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View Poll Results: When did your opinion of Diana start to change and why?
Morton book (1990) 25 9.80%
War of the Waleses (starting 1990) 20 7.84%
Squidgygate (1992) 12 4.71%
Hewitt affair (1993) 17 6.67%
Charles' interview (1994) 5 1.96%
Panorama interview (1995) 43 16.86%
Phone calls to Oliver Hoare (1994) 14 5.49%
Dodi al-Fayed (1997) 23 9.02%
Other (please explain) 96 37.65%
Voters: 255. You may not vote on this poll

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  #161  
Old 12-31-2007, 08:26 PM
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I don't recall reading anywhere that Diana took sleeping pills for a long time. I'd be surprised if she did because she was very careful of what she put in her body.

I think that she had bouts of mental illness in the form of the bulimia and perhaps depression, but I think she recovered from those. I think her main problem was not mental illness but a personality disorder, which is not so easily treatable with medication or counselling.
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  #162  
Old 12-31-2007, 09:00 PM
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I got the information for this article : Daily Express: The World's Greatest Newspaper :: Diana Inquest :: Medic insists Diana was not pregnant

Quote:
She said she was no longer taking sleeping tablets, which she had been doing for five years and that just before her death she was in a good mental state.
It's the Daily Express so I don't take this as the plain and simple truth but it sounds like she was actually on sleeping pills ...
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  #163  
Old 12-31-2007, 09:17 PM
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Originally Posted by zhontella View Post
There were also reports that Charles had a mental breakdown around the time he broke his arm -- his royal duties stopped for quite a time -- and Diana moved back in and stayed with him until he was better..
I don't remember reading that Charles ever had a nervous breakdown. I remember early in the marriage that Diana was going to therapy on the advice of the Queen Mother and Princess Margaret who had both apparently benefitted from therapy themselves. So psychological care wasn't totally a foreign concept to the Royal Family but eating disorders and self-mutiliation can be very tough for some families to handle.

Its funny this thread is bringing back memories of a lot of signs that things weren't going well in the beginning. I remember reading that the queen told one of her advisors that Diana always wore a walkman around the palace and it made it hard to talk to her. The advisor laughed and explained to his sovereign about modern technology. I also remember the Queen inviting Diana to her weekly ride in the park and Diana was so scared of horses she headed her horse straight for some bushes and couldn't get out. I also remember the rumours about the time that William was born about Diana having anorexia. And then Diana got stage fright before an event and refused to go on. There just seemed to be a lot of disconnect between Diana and the Royal Family and there seemed to be a lot of stress on Diana.

But the general reaction was, aww, isn't that sweet? rather than something is wrong here.

When did y'all actually remember first reading that something was severely wrong with the couple as opposed to guessing it by what you saw in the papers.
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  #164  
Old 12-31-2007, 09:21 PM
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I think my opinion began changing with the Panorama interview. I found it a bit contrived and manipulative and very self serving.

The major change has happened after doing a great deal of reading on the lady and her life.

I think she was ill suited to be incorporated into the Royal Family from the very beginning. I think she was a person with severe emotional problems that started in her childhood and advanced from there.

I think she used the Royal Family and abused them, especially HM Queen Elizabeth, who as far as I can ascertain was always a friend and ally, even through her worst stunts, at least until the end when HM finally decided that divorce was the only answer left. I can only imagine the desperation HM was feeling at that point, considering what a divorce would mean and potentially entail for the Monarchy.

I don't know how to describe my feelings any other way than to say, I SIMPLY DISLIKE THE WOMAN NOW.
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  #165  
Old 12-31-2007, 09:49 PM
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Originally Posted by ysbel View Post
I don't remember reading that Charles ever had a nervous breakdown.
I seems to remember there was a spell around July-Sept 1990 when Charles basically withdrew to Highgrove, ostensibly to nurse his broken arm. It wasn't so much a nervous breakdown, but reported as an early midlife crisis.

