Last Hours, Death, Transfer from France, Funeral and Interment

[Countessmeout]

Exactly. St George's and the cathedrals have security to make sure damage is not done, and to control visitors. Who would have paid to have the local church secured at all times? Considering the frenzy for years after her death, that poor church and town would have been flooded with people. Should locals who attend the church not be able to go to church on Sundays because of crazy Diana fans?? Maybe a plaque or little monument can be placed for Diana with her ancestors, while her body remains where it is.

 

[Dman]

Earl Spencer did not profit off of his sister's grave site. All the profits from the exhibition at Althorp went to the Diana, Princess of Wales Memorial Fund.

 

[Osipi]

What it really all boils down to is one word. Family. At the time of her death, Diana, Princess of Wales was a private citizen and although she had ties through her sons to the British Royal Family, she was no longer a member of that family and the BRF no longer had ties to her except through her sons.

All in all, I think her burial on the island at Althorp was the best move the Spencer family made as by observing the reaction of the people to her death, the outlying cause of her death (paparazzi) and the frenzy of the days following her death, they wanted some modicum of privacy for a very public person. I do think that Charles acted admirably in doing what he could for his sons by showing deep respect for his ex-wife by doing what he could to honor the mother of his boys by escorting her body back to the UK and walking with his sons in the funeral procession. At Balmoral, away from the public eye, Will and Harry were able to have their space to take in, process and come to grips with what perhaps was the most horrific moments of their young lives before having to be gawked at and photographed and such by people all over the world. HM made the right move at this time. She was a grandmother before a Queen. Her family rightly mattered more at that time than the multitudes of people clamoring for her to express what they were all feeling.

I feel that most of the blame for any problems that arose during that time did not point to the Spencers or to the Windsors but to the Prime Minister of the day, Tony Blair, and the media itself. It was his office that coined the phrase "people's princess" and it was the media that jumped on this adding fuel to the fire creating a frenzy where it became next to impossible for either the Spencers or the Windsors to handle this tragedy within their families.

 

[Mermaid1962]

I don't think that future admissions earnings was a consideration. Given his speech at the funeral and the way that he tore off the royal flag and replaced it with the Spencer one (according to Paul Burrell and perhaps another source), I think that he was seething with rage and grief and wanted his sister's body back on Spencer soil. Grief is a very strange thing. The initial numbness passes off after a couple of days and the real sorrow hits. People react differently and in different timings and sometimes do things which they normally wouldn't do.

 

[Queen Camilla]

Where was Charles Spencer the day the body was brought back from Paris?

He was head of her biological family. as she was divorced and her sons minors.

What was the reason why he did not accompany her body?

I don't think that future admissions earnings was a consideration. Given his speech at the funeral and the way that he tore off the royal flag and replaced it with the Spencer one (according to Paul Burrell and perhaps another source), I think that he was seething with rage and grief and wanted his sister's body back on Spencer soil. Grief is a very strange thing. The initial numbness passes off after a couple of days and the real sorrow hits. People react differently and in different timings and sometimes do things which they normally wouldn't do.

Or guilt.

Trying to overcompensate for the guilt he felt over their spat they had over the housing issue.

He is allowing his sister back on his property only after she is deceased and not while she was alive.

 

[Curryong]

Earl Spencer was at his home in Capetown South Africa when Diana died. He commented to the media about her death, citing the theories early on that the car was speeding because it was being pursued by paparazzi on motorcycles.

He obviously caught a plane to London later that day, but by then Prince Charles had gone to Paris with Diana's sisters.

 

[ROYAL NORWAY]

What it really all boils down to is one word. Family. At the time of her death, Diana, Princess of Wales was a private citizen and although she had ties through her sons to the British Royal Family, she was no longer a member of that family and the BRF no longer had ties to her except through her sons.

All in all, I think her burial on the island at Althorp was the best move the Spencer family made as by observing the reaction of the people to her death, the outlying cause of her death (paparazzi) and the frenzy of the days following her death, they wanted some modicum of privacy for a very public person. I do think that Charles acted admirably in doing what he could for his sons by showing deep respect for his ex-wife by doing what he could to honor the mother of his boys by escorting her body back to the UK and walking with his sons in the funeral procession. At Balmoral, away from the public eye, Will and Harry were able to have their space to take in, process and come to grips with what perhaps was the most horrific moments of their young lives before having to be gawked at and photographed and such by people all over the world. HM made the right move at this time. She was a grandmother before a Queen. Her family rightly mattered more at that time than the multitudes of people clamoring for her to express what they were all feeling.

