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  #601  
Old 12-01-2014, 08:22 PM
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Carl Philip and Sofia's Wedding: Suggestions and Musings

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Originally Posted by scooter View Post
^ UMM, not like every woman in the SRF. Queen Silvia wears what she wants. Victoria and Madeleine are Princesses of the Blood and have always had access. Sofia would have to ask in advance in case someone else wants to wear X, I would think, not just point and say "Bring it to me". Way down the food chain SRF wise.

They all have access to a jewelry foundation that is shared amongst all the royal women. It's a pretty well known arrangement.

Certain pieces ARE reserved for the Queen and the Crown Princess, but the rest are shared amongst all the royal women. How they decide who wears what is internal, but I doubt they're petty enough to fight about it.

I was really just correcting your erroneous assumption that a new person marrying into the family poses a risk to the collection. The foundation ensures the jewelry stays with the family, and again, Sofia will have access to the jewel collection.


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Old 12-01-2014, 09:59 PM
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HRH H, I'm sorry, I am not familiar with the SRF jewel foundation that they would all have access to...EQUALLY? Is there a link?


SH could just say I want to wear the big gun tiara without clearing it with those higher up the food chain?
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  #603  
Old 12-01-2014, 11:17 PM
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Carl Philip and Sofia's Wedding: Suggestions and Musings

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Originally Posted by scooter View Post
HRH H, I'm sorry, I am not familiar with the SRF jewel foundation that they would all have access to...EQUALLY? Is there a link?


SH could just say I want to wear the big gun tiara without clearing it with those higher up the food chain?

No, that's not how it works, as I explained in my post- there are definitely tiaras reserved for the queen and crown princess, but the rest are worn by the whole family, and this includes many of the historic tiaras.

If you're interested in learning about it, I suggest you read this: http://orderofsplendor.blogspot.com/...jewel.html?m=1

Also: if you look at the individual tiara page for almost every Swedish tiara, you'll find examples of it being worn by most of the family at one point or another. Exceptions are the Braganza and the Leuchtenburg sapphires

There's no reason to believe that Sofia won't have access to the foundation- behind Queen Silvia and Crown Princess Victoria, but roughly equal to Princess Madeleine and the sisters of the King. My own speculation is that a curator-type person who oversees the collection probably works out the schedule with the stylists used by the women in the family.

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Old 12-02-2014, 07:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Tilia C. View Post
For some time I too thought that the Baden fringe was meant to be exclusively worn by the Crown Princess. But then Victoria seems to have stopped wearing it, and it was worn by her aunt at Madeleine's wedding. So I thing that the fringe is still in the running for Sofia's wedding tiara.
I do not think Victoria has "dropped" the Baden Fringe. In recent years, she has tended to wear the Cut Steel tiaras more than anything else. I would not read much into it.

As for as her aunt using the Fringe tiara at Maddy's wedding, most of the non-"Big Guns" get used at the weddings as all the royal ladies need tiaras. This is why one of the King's sisters was wearing the Nine Pronger at Victoria's wedding, which is usually only used by the Queen.
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Old 12-02-2014, 07:47 AM
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What do you think of Prince Carl Philip creating a new tiara for Sofia?
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  #606  
Old 12-02-2014, 07:53 AM
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What do you think of Prince Carl Philip creating a new tiara for Sofia?
Its a possibility I guess and its always nice to see a new tiara.
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  #607  
Old 12-02-2014, 08:14 AM
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Originally Posted by scooter View Post
I quite agree. If she's going to wear a tiara CP should buy her one of her own. Then if the marriage does not last she gets to keep it and the SRF gets to keep the historical pieces.
In the Netherlands and in Sweden, most "historical pieces" have been placed into private family foundations that keep them in trust for perpetual use by the Orange-Nassau and Bernadotte families respectively. The jewelry held by the family trust cannot be sold or inherited and there is no risk then of any piece ever leaving the royal house.

