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  #141  
Old 11-16-2005, 02:57 PM
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Why should the thread be closed? I think there were a few over-reactions to comments. Otherwise people have posted decent opinions and I've enjoyed reading it.
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  #142  
Old 11-16-2005, 03:10 PM
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Well, for one thing, people don't seem to be saying much that's different from what was said twenty pages ago. And for another, the last three pages or so have made thoroughly depressing reading. "You hate Diana!" "Well, you hate Camilla!" "Charles is a pointy-eared idiot!" "Bush is a pointy-headed moron!" "Anyway, you're American so your opinion doesn't count!" "You weren't there so your opinion doesn't count either!" "Americans don't understand what's going on!" "Well, we're better than you Brits any day!" Three bloody pages of it! I bow to your greater optimism and all that, but I must say I've been hard put to find very many opinions in the last couple of pages that I'd want to label "decent."
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  #143  
Old 11-16-2005, 03:11 PM
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You're right Elspeth. Looking at it in that light - ditch the b*tch.
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  #144  
Old 11-16-2005, 03:12 PM
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Well I just got back and wish Elspeth would not close the thread. I think its unfair when the many people who do respect each other have to pay for the sins of the few. I'd like to get the chance to respond to some interesting things here and I have no plans to bash anybody.
  #145  
Old 11-16-2005, 03:18 PM
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In that case, I'll duly appoint ysbel "saviour of the thread" and we'll see if she can perform a miracle.:)

Just so long as this everlasting sniping stops, that's all. This stuff gives me headaches.
  #146  
Old 11-16-2005, 03:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by una
But don't you think this would have happened anyway?
To a certain extent, yes, but we know far less about C&C's affair than we know of Diana's doings. IMHO its because C&C didn't really say anything past one comment in the BBC interview and their friends for the most part followed their lead. Diana's friends followed her lead and released everything.

Quote:
Originally Posted by una
IMO she wouldn't mind all this coming out, she wasn't a private person, and may even have been pleased to know people were still paying her attention- that she was still "a star".
I don't know about that. Some of the attention she didn't mind, but she definitely minded James Hewitt's first book release. I also think-and this is just speculation based on their personalities-that if she had lived, she would have had problems with William regarding her fame once he became an adult. William definitely doesn't like attention, yet anytime he was around her he was subjected to intense observation and speculation by the press. Her fame already caused a rift between her and her brother whom she was once very close to because he refused to let her come to his house to escape the press.

I don't think very highly of Charles Spencer but for once I cannot fault him for this. He had his own wife and children to think of and he had to take into account how the inevitable press presence at Althorp would have affected his own family. I'm sure it hurt Diana terribly as she would definitely be hurt if William distanced himself in any way from her to escape the scrutiny. But with her fame and the notoriety about her private life, my belief is that it would have been inevitable.

That's why I think she would have regretted releasing her private details.
  #147  
Old 11-16-2005, 03:32 PM
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I agree. I know...I have sounded like a b***h as well.. :)

So, getting back on topic again.

What are people's thoughts if Charles and Camilla had a child together?

It could happen. They are not too old in that respect.

I know to some it may seem far-fetched, but I have thought about it from time to time.
  #148  
Old 11-16-2005, 03:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ysbel
To a certain extent, yes, but we know far less about C&C's affair than we know of Diana's doings. IMHO its because C&C didn't really say anything past one comment in the BBC interview and their friends for the most part followed their lead. Diana's friends followed her lead and released everything.
Very well put Ysbel.
  #149  
Old 11-16-2005, 03:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Marmalade
Maybe when Diana was younger her parents could have gotten her help for the emotional toll she went through regarding her parents' nasty divorce and custody battle.

But then, Charles could have also realized his bride WAS only 19 and did need support directly from him early on.
It sounds like a nice idea, Lady Marmalade, but it hardly ever happens like that. Diana's parents were involved in their own battles with each other, they probably had enough scars of their own to heal. Diana had the same problem with some of the things she did with her sons as her marriage fell apart.

I don't think Charles was able to give her the emotional support she needed. Men are not raised to give that all-encompassing support like women are; they don't have the emotional reserves themselves to give that much away and its an unfamiliar role for men to assume. The guys that appeared to give Diana the emotional support she needed at the time ended up using her (Hewitt, Burrell)

A few guys can give that kind of emotional support without taking advantage of people but they are very rare. When she was going through the bulimia and the post-partum depression, she needed an experienced professional and a peer group of women that had faced the same illness.
  #150  
Old 11-16-2005, 03:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elspeth
In that case, I'll duly appoint ysbel "saviour of the thread" and we'll see if she can perform a miracle.:)

Just so long as this everlasting sniping stops, that's all. This stuff gives me headaches.
Sorry Elspeth, next time I'll just have a G & T and calm down.:)
  #151  
Old 11-16-2005, 03:35 PM
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Quote:
What are people's thoughts if Charles and Camilla had a child together?
Well, if TRH had a child, I'd be thrilled for them and I think it would be something very very special - all children bring great joy to parents. I'll never see that and so I think that any couple that do have children should consider themselves blessed and enjoy every moment. That applies to Royal Babies too!
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  #152  
Old 11-16-2005, 03:37 PM
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I agree. Charles has done his best to be a good parent. Being a parent is never easy in any case. I give credit where credit is due.