I feel that most of the blame for any problems that arose during that time did not point to the Spencers or to the Windsors but to the Prime Minister of the day, Tony Blair, and the media itself. It was his office that coined the phrase "people's princess" and it was the media that jumped on this adding fuel to the fire creating a frenzy where it became next to impossible for either the Spencers or the Windsors to handle this tragedy within their families.

Great post, as usual.

 

[Denville]

The tourists would pay for entry. Westminster Abbey cost £20 for entry, St Paul's is £18


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I'm sorry but I think that is an awful idea. Cathedrals like St Paul's etc do charge for entry ( or rather they ask I think for a contribuiotn) because they are historical monuments and the money helps with their upkeep but this si a village church. it is there for the people of the area to worship, not for tourism

What it really all boils down to is one word. Family. the world. HM made the right move at this time. She was a grandmother before a Queen. Her family rightly mattered more at that time than the multitudes of people clamoring for her to express what they were all feeling.

I their families.

Oh come now, if she cared that much about the boys why did she send them out to speak to the crowds? I think that it was right at least that Will as D's oldest son should walk behind her coffin, maybe Harry was too young. But I can't see any reason for their being setn out to talk to the crowds other than that the RF waS scared that they were being seriously critiicsed by the public and they used the boys to delfect that. They knew that the boys wouldn't be criticised as they were..
As For C Spencer I don't believe he gave the profits to the Diana fund. He did do some events at Althorp for her fund, after her death but all profits of the Exhibition and generally seeing the house go to the house itself, as it costs a mint to upkeep.
However I am sure that his decision to bury Diana on an island was the right one and that it was hardly anytng to do with wanting profits.

Or guilt.

Trying to overcompensate for the guilt he felt over their spat they had over the housing issue.

He is allowing his sister back on his property only after she is deceased and not while she was alive.

again that is not the case. he did not refuse to allow Dian on his property and he did at the time of the Garden house incident offer her other houses.

 

[Osipi]

Oh come now, if she cared that much about the boys why did she send them out to speak to the crowds?

I don't remember W&H sent out to talk to the crowds. I do remember them solemnly taking in all the flowers, notes and such that had piled up outside of their London home at KP. They had arrived the day before the funeral was to take place and was accompanied by their father.

Perhaps for a better, in depth recollection of those days, a good source is Dickie Arbiter as he was close to the events going on and knew Diana quite well. Its a good read. Don't let the Daily Fail headline mislead you.

What really happened behind Palace doors in royalty's darkest hour: A prince too frightened to view Diana's condolence book. The Queen gripped with anxiety. An insider reveals the torment over the princess's death | Daily Mail Online

 

[Denville]

Yes they did speak to the crowds. You can see it on TV where they went out to see the flowers and to speak and shake hands with people.

 

[Jacknch]

Yes, I remember very well William and Harry shaking hands with some of the people that fateful week - I can't recall exactly where it was, but I remember feeling very uncomfortable about it - thinking at the time "they shouldn't have to be doing that", what with people thrusting their hands at them as if it was normal walk-about.

 

[ROYAL NORWAY]

Yes, I remember very well William and Harry shaking hands with some of the people that fateful week - I can't recall exactly where it was, but I remember feeling very uncomfortable about it - thinking at the time "they shouldn't have to be doing that", what with people thrusting their hands at them as if it was normal walk-about.

Yes, they did speak to the crowds. But I'm pretty sure (having read many of your posts) that you don't agree with what Denville writes in this post which I actually find quite shocking. It reminds me of the awful things that duch_lover_4ever wrote.

Oh come now, if she cared that much about the boys why did she send them out to speak to the crowds? I think that it was right at least that Will as D's oldest son should walk behind her coffin, maybe Harry was too young. But I can't see any reason for their being setn out to talk to the crowds other than that the RF waS scared that they were being seriously critiicsed by the public and they used the boys to delfect that. They knew that the boys wouldn't be criticised as they were..
As For C Spencer I don't believe he gave the profits to the Diana fund. He did do some events at Althorp for her fund, after her death but all profits of the Exhibition and generally seeing the house go to the house itself, as it costs a mint to upkeep.
However I am sure that his decision to bury Diana on an island was the right one and that it was hardly anytng to do with wanting profits.

