Máxima's Protocol and Etiquette Education

[ashelen]

I would like to know where Maxima learn protocoll and etiquette? to learn to speak in public, walk, pose etc..., anyones knows this?

 

[Marengo]

I am not completely sure but I think she already knew most of it, considering her family background and the schools she attended. Still there should have been some instructions when she got engaged. I believe she got several professors to teach her Dutch, other people like Andree van Es and Victor Halberstadt to introduce her to Dutch society. As Mrs. Lieke Gaarlandt - van Voorst tot Beesd was the lady that accompanied her I suspect she did much to teach Maxima the ins and out of the court, as did other courtiers probably.

 

[ashelen]

I grow up in Argentina and I attend german and english private school there and I guarantee you, she did not lear european etiquette and protocol in argentina, her family had money but they were not from society, but yes I agree with you she had to have several tutors, I presume
i wonder is there are any school for all of this?

 

[Regina]

I think Máxima didn't have to spend much time learning "how to talk", "how to seat", "how to eat" etc, because she always seemed very at ease in her official duties. But I am not sure if she was a girl of society in Argentina. She belongs to a family with money and power but I think Máxima did not learn european etiquette in Argentina. I love Máxima mostly because she is a very intelligent and confident woman, but I don't like when she laughs too much (when we all can see her guts...) or when she wears those weird and flashy cloths. A person with an aristocratic education in her childhood is much more discrete and serene (imo). I know her smile is sweet and she is genuine but I think the Queen should teach her how to be more "royal" and less "jolly good fellow".

 

[Vanesa]

I grow up in Argentina and I attend german and english private school there and I guarantee you, she did not lear european etiquette and protocol in argentina, her family had money but they were not from society, but yes I agree with you she had to have several tutors, I presume
i wonder is there are any school for all of this?

Sorry, but she DID belong to high society: the Zorreguieta family could find its origins in Basque cavaliers from Medieval times. She spend her childhood and youth in an aristocratic neighborhood and attended a school where most of the girls who studied there were from the same roots than her. As for the money...her family is quite the opposite than you say: they are nothing but "moderate rich people". The appartement where she lived (and which I know)is not great, believe me. Just the average.

Vanesa.

 

[ashelen]

Vanesa:
Where do you live or grow up?
sorry that I desagree with you, they are not aristocratic, but you have to have certain amount of money to live where they live, it is an expensive area in Buenos Aires and yes she atended espensive schools, she has a good education and probaly surpriseing for the europeans who they were thinking before she arrived to Holland that in Argentina the people was living with the feathers on their head!
Anyway my main question is where did she learn protocoll and etiquete, speaking in public etc, certenly she did not learn to be a princess in Argentina.

 

[lucien]

Vanesa:
Where do you live or grow up?
sorry that I desagree with you, they are not aristocratic, but you have to have certain amount of money to live where they live, it is an expensive area in Buenos Aires and yes she atended espensive schools, she has a good education and probaly surpriseing for the europeans who they were thinking before she arrived to Holland that in Argentina the people was living with the feathers on their head!
Anyway my main question is where did she learn protocoll and etiquete, speaking in public etc, certenly she did not learn to be a princess in Argentina.

Good manners are obligatory in some circles,if not all these days,so I would say there was a start.I did not think people in Argentina lived with feathers on their head,what a silly remark,especially to the dutch,who are among the best informed on a global scale.

After her education in Argentina,she went on to NYC ofcourse,and in the positions she held there it is an absolute must to have a high degree of,well,education,and she already learned to speak in public there.

Becoming involved with the dutch Heir to the Throne called for a little further pointing out the how and what of behaviour,Royal behaviour that is.
That started while she was still living in NYC,as did Alexanders aunt,HRH Princess Christina at that time,she was the first to introduce her to the world of Royal protocol & etiquette.Before the engagement was official,Máxima didn't just learn to speak dutch,but also was initiated more by dear mother/father-in-law,the very best examples.There really are no other "training centers" other then Royal Houses.

Oh yes,there are those with the pretentions,but never the class,they're just pompous wannabees.