As far as I understand, the most significant Danish royal jewels are not personally owned by the royal family either, but, unlike in Sweden and the Netherlands, they are not held in a private family trust, but rather by the State directly. The Dutch and Swedish arrangements are considered safer for the families because, since there is no state involvement at all in the administration of the collection, they have an additional safeguard from having their assets seized by the government should the monarchy be hypothetically abolished in the future.

Finally, the UK has a mixed system. The so-called "Crown Jewels", which are seen in coronation pieces like crowns, scepters and orbs, are part of the State-controlled "royal collection", together with several older pieces (including tiaras and small items) that predate Queen Victoria's demise. Most jewelry pieces acquired after the Victorian era are, however, privately owned by different members of the BRF, including Queen Elizabeth II's own extensive personal collection, which she frequently wears in state events and loans to other members of the family. Being personal items, they can be sold, given out as gifts, or passed on by inheritance. Several cadet branches of the House of Windsor for example are known to have sold quite a lot of jewerlry in recent decades as they became strapped for cash.

I hope I got that right.
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Old 12-02-2014, 08:35 AM
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Originally Posted by muriel View Post
I do not think Victoria has "dropped" the Baden Fringe. In recent years, she has tended to wear the Cut Steel tiaras more than anything else. I would not read much into it.

As for as her aunt using the Fringe tiara at Maddy's wedding, most of the non-"Big Guns" get used at the weddings as all the royal ladies need tiaras. This is why one of the King's sisters was wearing the Nine Pronger at Victoria's wedding, which is usually only used by the Queen.
I hope that you are right and Victoria will continue to wear the fringe soon. Imo it suits her very well. Probably time will show .
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Originally Posted by principessa View Post
What do you think of Prince Carl Philip creating a new tiara for Sofia?
Do I trust CP's design talent to create a new tiara? - No, not really!
It's too often the contemporary tiara look like unimaginative playthings (Letizia's supposed Ansorena tiara, the butterfly tiara of HGD Stephanie, etc.) Obviously even specialized jewellery designers have trouble to create something that is both nice and contemporary. If they buy a new tiara for her, they should go for something made by a professional with taste and experience, imo.
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Old 12-02-2014, 09:10 AM
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Much as I would like to see Sofia get a new tiara, I think it is unlikely to happen. The Swedes have not really bought many tiaras in recent decades.


Also, I also think the King and Queen are going out of their way to show that Sofia is accepted. Giving her a new tiara and not one from the family pool may be interpreted by some as her not being perceived as one of them. I therefore think she will probably end up using the traditional bridal tiara, or if not, perhaps the Connaught or one of the Button tiaras.
  #610  
Old 12-02-2014, 09:12 AM
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Much as I would like to see Sofia get a new tiara, I think it is unlikely to happen. The Swedes have not really bought many tiaras in recent decades.


Also, I also think the King and Queen are going out of their way to show that Sofia is accepted. Giving her a new tiara and not one from the family pool may be interpreted by some as her not being perceived as one of them. I therefore think she will probably end up using the traditional bridal tiara, or if not, perhaps the Connaught or one of the Button tiaras.
The king and queen could show their acceptance by giving Sofia a new tiara as a wedding gift.
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Old 12-02-2014, 09:17 AM
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The king and queen could show their acceptance by giving Sofia a new tiara as a wedding gift.
Quite the contrary, in my view. No other recent bride has been given a separate tiara, and they all seem to use from the family "pool". To single one out and not let her have one from the pool would, IMO, send out the wrong message.
  #612  
Old 12-02-2014, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Tilia C. View Post
. Afaik, the fringe and the Connaught are both part of the foundation. And even if privately owned they wouldn't be given away as a present.
Actually i read once that the Connaught tiara and also the Cameo Parure are still the private Property of the King who inherited them both from his mother.
  #613  
Old 12-02-2014, 09:35 AM
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Actually i read once that the Connaught tiara and also the Cameo Parure are still the private Property of the King who inherited them both from his mother.

According to Order of splendour the Cameo is private property of the King and the Connaught also seems not to be included in the family foundation but I can't find out who actually owns it.