Quote:
When did y'all actually remember first reading that something was severely wrong with the couple as opposed to guessing it by what you saw in the papers.
One of the incident I remember was in late 1985, Diana's dance with Wayne Sleep. When I first read about it, I was very surprised she would have done it since royals aren't supposed to be on stage to provide entertainment. Then I saw the photos.
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  #166  
Old 01-01-2008, 12:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Incas View Post
I seems to remember there was a spell around July-Sept 1990 when Charles basically withdrew to Highgrove, ostensibly to nurse his broken arm. It wasn't so much a nervous breakdown, but reported as an early midlife crisis.
When in fact it was just that Charles was spending most of his time at Highgrove, with Camilla, who is the one he wanted with him during his convalescence recovering from his broken arm injured in a fall playing polo on 28th June. The treating specialists elected to set the fracture without pinning it, but it not heal properly, and Charles had surgery on 2nd September followed by intensive physiotherapy.

On reflection, it was a crisis and Charles was in his early 40s so I suppose you could call it an early midlife crisis!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ysbel
When did y'all actually remember first reading that something was severely wrong with the couple as opposed to guessing it by what you saw in the papers.
My brain contains a lot of information about these events but it's not been very well programmed and it can't sort what's original from what's been added much later.
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  #167  
Old 01-01-2008, 07:12 AM
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Originally Posted by zhontella View Post
There were also reports that Charles had a mental breakdown around the time he broke his arm -- his royal duties stopped for quite a time -- and Diana moved back in and stayed with him until he was better.
In 1990, Charles had a very complicated double break to his arm, not a 'breakdown'. I have been unable to find any articles that suggest it was either a mental breakdown (zhontella) or a midlife crisis (Incas), so if there are links, it would be interesting to see them.
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  #168  
Old 01-01-2008, 07:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Roslyn View Post
I don't recall reading anywhere that Diana took sleeping pills for a long time. I'd be surprised if she did because she was very careful of what she put in her body.
It was suggested that Diana did inject herself with diuretics, to keep her weight down and of course the enemas, for the same reason.

If she was taking sleeping pills for 5 years, would she also need to take stimulants to get her going?
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  #169  
Old 01-01-2008, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ysbel View Post
I don't remember reading that Charles ever had a nervous breakdown. I remember early in the marriage that Diana was going to therapy on the advice of the Queen Mother and Princess Margaret who had both apparently benefitted from therapy themselves. So psychological care wasn't totally a foreign concept to the Royal Family but eating disorders and self-mutiliation can be very tough for some families to handle...
Very true ysbel. Many of her problems could be apparently justified by her natural shyness or because she was young so people just ignored it and only took the best they could see. Perhaps it's why, years later, she wanted the press attention and show them that yes, she could talk in public without blushing, etc. It must have been indeed very hard for the RF and for Diana to understand each other. IMO, Sarah Ferguson entering the royal circle made them open their eyes on Diana and realise that her problems were serious, not only some details of her personality. Sarah and Diana had approximately the same age so it was now easy for the RF to see the differences between the 2. But 1986 was, I think, too late to help Diana ; at least for the RF. I'm not blaming them at all. I believe that the ones who should have helped her in the first place were her own family but I remember reading that even when William was born, Diana only saw her mother once at KP.
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  #170  
Old 01-01-2008, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Chimene View Post
I was almost persuaded by the mental illness argument, when I decided to re-read the Bashir interview. She was all over the place that day and her answers were so cold and calculating. She even spoke of herself in the third person like some dictator.
If Princess Diana sounded cold and calculating, could it be because she rehearsed her lines? I read in various books on Diana that the questions were given to her before hand. Being all over the place in speech is not cold and calculating, but very confused individual. My impression of the interview was that she was in deep stage of paranoia. I have seen the Bashir interview twice. The first time was right in 1995. I really didn't register everything she said because of her makeup. I saw the interview last year and I felt she was a very troubled, spoiled person who lived with mental troubles.

