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  #181  
Old 08-03-2007, 12:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcbcode99 View Post
I will freely admit I am in the Camilla camp, :
And I freely admit always that I am in neither "camp", as I see beauty in both women and give them credit where it is due. I wish more people were less partial about them.
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  #182  
Old 08-03-2007, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbb View Post
i have a feeling i'm not the only one who can't wait for this whole thing to be over! the boys try to honor their mother and instead all this ugliness is stirred up again, i'm sure it has brought them pain and stress and it's just a crying shame!
Well said, and well stated.

I align myself with neither "camp" because the whole affair - no pun intended - is frankly squalid. I tend to think more of the young men who are the sons of Diana and Charles, and how this must affect them. It would appear that the world is their oyster, when in fact so many choices and options have been denied to them by simple fate.

If they invited their father's wife, then they had valid reason; all our speculations as to why they did will not be resolved to the satisfaction of many here. One camp will say it's because they were forced, the other camp because their father's wife is glorious. William and Harry extended the invitation. That's enough for me.

I trust that the solemnity of the event should keep the attendees in good form.
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  #183  
Old 08-03-2007, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elspeth View Post
I think that's a question for another thread, if not for its own thread if you'd like to start one. It's clear that a lot of people, having read the various stories of the Charles-Diana marriage and, if they're old enough, followed Diana's career from her marriage through to her death, have opinions on Charles, Diana, and Camilla which tend to make them more sympathetic to one side or the other.
'the various stories'...indeed!

Another thread for another slinging match? No, I'm not terribly interested in starting one myself. If anyone else feels it worthy of it's own thread though...

And age, to me, serves little purpose given those who are older know just as much as those who are of a younger age. There remains no greater personal affiliation to the situation, though some 'may' like to feel there is.

I do wish to make known to jcbcode99, though, that my response was not a personal reply.
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  #184  
Old 08-03-2007, 01:33 PM
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It's just insane that people are still so divided about things! After all this time, you can't accept what happened and get on with things? All this rubbish about Diana's camp and camilla's camp is so daft. It's old news, people. The world has moved on. Diana was a great woman and her death was a loss to the whole world. Camilla is a great woman too. Both women made plenty of mistakes, but for crying out loud, we all do, and get over it already!
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  #185  
Old 08-03-2007, 01:35 PM
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If I were William or Harry, I would not invite Charles and Camila.
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  #186  
Old 08-03-2007, 01:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elspeth View Post
As for the other part of your comment, yes, she did a lot of damage to the monarchy. She also put a human face on it. Would it kill you to acknowledge that she wasn't 100% evil?
Probably!

The 'human face' she put on the monarchy turned them into a very bad soap opera, they had a human face before Diana to most people. They may have appeared distant to some, but she used her 'royal status', (through marriage I might add) to set herself up as a 'celebrity', she manipulated, deceived and worse than that encouraged the celebrity status through using the media.
As I have said in other threads, I concede that Diana did some good for some of the charities she lent her name to, this is tempered with the knowledge that to her all the problems in her life, were always someone elses fault.
BUT, the problem I have is with her 'fans', who listened to the lies she told regarding Charles, Camilla and the rest of the royal family and solely on what Diana told them, stand as judge, jury and executioner.
The marriage break up was because of Diana and Charles, but so much easier to blame someone else. Even at the wedding she informed us, she was looking for Camilla when anyone who has a big church wedding will tell you that the guests faces are a blur!

As I said, Diana didn't get on with a lot of the people who are going to be there, perhaps HM should keep a low profile, sit at the back away from her family. How about the DoE, he apparently really didn't like Diana. The list would be endless, there wouldn't be room at the back.

The fact that Camilla is willing to go, to support her husband and his sons (he apparently played a part in their conception) should be applauded.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CasiraghiTrio View Post
her death was a loss to the whole world.
No, it wasn't.
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  #187  
Old 08-03-2007, 01:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martha
If I were William or Harry, I would not invite Charles and Camila.
There are about million things I would or would not do, If I were William or Harry.

