Relationship of the Royal Family with The Duchess of Cornwall?

[Oppie]

I think it is to avoid confusion. Usually when they refer to the Duke of Rothesay they add either Prince Charles or what the Prince of Wales is called in Scotland. I guess most people don't realize he has other titles besides Prince of Wales.

[tiaraprin]

Originally Posted by ElisaR

Again about titles.

From the Court Circular, 4 August 2005.
The Prince Charles, Duke of Rothesay and The Duchess of Rothesay this morning visited the Royal National Lifeboat Institution Station at Thurso and were received by Her Majesty's Lord-Lieutenant of Caithness (Miss Anne Dunnett).

If he is The Prince Charles, Duke of Rothesay, why isn't she Princess Charles, Duchess of Rothesay?

I was reading the current issue of Majesty magazine, and it says that Camilla's title of Duchess of Cornwall and her place in the order of precedence are due to Camilla's choice to be known as Duchess of Cornwall instead of Princess of Wales. Being ranked 4th in the pecking order is due to being officially known and titled Duchess of Cornwall which places her behind The Princess Royal and The Princess Alexandra (both Princesses of the blood). The magazine goes on to say that if Camilla was officially known and titled as Princess of Wales, she would have been number 2 in the pecking order behind Her Majesty the Queen.

[ElisaR]

Thank you.

[tiaraprin]

Not a problem Elisa, just typing what I read:) :p

[branchg]

Originally Posted by ElisaR

Again about titles.
If he is The Prince Charles, Duke of Rothesay, why isn't she Princess Charles, Duchess of Rothesay?

When in Scotland, his style and title is HRH The Duke of Rothesay in the Scottish peerage as the heir to the throne. As a son of the Sovereign, who holds the Crown's fount of honour, he is also HRH The Prince Charles, so the style is correct as his primary dignity comes first, followed by his dukedom when in Scotland.

Camilla is not "Princess Charles" in Scotland since she reflects her husband's rank as HRH the Duchess of Rothesay and does hold the style of "Princess Charles" in the UK. Instead, Camilla reflects her husband's individual styles and titles in each part of the Kingdom, with the exception of Princess of Wales, as she has declined to use this title.

[branchg]

Originally Posted by tiaraprin

I was reading the current issue of Majesty magazine, and it says that Camilla's title of Duchess of Cornwall and her place in the order of precedence are due to Camilla's choice to be known as Duchess of Cornwall instead of Princess of Wales. Being ranked 4th in the pecking order is due to being officially known and titled Duchess of Cornwall which places her behind The Princess Royal and The Princess Alexandra (both Princesses of the blood). The magazine goes on to say that if Camilla was officially known and titled as Princess of Wales, she would have been number 2 in the pecking order behind Her Majesty the Queen.

This is correct and appropriate. However, for state or public events, Camilla holds precedence based on her husband's place in the line of succession and is after the Queen in the ranking of ladies in the Kingdom.

Her style and title of Duchess of Cornwall places her behind two (adult) princesses of the blood for royal occasions since she is choosing not to assume her rank as Princess of Wales. So in terms of family protocol, she has taken a step down.

[Panther2000]

Originally Posted by una

I hope it doesn't have feathers on it.

I second that motion:p

[florawindsor]

Originally Posted by branchg

This is correct and appropriate. However, for state or public events, Camilla holds precedence based on her husband's place in the line of succession and is after the Queen in the ranking of ladies in the Kingdom.

Her style and title of Duchess of Cornwall places her behind two (adult) princesses of the blood for royal occasions since she is choosing not to assume her rank as Princess of Wales. So in terms of family protocol, she has taken a step down.

does this mean when Princess Beatrice and Eugenie come of age, she(DoC) will be placed behind them?

[Elspeth]

I assume so. It'd be hard to justify being placed behind Princess Alexandra but ahead of Princess Beatrice.

[iowabelle]

So, roughly speaking, unless the Queen decides another way, Princess Beatrice would be before Princess Alexandra who is before the Duchess of Cornwall, who is ahead of Sophie Wessex.

