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  #821  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:05 PM
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I feel sad for William and Harry...I am sure they they are embarrased their invitation caused their stepmother discomfort. I applaud Camilla in her decision to ensure the focus is on Diana's memory. I hope, for the sake of the monarchy, there can be some form of gracious "acceptance" (we don't even have to "like" Camilla...I wouldn't want to be seated next to her given the chance) of the Duchess of Cornwall and a respect for her position.

For goodness sake, even Diana (had she lived) would have been cordial and socially polite to Camilla had she had been at the same event!
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  #822  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:10 PM
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Are those, who regard the presence of Duchess of Cornwall in this memorial service as inappropriate, uneducated and morons?


In my opinion, yes. Because they obviously don't understand how a monarchy works. It isn't a popularity contest or something that is based on individual like or dislike. You accept the entire Royal Family and they do everything a Royal Family does together or not at all. The people who regard the presence of The Duchess of Cornwall as inappropriate are uneducated and are morons. They are the same morons who agreed with her not using the Princess of Wales title, they are the same morons who don't want to see her as Queen and they are the same morons that are happy to see the House of Windsor destroyed by the ghost of someone who was a part of the monarchy for 5 minutes as opposed to the 1000 years we've had it for. They are uneducated because they're happy to throw all that away and for all those who died to preserve and build the monarchy to what it is, on the back of some celebrity who did everything she could to undermine the very institituion she was once a part of and she's still undermining it death. That's what I object to, that's why it no longer has my support. It isn't about short-term anything Elspeth, indeed, it's about the long term. This whole incident reeks of what the future will be like. Charles and Camilla forced to bow one knee to Diana before taking any action and that is unfair and totally embarrassing. It's demeaning, it's silly and it isn't what I want my Royal Family to be. The Royal Family has lost it's guts, it's lost it's bearing and it's totally lost any respect it once had from me. And as for one part of the UK going against another, I think you'll find that the United Kingdom is pretty much dead on it's arse and after this debacle, it's put things very clearly into perspective. A republic, disestablishment, devolution - it's the future and I can't wait for it come along when we'll have no Princesses who need to seek a plenary indulgence for being themselves from the Church of Diana that has decided to set the Royal Family on a course of collapse.
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  #823  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:13 PM
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While I didn't really have a problem with her attending, I do believe it is probably for the best. As the statement said it would "divert attention". If she did go I'm sure that much of the news coverage of the event would deal with if it was right of Camilla to attend. While it will undoubtly still be a topic of discussion, hopefully most of the coverage will focus on Diana.
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  #824  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:15 PM
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And where does this end? I didn't realise when Camilla married into the family that she was only half-a-member of the family.
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  #825  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:15 PM
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It is a shameful day for the monarchy and it's followers. The service William and Harry wanted to unify their family, shot down by a few loon buckets and the media, who pander to them.

Shame on them, shame on Britain, the whole event is now worthless and pointless!

The only person who has acted with strength and character throughout, is Camilla, a true Lady and Princess!
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  #826  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:23 PM
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To BeatrixFan

Dear BeatrixFan,
It is fair to assume that uneducated morons are the driving force of any changes within a state. Namely uneducated morons guided by politicians that “[were] ruled by short-term public opinion” (Elspeth, 2007) removed quite a few royal families over the centuries (e.g., French, Chinese, or Russian). Of course, the situational variable (famine, economic decline) was different.
And now I believe that these uneducated morons paired with the most loyal fans of Princess Diana can abolish the monarchy by means of referendum because of freedom of opinion and expression.
As for “Charles and Camilla forced to bow one knee to Diana before taking any action”, good deeds never go unpunished, especially in such deeply complex situation.
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  #827  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marezdote View Post
If she did go I'm sure that much of the news coverage of the event would deal with if it was right of Camilla to attend. While it will undoubtly still be a topic of discussion, hopefully most of the coverage will focus on Diana.
Of course the focus would have been on Camilla, because just saying nothing about her presence just doesn't sell newspapers. I'm totally with BeatrixFan on this one: the BRF should never have given into this media circus. This isn't about Camilla and this isn't even about Diana, this is about who causes the biggest stir. Well they succeeded, congratulations to them. And congratulations to all the people who buy this nonsense...
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  #828  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:27 PM
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Should Camilla attend?

