Charles and Camilla: The Marriage (2005 and on)

[Lumutqueen]

...There is no proof that Camilla has always been Charles' love...

I think the entire Charles/Diana/Camilla "thing" is proof enough that Camilla has always been Charles' first and strongest love. I will not say only because I do believe he loved and cared for Diana as it's very hard to completely fake it.

What you're saying, I think, is that after the D&C marriage and before Camilla and Andrew's divorce there is no evidence Camilla and Charles were actively in a romantic physical relationship. However, you don't have to be in one of those to love someone.

The whole Prince of Wales sleeping with the wife of a brother officer apparently comes from 1980, this was just prior to Diana coming to Balmoral;

For the past year, Charles had been spending more and more time with Camilla, the wife of Guards officer Andrew Parker Bowles, and the affair had even reached the ears of the Queen.
Ma’am,’ a senior courtier had informed her, ‘the Prince of Wales is having an affair with the wife of a brother officer, and the regiment don’t like it.’
In April 1980, Charles had taken Camilla with him to Zimbabwe, where he was due to represent his mother at the country’s independence ceremony.
Ostensibly, Camilla was flying over to see her husband.
But at a formal dinner in Harare, the couple flirted ostentatiously and Charles fumbled below the table with his mistress while her husband stoically looked the other way. The incident was so flagrant that reports of it reached the Queen.

This entire quote however comes and has been used in several DailyMail articles;
Diana and The Queen: Her Majesty was the Princess's greatest supporter, sending her to a psychiatrist and hosting a family therapy session | Mail Online
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[vkrish]

Who was the woman slipping on the Royal Train with Charles before the big '81' royal wedding? Who was the woman Charles was caught talking to over the phone before the wedding and was overheard saying something along the lines of 'no matter what, I will always love you.'? Who was the woman Princess Margaret warned people about at the wedding reception in '81?

Thats nonsense gossip..

What you're saying, I think, is that after the D&C marriage and before Camilla and Andrew's divorce there is no evidence Camilla and Charles were actively in a romantic physical relationship. However, you don't have to be in one of those to love someone.

The whole Prince of Wales sleeping with the wife of a brother officer apparently comes from 1980, this was just prior to Diana coming to Balmoral;

Exactly..This is my point. From the time C&D married, till it 'irretrievably' broke down somewhere in late 80s, there is no proof of physical/romantic relationship between those two (C&C).
Atleast for a better part of that period, we have to say Diana was the love of Charles' life. So those early 80s were a 'GAP' in Charles' "eternal,forever" love for Camilla..So I am saying those words "always his love" is not exactly right...
We have to respect the marriage of Charles and Diana, with all its flaws, however short it is, maybe at some point there was love..We simply cannot say even though he was married and physically with Diana, he was in love only with Camilla, and his soul was always with her..
But then as Osipi said, even during the happy C&D days, Camilla might be good confudante and go-to-girl of Charles..but then a best female friend cannot be termed "love of life" for that period of time..

Hum i doubt that a woman who was so incredibly bitter during a 1995 interview found some kind of peace or understanding about the whole situation two years later.

Bcos in '95 she was under the pressure/burden/strain of an utterly unhappy marriage out of which she cannot or will not get out herself and had to follow onlyone time-tested strategy... While two years later she was free from the 'shackles', hence could take a neutral view of the people involved and have better judgement..JMO

 

[GracieGiraffe]

I really don't know why I'm on a Charles/Camilla/Diana thread without hazmat suit and protective gear.

I think Charles tried in the early days with Diana - it was not all bad at first.

As for his marriage now, I'm glad they're happy and sorry that Diana never had a chance to be happy. I think that the fact that he's happy is confirmed by his sons, who have clearly warmed to Camilla.

 

[Lumutqueen]

T So those early 80s were a 'GAP' in Charles' "eternal,forever" love for Camilla..So I am saying those words "always his love" is not exactly right...

As I said previously, I disagree. You don't have to be in a physical/romantic relationship to love someone. I fully except that Diana and Charles at some point were in love, however I also believe Charles has always loved Camilla throughout his entire marriage to Diana. Whether he forgot about it, chose to ignore it for his marriage or accepted his "hand" in life I have no idea. You can't love two people at the same, simple.

 

[GracieGiraffe]

Well, no, I think you can love two people at the same time. Long term love has its ups and downs - I think that when Charles committed to Diana he tried to let go of Camilla and indeed let go of her for a time. Had his marriage to Diana blossomed, I'm not sure he would have gone back to Camilla.

 

[vkrish]

I think that when Charles committed to Diana he tried to let go of Camilla and indeed let go of her for a time. Had his marriage to Diana blossomed, I'm not sure he would have gone back to Camilla.

Exactly..This is my idea too..

I really don't know why I'm on a Charles/Camilla/Diana thread without hazmat suit and protective gear.

Come on,no one needs a protective gear here..Absolutely no bashing..We are very calmly discussing differences of love/friendship/relationship/marriage..and how all these four are being mixed up rightly or wrongly in hindsight..

