengo]

I'd also like to know how she blew this second chance that she got with Barbro Ehnbom? I haven't heard anything about it.

AFAIK they are still on friendly terms, they recently posed together for a picture at an event at least.

 

[AdmirerUS]

If a woman makes the decision to be a prostitute/glamour model/escort etc that is on her. It's not disrespecting your own body, it's taking matters into your own hands.

My issue with this discussion is that so many of you think you can make CP's decision for him.
So she was a wild child. We can all find examples of male royals being wild children. Yet no one sets limits to whom these men can marry. Seriously, I think this is a great match from that perspective. If you paired CP up with someone unlike him, you would be inviting trouble (think back a bit). This is just my opinion, but I don't think princesses should be held to different standards than princes.
I think CP knows and likes his choice.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

I was looking forward to reading this week's Point de Vue cover story on the engagement, instead they made the Prince and Princess of Monaco and the baptism of Raphael El Maleh this week's cover, and relegated the Swedish Royal engagement to the back pages. They didn't give Carl-Philip and Sofia even a tiny photo on the cover.

Both Victoria/Daniel and Madeleine/Chris got cover stories. Carl-Philip is the only son, for goodness sake! If that isn't a snub I don't know what is. Hopefully they will at least give them a wedding cover.

 

[SElizabeth]

Oh, that's ridiculous.

Yes, she has taken some courses and received education. There's nothing to hide, she has just listed all the courses she has taken. But I suppose that's not enough for you.

And give us a break with this taxpayer money nonsense. Are you a specialist in Swedish taxpayer money? Do you know the exact amount of money Prince Carl Philip receive? Can you prove any of your allegations or are you just throwing all the nonsenses your mind can think about on a couple you don't like for no logical reason?

Where do you think the royal family gets it's money, from the *taxpayer* and that is the darn truth, plain and simple..........
You think PCP really works, say a 9/5 to job......
I don't have to prove anything and I am not saying anything that isn't a fact, written and reported in the media. How does the king and Queen live in the huge palace and not have money, their money comes from the
*TAXPAYER*, heck the media complains about the cost of the security for his daughter's wedding, the cost that the people paid for.........

 

[Blog Real]

She may come to surprise and become as popular as Diana was in England.


Seriously, though, we have to give u a chance for her to show you how it's going to be your job within the Royal family.

 

[Queen Penelope]

Here is an odd thought: Maybe they (the RF) see this as a 2nd chance so to speak, or more of a "blank slate" if you will. Maybe they plan on sending her to "Princess School" like they did for Diana, Mary and Letizia? I say blank slate, as they can mold her into what they want and expect out of the wife of a Prince??? They can teach her how to deal with the press correctly, do more good work with more charities, expand and get more involved with her current charity and how to use her status as a positive role model for young ladies. How to own up to her past, but do it with decorum. CP does not have such a great reputation either. Maybe together, they can help rebuild each other's reputation for the better and turn out to be an asset to the RF???!!!!

Love the bit about owning up to her past with decorum. IMO, it would really go a long way for her. Who amoung us doesn't have sonething from our past we would sooner forget? Just don't try spin it, be honest about it.

I personally can't get past her obvious fame seeking. The nude pictures were not a good choice and can't be changed. The fame seeking can. If she can quietly go about her business while supporting C-P and her inlaws-to-be without the whole "look at me!" thing she does, I think it would perhaps build some goodwill for her. She doesn't seem like a bad person, just desperate for fame. That bothers me way more than pictures in men's magazines and a TV show I've never seen (nor care to see!)


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[Grandma828]

I have been following this discussion and one thing keeps jumping out at me. When I was in college and studied psychology we learned that the human brain does not fully mature until age 25. The last thing that develope's is the ability to forsea the consequences of your actions. This means that Sophia was under that age when she was "modeling".Could explain a lot about her and give some hope for a better future.

 

[jjkg]

Sometimes I wonder if posters who are saying Sofia "just" posed nude are being disingenuous?

I certainly wouldn't care if that's all that was involved. The human body is a beautiful creation, and Sofia's in particular is lovely.

It's what she is doing while she is in the nude that I find objectionable. I saw one photo over the weekend where she was semi-nude with her face buried in the lap of some middle-aged gentleman.

If it's "slut shaming" to say that I am surprised that the king and queen of Sweden don't mind someone like that marrying into and representing their family then....oh well!

I saw that pic too and was shocked.

I guess I am showing my age but I cannot equate disapproval of Sofia's use of her sexuality to gain publicity and money as "slut shaming". I never shy away from accepting the "feminist" label, sometimes much to my detriment, but I would have deep, deep reservations if someone with Sofia's behavioral patterns, pre-CP and with CP entered my department. I have seen people getting fired for much less ( letting drink get out of hand at post-work parties with potential customers, and or industry press).