 

[Iluvbertie]

They went out to see the flowers etc at Balmoral on the Thursday. As there were people there they went to speak to them - no one force them to do so.

The next day they went to London and again they went out to see all the flowers etc - as did The Queen and Philip.

I still remember one of the crowd 'you make sure you take care of those boys' to Philip and his reply 'what do you think we have been doing?' Says it all really - the public felt that had a better right to the boys than anyone else.

Simple bullying of a grandmother taking care of her grandchildren - most bosses would allow the grandmother to take a week or so off in that situation but not the British public and the press, especially Diana's fans - they wanted to wallow in the boys grief rather than let the family help them at that time.

The London crowds that week were a baying mob (one of the reasons why the security for the funeral was so tight was the very real fears that an assassination attempt on Charles at least might have been attempted - if not a full scale revolution and overthrow of the monarchy).

 

[Denville]

No the public AT THAT TIME felt that the RF were callous people who didn't appear to care about Diana or her boys.. It may have been tactless, but I don't believe it sprang from unkindness or feeling that they had aright to the boys.

 

[Jacknch]

Common sense tells us that William and Harry were old enough to make their own decision regarding viewing the flowers or shaking hands with the crowds. In my mind it is inconceivable that the whole thing was a PR stunt devised by the Queen.

My discomfort was more related to the fact that people were thrusting their hands forward as if trying to get a handshake as they do on a normal royal walkabout.

Anyway, I found the video in question:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVBNwJwegso

 

[Iluvbertie]

That is exactly what it was about - that the public believed that cared about the boys more than their own family did stirred up by the press into hating the BRF and demanding that the Queen show she cared (the only people she had to show she cared to were two grieving grandsons but that wasn't enough for the mob in London that week - or Diana fans even to this day).

 

[Curryong]

Sorry, I was there in those crowds almost every day on that particular week and on the funeral day, and all I got from the crowds around the Palaces and waiting for the funeral cortège was grief, an overwhelming sadness that a beautiful young woman many loved and admired was gone before her time.

There was a bit of resentment towards Charles, a sort of sullen quality In the comments about him, but I never heard any revolutionary talk, calling for the Queen's head, even figuratively (and people who met the Queen that week treated her with respect.) The police and security forces were ready to move in and were necessarily cautious, but if those crowds were really 'baying' they could have thrown eggs or rocks at Charles if they'd really wanted to.

There seems to be a feeling, born of hindsight no doubt, that everyone out on the streets for Diana's funeral was gripped by mass hysteria combined with an uncontrolled anger. I must have viewed a different funeral because I saw nothing of that.

 

[ROYAL NORWAY]

It angers me and makes me sad that the Queen who had always been there for her people was bullied by the press in that awful way for taking care of her grandchildren, and for the only time in her reign putting family before duty.

As EIIR wrote in this post: It was one of the worst moments in the history of the monarchy.

http://www.theroyalforums.com/forum...lowing-dianas-death-13777-22.html#post1262650

Personally, I was and continue to be disappointed that the Queen gave in to the voyeuristic baying of the press and the public at the time to 'see' the grief of her family. How on earth was it anyone's business how deeply or otherwise the royal family felt the loss of a former family member? What right do we have to see their private emotions and feelings?

The whole episode was a shameful one for Britain. The mass hysteria over the death of someone who, lets face it, didn't deserve the public howling and weeping was an utter embarrassment. She did a bit of charity work but then so does the whole of the royal family. She was not Ghandi or Churchill or Mandela.

The Queen should have released a statement saying that she preferred that the family remain in private to help her grandsons deal with the death of their mother. There should then have been a private funeral where two young boys would not have had to be paraded in front of the whole world to provide 'grief porn' to fill tv and newspaper pages.

The Queen allowed herself to be controlled by a baying media and a government which would gladly have seen the back of the monarchy. It was one of the worst moments in the history of the monarchy in my opinion.

And as cepe wrote in this post:
http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f23/the-royal-family-and-the-media-11937-12.html#post1871170

The immediate response of the British people was to turn on the press. So what did the press do? Turn it round and blame HMQ. With hindsight we know what HMQ did in looking after her grandchildren was the right thing. But the press fooled the public and we shouldn't ever let it happen again.

