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  #201  
Old 04-13-2014, 03:42 AM
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From Styles of Address - Meeting the Royal Family - Royal Tours:

His Royal Highness The Prince of Wales should never be referred as "Charles, Prince of Wales" or "Prince Charles.”

If this is the case, then when he becomes King he will have to come up with another name.

Although I like the sound of King Charles & Queen Camilla, if he wants to be King George VII then I guess we will have to get use to it.

When he becomes King, some people will probably still be referring to him as the Prince of Wales or Prince Charles.
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  #202  
Old 04-13-2014, 06:32 AM
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Originally Posted by MARG View Post
[...] because he has been called Charles for over 65 years. If someone called him something else he'd probably be looking over his shoulder for him.
I think that is no argument. Jorge Mario Cardinal Bergoglio has been called by the same first names for 77 years before he became Pope Franciscus...

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  #203  
Old 04-13-2014, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
I think that is no argument. Jorge Mario Cardinal Bergoglio has been called by the same first names for 77 years before he became Pope Franciscus...

But he was unknown to most people. Charles has been in the public eye for all his life
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  #204  
Old 04-13-2014, 08:32 AM
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Exactly - Charles birth was front page news around the world in 1948 while the Pope, until last year, was virtually unknown outside his native land and even today most people wouldn't know his real name at all.

Charles, on the other hand, has had a number of major life events played out on the world's stage from childhood - e.g. attending his mother's coronation, his own investiture, his schooling in Australia, his time in the military, his wedding, the breakdown of his wedding, his myriad of overseas tours, the second wedding, his son's wedding - all done in the full glare of the world's press. We have seen him grow from new born baby to old age pensioner and all that time he has been 'Charles' or 'Prince Charles'.
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  #205  
Old 04-13-2014, 08:44 AM
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Everyone knows his first name as Charles. If he took another name, I imagine there would be people who would accidentally call him King Charles.
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  #206  
Old 04-13-2014, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by royalistbert View Post
But he was unknown to most people. Charles has been in the public eye for all his life
I agree. It would seem strange to all of us if he went by King George VII (I do believe that this is what he wishes to go by if he had to change his regnal name), and I'll bet lots of us will be saying "now who is King George again?" I personally think he should stick with Charles. Charles III sounds good to me.
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  #207  
Old 04-13-2014, 10:29 AM
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How completely confusing would it be if he chose "William" as his regnal name :)
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  #208  
Old 04-13-2014, 12:27 PM
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Well, the theater has decided he will be King Charles III. Anyone planning on going to the play that just opened in England? I see it got a rave review today.
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  #209  
Old 04-14-2014, 12:15 AM
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It doesn't take long for people to become accustomed to a new name. While I personally believe that The Prince of Wales will choose Charles III, it wouldn't surprise me if he goes with another names, something unique to define what will unfortunately probably be a relatively short reign.

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Originally Posted by HereditaryPrincess View Post
I agree. It would seem strange to all of us if he went by King George VII (I do believe that this is what he wishes to go by if he had to change his regnal name), and I'll bet lots of us will be saying "now who is King George again?" I personally think he should stick with Charles. Charles III sounds good to me.
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  #210  
Old 04-14-2014, 12:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Ontario Royalist View Post
It doesn't take long for people to become accustomed to a new name. While I personally believe that The Prince of Wales will choose Charles III, it wouldn't surprise me if he goes with another names, something unique to define what will unfortunately probably be a relatively short reign.

Yeah. That's why the press and public have completely embraced Kate's married name/titles and don't continue to insist on calling her Kate Middleton.
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  #211  
Old 04-14-2014, 05:16 AM
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Can some name one King or Queen of Great Britain who ascended to the throne as heir apparent or presumptive using any other name but the one that they were known as through most of their lives besides? I don't mean family nick names. There were very extenuating circumstances surrounding George VI, he was never suppose to be king, and Queen Victoria never went by Alexandrina. Yes, I am sure in the last 1000 years someone could come up with something, so can we limit it to say, the last 200 or 300.
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  #212  
Old 04-14-2014, 05:36 AM
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Edward VII - was officially known as HRH The Prince Albert Edward, The Prince of Wales - and even sometimes official as just The Prince Albert, The Prince of Wales but chose to reign as Edward VII.