And here we are talking of royal family of Sweden.


More I read the comments, more I am reminded of Sarah Palin, a VP candidate in US. She struck an emotional chord with her defenders, which her detractors could not fight against with facts on her personality, her past, lack of knowledge and skill-set. Watching her on national stage was like watching a slow train wreck. Before real world caught up with her, she was GOLD. People who were never involved in politics showed up for her rallies like she was the next messiah. Men were ga-ga over her. Women resented anyone who pointed out her flaws. She used her sexuality like a politician has never before. People with deep pockets were throwing money at her left, right and center. It was good while it lasted.


I fear the same with Sofia. she is going to be a sensation, eating up all the oxygen. All the stories will be about her and her antics. We can also take it as given about how certain agenda driven "inside the palace scoops" will be unleashed.

We already have one mag, defying press ethics and openly in Sofia's camp. And let us not be so naive as to believe that it has done so for altruistic motives and there has not been a relationship between them and Sofia. When push comes to shove, will the members of royal family, excepting the King, trust Sofia not to leak info suitable to her to the press? What happens when there are inevitable disagreements and grievances?

Princess Diana developed a relationship with press much later in her married life and we all know how deeply Charles and Diana public wars hurt the monarchy.

Here Sofia is entering the royal family with established relationship with press promoting her viewpoints. Not a good base.

I truly hope that Sofia really avails of this third chance in life and becomes a figure that respects the position she is going be fulfilling and brings honor to the family.


PS: I know that the opposing side does like to hear view points such as mine. But please do not call me anti-feminist when I have spent much of my life fighting for women. I take that personally.
Thanks

 

[jjkg]

Another point: role of her parents.


If what I read is true, her mother told her to go for it when she posed nude/semi-nude while she was 15/16(?)

What kind of parent is that.

If her alleged advise (go for it, you live once) is true then it is easy to see how Sofia could have the value system she did.

I feel sorry for her/

 

[jjkg]

Oh, the drama of it all. No one seems to care that the King has had affairs and done some pretty nasty things. No one cares that other kings during these times have also had affairs or such. The British will have a queen that has a pretty ugly past. She will be anointed. This gal with smile for cameras seems like she is trying. As for us here in the states, we still revere President Kennedy and his family, even after all the dirt came out. And Bill Clinton certainly has had some indiscretions, but is the most popular former president here, today. People forgive and forget. Prince Ernst August is obnoxious. And the two princesses of Monaco had very checkered pasts. So cut the silliness. She is a person and he loves her and the world will not end, in a few months no one will care.

I'll make this last comment and will hold my tongue for awhile (promise )

The distinction between all the examples you mentioned above and many more is "personal life" and public/professional life. These royal figures and many more (remember King of Spain Juan Carlos and his alleged 1500 affairs ! ) have shoddy personal lives. But there professional lives have not been built on using their sexual antics to gain fame, and money.

That is the key difference.

Heck, it is to be expected in this day and age that a royal bride will have some naked and/or compromising pictures in her past. Sofie of Wessex did not show her naked breasts to climb the ladder in her public relations career. Letizia did not use her first marriage to climb up the journalism ladder. So on and so forth.

But Sofia did it. Her sexuality was her profession and she used it to get to the right places. Infact, that was her primary skill.

She made this choice consciously, without force, and with alleged backing of her mother.

This in my book, shows a skewed core value-set.

And I have seen nothing in Sofia's behaviour with CP to illustrate that his value-set is a thing of past. Her desire for publicity, constant selling of her relationship with CP to the press, is just a manifestation of that value-set.

All for now

 

[biru]

I'm not very familiar with the SRF. But until now I still can't see Sofia as a princess, she's not even a lady in my opinion.

so, will she has the title as the princess of sweden after she married to CP?

I don't know much about Sofia, only that she used to have a nude pictures in the past and she had live together with CP in the past several years. Does anyone knows if she had attend a university before?

So sorry for my bad English

 

[SElizabeth]

I know that I am very opinionated when it comes to SH, and I will be honest, I don't like her period. When I saw some of those pictures and read articles that her mother said *go for it*, a mother is suppose to guide her daughter in this ugly world of men and she certainly did not. So my gut tells me that SH, when she got introduced to PCP, her mind went to work and she got the ring......I think she is very calculating and street smart and knows the way to get a man and this was a great catch for her. No I can't prove it, it's just my gut/instinct telling me this. I trust my gut feelings, saved me many times.