And most people today (even journalists) regrets the way they attacked/bullied the Queen in the days following Diana's death

 

[royal rob]

Sorry, I was there in those crowds almost every day on that particular week and on the funeral day, and all I got from the crowds around the Palaces and waiting for the funeral cortège was grief, an overwhelming sadness that a beautiful young woman many loved and admired was gone before her time.

There was a bit of resentment towards Charles, a sort of sullen quality In the comments about him, but I never heard any revolutionary talk, calling for the Queen's head, even figuratively (and people who met the Queen that week treated her with respect.) The police and security forces were ready to move in and were necessarily cautious, but if those crowds were really 'baying' they could have thrown eggs or rocks at Charles if they'd really wanted to.

There seems to be a feeling, born of hindsight no doubt, that everyone out on the streets for Diana's funeral was gripped by mass hysteria combined with an uncontrolled anger. I must have viewed a different funeral because I saw nothing of that.

How wonderful that you can tell us exactly what happen and the feelings of the people


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[Duc_et_Pair]

In the end all ended well. After the turmoil, the ludicrous process afterwards (Al-Fayed claiming the royal family had killed his son, etc.), time went on. The dust has settled down. Diana rests on a beautiful island on her ancestral estate. William is married and father of two. Harry hits the approval ratings. The Queen hits an unbelievable record and is celebrating her 90th birthday, time has really moved on.

 

[ROYAL NORWAY]

I also read/heard somewhere that Her Majesty received thousands of supportive letters from people in 1997 who said they didn't agree with the way she was treated by the press.

 

[Osipi]

I also read/heard somewhere that Her Majesty received thousands of supportive letters from people in 1997 who said they didn't agree with the way she was treated by the press.

I think the most poignant observation of how people reacted to the Queen as she and the DoE walked around looking at the flowers that were laid in memory of Diana was when one person (a child I believe) was holding a bouquet and HM asked if she wanted her to place them for her and the person replied "No Ma'am, these are for you".

 

[ROYAL NORWAY]

I think the most poignant observation of how people reacted to the Queen as she and the DoE walked around looking at the flowers that were laid in memory of Diana was when one person (a child I believe) was holding a bouquet and HM asked if she wanted her to place them for her and the person replied "No Ma'am, these are for you".

I agree! And as several posters have written on these threads: It wasn't the crowds who was the problem, it was the media.

 

[Lee-Z]

Sorry, I was there in those crowds almost every day on that particular week and on the funeral day, and all I got from the crowds around the Palaces and waiting for the funeral cortège was grief, an overwhelming sadness that a beautiful young woman many loved and admired was gone before her time.

There was a bit of resentment towards Charles, a sort of sullen quality In the comments about him, but I never heard any revolutionary talk, calling for the Queen's head, even figuratively (and people who met the Queen that week treated her with respect.) The police and security forces were ready to move in and were necessarily cautious, but if those crowds were really 'baying' they could have thrown eggs or rocks at Charles if they'd really wanted to.

There seems to be a feeling, born of hindsight no doubt, that everyone out on the streets for Diana's funeral was gripped by mass hysteria combined with an uncontrolled anger. I must have viewed a different funeral because I saw nothing of that.

Thank you very much for posting this; like many said here, the media gave a spin on things and unfortunately that will probably what will be left for generations after us, while eye-witness accounts like yours will disappear from communal memory...

 

[Denville]

Sorry, I was there in those crowds almost every day on that particular week and on the funeral day, and all I got from the crowds around the Palaces and waiting for the funeral cortège was grief, an overwhelming sadness that a beautiful young woman many loved and admired was gone before her time.


. I must have viewed a different funeral because I saw nothing of that.

I agree. I remember people being very gentle mostly, and polite to each other.

People wanted to talk to Will and Harry, not because they felt that they owned them or that they owned Diana but because they were saddened by Diana's death and wanted to show W and Harry that they cared that they were unhappy too.
And I think that people DID feel that the queen and the RF had been cold to Diana, and had not shown any grief at her death... there was a certain anger among some people that the queen had been cold towards her daughter in law and that Charles ahd been a bad husband, and that between them all they had left Diana with no option but to leave the RF./

 

[ROYAL NORWAY]

And I think that people DID feel that the queen and the RF had been cold to Diana, and had not shown any grief at her death... there was a certain anger among some people that the queen had been cold towards her daughter in law and that Charles ahd been a bad husband, and that between them all they had left Diana with no option but to leave the RF./

This isn't just a answer to this, but to many of your posts.