This is getting confusing. (IMO... well, I won't go there.)

[branchg]

Originally Posted by iowabelle

So, roughly speaking, unless the Queen decides another way, Princess Beatrice would be before Princess Alexandra who is before the Duchess of Cornwall, who is ahead of Sophie Wessex.

This is getting confusing. (IMO... well, I won't go there.)

You are correct. Once they come of age, Princesses Beatrice and Eugenie would come before Princess Alexandra and the Princess Royal (in royal protocol) because they are closer to the succession of the throne in their own right as male-line granddaughters of the Sovereign.

In terms of official precedence, the York princesses already follow the Duchess of Cornwall for ladies in the UK, followed by the Countess of Wessex, then the Princess Royal, Zara Philips, Lady Chatto, Princess Alexandra and the wives of the Dukes of Kent and Gloucester and Princess Michael.

[branchg]

Originally Posted by Elspeth

I assume so. It'd be hard to justify being placed behind Princess Alexandra but ahead of Princess Beatrice.

I agree, although it's possible the Queen will leave it as is. Such things remain in the Sovereign's will and the girls are very young.

[Elspeth]

Originally Posted by branchg

You are correct. Once they come of age, Princesses Beatrice and Eugenie would come before Princess Alexandra and the Princess Royal (in royal protocol) because they are closer to the succession of the throne in their own right as male-line granddaughters of the Sovereign.

In terms of official precedence, the York princesses already follow the Duchess of Cornwall for ladies in the UK, followed by the Countess of Wessex, then the Princess Royal, Zara Philips, Lady Chatto, Princess Alexandra and the wives of the Dukes of Kent and Gloucester and Princess Michael.

Don't the Duchesses of Gloucester and Kent precede Princess Alexandra in the official precedence? The whole point is that women are supposed to take their husband's titles. Otherwise you'd have weird things like countesses who are daughters of dukes ranking higher than marchionesses who are daughters of earls or something equally weird.

[tiaraprin]

Gee, this conversation should go over to the Order of Precedence thread!! We have a new debate!!:p :p


When Beatrice and Eugenie are of age and are present at public functions, yes they have to preceed the Duchess of Cornwall as Princesses of the Blood. They will go before Princess Alexandra and the Princess Royal because their father is higher in the line of succession.

[branchg]

Originally Posted by Elspeth

Don't the Duchesses of Gloucester and Kent precede Princess Alexandra in the official precedence? The whole point is that women are supposed to take their husband's titles. Otherwise you'd have weird things like countesses who are daughters of dukes ranking higher than marchionesses who are daughters of earls or something equally weird.

Yes, they do. Sorry about that!

[james]

I think that when Charles is King Camilla will be Queen no matter what has been said up until now. We were told that he had no plans to ever remarry and he did so I don't believe a word of this "Princess Consort" nonsense.

[Zonk]

Not to be negative and wish death on anyone...but I believe if and when Charles becomes King...the chances of a Queen Camilla (I can barely type the words) are silm. The women in her family tend not to live long..in addition, wasn't she a heavy smoker at one time? Plus, I agree with the consensus...Charles will never let his wife be slighted wth that Princess Consort business. Thats all smokes and mirrors!

[tiaraprin]

Originally Posted by Zonk1189

Charles will never let his wife be slighted wth that Princess Consort business. Thats all smokes and mirrors!

You got that right Zonk. It is his way or the highway!! People say Diana was selfish, but so is Charles, and many people have testified to it without having to quote the scandalmongers!!

[branchg]

I think it is inevitable that Camilla will be Queen Consort.

[Warren]

Originally Posted by branchg

I think it is inevitable that Camilla will be Queen Consort.

Yes, as has been pointed out on more than one occasion in these Forums, the denial of the Duchess of Cornwall's right to become Queen requires a specific Act of Parliament before the event. (It's hard to imagine the Parliament doing so afterwards!)

Otherwise, the moment Queen Elizabeth dies, Charles becomes King of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland etc etc and Camilla becomes Queen. Quite apart from anyone's personal preferences as to the title she should bear, this is a simple fact.
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