 

[Marengo]

I believe the remark that her mother encouraged her to do nude pictures is from an old interview with Sofia. But like much of what reality starlets (or anybody else for that matter) say, this may not be the complete truth. The kind of magazines she was interviewed for weren't exactly known for their in-depth articles, a quick/ empty/ witty/ light answer is preferable over a more 'heavy handed' one. In the end these reality stars talk a lot and want to present a certain image of themselves. The magazines that she posed for want the image of a naughty woman, so that is what they got. Note that the encouragement that was spoken about was for a photoshoot for Slitz when she was 22, not the one taken when Sofia was 16.

I really have a hard time believing that a sane parent would encourage a 16y/o daughter to do nude shoots. Esp. since Mrs. Hellqvist seems clever enough, being a politician and all that & she never told (or is required to tell) her side of the story. Her other daughters seem well rooted, they are doing degrees in psychology and philosophy at the Stockholm Univerisity. Mrs. Hellqvist is a private person, so we should not burn her -or her husband- at the stake and assume the worst automatically. We simply don't know the full story -perhaps Sofia's parents encouraged her, perhaps they did not, perhaps they tried to be supportive hoping that that is the best way to guide her through this phase in life. We don't know, and we have no right to know, this is a private matter to those involved.

 

[Sancia]

Oh please stop it. If a woman makes the decision to be a prostitute/glamour model/escort etc that is on her. It's not disrespecting your own body, it's taking matters into your own hands. That is making the choice to do what you want and how you want to achieve what you set out to do. Now if she was forced into it, that's another story but there are plenty of women who made the decision to do the type of work they do and are contributing people.

People need to get over the stigma that every woman who works in an industry related to that of the sex industry, is an unworthy person.

Also, people need to stop it with not willing to give her a chance. Firstly of all, it's not up to you to give her another chance. She is not marrying into your family now is she? Secondly of all, these are two adults who have decided to get married and really start a family/life together. They are not killing anybody nor is that decision affecting anyone in any way. Please cry some more over it.

Some points about it.

- I don't think at all that all women working in sex industry are unworthy persons. Actually, I do know one of them. Although I don't approve at all her job, she is quite close to me. And I can say this : she never said her children the true nature of her job. Her children don't know in what industry their mother is working. That is saying much. She had no other choice than working in sex industry due to life events but she does not see it as a suitable career path for her children.

- A decision to be a prostitute/glamour model/escort is not only on woman's hands. On the contrary, in most of the case, prostitution means women slavery and mafia, and lot of difficulties to escape.

- Exposing a naked body may be seen as the ultimate freedom gained through feminist fight. There are other opinions about it. If my country was a monarchy and a former nude model was to marry into the royal family and become a princess, I can assure you that the strongest disagreement would not come from our local Tea Party but from all the people working with sexual abuses victims. I remember very well a discussion with one of them who talked about her disgust to see a naked girl in every car magazine. She suffered the worst and would be ready to demonstrate and talk with every journalist interested about how promoting nude models is an insult to her sufferings. She is not the only one to see in nudity promotion nothing else than something complying to masculine pulsions. There are studies - not made by bigot researchers - proving clearly the links between promoting nude women pictures and sexual violences and abuses. That is not bigotry. If I were Swedish, I would demonstrate with my friend and say the royal family : "miss Hellqvist, please have a long talk with victims about their feelings on nude women pictures, please come and take part to NGO activities on this matter".

 

[Elenath]

I'll make this last comment and will hold my tongue for awhile (promise )

The distinction between all the examples you mentioned above and many more is "personal life" and public/professional life. These royal figures and many more (remember King of Spain Juan Carlos and his alleged 1500 affairs ! ) have shoddy personal lives. But there professional lives have not been built on using their sexual antics to gain fame, and money.

That is the key difference.

Heck, it is to be expected in this day and age that a royal bride will have some naked and/or compromising pictures in her past. Sofie of Wessex did not show her naked breasts to climb the ladder in her public relations career. Letizia did not use her first marriage to climb up the journalism ladder. So on and so forth.

But Sofia did it. Her sexuality was her profession and she used it to get to the right places. Infact, that was her primary skill.

She made this choice consciously, without force, and with alleged backing of her mother.

This in my book, shows a skewed core value-set.

And I have seen nothing in Sofia's behaviour with CP to illustrate that his value-set is a thing of past. Her desire for publicity, constant selling of her relationship with CP to the press, is just a manifestation of that value-set.

All for now

So... people can sleep with as many people as they want, members of royal families can have lovers (either male or female), they can do pretty much whatever they want with whomever they want as long as they are not paid for it?? That’s hypocritical.

People get by on looks all the time. It’s well known good looking people are more popular, get better business deals, better partners, etc. Sex sells everything even royalty. It’s just that most of the time it’s not so blatantly obvious.