 

[ashelen]

lucien:
thank you for your quote being inform about Argentinta,but i guaranted it is not a silly remark, but let me tell you something, and this is my personal experience, I lived in Europe for 10 years and my work took me to live in all the countries in Europe,or al least most of them, generally the people would ask me where are you from/ I would say from Argentina, and the first thing that people would ask me" but you are blond blue eyes, how is possible?, well I replied my parents are danish, so they would be surprise and after where is Argentina??? I would say in Southamerica, some people would have more or less an idea but sometimes they would say , oh! yes i know in southafrica! and I tell you it was very educated europeans doctors, lawayers, etc.....even my husband who is british, he said to me when he arrived to Argentina the first time ( before even he met me) he was surprise to find such and european country!
Now I am in the US for the last 8 years and here is worst,
Anyway here is not about me, it is just wanted to explain about my silly remark as you called.
here is about Maxima's etiquette and protocoll education
One thing that I love about Maxima is that thank to her the people knows more about Argentina, she is great about that and I admire her for this!

 

[Aquarela]

lucien, i beg to differ from you. I am an Argentinian and i lived in europe (and asia) when i was a teenager and there is a lot of differences between european and argentinian education. what ashelen said are not silly remarks. I quote her 100%.

Maxima's family lives with comfort and they deal with rich people but they dont belong to top high society. remember that Doña Carmen started her relationship with jorge zorreguieta when he was still married and those things are not well seen in high society of argentina.

you mentioned that maxima lived in nyc and because of her good job there, it is an absolute must to have a high degree of,well,education. Well i know north-americans are they are quite informal. they dont care about royal or aristocratic etiquette. Maxima has a good job but she was not the president of deutsch bank, she had a good carreer just like many women have. This don't make them the top of the top in education.

i think maxima is a well educated woman, maybe she should pay attention to her outfits and to her hair (you learn this in private schools ). sometimes i think she is going to perform in a circus. I don't see much difference about her and other royal princesses in what concerns to education. none of them ever made huge faux-pas during these years... maybe mette-marit did some few mistakes but she's perfect now. Mathilde is, imo, the one who has education and good manners in her blood and mind since ever. all the others had to learn protocol and etiquette, and they did it pretty well.

ashelen i quite understand you. i am blond and when i arrive to europe people ask me where did i came from. when i said from argentina they all asked 'but you have british or german family right?'

 

[lucien]

lucien, i beg to differ from you. I am an Argentinian and i lived in europe (and asia) when i was a teenager and there is a lot of differences between european and argentinian education. what ashelen said are not silly remarks. I quote her 100%.

Maxima's family lives with comfort and they deal with rich people but they dont belong to top high society. remember that Doña Carmen started her relationship with jorge zorreguieta when he was still married and those things are not well seen in high society of argentina.

you mentioned that maxima lived in nyc and because of her good job there, it is an absolute must to have a high degree of,well,education. Well i know north-americans are they are quite informal. they dont care about royal or aristocratic etiquette. Maxima has a good job but she was not the president of deutsch bank, she had a good carreer just like many women have. This don't make them the top of the top in education.

i think maxima is a well educated woman, maybe she should pay attention to her outfits and to her hair (you learn this in private schools ). sometimes i think she is going to perform in a circus. I don't see much difference about her and other royal princesses in what concerns to education. none of them ever made huge faux-pas during these years... maybe mette-marit did some few mistakes but she's perfect now. Mathilde is, imo, the one who has education and good manners in her blood and mind since ever. all the others had to learn protocol and etiquette, and they did it pretty well.

ashelen i quite understand you. i am blond and when i arrive to europe people ask me where did i came from. when i said from argentina they all asked 'but you have british or german family right?'

Most Argentinean ladies prefer to be blond.....and again when their roots show,hair roots that is...,
and ofcourse it has a lot of a european country,there has been an invasion of most countries from here,
especially mediterranean,Italy especially,there,so,small wonder.

Oh yes,yanks can't/don't bother too much about etiquette,but Máxima worked for the Deutsche Bank remember,
not the local yankee doodle store?
There is the difference,very formal.

 

[lilytornado]

ashelen i quite understand you. i am blond and when i arrive to europe people ask me where did i came from. when i said from argentina they all asked 'but you have british or german family right?'

Well, I am German and people asked me: "Why do you have so dark hair and eyes ? You are German right? I thought they were all blond and blue eyed!" I seriously heard that in France, Us, etc.

I think Máxima probably already had good manners (knowing how to eat, etc), but some things are probably just different in Argentina and Europe especially in a royal family, so of course she had some etiquette lessons, maybe even together with the language training? (together with some culture lessons?)

 

[susan alicia]

the most obvious thing she had to learn about royal etiquette is how to curtsy to kings and queens, probably a bit different to a curtsy to a priest or a curtsy to your classical ballet teacher at the end of the lesson.

