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  #1101  
Old 12-17-2010, 07:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
No one has ever suggested that she wouldn't be Queen Consort in fact, just as she is Princess of Wales. This was confirmed in parliament in the week leading up to the wedding.

The necessity for legislation has been mentioned but not confirmed.

It could very simply be that on the day in question the Princess Consort title starts being used with no announcement etc being made.

We will simply have to wait and see what happens.

Charles has always made it known that he wants her crowned beside him as his Queen but that doesn't change the official line from CH and BP is still that she will be Princess Consort - so Charles has a personal preference and an official line and he will wait and see when the time comes.
If this, BTW, is not the absolute definition of disingenuous in the dictionary, we really should write to the Webster's Dictionary people.
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  #1102  
Old 12-18-2010, 01:08 PM
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This thread isn't about Diana and whatever damage she may have done to the monarchy. This thread is about whether our opinion has changed since the Prince of Wales made a honest woman of the Duchess of Cornwall.

"Long term" and "discrete" do not make it right. For anyone and, especially, a royal who is one day going to be the Head of the English Church. Would you enjoy having your spouse indulging in a "long term" and "discrete" affair with a "long term love"? I wouldn't. Would you want someone who is going to - effectively - be a church elder one day to have conducted a long term affair with someone other than his wife and then try to justify it by stating "... well, my marriage had been going wrong for years..."? I wouldn't. For me, personally, that would reveal not only a lack of depth and character in the person, but, also, a lack of any real appreciation for anyone's feelings other than his/her own.

An affair is an affair. It is cheap by its very existence. Trying to justify it by turning it into the "romance of the century" and indulging in a massive public "rehabilitation" doesn't transform it's shabby origins. I would have respected both the Prince of Wales and the Duchess of Cornwall a great deal more had they waited until both of them were in a position where a relationship could have been conducted openly and lovingly. The very fact that they snuck around for so long, tells me that they were both very aware of what they were doing was wrong and would hurt a number of people.

No matter how you look at it, the Prince of Wales behaved imprudently and recklessly, and - certainly - without any grace. When he becomes king, he will not be a king that I can respect. There will always be that doubt that - when the going gets rough - he's going to indulge himself and his feelings before thinking of anything else.

I have met the Prince of Wales and the Duchess of Cornwall. They are charming people. They know how to make one feel at ease. They both have a great sense of humour. As people, I like them immensely. As future sovereigns, I wouldn't trust either of them to do what is best of the continuation of the monarchy or the support of it's image.

And, perhaps, that is the great tragedy of their "love affair".
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  #1103  
Old 12-18-2010, 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by SelenaWolf View Post
As people, I like them immensely. As future sovereigns, I wouldn't trust either of them to do what is best of the continuation of the monarchy or the support of it's image.
Selena, I truly find your opnion as you stated it understandible and feel you're very much entitled to have it.

But you obviously have a very romantic if not wishfully view on the idea of monarchy. The king never was a father-figure in reality, no king ever was. Not even that French king who became a saint - he was pretty cruel at times. Another example for season's sake is Santa Claus aka St. Nicolas of Myra. He was one of the "fathers" of the concil of Nicaea and is still notorious for having been quite brutal on fighting for his ideas....

So compared to his ancestors and other folk in his position, Charles is a very "good" man. A much better man than Henry VIII. who was the first "defender of the faith" and head of the Church of England. I personally trust him absolutely when it comes to his duty.

Of course conveying the idea of the "good" king always helped keeping his subjects from rioting. But that's just image, not reality. And king Charles will be better than most before him. But that's my opinion. But then I see the monarchy not as a positive myth but as a historic institution whose whole existence is based on some very unpleasant facts - greed, war, murder and the longing for power. Plus a lot of personal vanity in believing in "god-given" rights.
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  #1104  
Old 12-18-2010, 02:58 PM
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Why is so difficult from some part of the public to forgive and forget these old, yes old, stories?
We can forgive the Duke of Edinburgh, a well known womaniser (who cheated on the Queen more than once), the highly respected Princess Anne (who was exactly in the same situation than her brother, as some people tend to forget), forget the numerous stories surrounding the Duke of kent, Pce and Pcess Michael, Linley and more BUT Charles has to live until the end of his life with the word sinner on the forehead just because he was one time married with a now defunct woman who was regarded as a national treasure (and god knows she was herself not a saint).
It's just deeply unfair....
This family made peace with all these events. 20 years later i think it's time for some people to move on...
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  #1105  
Old 12-18-2010, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Nico View Post
We can forgive the Duke of Edinburgh, a well known womaniser (who cheated on the Queen more than once)
Sorry to detract from the topic of Charles and Camilla here but I just have to say something about this statement. What are the sources for the statement in reference to the Duke of Edinburgh? To my knowledge, there has never been any credible evidence that any of this has occurred.

It *is* true that the DoE has close intimate friends who share common interests with him that just happen to be women such as Lady Brabourne.
There has never been evidence that the DoE has been anything but faithful to HM.
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  #1106  
Old 12-18-2010, 06:40 PM
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Please note that all posts that relate to Camilla's title when Charles becomes King, should be made here http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums...-16252-21.html .

