Discussion about Princess Sofia's Past & Future Role in the Royal Family

[Tilia C.]

Discussion about Sofia Hellqvist's Past & Future Role in the Royal Family​

This thread has been created to discuss Princess Sofia's past, her suitability to be a member of the Swedish Royal Family, and her role within the SRF. Before we begin, however, the moderators would like to set out some ground rules for the discussion, as it is no doubt going to continue the controversy that follows Sofia:
​

• This is a discussion board, and as such, a variety of opinions - particularly on this topic - are to be expected. The moderators will not be removing posts containing negative opinions unless they violate the board rules, no matter how much we are begged to do so
• It is imperative that members remain respectful to each other, and do not stoop to personal attacks - on the subject matter or each other - to get their point across
• Repetitive negative posting by individual posters will be removed at moderator discretion. If your intent is to simply repeat the same opinion over and over without participating in a discussion, this thread is not the place to do so
• Comparisons to other royals will be removed, as they do nothing to discuss the topic and end in battles

The previous thread can be found here: Discussion about Sofia Hellqvist's Past & Future Role in the Royal Family​

Any questions should be directed to a Swedish Royal House moderator​

 

[LadyFinn]

One of the first press articles about Sofia, from Dalarnas Tidning Dt, 6th June 2003.
Dancing into the future
- We are neighbors and have been childhood friends since kindergarten, explained Louice.
She hopes to become a professional dancer eventually, but now the closest it becomes summer job as a nursing assistant at Söderåsen.
- These years in Vansbro have been great, but it's nice to go out now, Sofia Hellqvist from Älvdalen thinks. Sofia, who studied at the aesthetic line was joined by boyfriend Dennis Damm, fishing guide in Älvdalen.
- I move to Stockholm to work at the restaurant. Sofia who tends to be a model, and participate in commercials hopes eventually get work with anything in song, music and theater.
Dansar mot framtiden

 

[Madame Verseau]

How is Sofia's standing in the SRF?

Hi. I'm new to the Forum. Read around a bit and I wanted to join.

Full disclosure - not a fan of the new princess of Sweden, Sofia. Her past is an issue for me, mainly her involvement with Project Playground. I've seen allegations of shadiness that went down on this organization. No formal investigations, but if there's proof it can be embarrassing for the SRF. Some of the posters I've read said since the king and the Riksdag (Swedish Parliament) signed off that should be it. Fair enough. But I do question, if Sofia's been accepted:

Why doesn't she have the Order of the Seraphim yet? It is the highest honor issued by the king, and it wasn't announced she has received it. When pressed, the court information officer (CIO) said she would get it, they don't know when. I don't understand because Daniel received his order sash on his wedding day. Chris didn't get the Seraphim, but he received the Order of the Polar Star two days before his wedding. Estelle and Leonore received the order sash on their christening days, breaking the custom that a knight (male) or a member (female) has to be at least 18 yrs. old to be inducted.

Why doesn't Sofia have a coat of arms yet? - Every member of the SRF (except Chris) has one, even Estelle and Leonore. I imagine the new prince Nicolas will get his coat of arms by his christening. But Sofia, who has royal and ducal titles, doesn't have one. What gives? It makes one wonder because there is no concrete reason not to announce now now that she's married.

 

[JR76]

Hi. I'm new to the Forum. Read around a bit and I wanted to join.



Full disclosure - not a fan of the new princess of Sweden, Sofia. Her past is an issue for me, mainly her involvement with Project Playground. I've seen allegations of shadiness that went down on this organization. No formal investigations, but if there's proof it can be embarrassing for the SRF. Some of the posters I've read said since the king and the Riksdag (Swedish Parliament) signed off that should be it. Fair enough. But I do question, if Sofia's been accepted:



Why doesn't she have the Order of the Seraphim yet? It is the highest honor issued by the king, and it wasn't announced she has received it. When pressed, the court information officer (CIO) said she would get it, they don't know when. I don't understand because Daniel received his order sash on his wedding day. Chris didn't get the Seraphim, but he received the Order of the Polar Star two days before his wedding. Estelle and Leonore received the order sash on their christening days, breaking the custom that a knight (male) or a member (female) has to be at least 18 yrs. old to be inducted.