The fact is, they had invited their father and their stepmother to the memorial. Both will attend because it is important for the boys.

If the Princes send a clear signal they want to go ahead with their lives, that they are comfortable and happy with their father & stepmother, and that they want to remember their mother, can't we all do the same, regardless of the 'camp' we belong to?
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  #188  
Old 08-03-2007, 01:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
Probably!

The 'human face' she put on the monarchy turned them into a very bad soap opera, they had a human face before Diana to most people. They may have appeared distant to some, but she used her 'royal status', (through marriage I might add) to set herself up as a 'celebrity', she manipulated, deceived and worse than that encouraged the celebrity status through using the media.
As I have said in other threads, I concede that Diana did some good for some of the charities she lent her name to, this is tempered with the knowledge that to her all the problems in her life, were always someone elses fault.
BUT, the problem I have is with her 'fans', who listened to the lies she told regarding Charles, Camilla and the rest of the royal family and solely on what Diana told them, stand as judge, jury and executioner.
The marriage break up was because of Diana and Charles, but so much easier to blame someone else. Even at the wedding she informed us, she was looking for Camilla when anyone who has a big church wedding will tell you that the guests faces are a blur!

As I said, Diana didn't get on with a lot of the people who are going to be there, perhaps HM should keep a low profile, sit at the back away from her family. How about the DoE, he apparently really didn't like Diana. The list would be endless, there wouldn't be room at the back.

The fact that Camilla is willing to go, to support her husband and his sons (he apparently played a part in their conception) should be applauded.


No, it wasn't.
To you!
And actually before her death the Princess and the Queen were on friendly terms.
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  #189  
Old 08-03-2007, 02:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
Probably!

BUT, the problem I have is with her 'fans', who listened to the lies she told regarding Charles, Camilla and the rest of the royal family and solely on what Diana told them, stand as judge, jury and executioner.
Well as a Diana 'fan', I never told a bad word on Charles or Camilla and I think you're generalizing a little here. When I read or listen to something Diana has said, I know that she always changed her mind and the next day could say it was absolutely untrue. I'm aware of 'this' Diana. For the marriage failure, you can only blame Charles and Diana, not exclusively Camilla. The 'use' of Camilla (excuse me in advance, it's not against her at all. Just didn't know how to put it) as THE 'cause' for this disaster has arranged both (yes, even Charles). Diana blame her because she was her husband's mistress : ok, we understand your anger, no need to say more. As for Charles, after revealing his affair, he was in a tough situation but he didn't had to go further in explaination of 'why didn't it work?'
If they didn't had Camilla (She really made Diana suffer but the marriage wouldn't have last long even without her), they should had to express why such a mess and it would have been way more difficult to justify themselves to the RF, and most of all, to the people for this horrible mistake.
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  #190  
Old 08-03-2007, 02:15 PM
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Back on topic, please, or we'll be doing some more deleting.
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  #191  
Old 08-03-2007, 02:19 PM
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Oh Dear Lord!!!! When I said I was "in the Camilla camp" I was not trying incite all of these posts. I was merely stating what is obvious-- there is a faction-but I did not mean that I think Diana is bad--quite the contrary, actually-and I do think that being divided in "camps" is somewhat silly--but yet just read the thread and we will see that it is true-in fact, I can go back and reread any posts made by anyone at any time on any thread by members who say they are in "neither camp" and see where they most certainly made known who they support. Frankly, and Madame Royal stated beautifully when she said "Why there's a need to be a partisan to any camp seems plainly pointless and is truly, of such secondary value. " And, she is quite right. Unfortunantly, on these threads we do tend to take sides and by doing so, regardless of how innocent we may think our comments are, there will always be some who take things further than necessary. (I myself am guilty of this!) When I make the comment "The Camilla Camp" I am only stating what is obvious--we are divided amongst the two in our affections. While I liked Diana, I stronly feel that Camilla is a better match for Charles and as such will make a more appropriate consort than Diana would have made. That's what I meant---and should have said. And, yet again, we are off topic!

