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View Poll Results: When did your opinion of Diana start to change and why?
Morton book (1990) 25 9.80%
War of the Waleses (starting 1990) 20 7.84%
Squidgygate (1992) 12 4.71%
Hewitt affair (1993) 17 6.67%
Charles' interview (1994) 5 1.96%
Panorama interview (1995) 43 16.86%
Phone calls to Oliver Hoare (1994) 14 5.49%
Dodi al-Fayed (1997) 23 9.02%
Other (please explain) 96 37.65%
Voters: 255. You may not vote on this poll

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  #61  
Old 12-29-2007, 02:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GlitteringTiaras View Post
but to classify her as a saint, as some do.
It's often been my experience that those who affiliate Diana with the word 'saint' are those who were never particularly fond of the woman. I don't believe I've read a post by anyone who favourably recalls her memory, which proclaimed her as, or compared her too, some 'celestial being'.

I've read many posts which portray her as someone who's memory remains dear (and not without the occasional over compensation to boot), but the term 'saint' has certainly been expressed, if not exaggerated at great length by those who don't, for whatever purpose or means, associate with such amiable feelings.
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  #62  
Old 12-29-2007, 05:50 AM
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Originally Posted by zhontella View Post
Furthermore, Diana was afraid -- possibly scared the royal family wanted to ban her to Siberia and forbid all contact with her children -- so that alone could also cause a lot of irratic and unpleasant behavior.
Ban her to Siberia?
Who have you ever heard of, who the Royal Family banned to Siberia?
If Sarah wasn't 'banned' and had pretty much equal rights with Andrew, when it came to children, then surely Diana would know that her situation couldn't have been worse?
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  #63  
Old 12-29-2007, 06:00 AM
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I voted "other".

I seem to be one of the oldest here. I was 27 when Diana and Charles married, and had recently been married myself. At that time I was working full time and studying part time. I never warmed to Diana. I thought she was immature, silly, too giggly and girly for my liking, and more than a bit dim. There was also a certain something about her - perhaps it was smugness - that I just didn't like. I couldn't relate to her at all and I couldn't understand why Charles picked her because they didn't seem to have anything in common and I couldn't imagine what they would talk about. I formed the view that she must have been chosen as good brood mare material. Considering her background I assumed she knew the deal and was happy to go along with it, as she would be Queen one day.

Even though I didn't particularly like her at the start, it would be wrong to say I wasn't interested in her or that I strongly disliked her. I watched the wedding and recorded it, and she was Charles' wife so I was curious and my husband and I hung around to see them when we had the opportunity when they were here in 1988. I certainly noticed her change of dress style when she abandoned the frills and matronly look and started looking sleek and smart. She was capable of being a real stunner, but I thought she seemed perhaps too concerned about her looking good.

After the War of the Waleses started and we began to see the snarls and pouty faces, and see how unhappy Charles looked in her presence, I became more interested and my opinion of her intensified and began its downward spiral.

I am finding it difficult to distinguish between how the various events affected my opinion of Diana as they occurred from the impact they had when I read about them in books years later. I think it's fair to say that by the time of the Panorama interview I had a very low opinion of her. That event demonstrated to me beyond doubt that she was manipulative, arrogant, self-absorbed, and dangerous because it seemed to me she would sacrifice anyone and anything to get what she wanted and to try to make herself look good. These views were supported by the revelations about her involvement in the Morton book, which confirmed she was sneaky and would lie to get what she wanted.

The fact of the Hewitt affair didn't bother me at all because she was clearly in an unhappy marriage and I think everyone's entitled to some happiness and I think she and Hewitt were well suited to each other. What does bother me about her relationship with Hewitt was how she could be such a hypocrite about it. I was staggered that she could still play the wounded party and maintain that she didn't want a divorce at a stage when it was patently obvious that she and her husband had absolutely nothing in common and couldn't even stand to be in the same room as each other and both had been in relationships with other people for years.

None of the other listed incidents changed my opinion of Diana.
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  #64  
Old 12-29-2007, 06:26 AM
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Originally Posted by TheTruth View Post
I mean, we'll never know who cheated the first and I don't want to be mean but most of the time when you have an affair, your decision is caused by the other person of the couple.
The thing is that we only have Diana's word for it that Charles never ended his relationship with Camilla while Charles claims that his marriage was truly over when he hooked up with Camilla. We simply don't know who cheated first, but there is a lot of information pointing to the fact that Diana introduced the idea of "three in a marriage" in order to explain her own behaviour, so it could well be a lie. As it is, we don't know who cheated first on whom.
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  #65  
Old 12-29-2007, 10:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Jo of Palatine View Post
The thing is that we only have Diana's word for it that Charles never ended his relationship with Camilla while Charles claims that his marriage was truly over when he hooked up with Camilla. We simply don't know who cheated first, but there is a lot of information pointing to the fact that Diana introduced the idea of "three in a marriage" in order to explain her own behaviour, so it could well be a lie. As it is, we don't know who cheated first on whom.
I agree it's impossible to know. But in regards to their affairs, I always see Charles as contributing more to the marital breakdown with Camilla, than Diana did with James Hewitt, regardless of "who cheated first." The reason is that Hewitt was someone Diana just met and flirted around with--whereas Camilla was someone Charles had known for a long time and had a very deep connection with. I think once Charles became involved with Camilla again, no matter when, he would have stopped contributing much to the marriage because Diana just couldn't compare to Camilla.