 

[Osipi]

I really don't know why I'm on a Charles/Camilla/Diana thread without hazmat suit and protective gear.

My eyes really must be getting due for a checkup soon. At first glance I thought you said you needed a Hasnat suit.

A lot of different factors make up a relationship just as there are all different kinds of relationships. One thing I think we can safely say is that when Charles and Camilla finally did get married, they both knew each other very well and knew what to expect from each other and realized what their common likes and dislikes are as well as their differences.

 

[Iluvbertie]

As this is a thread about the marriage of Charles and Camilla - which took place in 2005 - how can Diana even figure into it as she had been dead for nearly 8 years when that marriage took place?

 

[vkrish]

Even I am guilty of that. Actually i am anticipating the mod's axe any moment. But blame that on a "quote" of Diana in post #1311. There was no need for that in the first place. Just couldnt resist questioning that..and it led to all this..Anyways..

 

[Dman]

Although it's proving to be a pretty successful marriage with a great deal of happiness, we have to accept that it's a pretty controversial marriage that has a very interesting foundation.

 

[BritishRoyalist]

Although it's proving to be a pretty successful marriage with a great deal of happiness, we have to accept that it's a pretty controversial marriage that has a very interesting foundation.

Agree. It will definitely go in the history books and I am sure peoples still be talking about it and debating it hundred of years from now like Henry VIII and his six wives

I am sure a movie will be made eventually

 

[vkrish]

I think the best thing about this marriage is there are hardly any expectations.. It is the ultimate success mantra for any relationship, though
They both have been through so much in their respective cases, that they just dont want any more mess..leave alone desiring more "love..cuddles..kisses" etc etc..
And when you lower your expectation you are automatically happy with any small thing you get..
Because if you simply go ny their expectations, i think Charles can find some, if not many, fine British middle-aged aristocratic women who can definitely match his maturity and tastes..
He gave up expecting anything, just being content with having a close friend and confident as his wife and consort..

 

[sesa]

everyone deserves happiness and charles and camilla have found theirs. I may not agree with how they went about it, or how it happened, but in the end, they are happy and so are the kids from both of them. They have all accepted each other. And now a days, that says a lot. I just wish that Diana had a chance to find her happiness, but she is (hopefully) resting in peace and that chapter is closed. And with that, Charles found his happiness. So good on them!

 

[GracieGiraffe]

Hasnat suit! That is just awesome, Osipi!

I believe you've coined a new phrase!

 

[nascarlucy]

Prince Charles had a strong emotional bond with Camilla that he never had with Diana or any other woman. If he didn't have this emotional bond with her, he would have moved on to someone else a long time ago when his marriage to Diana went sour.

He tried to make the marriage with Diana work but it didn't work out.

 

[COUNTESS]

Looks Charles is happy and loves his present wife. Actually, always, has. The only real mistake he made was not making her his wife in the first place. The other stuff is fantasy. From his tampon call, which wasn't his first outing he and Camilla were together. Someone said they had never slept together until their divorces. Another fantasy. He kept a mistress, never felt it was wrong, for as he stated lots of Princes of Wales did so. Camilla may be an off shoot of that. Victors often tale the tale of history. Charles has been, rewritten, as he is alive and she is dead, in his terms. Publicists make their make. Diana has not had one for some time. It, really, doesn't matter. Charles would like to look like the victim, he wasn't. But so many today, have no idea and, again, it doesn't matter. Diana and Charles never belonged together, Camilla and Charles did. If Charles had a backbone it should have worked that way.

 

[BritishRoyalist]

Charles couldn't marry Camilla before. One reason was he went off too the navvy in 1971 and during the time Camilla had married Andrew and so when he returned she was married and so he couldn't propose even if he wanted and we don't know how serious they really were in 1971 when he left. Obviously if it was serious she may have waited. And from what I read The Queen Mother and Louis Mountbatten did not find Camilla suitable.
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[vkrish]

Looks Charles is happy and loves his present wife. Actually, always, has. The only real mistake he made was not making her his wife in the first place. The other stuff is fantasy. From his tampon call, which wasn't his first outing he and Camilla were together. Someone said they had never slept together until their divorces. Another fantasy. He kept a mistress, never felt it was wrong, for as he stated lots of Princes of Wales did so.

Ohh please..Not again..This discussion, even on such a volatile topic, is going so smoothly, until the "only-what-I-say-is-truth-rest-all-is-fantasy" Queen has arrived to spew venom of negativity. How do you know they were never in love and Camilla was always his mistress, unless you have spent the entire 80s as a fly on the walls of KP and Highgrove 24x7..

Victors often tale the tale of history. Charles has been, rewritten, as he is alive and she is dead, in his terms. Publicists make their make. Diana has not had one for some time.

So why dont you take the job of being her publicist now..and enlighten all of us about what is the real truth..
Dear COUNTESS, there are no victors or losers here.All 3 have suffered, all 3 had made mistakes and all 3 have moved on. So stop putting your special trademark negativity and partisanship in every discussion possible..