Posts that persist on debating the Diana/Charles/Camilla triange will be deleted without notice.

The subject of this thread are Charles and Camilla, NOT Diana.

Let's stay on topic.

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  #1107  
Old 04-22-2011, 12:22 AM
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I have had a chance to watch (several times), the reporter who first approached Prince Charles for his reaction to the announcement that his son was about to be married. His statement, something to the effect of, "Yes, it's obvious the announcement is true, they've been practicing at it long enough," or whatever he said with that disdainful look on his face was just another version of "ME, why isn't everyone asking about ME, why are you interrupted MY conversation about MY important topic to ask about that kid who is getting married."

Sorry, but that's what I saw - and I can't forgive him for it. Perhaps it's all the coverage, showing him at his own wedding, but, just watching him and listening to him (without listening to any reportage), I think he's not half the man his son is. Where is his dignified bearing? Why didn't he have a prepared reaction to the engagement announcement - something that made him seem regal, dignified, FATHERLY, compassionate?

I really respect his work on the environment, but that's the work any rich man can do. I expect more from him - and I find that Prince William exceeds my expectations of someone so young, while Charles is finding new ways to make me disdain him - though I try to be charitable.

I will say that Camilla's reaction to the engagement was so enthusiastic, so genuine, so kind - thank god that Charles has her in his life.
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  #1108  
Old 04-22-2011, 01:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PrincessKaimi View Post
I have had a chance to watch (several times), the reporter who first approached Prince Charles for his reaction to the announcement that his son was about to be married. His statement, something to the effect of, "Yes, it's obvious the announcement is true, they've been practicing at it long enough," or whatever he said with that disdainful look on his face was just another version of "ME, why isn't everyone asking about ME, why are you interrupted MY conversation about MY important topic to ask about that kid who is getting married."

Sorry, but that's what I saw - and I can't forgive him for it.
Every person that old has a history. Charles especially has a history of being sidelined by the media because of a lot of vain and in reality unimportant reasons like his first wife, the scandals, her fashion... everything at various points in his life was more important than his work. And he worls really hard and is dead serious about his causes. So no wonder he reacted that way when again something was more important than the topic he wanted to talk about.

BTW: I did not read his reaction in that negative way. When it comes to private things, Charles often is a bit sticky and stuffy. And especially then he is very "humourous"...
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  #1109  
Old 04-22-2011, 01:34 AM
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When I saw that comment from Charles I laughed as it was simply so true -they have been practicing for years.

It came across as a loving father having a bit of a joke at the expense of his son and fiancee.
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  #1110  
Old 04-22-2011, 01:37 AM
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It definitely changed. I still wouldn't say I'm a 100% fan of the couple. but have grown to realize that they love each other and she makes him happy.

In the end she's the one he chose, so it's time to move on. Even if I disagree with the way they handle their relationship while still married w/ others.
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  #1111  
Old 04-22-2011, 01:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
When I saw that comment from Charles I laughed as it was simply so true -they have been practicing for years.

It came across as a loving father having a bit of a joke at the expense of his son and fiancee.
Agree. My first reaction to the announcement was "Finally". Remember what Harry said during an recent interview, he though this moment would never happen! also let's not forget The PoW knew about this way before we did, so he had already digested the idea.
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There's not much of a difference between a stadium full of cheering fans and an angry crowd screaming abuse at you. They're both just making a lot of noise. How you take it is up to you. Convince yourself they're cheering for you. You do that, and someday, they will - Sue S.
  #1112  
Old 04-22-2011, 01:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
When I saw that comment from Charles I laughed as it was simply so true -they have been practicing for years.

It came across as a loving father having a bit of a joke at the expense of his son and fiancee.
I watched it several times, with and without sound. His mouth crooks down - almost like a tic, he looks irritated he's even being asked (when he should look joyous for his son), I see nothing that indicates a joke. While it may look that way to some people, it doesn't look that way to all people - and some of the people who've viewed it and commented to me are British, so it's not just an American thing. It's body language and facial expression

He looks so peeved. It's not as if some reporter asking his response was unexpected - that surprised me too. He should have had a "proud father" response ready, if you ask me. Camilla sure had the right attitude and response, she's gay and proud and genuine. Charles looks pinched and unhappy about the whole business.

We'll see if he can unglum himself for the actual wedding. The practicing remark was crude, in my opinion.
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  #1113  
Old 04-22-2011, 01:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Mia_mae View Post
Agree. My first reaction to the announcement was "Finally". Remember what Harry said during an recent interview, he though this moment would never happen! also let's not forget The PoW knew about this way before we did, so he had already digested the idea.
Which is why I thought he'd have a more joyous, loving response and not such a sour puss.

But if he wants the world to see him as a sour puss, he's making great progress. Surely he knows that this is one time when he's once again on the world stage and not simply in his own backyard. As the future King of England, I'd think he'd want to give a more proper, dignified and father-like response.