Why doesn't Sofia have a coat of arms yet? - Every member of the SRF (except Chris) has one, even Estelle and Leonore. I imagine the new prince Nicolas will get his coat of arms by his christening. But Sofia, who has royal and ducal titles, doesn't have one. What gives? It makes one wonder because there is no concrete reason not to announce now now that she's married.

Sofia didn't get an order on her wedding day because it's against tradition to wear a sash together with a wedding dress.


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[Madame Verseau]

@JR76 - hi & thanks. That explains the wedding day, but what delays the announcement now? Also, on the official royal Facebook page, Sofia has her monogram, but her picture has no sash or Bernadotte diadem on her head.

 

[Meraude]

Why doesn't she have the Order of the Seraphim yet? It is the highest honor issued by the king, and it wasn't announced she has received it.

Why doesn't Sofia have a coat of arms yet? - Every member of the SRF (except Chris) has one, even Estelle and Leonore. I imagine the new prince Nicolas will get his coat of arms by his christening. But Sofia, who has royal and ducal titles, doesn't have one. What gives?

As for the Order of the Seraphim, you can compare her situation with that of princess Lilian, who married prince Bertil in 1976, but didn't get the Order of the Seraphim until 1985. Perhaps Sofia doesn't have to wait nine years for her order, but it's not certain she will get it this year. Lilian got the Nordstjärneorder after her marriage, and my guess is that Sofia also will get it soon.

As for her coat of arms, she will have to decide what the centre piece of her coat of arms will be, prince Daniel have the coat of arms of his home town in the middle of his coat of arms, princess Lilian had three fleur de lis (for Wales) in her coat of arms, to differentiate their coat of arms from their spouses. Sofia's coat of arms will be her husband's with a centre piece of her choosing.

As for the photo without a tiara, it was taken before her wedding, and it seems that the SRF don't loan their tiaras until a woman is married into the family. Lilian wore a tiara before her marriage, but that tiara was owned by her husband, not a SRF tiara.

 

[crm2317]

Did Chris get the order of the Seraphim on the occasion of his wedding? If he did I doubt that Sofia will be made to wait a long time for hers.

 

[Stefan]

As for the Order of the Seraphim, you can compare her situation with that of princess Lilian, who married prince Bertil in 1976, but didn't get the Order of the Seraphim until 1985. Perhaps Sofia doesn't have to wait nine years for her order, but it's not certain she will get it this year. Lilian got the Nordstjärneorder after her marriage, and my guess is that Sofia also will get it soon.

But Lilian did get the Order of the Plar Star at the time of her marriage. Even before wwhen she was still a btitish citizen as according to the law at that time no swedish cititzens could get swedish Orders. And she got the Order of the Seraphim in 1995 when the law was changed so that memers of the swdish RF could get swedish Orders.

 

[Madame Verseau]

As for the photo without a tiara, it was taken before her wedding, and it seems that the SRF don't loan their tiaras until a woman is married into the family. Lilian wore a tiara before her marriage, but that tiara was owned by her husband, not a SRF tiara.

Silvia wore the Cameo Tiara for her wedding to Carl Gustaf (CG). The Cameo is part of the Bernadotte collection. @crm2137 - Chris didn't get the Seraphim on his wedding to Madeleine (Madde) and he doesn't have it now. My concern is the Swedish gossip press likes to cook up feuds between members of the SRF. In the run up to the wedding the press likes to run Madde vs. Sofia, how the blood princess is being mean to the married in with a not-so-clean past. Even with Sofia's hen party the press went on about Madde not being there, knowing full well she was on an official visit in Rome meeting the Pope. Daniel was dragged for not being at Carl Philip's (C-P) bachelor party and he was with Victoria on a weekend visit with Haakon & Mette-Marit (MM) of Norway at the time. (And the bachelor party had entertainment that would have gotten both Daniel and Chris in hot water with their wives and the press.) I'm saying if the lack of award goes too long the media will sell a narrative that Sofia is still being slighted but within the family. CG should not be pressured into giving it to her to avoid bad press, but it may come to that.

