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  #161  
Old 04-21-2016, 07:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
Xenobia: I have a question. If I understand it correctly, the testamentary disposition of Stenhammar says that the estate should be leased to a (male) prince of the House of Bernadotte. Is it possible that Carl Philip and his son may be the Stenhammar's "heirs" instead of the Westling Bernadotte branch of the family, which, under Swedish law, will inherit the throne ?
As I understand the terms stipulated for Stenhammar: yes. Even though the succession laws changed, it doesn't affect the rules for this particular property. That stipulates that Stenhammar should be leased to a male member of the Bernadotte family, with precedence to the Duke of Södermanland. And now we have a Duke of Södermanland, who also should have been heir to the throne if Sweden still had agnatic succession.
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  #162  
Old 04-21-2016, 07:33 AM
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I like the names!
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  #163  
Old 04-21-2016, 07:36 AM
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Wonderful names.
Just one question: is Alexander very popular in Sweden?
Is it an old/traditional name in Sweden or were there already other Princes in Sweden with the name?
BYe Bine
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  #164  
Old 04-21-2016, 07:50 AM
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I like Alexander very much. If only Kate had chosen that name as a first name for George Alas. I had a feeling that Alexander would have been a strong contender since ethe queen said yesterday that the name was preciuos. Don't ask me why.

I only don't think it's fair the boy has 4 names and that he was given such an important duchy. It doesn't reflect too well on the king.
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  #165  
Old 04-21-2016, 08:11 AM
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Princess Madeleine says welcome to Prince Alexander:

https://www.facebook.com/PrincessMad...type=3&theater
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  #166  
Old 04-21-2016, 08:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marty91charmed View Post
I like Alexander very much. If only Kate had chosen that name as a first name for George Alas. I had a feeling that Alexander would have been a strong contender since ethe queen said yesterday that the name was preciuos. Don't ask me why.

I only don't think it's fair the boy has 4 names and that he was given such an important duchy. It doesn't reflect too well on the king.
I think 4 names was expected. A name from each grandfather, a name from Prince Bertil and a spoken name by choice from the parents. Had they choosed 3 names Bertil would probably have been left out.

I don't think this child got a more "grand" dukedom than the other grandchildren. Nicolas got Ångermanland wich had never had a royal duke before but it's still a very old and important part of Sweden.

Alexander probably got Södermanland to secure his right to inherit the right to use Stenhammar Castle. The first owner (a non royal) stipulated in his will that Stenhammar Estate should be owned by the swedish state and rent out to a Prince by blood of the Bernadotte dynasty, preferably the Duke of Södermanland if there is one. That's why the last Duke of Södermanland Prince Wilhelm, the younger brother of Gustaf VI Adolf, lived there.
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  #167  
Old 04-21-2016, 08:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bine221 View Post
Wonderful names.
Just one question: is Alexander very popular in Sweden?
Is it an old/traditional name in Sweden or were there already other Princes in Sweden with the name?
BYe Bine
Alexander is a quite popular name here in Sweden. We have not had a Prince Alexander before.
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  #168  
Old 04-21-2016, 08:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hans-Rickard View Post
I think 4 names was expected. A name from each grandfather, a name from Prince Bertil and a spoken name by choice from the parents. Had they choosed 3 names Bertil would probably have been left out.

I don't think this child got a more "grand" dukedom than the other grandchildren. Nicolas got Ångermanland wich had never had a royal duke before but it's still a very old and important part of Sweden.

Alexander probably got Södermanland to secure his right to inherit the right to use Stenhammar Castle. The first owner (a non royal) stipulated in his will that Stenhammar Estate should be owned by the swedish state and rent out to a Prince by blood of the Bernadotte dynasty, preferably the Duke of Södermanland if there is one. That's why the last Duke of Södermanland Prince Wilhelm, the younger brother of Gustaf VI Adolf, lived there.
I see what you mean about the names, but still. Estelle is the only one who got 4 names and, IMO, they could have left out Hubertus if they really wanted a "Bertil" to be there.

Forgive me, but I would have expected Sondermanland for Oscar. It looks pretentious, especially knowing the views of the King. I see this as a sort of gift/compensation for Carl Philip and his son for having been robbed of their birthright.
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  #169  
Old 04-21-2016, 08:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marty91charmed View Post
I see what you mean about the names, but still. Estelle is the only one who got 4 names and, IMO, they could have left out Hubertus if they really wanted a "Bertil" to be there.