Guess looking bored and peeved is more his own style - but really, he's representing something besides himself now.
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  #1114  
Old 04-22-2011, 01:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Mia_mae View Post
Agree. My first reaction to the announcement was "Finally". Remember what Harry said during an recent interview, he though this moment would never happen! also let's not forget The PoW knew about this way before we did, so he had already digested the idea.
IIRC, the press caught Charles as he was doing an engagement somewhere that morning (as was Sophie). I took his statement about "practicing at it long enough" as a tongue-in-cheek example of the renowned dry British wit. To me there was no hint of disdain or that he was anything other than happy about the announcement. He may have been curt with the reporters but that is to be understood as he was making his way to somewhere he needed to be at the time.

I definitely think that since the marriage, Charles is a much more relaxed and happy man and very comfortable in his own skin. With Camilla by his side, he's finally coming into his own in both his personal and professional life.
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  #1115  
Old 04-22-2011, 01:56 AM
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I don't doubt he was delighted, but I recall thinking at the time...

"If you're happy Charles, tell your face".

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  #1116  
Old 04-22-2011, 02:09 AM
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"If you're happy Charles, tell your face"



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There's not much of a difference between a stadium full of cheering fans and an angry crowd screaming abuse at you. They're both just making a lot of noise. How you take it is up to you. Convince yourself they're cheering for you. You do that, and someday, they will - Sue S.
  #1117  
Old 04-22-2011, 01:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Mia_mae View Post
It definitely changed. I still wouldn't say I'm a 100% fan of the couple. but have grown to realize that they love each other and she makes him happy.

In the end she's the one he chose, so it's time to move on. Even if I disagree with the way they handle their relationship while still married w/ others.
Your feelings mirror my own, in that I am still not a 100% fan of the couple and disagree with thier behavior in the past, but I too have grown to be able to accept the facts and move on. It took me years to be able to do this, because I had a lot of anger towards them. But then one day, I " woke up" and thought, Why be angry at people I do not know?

I was angry, because here Charles was getting a 2nd chance at being happy, while Diana did not get hers, but I stopped, because I realized, It won't bring her back.

I think I was having a delayed response of anger about Diana's death. I was so young when she died, that it did not happen for me till later. It came out as anger at Charles and Camilla for treating Diana so awful, and now here they were getting another chance, but it wasn't about that. It was about Diana's death. I was angry at Charles. I thought for the longest time, If only Charles had loved Diana, she would not have been with Dodi in that tunnel and crashed. I stopped being mad at Charles, when I realized the accident was a tragic twist of fate, how he felt about Diana had nothing to do with it! Diana died because of a tragic accident, not because Charles did her any harm. So I accepted she had died and stopped being angry at Charles. He does not deserve it, and above all, it won't bring Diana back.Besides, I was never angry at Charles to start with. I was angry that Diana died.

I hope people can understand my feelings. It is hard to share them. I fear people will be judgemental. I worry I am the only one to have felt this way.
I want people to know that despite my past feelings, I never wished harm on anyone, and that I now wish Charles and Camilla nothing but happiness.
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  #1118  
Old 04-22-2011, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by PrincessKaimi View Post
I have had a chance to watch (several times), the reporter who first approached Prince Charles for his reaction to the announcement that his son was about to be married. His statement, something to the effect of, "Yes, it's obvious the announcement is true, they've been practicing at it long enough," or whatever he said with that disdainful look on his face was just another version of "ME, why isn't everyone asking about ME, why are you interrupted MY conversation about MY important topic to ask about that kid who is getting married."

I think he's not half the man his son is.
I will say that Camilla's reaction to the engagement was so enthusiastic, so genuine, so kind - thank god that Charles has her in his life.
Did not see the report, so cannot give an opinion, but I can say that I dislike that trait in people- when they feel they have to- or feel that they are entitled to- make everything about themselves.
You are right- I believe William is more of a respectable man, then his father ever will be.
I am so glad to see how supportive Camilla has been.
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  #1119  
Old 04-22-2011, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by roseroyal View Post
Did not see the report, so cannot give an opinion, but I can say that I dislike that trait in people- when they feel they have to- or feel that they are entitled to- make everything about themselves.
You are right- I believe William is more of a respectable man, then his father ever will be.
I am so glad to see how supportive Camilla has been.
I saw it -I dont think that was the case. I think when it comes to the press Prince Charles shows all of his emotions on his face. He hates to answer off the cuff questions and really doesn't like interviews unless he is seemingly in control.

That I would say IS a bad trait. People should not be able to irk you and read you like that-especially when you are in a leadership position.

You are right-Camilla is a good influence-hopefully he will continue to loosen up and not take every remark to heart.
Who has been more villified than Camilla-I can not repeat hear the vile names she has been called in the newspaper and on the internet for over 10 years now. And yet -in public she's always smiling and cheerful-she "just gets on with it".
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  #1120  
Old 04-22-2011, 03:12 PM
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Like many of you, I loved Diana and hated what Camilla had done. If only she had "waited" for Charles like Kate waited for William, instead of marrying APB. But now, I've grown to like her- she seems funny and fun, and if she lived next door, I'd invite her over for a drink or five.
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