As I and other posters have said several times: The crowds was manipulated by the press, and most people today (even journalists) regrets the way they attacked/bullied the Queen in the dark days following Diana's death.

And if there's one thing the Queen is not, then it's cold. This is the lady who Sarah Ferguson refers to: As the most wonderful, forgiving, non judgmental person I know. This is also the lady who asks her staffers about they are being kind etc.

Several reliable people including Dickie and Victoria Arbiter has said that the Queen was very fond of Diana and that she tried to help her several times, and that she always treated her daughter in law well. Even that Paul Burrell guy has said that.

And that says a lot about the Queen as a person, because Diana was very unkind to her. Some of these people also claim that Diana was very fond of the Queen too, and that they had a pretty good relationship untill she did the interview in 1995. And as Frances Shand Kydd sayd:
Diary reveals how princess's mother raged at the royals - Telegraph

Frances Shand Kydd in her diary denied that The Queen and Diana did not get on, claiming they had a "lot of mutual respect and admiration".

 

[royal rob]

This isn't just a answer to this, but to many of your posts.

As I and other posters have said several times: The crowds was manipulated by the press, and most people today (even journalists) regrets the way they attacked/bullied the Queen in the dark days following Diana's death.

And if there's one thing the Queen is not, then it's cold. This is the lady who Sarah Ferguson refers to: As the most wonderful, forgiving, non judgmental person I know. This is also the lady who asks her staffers about they are being kind etc.

Several reliable people including Dickie and Victoria Arbiter has said that the Queen was very fond of Diana and that she tried to help her several times, and that she always treated her daughter in law well. Even that Paul Burrell guy has said that.

And that says a lot about the Queen as a person, because Diana was very unkind to her. Some of these people also claim that Diana was very fond of the Queen too, and that they had a pretty good relationship untill she did the interview in 1995. And as Frances Shand Kydd sayd:
Diary reveals how princess's mother raged at the royals - Telegraph


Both you and posters such as Duch_Luver_4ever should start listening to reliable people/staffers instead of reading all these pro/anti Diana books before you start the deconstruction of a true icon as Her Majesty the Queen is.

Bit boring if we all thought the same and not much point in having this forum. It's a bit rude to tell a fellow member what they should do. But that's JMO if you get my point


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[Osipi]

One thing I've noticed that has been kind of overlooked in all the discussion surrounding the time of Diana's death, funeral and internment is that no one has stated the obvious fact that actually the British Royal Family, at the time, weren't obligated to do anything at all. Not Charles, not the Queen and not the government of the day. Supporting, consoling and comforting her sons and being there for them was the best thing they could have done at the time.

Sometimes I get the feeling that with the criticism of how such and such a person in the BRF handled things during that period, that they feel the BRF owed certain modes of behavior, recognition and even displays of emotion as if Diana was still a member of the BRF. She wasn't. She was a private citizen that was once married to the Prince of Wales. The Spencer family were really the people to call the shots and if memory serves me well, when Charles flew to Paris, her two sisters Jane and Sarah also went with him.

Personally, I think the BRF went above and beyond what they were "required" to do and it was done because they wanted to and weren't pushed into anything.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

I agree completely. That the ex-husband flew to Paris, together with his former sisters-in-law Lady Sarah and Lady Jane was heartwarming but indeed not expected or required at all. The Spencers could have made it a "Spencer-only" affair but included the royal family from the beginning. The fact that the coffin was draped with a royal standard and not with a Spencer standard already shows how ambigue the whole affair was, it was not at all that black-and-white as Earl Spencer made us believe with his eulogy.

 

[Jacknch]

I quite agree with this - one needs only to remember the deaths of the Queen Mother and Princess Margaret to see how they act and react when a member of the royal family dies - with a quiet dignity and privately - as most of us would do.

Many people around the country were shocked at the news of Diana's death so you can only imagine how her family and former in-laws must have felt.

The initial statement/reaction from the Palace (and I remember this well from the news reports that dreadful morning) was that they were "shocked and distressed" by the news. That should have been more than enough for people to know how the Royal Family felt and goes to show how, in the days that followed, the media were the ones who "panicked" and started to print all sorts of rubbish and whip everyone up into a frenzy.