He is the most obvious one besides George VI.
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  #213  
Old 04-14-2014, 05:47 AM
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Originally Posted by padams2359 View Post
Can some name one King or Queen of Great Britain who ascended to the throne as heir apparent or presumptive using any other name but the one that they were known as through most of their lives besides? I don't mean family nick names. There were very extenuating circumstances surrounding George VI, he was never suppose to be king, and Queen Victoria never went by Alexandrina. Yes, I am sure in the last 1000 years someone could come up with something, so can we limit it to say, the last 200 or 300.

George VI reigned under his last name, George, instead of the one he'd been known as throughout his life, Albert.

His mother, while not a regent, also changed her name upon becoming Queen. Previously she'd always formally been Victoria Mary (and informally May); it was decided that as Queen Consort she should only use one name.

Edward VII had been Albert Edward prior to his mother's death, with the expectation (on her part) that all subsequent male monarchs would be Albert Something. Edward disagreed and dropped his father's name from his own upon becoming king.

Victoria was Alexandrina Victoria prior to her reign and it was initially expected that she would reign as such. However she chose to simply be Victoria on the first day of her reign. If memory serves, her full name was only used officially previously; she'd been called Drina as a young child, but went by Victoria pretty exclusively prior to her reign.

George I and George II both used double barreled names in Germany prior to their acensions (George Louis and George Augustus, respectively).

If memory serves, Robert III of Scotland was born John Stewart, but chose to change his name on his accession. Robert had positive, familial associations (his father and great-grandfather being the II and I of that name), while John was associated with John Balliol.

And that is, I believe, all the name changes in 1,000 years of English/Scottish/British history, although most have occurred in the last 300 years.
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  #214  
Old 04-14-2014, 06:39 AM
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Originally Posted by royalistbert View Post
But he was unknown to most people. Charles has been in the public eye for all his life
But that was not the argument I responded to. That argument was he has been called so long with his name, that he would look over his shoulder when he is called with another name. Jorge Mario Cardinal Bergoglio was in exact the same situation: he has never ever been called "Francisco" his whole life.

By the way, there is no risk that Charles will look over his shoulder because he is never addressed with his old or his new name. It is always and ever "Your Royal Highness" or "Sir". And as King he will be "Your Majesty" or "Sir". No matter the name he uses.

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  #215  
Old 04-14-2014, 08:06 AM
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Actually Charles is often called by his name for instance his siblings and cousins are more likely to call him Charles or some other name and his sons call him Papa or Dad or Father or something else so those who would actually be calling him by his name would be the ones closest to him. Can you really see Anne calling her brother Your Royal Highness rather than Charles?

There is a difference for someone who has only ever had a public name - well known and used in public compared to someone who very late in life decided to use a different name publicly.

Charles has been called Charles regularly by the public - particularly on walkabouts rather than the more formal Your Royal Highness etc. Francis has only recently decided to be called by that name.

If they were together in the street the public would call out both Charles and Francis rather than Jorge and expect the pope to respond just as Charles has always has responded to Charles from the crowds.
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  #216  
Old 04-14-2014, 08:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
Actually Charles is often called by his name for instance his siblings and cousins are more likely to call him Charles or some other name and his sons call him Papa or Dad or Father or something else so those who would actually be calling him by his name would be the ones closest to him. Can you really see Anne calling her brother Your Royal Highness rather than Charles?

There is a difference for someone who has only ever had a public name - well known and used in public compared to someone who very late in life decided to use a different name publicly.

Charles has been called Charles regularly by the public - particularly on walkabouts rather than the more formal Your Royal Highness etc. Francis has only recently decided to be called by that name.