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Old 12-02-2014, 10:02 AM
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Originally Posted by muriel View Post
Quite the contrary, in my view. No other recent bride has been given a separate tiara, and they all seem to use from the family "pool". To single one out and not let her have one from the pool would, IMO, send out the wrong message.
Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't Sarah Ferguson get a new tiara when she married Prince Andrew? I thought I read that somewhere so I could be mistaken....I think it would be a lovely gesture if SH got her very own special tiara to use, something that would suit her personality, not the traditional/old world style that is what makes up most tiaras today, something more modern.
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Old 12-02-2014, 10:03 AM
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Ahh, thank you for that information, Stefan an JR76.

So in theory they could give one of these as a wedding present. But they most definitely won't, which is the point I wanted to make. The King has bought back historic tiaras (at least the rubies, maybe also the aquamarine and the pink tourmaline parure). The SRF has learned to keep historic jewels in the main line, while giving all family members access to appropriate jewels.

Their own daughter Madeleine seems to have received the modern fringe tiara at some point. A tiara with no further royal connection than being worn by the Queen a couple of times. It's a pity that there is no other contemporary tiara that could be reserved for CP's wife. But that's simply how it is, imo.
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Old 12-02-2014, 10:12 AM
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Quite the contrary, in my view. No other recent bride has been given a separate tiara, and they all seem to use from the family "pool". To single one out and not let her have one from the pool would, IMO, send out the wrong message.
Sofia can't be compared to any of the recent brides. It would be a nice gesture to give her a new tiara. And to make her special in that way.
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Old 12-02-2014, 10:14 AM
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I did a google search on tiaras that where given as gifts of brides coming into a royal family and to answer my own question above, Yes Sarah did receive her own tiara which QE bought for her, so maybe it would be a very nice gesture for the K/Q to give SH a tiara something that would be just for her keeping alone. * 1986, the Queen – purchased a tiara from Garrard for Sarah Ferguson's wedding to her son Prince Andrew.*
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Old 12-02-2014, 10:20 AM
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Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't Sarah Ferguson get a new tiara when she married Prince Andrew? I thought I read that somewhere so I could be mistaken....I think it would be a lovely gesture if SH got her very own special tiara to use, something that would suit her personality, not the traditional/old world style that is what makes up most tiaras today, something more modern.
Well. Sarah Ferguson was another generation and another country, and I don't see that the SRF would take her as a guideline.
Btw, the rumours say that Sarah had contacted a jeweller to loan the tiara since her own family had none. When the Queen heard about that, she decided to buy this tiara as a wedding gift.

When it comes to Sofia, I don't think that she'll contact a jeweller without discussing it with the RF.

Mette-Marit got a tiara as did Mary. But both the Norwegian and the Danish RF have a smaller tiara collection and it seemed smart to make additions.
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Old 12-02-2014, 10:22 AM
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Carl Philip has already designed Sofia's engagement ring and earrings for her. Maybe we see a necklace designed by Carl Philip at the Nobel ceremony. And a tiara at the wedding.
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Old 12-02-2014, 10:39 AM
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Originally Posted by SElizabeth View Post
I did a google search on tiaras that where given as gifts of brides coming into a royal family and to answer my own question above, Yes Sarah did receive her own tiara which QE bought for her, so maybe it would be a very nice gesture for the K/Q to give SH a tiara something that would be just for her keeping alone. * 1986, the Queen – purchased a tiara from Garrard for Sarah Ferguson's wedding to her son Prince Andrew.*
The customs and practices of the SRF and BRF are quite different. Sarah did indeed receive a new tiara. But the BRF do not really have a history of sharing tiaras between the ladies. Those allocated to specific members usually tend to stay with them for the rest of their lives, a bit like the Danish RF. The Swedes, however, share a lot of their jewellery, with the exception of some items being reserved for the Queen and the Crown Princess.

The SRF have not had any "material" new tiaras, other than the modern fringe, in the last few decades. For Sofia to not get to use a royal tiara at her wedding would, IMO, not send the right message at all.
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