PS--Madame Royale--I know that your response was not a personal one and I always enjoy your posts and your insight. It would be impossible to take part in these threads anyway if we were all sensitive! I enjoy every aspect and member of this forum!
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  #192  
Old 08-03-2007, 02:37 PM
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I agree jcbcode99. Why would we have to choose ?! A memorial for Diana ? cool ! Camilla's going ? cool again !
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  #193  
Old 08-03-2007, 02:54 PM
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I don't think the royal family should be there (excluding William and Harry, of course). Nor do they most likely want to be there. They are going in support of William and Harry, not because they want to remember Diana, let's be real about this.

** Sorry Elspeth, I was composing when you posted the warning. Delete whatever you feel necessary :) {thanks, I did - Elspeth. }
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  #194  
Old 08-03-2007, 04:42 PM
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Whether Camilla should go (or not) should be left up to William and Harry. I think that they have decided to make her part of their family... and if that's their decision, we should respect it. In my opinion they have been remarkably mature about putting their negative feelings behind them, in support of their surviving parent.
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  #195  
Old 08-03-2007, 05:03 PM
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<off-topic material deleted - Elspeth>

Quote:
Originally Posted by iowabelle
Whether Camilla should go (or not) should be left up to William and Harry. I think that they have decided to make her part of their family... and if that's their decision, we should respect it.
Well said.
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  #196  
Old 08-03-2007, 05:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcbcode99 View Post
PS--Madame Royale--I know that your response was not a personal one and I always enjoy your posts and your insight. It would be impossible to take part in these threads anyway if we were all sensitive! I enjoy every aspect and member of this forum!

I'm glade of it, and thankyou, jcbcode99
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  #197  
Old 08-03-2007, 05:57 PM
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Whether people like it or not, Camilla IS part of their family and life goes on. Princes William and Harry had to get on with it and they have invited their stepmother to the memorial service honouring their mother.

I'm sure Diana would have wanted her sons to get on with their lives and not dwell in the past.
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  #198  
Old 08-03-2007, 06:29 PM
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<off-topic material deleted - Elspeth>

People seem to confuse the professional and the personal. The professional life of the Royal Family is all that concerns us, the personal has nothing whatsoever to do with us. Princess Alexandra could be a baby-eating Nazi pig torturer for all I care but she does a brilliant job and carries out her engagements with professionalism and elegance. The Duchess is no different, she's a member of the Royal Family who has an engagement to attend and she'll attend it and give it the same grace and dignity that she'd give to any one of her engagements. People seem to think that she's going to turn up dressed as Tootsie with a Mariachi band playing "Ding Dong the Witch is Dead". <personal comment deleted - Elspeth> And before I get accused to defending Camilla - I pay for her from my taxes. I want to see her to do a good job and she does that. That's all that really concerns me.
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  #199  
Old 08-03-2007, 06:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saphire View Post
I think that out of respect she shouldn't attend. Diana did not like her, so for that reason alone she should stay away.
I think she should go out of respect. Does the deceased necessarily have to have liked everyone who comes to their memorial/funeral? No, one goes out of duty, out of respect for the deceased person's life, and most of all, out of respect for the one's he/she left behind. It's been ten years - does anyone think that Diana, wherever she is, really cares who shows up at this thing? Life, and things like memorial services, are for the living and Camilla should go as a senior member of the Royal Family, as stepmother to Diana's sons, and as wife of the Prince of Wales.
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  #200  
Old 08-03-2007, 06:47 PM
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Look, when a person croaks they automatically become angels. I had a Great Aunt who was a total cow and everyone hated her guts. They even called her Evil Edna for goodness sake. At her funeral, where was everyone? Sobbing round the coffin extolling her virtues as a lovely human being. They'd all conveniently forgotten that she was about as lovely as TB on Christmas Day but that wasn't the point - in Britain we have a way of doing death and a way of treating the dead. And as btsnyder says, memorial services are for the living and unless the dead leave a guest list, you just turn up, shake a few hands and do the "Nice to see you" bit.
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