But, I agree Diana's "there were three in our marriage" was a badly-chosen comment regardless of how true it was. It was hypocritical, and it had that ability to subtly but very clearly point the finger at Charles as the one to blame, vindictive behaviour Diana displayed often in many different ways.
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  #66  
Old 12-29-2007, 12:57 PM
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I agree that the affair between Charles and Camilla might have contributed more to the marriage breakdown. But I don't think Charles was happy to see his wife going with another man either. Many think he didn't care and it would surprise me that he didn't know about it. Diana never talked of Charles having an argument about her and Hewitt so I really can't say if he did mind. Although their relationship lasted for 5 years (nothing compared to Charles and Camilla's), I heard many times that after he had learnt about her death, he became a total wreck. According to some of his friends, he did nothing but drink all day and having suicidal thoughts ... Don't know if it's true but I guess it was more than a flirt then.
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  #67  
Old 12-29-2007, 02:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madame Royale View Post
The late Princess of Wales suffered from mental illness.

Diana battled Bulimia Nervosa for some time and it is clear (not directed at any one person) that some here, are either unwilling or are just unable to fathom the influence such a 'disease' can have on a persons temprament and general outlook on life.

Severe irrationality which is often followed by a sense of guilt, nervousness and at times, deep depression are exceptionally common for eating dissorder sufferers.

I'm not looking for excuses, as I recognise her attempts (moreso in the latter years) to manipulate the media and conduct somewhat spiteful endeavours, but not once have I ever misplaced the factual gen that here was a woman who had fought mental illness and throughout her life had been deeply affected by events she could either not control or at times felt powerless to overcome. Diana dealt with issues in ways which were most apparent to her at the time. Rightly or wrongly, they were the choices she made. I wouldn't have made the same choices but then again, I wasn't Diana.

Bulimia nervosa - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
True, I should have made that acknowledgement. I wasn't dismissing her eating disorder. What I meant was, the bulimia and the depression bipolar does not make.
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  #68  
Old 12-29-2007, 02:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BeatrixFan View Post
I think the Queen of Hearts thing cuts me the most when I watch it. I just saw that as a direct attack on the Queen and it's difficult to stomach.
Right on, Exactly. It was a direct attack on the queen and thus on the monarchy. It was infuriating to the extreme. Due to that statement, I was not surprised that the queen wanted to ignore Diana's life and death and stay oblivious to all at Balmoral after Diana died. I was not surprised that in her belated eulogy to Diana, she carefully omitted any expression of love for Diana. The queen is, afterall, front and center -- always has been and always will be until her death. It was no less than high treason for Diana to claim she wanted to replace the queen in "people's hearts".

I am not surprised that soon after that interview, the queen wrote Diana a letter stating it was time to divorce. And that naturally led to Diana having to give up her HRH and thus her royal protection and thus be an "accident" waiting to happen.

{edit - Elspeth}
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  #69  
Old 12-29-2007, 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted by zhontella View Post
I am not surprised that soon after that interview, the queen wrote Diana a letter stating it was time to divorce. And that naturally led to Diana having to give up her HRH and thus her royal protection and thus be an "accident" waiting to happen.
She didn't have to give up her protection. Reportedly, she insisted on doing that even though the royal family wanted her to keep it.

{deleted for consistency - Elspeth}
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  #70  
Old 12-29-2007, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTruth View Post
Although their relationship lasted for 5 years (nothing compared to Charles and Camilla's), I heard many times that after he had learnt about her death, he became a total wreck. According to some of his friends, he did nothing but drink all day and having suicidal thoughts ... Don't know if it's true but I guess it was more than a flirt then.
I didn't know some of that about James Hewitt and Diana, just that the relationship was obviously less serious than that of Charles and Camilla. For him at least it may have felt like more than a flirtation and I'm sure Diana was quite emotionally attached to him at times.

I'd really never thought about the significance, to the Queen, of Diana calling herself the Queen of Hearts...somehow I saw it more as her way of saying, even if I'm not Charles' queen, I'll be the people's queen. But yes, of course, it is obvious to me that the Queen would be appalled by this. She takes her role very seriously and would have seen Diana as trying to usurp her in some way and perhaps make a mockery of her inherited right.
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  #71  
Old 12-29-2007, 03:26 PM
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Well my opinion of Diana changed after the Hewitt affair because I didn't see her as a person who could have an affair. I was surprised at the type of man she was attracted to - he seemed like a good looking cad. Rather like the Hugh Grant character in Bridget Jone's Diary.

Seeing the type of man that Diana was attracted to convinced me that she and Charles would have a hard time repairing their marriage even if they could forgive each others affairs.