If they were together in the street the public would call out both Charles and Francis rather than Jorge and expect the pope to respond just as Charles has always has responded to Charles from the crowds.
Of course the Prince will always remain Charles for his family and the people with which the Prince is on first-names-terms. Like King George VI always remained 'Bertie' for his mother, his siblings and other close family. I can not imagine that people would address him publicly as "Charles" but apparently this happens, I understand. Well, I hope that he will become Charles III indeed.

The Stuarts are a most interesting period in the British royal history and I think that a Charles III will be a nice reference to Charles I and Charles II, no matter the unhappy end of the first Charles. Prince Philip and Princess Elizabeth have given their baby the name Charles and I think they did it with purpose. Choosing Charles would also honour the choice his parents once made.
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  #217  
Old 04-14-2014, 08:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post

By the way, there is no risk that Charles will look over his shoulder because he is never addressed with his old or his new name. It is always and ever "Your Royal Highness" or "Sir". And as King he will be "Your Majesty" or "Sir". No matter the name he uses.

I've met him, informally at an engagement, the conversation went as such;

"Hello, Your Highness"
"Hello, it's nice to meet you"
"Thank you for coming today, you've had good weather"
"Yes Camilla mentioned the weather was going to change when we got here"
"It's lovely to meet you, thank you for talking to me Charles"
"You're welcome dear"

He moved on, and several other people mentioned Charles in their conversations and a lot of people shouted Charles and Camilla.
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  #218  
Old 04-14-2014, 03:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
I've met him, informally at an engagement, the conversation went as such;

"Hello, Your Highness"
"Hello, it's nice to meet you"
"Thank you for coming today, you've had good weather"
"Yes Camilla mentioned the weather was going to change when we got here"
"It's lovely to meet you, thank you for talking to me Charles"
"You're welcome dear"

He moved on, and several other people mentioned Charles in their conversations and a lot of people shouted Charles and Camilla.
Interesting that people go on first-name-terms with the future King while they would never do so in job applications, formal talks, in a court case or when the president of a company asks something. I know that in some cultures there is the idea that there are no limits. On the continent, especially in Germany, France, Italy, Spain a correct form is very appreciated. In these languages (also in Dutch and Scandinavian languages) there is also a difference in a formal You and an informal You. For an example Vous/Sie (formal) and Tu/Du (informal) in French and German. When you have reached the stage that you can call people with first name and the informal You, then you have been allowed in their more close eenvironment. It is an unwritten but very important line you better not cross not to harm your position or career. In my ears it sounds very weird to say Charles, or Elizabeth, or Philip or Juan Carlos directly in their face.
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  #219  
Old 04-14-2014, 07:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
Interesting that people go on first-name-terms with the future King while they would never do so in job applications, formal talks, in a court case or when the president of a company asks something. I know that in some cultures there is the idea that there are no limits. On the continent, especially in Germany, France, Italy, Spain a correct form is very appreciated. In these languages (also in Dutch and Scandinavian languages) there is also a difference in a formal You and an informal You. For an example Vous/Sie (formal) and Tu/Du (informal) in French and German. When you have reached the stage that you can call people with first name and the informal You, then you have been allowed in their more close eenvironment. It is an unwritten but very important line you better not cross not to harm your position or career. In my ears it sounds very weird to say Charles, or Elizabeth, or Philip or Juan Carlos directly in their face.
I agree that the topic is fascinating. There is a PHD thesis in here for a number of communication/anthology/international management/social sci majors.
I know that, in the US, this is interesting territory. Your interviewer may well be on tenterhooks to assess when you will attempt intimacy - too early, too late, just right? When interviewing entry level candidate we will toss out first names to see if the candidate uses them. At more senior levels we will expect and assess how/when the candiate starts to use first names.
If you know it is a game, it amuses.
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  #220  
Old 04-15-2014, 03:26 AM
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Needless to say, members of the Royal Family are adept at taking these things in stride - just because people make all sorts of gaffs or try to gratify themselves for one reason or another by overly forward/familiar, doesn't mean that it's proper and that it should be emulated.
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