 

[cepe]

Ive not seen this picture before but I think it says a lot about their marriage

http://static.dnaindia.com/images/cache/1914136.jpg

 

[BrazilianEmpire]

Ohh please..Not again..This discussion, even on such a volatile topic, is going so smoothly, until the "only-what-I-say-is-truth-rest-all-is-fantasy" Queen has arrived to spew venom of negativity.

Please, not a Queen, a Countess!

And seems she spent a great deal of time with The Prince and Princess of Wales and Mrs. Parker Bowles during the 80's and 90's. I wonder if she ever appeared on the background of any official picture.

 

[GracieGiraffe]

I wonder if they think about it as much as we do.

 

[wyevale]

I wonder if they think about it as much as we do.

Unlikely, as they are very busy people, representing HM the Queen, at home and abroad.

 

[Dman]

A royal love story: Prince Charles and Camilla-
A royal love story: Prince Charles and Camilla - Telegraph

 

[AdmirerUS]

A royal love story: Prince Charles and Camilla-
A royal love story: Prince Charles and Camilla - Telegraph

Fascinating. It would appear the space given to Catherine to grow into her role originated with Camilla. There probably is some truth to this.

I take strong issue with "divergent personal agendas." I think Camilla has always wanted to be Charles' life partner and to love him in a devoted way. I think Charles has always wanted to be loved in a devoted way. Given that devotion, he seems to have learned how to be devoted in return (and even enjoy small children). This is just my opinion and I mean it without snark. Charles, like his mother, enjoys being at the fore in life events. It is his role, as he sees it.

Fascinating read though.

 

[Osipi]

I take strong issue with "divergent personal agendas." I think Camilla has always wanted to be Charles' life partner and to love him in a devoted way. I think Charles has always wanted to be loved in a devoted way. Given that devotion, he seems to have learned how to be devoted in return (and even enjoy small children). This is just my opinion and I mean it without snark. Charles, like his mother, enjoys being at the fore in life events. It is his role, as he sees it.

This hits the nail on the head for me. Camilla, I think, never had an "agenda" when it came to her relationship with Charles. She loved/loves Charles the man and I don't feel that his titles, his wealth, his position, his importance to the world had any bearing on how she sees him and loves him. Whether she stayed quietly in the background privately or by his side as his Queen just happened to come with the territory of the man she loves.

 

[US Royal Watcher]

...I think Camilla has always wanted to be Charles' life partner...

Although I think it would have been better if Charles and Camilla had married in the 70s, I disagree that Camilla has always wanted to be Charles' life partner. I think she didn't wait for Charles to return from his assignment because she was in love with her first husband. Apparently Andrew Parker Bowles was quite a catch: good-looking, rich, intelligent, good conversationalist, athletic, and a charming personality. He even dated Princess Anne at one point.

It's a testament to Camilla that she attracted the love of two men who could have had any practically any other woman in the world. I think she is lovely, but she has never been a great beauty. Her strength is her warmth and personality.

I also take issue with article's reference to diverse agendas and hints that the marriage was difficult at first. For all intents and purposes, Charles and Camilla lived together after his divorce, so I don't think there was much adjustment to each other. They have always struck me as very comfortable with each other.

I think the article is accurate when it reports Camilla was reluctant to take on public duties, particularly alone. She has worked at it and is obviously more comfortable.
.

 

[Kakyoin]

My answer is: ''Sure''.

 

[Dman]

Well, I have no doubt that Camilla loves Charles. As for her "agenda", I think that's tricky.

 

[Osipi]

In a way, I think I can identify with both Charles and Camilla and perhaps give my own take on second marriages such as theirs is. I am on my second marriage to a wonderful man that is not only my life partner but my best friend.

Like Charles, I was friends with my current mate during the time of my first marriage falling down the tubes, doing the funky chicken and curling up and dying. I know how possible it is to have a close, intimate and platonic relationship with a member of the opposite sex without it being something lurid, lewd or stuff that tabloid fodder is made out of. I was divorced for 5 years before we even thought of taking our relationship to another level. In fact, I dated and lived with another man in the interim. Neither man had any bearing in our decision to divorce or even factored into it. Sometimes the best way to show love for a spouse is to let them go to allow them to become the best possible person they can be.

The gist of it all and to make my point in this is that as AdmirerUS pointed out stating:

"Although I think it would have been better if Charles and Camilla had married in the 70s, I disagree that Camilla has always wanted to be Charles' life partner. I think she didn't wait for Charles to return from his assignment because she was in love with her first husband. Apparently Andrew Parker Bowles: was quite a catch: good-looking, rich, intelligent, good conversationalist, athletic, and a charming personality. He even dated Princess Anne at one point."

We make choices in our lifetimes and over time, some of them turn out to not to withstand the long haul and changes are made. It doesn't mean that when the choices were made that they were wrong at the time or that love wasn't there. Life is about changes and how we meet them and adapt to them and move forward.

I honestly believe that the marriage of Charles and Camilla is what is best for them at this time. Its obviously working out very very well for them.

 

[Spheno]

Camilla pays tribute to Prince Charles as he celebrates 65th birthday | Mail Online