Diana's Secret Tapes Recorded in March 1997

[Roslyn]

You have your ideas, and standards, and interests, and others of us have ours. And they may - indeed very likely will - differ. Those differences do not make our different interests and ideas and standards wrong.........just different.

Vive la difference!

 

[US Royal Watcher]

I don't think this is just a matter for historians. This is not just about Diana (and I don't think anyone can stop the dead from resting in peace). What happened during Charles and Diana's marriage is still impacting Charles and Camilla today. Charles has never regained the popularity he enjoyed before he married Diana. His work today is still being overshadowed by the charges leveled at them by Diana and her friends 20 years ago. For an example, all you have to do is look at comment sections under every single article about them. It will come up again when Charles takes the throne.

I am especially curious about the tapes Morton has. One of my criticisms of Diana is that she failed to reveal her own affairs while charging Charles with infidelity. My question is whether that was her decision or Morton's? It would make a difference to me if Diana had been ready to come clean but was talked out of it.

Similarly, it would be interesting to hear Diana's own words. Many of the people who have revealed things Diana told them have their own agendas. I'd like to hear an unfiltered account so I can judge for myself.

I understand some people want to declare this is a dead issue, but the fact that they even clicked on this thread indicates they have an interest.

...I have the feeling that any student who wants to make and to uphold a thesis about Diana, will meet raised eyebrows...

Given the impact Diana's death had on millions of people, I would think that there would be a major interest in an academic study of Diana. Not just her life, but the media and public interest, her manipulation of the media, and the impact of the tabloid media. I think the reaction to her death is a fascinating phenomenon that I don't think anyone really understands.
.

 

[sthreats]

Diana's secret tapes recorded in March 1997

I don't get it. The link to an article from 2006 about a secret tape from 1997. This is 2014 and this unnamed source is yet to come forward. We don't even know if this is true. Even if the tape surfaced it could be spliced together. I'm sorry I just don't see the point of discussing this.

 

[Roslyn]

I don't think this is just a matter for historians...

I think these are all very good points.

 

[MarcosFenn]

If some (maybe second-rate) politician messes up in private, then often a 50-year rule applies for the declassification of relevant documents. It is not an exact science.

What I find objectionable is people using the selective airing of intensely private matters in order to manipulate events.

 

[Osipi]

It is often said that history is written by the victors. In this time period of the animosity between Diana and Charles and the British Royal Family, there were no victors.

 

[Lee-Z]

It is often said that history is written by the victors. In this time period of the animosity between Diana and Charles and the British Royal Family, there were no victors.

I often get the idea that their battle is still being fought by other people "on their behalf"; it could only have ended by the directly involved together and because the untimely death of one of the two that will never happen..

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

...This is not just about Diana...

I have the idea that the Prince of Wales, also because of his very succesful Prince's Trust, his commitment to the countryside and the national heritage, is pretty popular in general. The vitriol and venom in the comments' sections of online media are not the Prince's exclusive "pleasure". Even popular royals as Prince William, Catherine and Prince Harry better avoid reading the comments in magazines as the Daily Mail. Recently Diana was in the general interest again because of that Naomi Watts film (which was a total flop at the box offices). Really, maybe there was a time that Diana was declared a Saint. From that sainthood little is left when you read the comments' sections.

Even persons we in general do have a positive vibe about like First Lady Michelle Obama, Tennis Legend Roger Federer or Hollywood Darling Mila Kunis better fasten their safety belts and protect themselves before reading the vomit and the trolls in the comments' sections. That is the world anno 2014.

At the same time I say: don't underestimate the power of symbols and togetherness. In the unimagineable event that Queen Elizabeth II passes away, leaving her many Realms behind after a Reign, with a lifespan, there will be deepfelt loss of a long-lasting symbol, a rally around the new King. He will lead the nation in mourning, his son becomes the Duke of Cornwall and Rothesay, eventually created Prince of Wales, a whole different royal family will appear on the balcony. Suddenly a King will ride on horseback before his troops during the Trooping. New elements and more openess will enter the palaces, a fresh airwave will live up the monarchy.