She has told us that she is guided with her emotions instead of her intellect. In the Diana Chronicles by Tina Brown Charles friends and Tony Blair's government thought she was a loose cannon-mental after that interview. Her next action was to blame Tiggy of a miscarriage. Do these two actions sound like a person who is all together mentally?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Chimene View Post
The marriage was not working out, so she was seduced by the idea that she wanted to be free. After the book came out and she saw the reactions, she started to rethink her plan, and this is where the battle began. The children became her weapon in her power play or “chess game” as she called it. She was negotiating with the BRF in front of the entire world - she wanted to be an "Ambassador".In doing so, she was undermining Charles reputation, while telling the Queen how things should be done. She seems to have a clear understanding of how the establishment and system worked, yet how on earth could she have underestimated their power?
With mental illness and being spoiled a person does not make the right, logical choices.

Some people have brought out in this thread that Princess Diana was not disciplined by her parents and she was spoil. Also from reading about her Spencer relatives being a firey, red-headed clan, becoming Princess at 20 and the press interest made her even more spoil. I have come to the conclusion that with her mental illness, being spoil and the Spencer character that she was not angel to live with, but a complex individual. And even ten years on she still is fascinating us and I think if she became Queen-what a BRF the world would have!!!
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  #171  
Old 01-01-2008, 11:11 AM
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There is a difference between mental illness and emotionally unstable. And being spoiled, either by parents or by the press, wouldn't cause of mental illness, it may encourage emotional unstability. If being spoiled can be an excuse, I'd think Charles have a better claim at both. But few if any have given him the same leeway in the marriage breakdown.
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  #172  
Old 01-01-2008, 11:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Incas View Post
There is a difference between mental illness and emotionally unstable. And being spoiled, either by parents or by the press, wouldn't cause of mental illness, it may encourage emotional unstability. If being spoiled can be an excuse, I'd think Charles have a better claim at both. But few if any have given him the same leeway in the marriage breakdown.
The only document sickness of Princess Diana was bulimia. That is mental illness and the suicide of her uncle is another documented factor that there was a HISTORY OF MENTAL ILLNESS IN DIANA'S FAMILY.

Diana keep the bulimia secret from her doctors in the early years, so they could not help her mental illness. Her married life was troubled and painful for her and Prince Charles. The break down of their marriage was because she could not be reasoned with because of her illness and being spoil. I do blame Charles for not helping her more and from what I have read about him he is very spoil and emotionally needy for a mother figure.
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  #173  
Old 01-01-2008, 12:20 PM
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well, i was also too young, when she died. so i hadn t ever really realized who she was before. but when i saw the pics of her everywhere i began to wonder why she should have been so perfect. and all i found was i princess i still don t like. somebody who was famous for her look and maybe charities which she supported but never in a way like other "stars" i think. she still tried to be focused on, i felt like. and i just can t imagine how you can marry sb without realizing another woman. and especially, if you knew this woman. another point is, that i think this interview in which she mentioned the three persons in a relationship wasn t a really nice thing to do. ifg other people give such statements people often say, they should look on theimselves or that it isn t something for public. but she showed the mistakes she felt and obviously wanted everybody to know that.
what i voted for in this poll is the affair with dodi, because i feel like it s another thing she wasn t right to do so. why did she have all those lovers if she could have done so many other more useful things?? no, she loved a lot of men although she could have spent this time caring for her boys or working for charities or whatever. it is the kind of thing privileged do whereas those who don t, don t get the attention for their work.

that s what i think.
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  #174  
Old 01-01-2008, 12:41 PM
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Originally Posted by georgiea View Post
The only document sickness of Princess Diana was bulimia. That is mental illness and the suicide of her uncle is another documented factor that there was a HISTORY OF MENTAL ILLNESS IN DIANA'S FAMILY.