The fact he openly hugs and kisses his sons in public speaks volumes about his character as a parent.
  #153  
Old 11-16-2005, 03:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ysbel
Diana's parents were involved in their own battles with each other, they probably had enough scars of their own to heal. .
If we all thought Charles and Diana's battle was bloody, we should remember just what kind of a war the Spencers fought.
  #154  
Old 11-16-2005, 03:40 PM
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Quote:
I don't think Charles was able to give her the emotional support she needed. Men are not raised to give that all-encompassing support like women are
Well, I don't think thats nessecarily true - but we have to look at the way Charles was brought up. His mother was very 'Queen Maryish' when she was raising her children. The stiff upper lip still existed - it still does to an extent. And so in Charles's mind, Diana was probably over reacting and she should have had more control over her emotions. Several stories show that emotionally, she was wreck. Burrell seems to be a little bit simpering and soft and so she could turn to him for a shoulder to cry on, whereas with Hewitt, the sexual want would make her feel needed in some way (I guess) and thats why she sought solice with them - they showed more emotion towards her than Charles did. Camilla doesn't seem the sort to burst into tears or crumble when she's criticised in the press and so Charles knows that he doesn't need to constantly praise Camilla as he had to do with Diana. She isn't insecure.
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  #155  
Old 11-16-2005, 04:13 PM
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I think both were emotionally unprepared in some ways to handle each other. History will show it was an ill-fated arrangement on both sides.

However, if anything blessed came out of it, it was those two young men. They both have had their ups and downs, Harry especially, but they are turning out to be the most normal so far in the family.
  #156  
Old 11-16-2005, 04:48 PM
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I still remember one of, IMO, the most astute commentaries on the Charles-Diana debacle, only I forget who said it: that two emotionally needy people came together and found that they had only demands to make.
  #157  
Old 11-16-2005, 04:54 PM
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They were totally unsuitable for each other. Can't remember where I read it..but I believe when they (Charles/Diana) started dating, the press went crazy and Prince Phillip asked or told him to make up his mind or her reputation would be ruined. And the rest is history. If they had more time to date, perhaps they would have noticed that they were ill-suited for each other.

In terms of the emotional support, from what I see....Camilla provides it in spades to Charles. And that is why it works...he is the most important thing to her (other than her family) and sorry, he is somewhat selfish (IMO). I am sure he provides it to her as well. Unfortunately for Charles, he will be remembered for his disaster of a first marriage and less for the good works that he does. Ad yes, he does do a lot of good work. The Prince's Trust is exemplary example of how a charity should be run.

I find it ironic that people bash Diana for her so called emotional problems, when lets face it...she was 13 years younger than Charles. And people are prone to blame her for their differences. Oh she pretended to like this when they were dating. HELLO. Name one person who done the same thing when dating someone. You want to make a nice impression. Their likes or your likes. I have a girlfriend who used to cook all the time for her boyfriend..they get married and its cereal for dinner :) Of course they have kids, school, etc. but you get the point.

They had different expectations of marriage, interests, etc. it was a mismatch from the start.
  #158  
Old 11-16-2005, 04:55 PM
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Elspeth..that is a great point and it explains their marriage perfectly.
  #159  
Old 11-16-2005, 05:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zonk1189

Oh she pretended to like this when they were dating. HELLO. Name one person who done the same thing when dating someone. You want to make a nice impression. Their likes or your likes.
I have to be honest Zonk1189, I really don't know anyone who has done that, some of our friends are divorced or separated but lying about likes and dislikes was not a factor in the split. More a case of their likes and dislikes changing over the years.:)
  #160  
Old 11-16-2005, 05:07 PM
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I guess you can call it lying if you want to be clear cut about it.

The only reason I mentioned the likes and dislikes cause it was brought up that Diana lied about liking somethings that Charles cared for. I wouldn't consider so much as lying. If you really like/love someone, in the begining (in the get to know you phase) you talk about your likes and dislikes. If I don't like to watch American foot ball every Sunday (and I am talking about all the games..thats about 4 to 6 hours) but I watched it while we dating..cause I wanted to spend every minute with you. Five years down the line..don't have a problem cause while you want to do it every Sunday, I don't!
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