 

[Madame Verseau]

I have been reading about Victoria Day but the coverage leans quite towards Sofia's appearance at the event as a princess of Sweden. As in, Sofia's appearance is in the headline. I was a bit put off by that because it's Victoria's day, and some comments on one particular website, SvenskDam, thought it was too much. A couple of commentors have come to Sofia's defense. But it makes you think that all the money and effort spent to rehabilitate Sofia's image was for naught. She's still going to be a polarizing figure on blogs and comment boards after the wedding. It raises the question how will Sofia be an effective representative of Sweden.

 

[HRHAmy]

Sofia will never get rid of her past. No matter how much the SRF will try to make it go away. It will always be there and it surely will always be brought up. What's done is done. It was funny I was just looking at Sofia's biography on the SRF's website today and there was nothing about her time as a model. It covered her schooling, her time as a yoga instructor then on to her Project Playground work. It seems as though the royal family wants to wipe away her past to make her look more respectable. I'm afraid as much good as Sofia will do in the future, she will never fully get rid of her racy past.

 

[Dman]

Sofia will never get rid of her past. No matter how much the SRF will try to make it go away. It will always be there and it surely will always be brought up. What's done is done. It was funny I was just looking at Sofia's biography on the SRF's website today and there was nothing about her time as a model. It covered her schooling, her time as a yoga instructor then on to her Project Playground work. It seems as though the royal family wants to wipe away her past to make her look more respectable. I'm afraid as much good as Sofia will do in the future, she will never fully get rid of her racy past.

There's no need to mention Sofia's past as a model. What matters now is her role as Carl Philip's wife and as a member of the royal family.
People can go on and on about Sofia's past all they want, but the girl has moved on to bigger and better things.

 

[Ish]

There's no need to mention Sofia's past as a model. What matters now is her role as Carl Philip's wife and as a member of the royal family.

People can go on and on about Sofia's past all they want, but the girl has moved on to bigger and better things.

The way that the SRF's website fails to mention Sofia's past career (not to mention the way they don't really say anything concrete about her pre-Project Playground achievements, including the use of dates) is the SRF trying to white wash her history.

Her page on the SRF's website tells of her background and personal history. Her modelling career is a part of that, like it or not.

 

[xenobia]

I have been reading about Victoria Day but the coverage leans quite towards Sofia's appearance at the event as a princess of Sweden. As in, Sofia's appearance is in the headline. I was a bit put off by that because it's Victoria's day, and some comments on one particular website, SvenskDam, thought it was too much. A couple of commentors have come to Sofia's defense. But it makes you think that all the money and effort spent to rehabilitate Sofia's image was for naught. She's still going to be a polarizing figure on blogs and comment boards after the wedding. It raises the question how will Sofia be an effective representative of Sweden.

Victorias birthday was Sofias first appearance as a princess, and full member of the swedish royal family, so of course it's a big thing. But it's not Sofia who decides what the headlines say. I don't think she did something during the concert that gives us any sign of her trying to steal the spotlight away from Victoria.

 

[Dman]

The way that the SRF's website fails to mention Sofia's past career (not to mention the way they don't really say anything concrete about her pre-Project Playground achievements, including the use of dates) is the SRF trying to white wash her history.

Her page on the SRF's website tells of her background and personal history. Her modelling career is a part of that, like it or not.

They could put model as her past career, but I really don't see the need to do so. Many royals don't have their past careers listed under their bio's.

 

[HRHHermione]

I think in ten years, the number of people who care about Sofia's past will be infinitesimal.

 

[royal rob]

I think in ten years, the number of people who care about Sofia's past will be infinitesimal.

Sadly I don't think so people love going back over the past again and again. Just take a look at any of the Diana threads were the same things are just repeated time after time. I think her past will always be talked about even if she never puts a foot wrong


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[HRHHermione]

Sadly I don't think so people love going back over the past again and again. Just take a look at any of the Diana threads were the same things are just repeated time after time. I think her past will always be talked about even if she never puts a foot wrong


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The past for Diana is obsessed over because sadly, the past is all that exists for her.

It's not obsessed over for any other royal in the same way. If Princess Sofia has a happy, successful marriage which I very much hope she does, I'm pretty confident that no one's going to care about some modeling she did in her early twenties after she's been in public life for awhile and had a few children.