Diana keep the bulimia secret from her doctors in the early years, so they could not help her mental illness. Her married life was troubled and painful for her and Prince Charles. The break down of their marriage was because she could not be reasoned with because of her illness and being spoil. I do blame Charles for not helping her more and from what I have read about him he is very spoil and emotionally needy for a mother figure.
(my bolding)

I know what you mean. I read once about the Spencer's "bad blood" in reference to their mental problems and strong personality. I find it quite sad that people generalized it this way and like I said in previous post, Diana was not mad, not more than the average.
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  #175  
Old 01-01-2008, 01:12 PM
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But few if any have given him the same leeway in the marriage breakdown.
Maybe that is because he has been able to keep stable firendships for centuries and is able to live a happy family life with his new wife and sons. Seems (at least to me) a proof that he is much better suited for marriage than she was.
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  #176  
Old 01-01-2008, 02:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
It was suggested that Diana did inject herself with diuretics, to keep her weight down and of course the enemas, for the same reason.

If she was taking sleeping pills for 5 years, would she also need to take stimulants to get her going?
I think Skydragon makes a very excellent, valid point that suggests to me that Diana was not mentally ill/unstable. If it were the case that Diana was taking sleeping pills for five years, then I think it is highly likely, especially with the amount of public engagements she had, that would have taken stimulants as well. Sometimes, those things can make you a bit loopy and a little foggy--also, taking medications daily for years does have side effects.

I know that we're all suggesting that perhaps Diana had a mental illness or was mentally unstable--but I just don't buy it. The only problem we know of was her eating disorder and we can look at her family and see some problems--but not her immediate family. Her sisters seem quite normal and her brother seems a lot like Diana, in my opinioin. I am going to have to say that I think that Diana's problems all stem from a lack of discipline in her childhood that deluded her into thinking she should always get her way. Honestly, I am sure after childhood incidents with nannies and her stepmother that her family took her to see psychologists who said that nothing was wrong with her. Had there been a problem then it would have been addressed then. But, she went on with her undisciplined childhood and before she could experience life and learn differently she became Princess of Wales--a position that guaranteed always getting your way.
But, she didn't get her way and that's when a spiteful, calculating, and ego-maniac type personality emerged.
ANd yes, her insecurities about herself completely played into that as well. If anyone doubts her insecurities one need only look at that ghastly blue eyeliner she always wore--insecure people make some bad choices
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  #177  
Old 01-01-2008, 02:55 PM
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What blue eyeliner ? I can only remember theone she used to wear in the 80's but not after. Well, whatever ... .
It's true that her parents probably didn't give alot of time to her education and the fact that she wasn't meant to be a girl did play its role. Moreover, her mother left when she was 6 and when her father came up with Raine the revolt had already begun. She followed her sisters in the hatred toward Raine and her angriness even exceeded theirs. All her life was guided by revolt and she paid the price I think.
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  #178  
Old 01-01-2008, 04:00 PM
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I am sure we all know many people who came from 'broken homes' and still turned out to be non vindictive adults. We probably also know people who came from loving, caring homes who are the nastiest people around, so it is a little unfair to blame the parents!

I believe that Diana learned how to manipulate the staff and her father, after her mother left. She probably found it also worked on her mother who would be suffering from guilt. If 'caught', there was always the tears followed by tantrums route. Once she had perfected the 'art', she became used to getting her own way and Charles and the RF not falling for it was probably a great shock to her. The more she had tantrums, the more Charles dug his heels in, not from any sense of 'teaching her a lesson', but because one simply didn't give in to demands of 'that sort'.
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  #179  
Old 01-01-2008, 05:27 PM
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Skydragon--you said it succinctly and perfectly! This is exactly what I think was the problem--not mental illness or a broken home. Perfectly said!
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  #180  
Old 01-01-2008, 05:55 PM
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I am sure we all know many people who came from 'broken homes' and still turned out to be non vindictive adults...
True but how do you explain bulimia and self-destruction if she seemed so selfish to you ? It takes alot to come to that and I don't think the problem started without an exterior factor.
Moreover, no one is vindictive or does such things that you describe very well by nature. Nobody is born to be this or that.
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