 

[ashelen]

Aquarella: thank you for your understanding, and yes a lot of people in Europe and specially america, consider Argentina a third world country and like in America when I had the same question and answer from Denmark, the person, - a well educated CEO- answer to me, "Oh! danish from Holland!" so lucien you don't know what are you talking! yes they are a lot of blond with the bottle, but there are a lot of natural blonds like me from danish parents! and that is full in europe too natural blond and bottle blond! It doesn't exist etiquete here in the US, they do not know even how to use a knife or a falk and I insist educated people! so this thing about she was at the Deuthsche bank means nothing! and have it clear her mother star her relationship with her father when he was still married so certenly this is not well seen in Argentina! she had obviusley some kind of manners but defenetly she did not have the etiquette and protocoll from the royal, she learned this after!

 

[carlota]

maxima did indeed receive a good "manner education" and good etiquette. i doubt it was up to royal standards, because of obvious reasons, but she was definitely raised in an upper class family and therefore she must have been quite at ease when learning the basics and not so basics. she obviously must have had to learn much more to be able to behave correctly at the presence of high authorities, but the base and also quite a bit of steps where there already.

if what you meant is where, when and how maxima learnt all this missing bits, i read that she lived in belgium for some time to get used to them and to learn the language. mathilde of belgium was apparently quite closed to her and must have helped her quite a bit, having both have been raised in an upper class environment and being familiar with maxima's doubts.

 

[Marengo]

Interesting that HRH Princess Christina helped Maxima a bit in the beginning, I completely forgot about that Lucien! Quite ironic that she would be teaching something like that as she did her best to escape from royal life as much as she could during her whole life thus far.

 

[Aquarela]

Oh yes,yanks can't/don't bother too much about etiquette,but Máxima worked for the Deutsche Bank remember,
not the local yankee doodle store?

I didn't know Deutsche Bank gives royal etiquette to their employees

 

[Maxie]

I think that above all things Maxima has learned to be very confident about herself through her upbringing and education and for someone who is confident about herself, european etiquette is just a piece of cake.

About people having all kinds of weird opinions about other countries, well: it's just what people do. We can't expect everybody to know the ins and outs about everything, can we?

 

[Aquarela]

I think that above all things Maxima has learned to be very confident about herself through her upbringing and education and for someone who is confident about herself, european etiquette is just a piece of cake.

Maxima is a very confident woman and we lile her because she always seem to fight against adversity with a smile in her face.
But about good manners i have my doubts...

pic 1

pic 2

I don't know any very well educated woman in Argentina who eats like this in public.

 

[Maxie]

Well, it's quite normal here to eat in public and I bet very well educated people do it too. There's nothing better than when the sun starts shining in spring and all kind of restaurants also serve food outside... oh those days. Can't wait till spring's here again.

Next to that most dutch aren't really into the etiquette thing, to be honest. We just like to act normal, nothing silly and etiquette definitely is considered as silly. So with state banquets and stuff it can come in handy for Maxima, but in think that in daily dutch life she will not encounter these rules very much.

 

[BeatrixFan]

Maxima, eating?! She'll be breathing next. Disgraceful behaviour.

 

[ZaJa]

LOL Everyone eats. Out of all the people I've read about on this forum she's one the most genuine people I've seen. She may not be royal enough for some people but she has a great sense of self, educated, and seems to respect those around her. What more is there?

 

[ashelen]

that's it is what i am talking about, she come may be from parents with money but not aristocracy, she learn somewhere and with somebody royal etiquette and protocoll, it was not in argentina, defenetly, eventhought argentinean people has more manners that soemtimes in the US, am very surprise somebody took this photos, , when and where this photos were taken???? that's shows you she did not learn manners and etiquette in the deutsche bank as lucien mention before!

 

[Marengo]

Well, it seems Maxima is seated outside on a terrace, quite a normal place to eat. And note that she is in good company too, I believe King Juan-Carlos and his wife Sofia took Beatrix and Claus out for dinner at a terrca of a restaurant once, the owner didn´t know what hit him

 

[Winnie]

Maxima, eating?! She'll be breathing next. Disgraceful behaviour.

BeatrixFan -- your above quote is a hoot! I understand your great humor and agree with you! That is why I really enjoy Maxima -- she is a normal loving happy person that just happened to fall in love and marry a prince (much to his luck and pride) and gave birth to adorable loving girls. What a wonderful life for two happy people. We should all be so blessed.