 

[Madame Verseau]

It's not just commentors on boards and blogs that are going over her past. Writers of articles for news and gossip blogs are bringing it up. Sofia has been described in print and/or electronic media recently as "reality show star", "topless model" "erotic model" "glamour model", "bikini model", "ex-stripper", etc. Project Playground is never mentioned most of the time. There are certain members of the press will never let her live it down.

 

[Dman]

People just need to let the past go and look forward to today and what's to come.

 

[Lee-Z]

There are certain members of the press will never let her live it down.

Nope, because the press has to earn money and juicy stories is what brings in the big bucks

It's funny, if you had asked the questions you've been asking lately about Sofia here a couple of months ago, they would have sparked an enormous pro/con debate and several moderators working in overdrive to prevent the rest of us verbally demolishing eachother.... now the comments are quite relaxed; we've all been there, seen it all (with snake and without ) and probably said all there is to say
i have a feeling it's a bit the same with the general public; press tries to stir a little, but nothing new

only if in the future new, more damning, evidence comes to light there might be a possibility for new discussions, but i somehow expect P.Sofia will be on princess-behaviour from now on, and the past will soon be only an amusing anecdote

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

the full nude stuff she did was largely ignored by the pink press because its too hard to print and too much of what pink press readers want to see, so many occasional pink press readers think she was just a model who posed in a bikini with a snake and did a reality show what is not true. i don't expect this to change.

i am so glad that cp is only a prince down the line and not a future king because his wife is not qualified to represent sweden on such a high level. for what cp usually does and to provide the nation with sugary family pictures, it might be enough.

 

[Archduchess Zelia]

It's not just commentors on boards and blogs that are going over her past. Writers of articles for news and gossip blogs are bringing it up. Sofia has been described in print and/or electronic media recently as "reality show star", "topless model" "erotic model" "glamour model", "bikini model", "ex-stripper", etc. Project Playground is never mentioned most of the time. There are certain members of the press will never let her live it down.

And that says more about the tabloids than Sofia.

 

[eya]

For the work to be done (work is the right word?) is perfect.
Must be nice to be dressed nicely and smilling to greet the people. I think is easy.

 

[LadyFinn]

the full nude stuff she did was largely ignored by the pink press because its too hard to print and too much of what pink press readers want to see, so many occasional pink press readers think she was just a model who posed in a bikini with a snake and did a reality show what is not true. i don't expect this to change.

i am so glad that cp is only a prince down the line and not a future king because his wife is not qualified to represent sweden on such a high level. for what cp usually does and to provide the nation with sugary family pictures, it might be enough.

I agree totally. The press also mercifully "forgot" Sofia's interview in Slitz, that gave some information about how she has been raised by her parents, considering the things she spoke at the interview.

 

[carlota]

And that says more about the tabloids than Sofia.

well, to be honest none of what they would say is untrue. so to me it does say something about sofia mainly, and then about the press on a minor proportion.

I agree totally. The press also mercifully "forgot" Sofia's interview in Slitz, that gave some information about how she has been raised by her parents, considering the things she spoke at the interview.

what was it that sofia mentioned to slitz? i can't see anything about her upbringing being too controversial...

Sofia will never get rid of her past. No matter how much the SRF will try to make it go away. It will always be there and it surely will always be brought up. What's done is done. It was funny I was just looking at Sofia's biography on the SRF's website today and there was nothing about her time as a model. It covered her schooling, her time as a yoga instructor then on to her Project Playground work. It seems as though the royal family wants to wipe away her past to make her look more respectable. I'm afraid as much good as Sofia will do in the future, she will never fully get rid of her racy past.

unfortunately not. the fact that the SRF tried to "hide" her past in the biography is no clever move in my opinion - come on, it's known, there's evidence all over the internet... you might as well acknowledge that sofia was "a model" (which sounds more dignified than saying she posed naked) and that she "participated in some TV shows". i'd prefer to see that written than to completely ignore her past and talk about project playground, which probably represents 10% of her past activity when considering the time spent her modelling, posing and reality TV. it's no easy position for the SRF but at least being honest and transparent in her biography would project the image to the public that they are not ashamed of her past and that they accept her. how can they expect the public to accept her when they try to cover these facts themselves?

 

[MARG]

Victorias birthday was Sofias first appearance as a princess, and full member of the swedish royal family, so of course it's a big thing. But it's not Sofia who decides what the headlines say. I don't think she did something during the concert that gives us any sign of her trying to steal the spotlight away from Victoria.