This was always going to be polemic either way.
Damned if she did and damned if she did not.
In any event the news this afternoon that she has decided not to be present will allay any public repercussion. I think the decision is right.
In reality there should have been collusion between the relevant authorities very early on, before the date was set. This way Camilla could have had an engagement "organized" for her for that day and which "could not be broken".
She could then have apologized, etc etc. This would have avoided these weeks of debate.
Caspia1.
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  #829  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:30 PM
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I think that it is quite harsh to call people uneducated simply because they think that it is inappropriate for Camilla to attend a memorial for someone she did not care for, and who did not care for her.

Furthermore - I do not think that she should attend. I am educated, and I do not think myself a moron. I think that she should not attend simply because a) there was animosity between the two, and b) If she had attended, she would have been quite a prmoninent person in this event, as the press would have been more idiotic about it and made it about her.

They are public people, and therefore have to listen to what the public says about them. It is not a question of whether or not only the newspapers say it, a great majority of the British people, who as a whole, I understand are rather intelligent, think that she should not attend. Were this a private memorial, I sincerely doubt that she would have attended, given the relationship between the two. She will not mourn Diana, so what is the purpose of her going? Were I in her shoes, I would not go.

I think you are quite off base for calling people morons simply because of one opinion.

Rather than call them uneducated morons, I might be more inclined, in this situation, to call them people who understand commonsense and etiquette.
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  #830  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al_bina View Post
And now I believe that these uneducated morons paired with the most loyal fans of Princess Diana can abolish the monarchy by means of referendum because of freedom of opinion and expression.
.
There are not enough of these morons able to work out how to vote! Loyal fans, they are a total disgrace, they more than Diana will be remembered for this debacle. Diana will be remembered for her legacy of division and hatred.
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  #831  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Empress View Post
It is not a question of whether or not only the newspapers say it, a great majority of the British people, who as a whole, I understand are rather intelligent, think that she should not attend.
Yes, one could see it this way, but I always asks myself why the British public stays so cold towards Camilla, especially after two years of marriage in which she showed her best side, always being discrete and on the background. I still think that the same press has a great deal to do with that, Camilla just can't win. And yes, I'm sure that the majority of the British people is rather intelligent, but I also think that there's a time to move on and apply some forgivingness, which is (imho) one of the examples of (social) intelligence.
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  #832  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Empress View Post
They are poblic people, and therefore have to listen to what the public says about them. It is not a question of whether or not only the newspapers say it, a great majority of the British people, who as a whole, I understand are rather intelligent, think that she should not attend. Rather than call them uneducated morons, I might be more inclined, in this situation, to call them people who understand commonsense and etiquette.
Lets at least get this right... 54% of the 1001 people asked, not the British people, not even a medium percentage of them, just over the 1000 mark. Do you consider that indicative of what the British people wanted?

As for etiquette, etiquette dictates that Camilla should be at her husbands side, right next to her stepchildren.
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  #833  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:40 PM
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Prince William and Prince Harry should have been advised...very strongly...to have made the memorial service a private one. Not only was the situation with Camilla a tricky one, Paul Burrell, Patrick Jepshon, Sarah Ferguson and now Barnardo's charity have gotten their few minutes of complaints in print and press.
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  #834  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:42 PM
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This is about more than Camilla going to a memorial service, this is just as Skydragon said, about Diana's legacy being one of division and damage. People don't seem to see that by Camilla not going, she's become a second class member of the RF, she's become someone who always needs the public's approval for every small thing she does and that can never work. People are uneducated if they can't see how damaging this is and they're moronic if they can't see that this is tearing the Royal Family apart and making them look dysfunctional which was exactly what happened when Diana was alive. It's back to square one, it's the end for the Royal Family and the end hasn't been brought about by politicians or the majority, it's been brought about by a lunatic fringe and the Royal Family bowing to that fringe to please the press. And for doing that they deserve to fall.
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  #835  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:45 PM
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Unfortunately, one can not poll the entire British Population. All polls run by reputable firms are only a sampling ( wide spread) of a particular group. In this case apparently the sampling was of every day Brits, and that is what is being used. Perhaps on another day with another user group the results would have been different. Unfortunately I don't think so.