 

[susan alicia]

yes, what she is doing is licking/sucking her fingers and bringing her mouth to the food in stead of the food to her mouth

Maxima is a very confident woman and we lile her because she always seem to fight against adversity with a smile in her face.
But about good manners i have my doubts...

pic 1

pic 2

I don't know any very well educated woman in Argentina who eats like this in public.

 

[fee]

I actually don't understand the whole paloola.
Royal etiquette doesn't strike me as so much different from good manners.
A well brought up person should not have any problems, as we usually don't pick our noses, scratch our scalps or worse our bums, we put a hand in front of a yawn or a sneeze, try not to pass any gas thru any opening and we keep ourselves from spitting on the street.
Seriously, manners are something that have to be learnt from early on, a grown woman of about 30 will not suddenly turn "Eliza Doolittle".
A company like Deutsche Bank, even in leisurely USA will be very keen on manners and a certain etiquette, try rushing thru the door in front of your superior and slam the door into his face to boot and watch what that does to your next resume.
The very distinct royal etiquette like never walk in front of the sovereign, never sit before he/she does, curtsey, who reaches out for a handshake first etc, IMO are easy to learn.

Regarding the american or european ignorance concerning South american countries (or the american failure to put european countries correctly into some order) I feel a bit insulted.
Of course there are people who think Argentina is a third world country with copa cabana and Inkas, and of course there are Americans who don't now dutch from danish, just as there are still people believing in an invasion of Aliens at Roswell in 1954...but on the whole we are not completely stupid or ignorant.
And about the possibility of natural blondes from Argentina, there are natural blondes from every ethnic group of humankind.
However Maxima is very good example of a blonde from Argentina who certainly needs a bottle of l'Oreal every once in a while to achieve her looks.....

 

[Regina]

Well, it seems Maxima is seated outside on a terrace, quite a normal place to eat. And note that she is in good company too, I believe King Juan-Carlos and his wife Sofia took Beatrix and Claus out for dinner at a terrca of a restaurant once, the owner didn´t know what hit him

I don't think Aquarela was refering to the place where she was eating but to the way she was eating. Well I find a bit confusing when people (no matter where they are) prefer to use their hands than the knife and fork. About licking/sucking the fingers, well for something they invented the napkins
But I found the pics funny and I don't think there is such a reason to feel shocked. It's funny to see Maxima with such good appetite! That's a symptom of happiness, right?

 

[carlota]

But about good manners i have my doubts...

pic 1

pic 2

I don't know any very well educated woman in Argentina who eats like this in public.

trust me: she wouldn't be there if she did that all the time, at a gala dinner or in the presence of dignataries. i guess in the situation it was okay to eat with her hands. she wouldn't be there if her manners weren't those of a princess as such: we saw other princesses eating with their hands as well... are they all then vulgar because they do that? not at all. some situations favour some certain behaviour without it being terrible.

asking for fork, knife, servillete, dishes and the 4 protocolar glasses, when everyone eats with their hands... now, that would have been bad-manered!

 

[fee]

trust me: she wouldn't be there if she did that all the time, at a gala dinner or in the presence of dignataries. i guess in the situation it was okay to eat with her hands. she wouldn't be there if her manners weren't those of a princess as such: we saw other princesses eating with their hands as well... are they all then vulgar because they do that? not at all. some situations favour some certain behaviour without it being terrible.

asking for fork, knife, servillete, dishes and the 4 protocolar glasses, when everyone eats with their hands... now, that would have been bad-manered!

As much as I agree with your last statement, that it would have been quite rude to ask for a table to be set for her when everyone else was picknicing on the lawn, but what do you mean with "she wouldn't be there" were her manners less then princess like?
Would the dutch government demand a separation? The Queen ban her from The Hague?
Sorry but not bl##dy likely...
And there are about a ton of pix of a nose-picking, bum-scratching crown prince of another european country and yet he is still there...

 

[susan alicia]

a new thread dedicated to them?

As much as I agree with your last statement, that it would have been quite rude to ask for a table to be set for her when everyone else was picknicing on the lawn, but what do you mean with "she wouldn't be there" were her manners less then princess like?
Would the dutch government demand a separation? The Queen ban her from The Hague?
Sorry but not bl##dy likely...

And there are about a ton of pix of a nose-picking, bum-scratching crown prince of another european country and yet he is still there

...