I couldn't see her going back from Hewitt to Charles.
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  #72  
Old 12-29-2007, 04:13 PM
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Why? From one cad to another.
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  #73  
Old 12-29-2007, 04:28 PM
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Why? From one cad to another.
I should have said good looking, charming cad. I wouldn't describe Charles a good looking charming man with honey words to sweep a woman off her feet and then turn on her. James Hewitt was. He was very good looking, could turn on the charm and then later use his association with Diana for his own purposes while protesting that he was always faithful to her.

None of Charles' women friends have claimed that Charles was a charmer, he has been called stiff, inflexible, insensitive and inelegant but a charming scoundrel? No.
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  #74  
Old 12-29-2007, 04:47 PM
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BTW I noticed most people voted for Other and the Panorama interview.

I was quite surprised at the Panorama interview. At the time, all the media outlets were reporting that the Panorama interview was a triumph for Diana. I think I remember that the public opinion polls view on her went way up while polls about the royal family and Charles recorded that their reputations where negatively affected by Diana's interview.

So at what point did people realize the Panorama interview a mistake? Right after the interview or a little bit later?
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  #75  
Old 12-29-2007, 04:49 PM
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So at what point did people realize the Panorama interview a mistake? Right after the interview or a little bit later?
The minute I heard about wanting to be Queen in people's hearts. I remember being absolutely horrified. I'd already been rather irritated by the mixed messages of "they don't know how to handle a strong woman" and "pity me, the poor victim," and I think that by then the digs at Charles's unfitness to be King were not surprising - but to use that platform to launch a direct attack on the Queen was incredible.
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  #76  
Old 12-29-2007, 05:03 PM
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I watched the whole thing in shock. She was already very popular, so I'm not sure what she thought she was accomplishing. What she needed was a good therapist, but instead she decided to shoot herself in the foot with a really bizarre interview.
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  #77  
Old 12-29-2007, 05:39 PM
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Originally Posted by rmay286 View Post
I agree it's impossible to know. But in regards to their affairs, I always see Charles as contributing more to the marital breakdown with Camilla, than Diana did with James Hewitt, regardless of "who cheated first."
It is fairly amusing to see how everyone 'skips' over Diana's self admitted affair with Barry Manakee, they also ignore Waterhouse and Gilbey! .

I don't think Charles could ever be described as a 'honey tongued' or a 'cad', I once heard him described as 'a flirt', purely because he is polite and gentlemanly.
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  #78  
Old 12-29-2007, 05:40 PM
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Originally Posted by ysbel View Post
I should have said good looking, charming cad. I wouldn't describe Charles a good looking charming man with honey words to sweep a woman off her feet and then turn on her. James Hewitt was. He was very good looking, could turn on the charm and then later use his association with Diana for his own purposes while protesting that he was always faithful to her.

None of Charles' women friends have claimed that Charles was a charmer, he has been called stiff, inflexible, insensitive and inelegant but a charming scoundrel? No.
Lol, I love the comparison you've made about Hewitt and Hugh Grant : so true ! Only in a physical view, if you put both Charles and Hewitt, side by side, I'd go for Hewitt. But there's also the age to consider. Charles was 12 years older than Diana whereas Hewitt was only 3 years older ; at that time of her life, it was not something unimportant. Her choice is justified IMO.
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  #79  
Old 12-29-2007, 05:58 PM
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So at what point did people realize the Panorama interview a mistake? Right after the interview or a little bit later?
I realized the Panorama interview was a mistake while I was watching it. A mistake for Diana, that is. I, on the other hand, was absolutely delighted with it, because she was showing everyone some of her most unattractive qualities, and I was sick and tired of hearing about "poor Diana". I was in the "poor Charles" camp.

The bad make-up, the sad expression, and contrived answers. The interview revealed so much about Diana! Did she really think it would make her look good? Yes, she did! It was great entertainment.
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  #80  
Old 12-29-2007, 06:05 PM
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I voted for Other because I am not sure when my opinions changed or if they did really.

I was born around the same time as Diana and was living in England at the time of the courtship, wedding etc and I think my opinions were strongly influenced by my own age and worldy knowledge at the time. Needless to say I didn't notice the things that my mother did at the time. I remember my mother saying as the engagement was announced that they were totally not suited and this marriage would be a disaster. As Diana might have been 19 but she was a very young thinking 19 year old.

Overtime, as I grew older--I started to notice things that I didn't see when I was 19. So my opinions changed gradually. I actually began to feel sorry for them both as time went on. Diana had problems that needed professional help long before she got any. That had a lot to do with her behaviour towards others. She was very insecure.

She appears to have been the type of person who was mind set on lashing out/going after someone without thinking things through to the full effect it would have. Only afterwards did she see how wrong it was but by then the damage was done.

The Panaroma interview was a perfect example--I really believe that she didn't have any idea what effect it would have on her sons or others at the time she did it. She was only focused on hitting out at Charles.

I have read that towards the end of her life Diana regretted doing both the Interview and the book. Now they are part of her legacy whether right or wrong. These 2 things will be a big part in how she will be judged by many who never had the chance to meet her to make up their own minds.

I never realised until recently how true Earl Spencer's assesment of his sister was in his eulogy. She was a unique and very complicated.
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