Forgive me, but I would have expected Sondermanland for Oscar. It looks pretentious, especially knowing the views of the King. I see this as a sort of gift/compensation for Carl Philip and his son for having been robbed of their birthright.
I think the practical reason behind the four names simply is that they didn't want to drop Bertil. Even if they do have more children in the future, there is no guarantee that there will be another son.

Making prince Alexander duke of Södermanland is a practical move. He's in line to inherit both Stenhammar and Ökenäs. In the future, it would have been very strange if Oscar was made duke of Södermanland, and Alexander owned/leased the two major royal properties in Södermanland.
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  #170  
Old 04-21-2016, 08:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xenobia View Post
I think the practical reason behind the four names simply is that they didn't want to drop Bertil. Even if they do have more children in the future, there is no guarantee that there will be another son.

Making prince Alexander duke of Södermanland is a practical move. He's in line to inherit both Stenhammar and Ödåkra. In the future, it would have been very strange if Oscar was made duke of Södermanland, and Alexander owned/leased the two major royal properties in Södermanland.
I would prefer a pattern for the naming of child, and I can't deny that I was dissapointed when Oscar was given only 3 names. Well,that's it anyway. Alexander is a beautiful name.
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  #171  
Old 04-21-2016, 08:54 AM
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Very nice name and practical reason for the dukedom, no reason to over think this. These srf women sure make childbirth. Look easy!
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  #172  
Old 04-21-2016, 09:09 AM
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Alexander Erik Hubertus Bertil. I like very much! So far my favourite baby names of all Sweden Royal grandchildren. I love how it sounds beautiful, tuneful and charming. Carl Philip and Sofia chose excellently and they honoured the king, Carl Gustaf and Carl Philip himself and late uncle, Bertil. Prince Alexander welcome!
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  #173  
Old 04-21-2016, 09:40 AM
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IMO Alexander should not be treated as 'a rightful heir'. If CP was a Crown Prince he would not be allowed to marry Sofia, and they would not have a child together.
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  #174  
Old 04-21-2016, 09:46 AM
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Wonderful names for the little prince.

Why are there so many conspiracy theories they liked four names and gave them to their son. Good for them if they are happy .
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  #175  
Old 04-21-2016, 10:45 AM
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What a beautiful name! He will be a popular prince when he grows up. Such a regal name!

I am surprised at some of the arguments: While this is a royal family, not everything is about succession to the throne! There are so many reasons why family might celebrate differently.

Carl Phillip is a blood Bernadotte. Quite frankly, many families cares about a blood male heir. it doesn't take love away from other children. That's just how life works - the two events are not dependent of each other. King and Queen, like many other parents, seems to love all their children and the siblings love and support each other. It's what matters the most.
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  #176  
Old 04-21-2016, 11:58 AM
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Love the names. So wish that Oscar had a better name --- JMHO!


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  #177  
Old 04-21-2016, 11:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tausi View Post
What a beautiful name! He will be a popular prince when he grows up. Such a regal name!



I am surprised at some of the arguments: While this is a royal family, not everything is about succession to the throne! There are so many reasons why family might celebrate differently.



Carl Phillip is a blood Bernadotte. Quite frankly, many families cares about a blood male heir. it doesn't take love away from other children. That's just how life works - the two events are not dependent of each other. King and Queen, like many other parents, seems to love all their children and the siblings love and support each other. It's what matters the most.

Unless I'm mistaken both Victoria and Madeleine are "blood" Bernadotte unless they were adopted.


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  #178  
Old 04-21-2016, 12:15 PM
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I said "Blood male heir" .. This is discussion beyond this forum. So out of respect for others, I am ending my argument.
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  #179  
Old 04-21-2016, 12:23 PM
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Those interested in discussing the 1979 change of the Swedish succession can do so here.
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  #180  
Old 04-21-2016, 01:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suztav View Post
Unless I'm mistaken both Victoria and Madeleine are "blood" Bernadotte unless they were adopted.


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I suppose the point the OP was trying to make was that, using traditional criteria. Estelle and Oscar are Westlings, Leonor and Nicholas are O'Neills, and Alexander would be the only Bernadotte among Carl Gustaf's grandchildren. Legally, though, we know that neither Victoria's nor Madeleine's children use their respective fathers' family names.
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