And Skydragon, etiquette and common sense would dictate that she not go.

PROTOCAL would dictate that were she to go, she would go with her husband and be seated with him.

Personally, I think that she should not have accepted the invitation to begin with, but hacving accepted it, I think that she should have just gone, and not bowed to this nonsense.

But there you go, just what I think. And I am entitled to my opinion.

None the less, I would like to know what the members here think re 2 questions.

1) What would Camillas presence have accomplished?
2) Would she have gone if this were a private memorial?
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  #836  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:46 PM
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Prince William and Prince Harry should have been advised...very strongly...to have made the memorial service a private one.
They should have been advised to know their place and their place isn't to dictate to their betters. They should have been advised not to have a memorial service at all, it wasn't needed, it's caused division and hurt, it's completely bashed Camilla in the worst way and it was totally unnessecary. They should have been advised that their grandmother is actually the one in charge and no amount of falling out of clubs with chavvy bints will change that. Their grandmother is the Queen and she should have put her foot down and said no, especially when we all know she really doesn't want to go. They're responsible for this farce and I hope they get their come uppance. They don't warrant their titles, they're a disgrace to the name Windsor.
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  #837  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Empress View Post
1) What would Camillas presence have accomplished?
2) Would she have gone if this were a private memorial?
Well, for the first question: the BRF would have looked like a whole, moving on and leaving all the rubbish behind them. Now they're not. They're indeed back to square one.

And for the second one: no, I think things would have been exactly the same. The press would have reacted the same way, they're not interested if a memorial is public or private. It would be 'Oh horror, Camilla, THAT WOMAN, is attending a memorial service for our beloved Di' all over again. But what's private? No cameras around? I think it would make no difference if the memorial was to be private.
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  #838  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:51 PM
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Well, on the whole, if they want to have a memorial for their mother, who are we or anyone else to say no to them.

Now, I agree that they might have gone about it better. The concert would have been enough for me, and a private memorial. But then again hindsight is 20/20 and they are young. And we are not in their positions so we can't really judge what is going on in their lives except from what we see and can speculate on.

I certainly applaud them for making the gesture to Camilla, but I really don't think it was neccessary. They had made their positions on her very clear, and they just put her in an awkward situation.

I am not saying that it is all Camillas fault or all the princes, but between the three of them, and possible Charles, they have made a right Brouhaha of the whole thing.

Camilla should have just said to the Princes, "No, thank you for thinking of me, but I really think that your memorial for you mother should be about you and your mother, and nothing else." It might have created one or two days of press then, but little would have been said now.
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  #839  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:53 PM
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Private for me, would have been if they had just had a normal quite ceremony, with absolutely no announcement of it say at Windsor, or some other small chapel and just invited close family and friends who might have wanted to attend.

No big announcement, nothing to the press, and certainly no putting people in awkward positions.

The concert was enough for the public I think.
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  #840  
Old 08-26-2007, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Empress View Post
Unfortunately, one can not poll the entire British Population. All polls run by reputable firms are only a sampling ( wide spread) of a particular group. In this case apparently the sampling was of every day Brits, and that is what is being used. Perhaps on another day with another user group the results would have been different. Unfortunately I don't think so.

And Skydragon, etiquette and common sense would dictate that she not go.

PROTOCAL would dictate that were she to go, she would go with her husband and be seated with him.
The Mail apparently asked the pollsters to telephone only 1000 people on their list, (you can register to answer polls on whatever subjects you are interested in) the area was probably telephone codes in London. Do you think 1000 people could represent the US for instance, what about Canada. It is ridiculous of the media to pass this 2nd rate poll off as representing Britain.

Perhaps US etiquette is different to the etiquette practised here - here it is a code that governs the expectations of social behavior, according to the conventional society or social class one belongs to.
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