Absolutely! Victoria has a birthday every year and from the overt PDA's she and Madeleine have made over their brother it is clear they love him dearly and that means accepting his marital choice.

It's not just commentors on boards and blogs that are going over her past. Writers of articles for news and gossip blogs are bringing it up. Sofia has been described in print and/or electronic media recently as "reality show star", "topless model" "erotic model" "glamour model", "bikini model", "ex-stripper", etc. Project Playground is never mentioned most of the time. There are certain members of the press will never let her live it down.

Nope, because the press has to earn money and juicy stories is what brings in the big bucks

It's funny, if you had asked the questions you've been asking lately about Sofia here a couple of months ago, they would have sparked an enormous pro/con debate and several moderators working in overdrive to prevent the rest of us verbally demolishing eachother.... now the comments are quite relaxed; we've all been there, seen it all (with snake and without ) and probably said all there is to say
i have a feeling it's a bit the same with the general public; press tries to stir a little, but nothing new

only if in the future new, more damning, evidence comes to light there might be a possibility for new discussions, but i somehow expect P.Sofia will be on princess-behaviour from now on, and the past will soon be only an amusing anecdote

Couldn't have said it better myself.

The haters can hate and the stirrers may stir but they don't seem to be getting any traction. As far as the family and many others seem act it seems that now that Sofia is married to Carl Philip it's a done deal. The past is the past. We're all living in the present.

 

[Queen Claude]

As time goes by Sofia's bio will expand as she performs royal duties, has children and wears nice clothes, but any write up of her beyond a paragraph will note, accompanied by pictures, that she was a former glamor model and appeared on a reality TV show - it is not going to go away, it's just there. Of course there are people who do not and will never approve of her but obviously there was not such a high level of disapproval that it prevented the marriage from being approved. If the public outcry against what Sofia did when she was in her early 20s was not overwhelming in 2014-2015, then that is unlikely to change in 2020, 2025 and beyond, especially if she does a good job as a Princess of Sweden. Again it is not a big deal if ten years from now, there is a big write up on Sofia that discusses her past and they run pictures of her in skimpy clothes and/or partying.

Perhaps her official bio should have included something like she was a former model and television personality but far more people read the Daily Mail, People, US Weekly and other gossip sites and those publications definitely highlight the juicier parts of Sofia's past and will continue to do so.

 

[Meraude]

But Lilian did get the Order of the Plar Star at the time of her marriage. Even before wwhen she was still a btitish citizen as according to the law at that time no swedish cititzens could get swedish Orders. And she got the Order of the Seraphim in 1995 when the law was changed so that memers of the swdish RF could get swedish Orders.

As I wrote, Lilian got the Nordstjärneordern = Order of the Polar Star at the time of her marriage. She got the Order of the Seraphim at her 80th birtday.

If you look back in the history of the Order of the Seraphim, you can see that queen Louise didn't get the order until she became queen, and princess Sibylla, her daughters and princess Ingeborg didn't get their orders until 1952. https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lista_%C3%B6ver_mottagare_av_Serafimerorden There is nothing that says that Sofia "should" get the order directly after her wedding.

Silvia wore the Cameo Tiara for her wedding to Carl Gustaf (CG). The Cameo is part of the Bernadotte collection.

Yes, for the wedding when she became a member of the SRF. She wore the Connaught diadem at the celebrations the evening before the wedding, but there were no official photos of her with a diadem until after the wedding.

It raises the question how will Sofia be an effective representative of Sweden.

My hope is that she will concentrate on being a wife (and mother) and her own project playground, and do as much as, or as little as, representation for Sweden as her husband does, family ocations but not much more,.

 

[Mbruno]

My hope is that she will concentrate on being a wife (and mother) and her own project playground, and do as much as, or as little as, representation for Sweden as her husband does, family ocations but not much more,.

I expect her to attend openings of parliament, national day/official birthday celebrations, Nobel ceremonies, and possibly state banquets in honor of visiting HoS's on a regular basis. I don't expect her or her husband for that matter to take part in state visits overseas, or to lead Swedish delegations in diplomatic, business, cultural or scientific missions to foreign countries as the King and the Crown Princess routinely do.