Mark my words. The example is there. The scandal-ridden Prince Bertie became Edward VII and a most loved King in his short Reign. The stammering and stuttering Duke of York who had to follow his brother's footsteps after scandal hit the monarchy became an unexpectedly beloved monarch. You never know how things work out. In my view Charles and William have nothing to fear and can look forward to become great and beloved Kings. All this despite the bitter years of the War of the Waleses. But all this at the same time also because of their relationship: without Charles and Diana, there would be no William, Harry and George...

 

[Osipi]

Mark my words. The example is there. The scandal-ridden Prince Bertie became Edward VII and a most loved King in his short Reign. The stammering and stuttering Duke of York who had to follow his brother's footsteps after scandal hit the monarchy became an unexpectedly beloved monarch. You never know how things work out. In my view Charles and William have nothing to fear and can look forward to become great and beloved Kings. All this despite the bitter years of the War of the Waleses. But all this at the same time also because of their relationship: without Charles and Diana, there would be no William, Harry and George...

A very well written post and I think you've hit the nail on the head as far as how Charles and William will be seen as kings. One note though and that is that it was David (his familial name) that became Edward VIII and then his brother Bertie that followed him as George VI.

 

[Lee-Z]

i think Duc-et-pair referred to two separate kings: Edward vii (the one married to Alexandra) in the line you bolded; in the next sentence to his son George VI

 

[Warren]

Osipi, the first 'Bertie' refers to Edward VII (who many at the time assumed would be a wastrel king); the second to the other Albert (George VI) and his [unnamed] brother Edward VIII.

 

[Iluvbertie]

Maybe there are differences in what is needed to study a topic. Usually academic students must meet stringent requirements. They need to have a solid background in the theory and methods of their field and demonstrate a good knowledge. Prior to beginning work, a student will need to draw up a formal, written agreement with his/her supervisor. The agreement, which must be approved by the university, will outline the objectives of the research project and an individualised plan of study.

Let us assume that a student wants to research Diana, Princess of Wales. In what framework should that be done? History? Social sciences? Is the person of Diana, Princess of Wales "heavy" enough for an academic research project, for a thesis and a well-documented academic report, approved by supervisor and university? Yes, the late Margaret Thatcher is. Yes, Queen Elizabeth II is. Two ladies with direct political, social and historical influence which gives any student loads of data and information.

I have the feeling that any student who wants to make and to uphold a thesis about Diana, will meet raised eyebrows and even negative comments because it will become commented as ultra-light and not scientifical enough. Maybe we have different 'notions' of students. Maybe at secondary education level, studies about the life of Diana are acceptable for a starter.

I am well aware of what is needed to undertake a formal program of research at university level but I am teaching High School students whose teachers are actually teaching them how to be historians at a more basic level.

As for studying Diana at the thesis level - has been done - my supervisor for my Ph.D has had two students look into Diana at that level already - one looked into her in a comparison with other Princesses of Wales and how they define their roles in that position showing how the role has changed over time and the other looking at her social impact on young people across the Commonwealth - neither 'lightweight' studies.

I have certainly taught Diana to high school students and know many other teachers who do so - as a means of getting students into the idea of writing a biography and to be careful with using one source alone - she is great to use for teaching about bias and how we are all biased in the way we see the world and how, as historians, we have to take into account the bias of the writer, person speaking etc.

 

[Osipi]

Osipi, the first 'Bertie' refers to Edward VII (who many at the time assumed would be a wastrel king); the second to the other Albert (George VI) and his [unnamed] brother Edward VIII.

Thanks for the correction Lee-Z and Warren. I totally read that wrong.

 

[US Royal Watcher]

...In my view Charles and William have nothing to fear and can look forward to become great and beloved Kings. All this despite the bitter years of the War of the Waleses...

I agree that most people will rally around Charles when the time comes, but the War of the Waleses continues to impact Charles' popularity now. The last poll I saw indicated that approximately 30 percent of the people want the crown to pass directly to William and fewer than 20 percent want to see Camilla crowned as Queen. I believe that will change as time goes on, but I also think that Diana's words and actions are still having an impact.

I still would like to hear exactly what she said in the Morton tapes. They may be irrelevant but they also may completely change how people perceive Charles' first marriage--either positively or negatively.

It would have been different if Morton hadn't released some of the tapes.

 

[nascarlucy]

It's possible that what she said could be stuff that is already known or stuff that could be damaging to the royal family. If someone has these tapes or if they exist, it's interesting that they have never materialized or been released. Is someone holding something back, perhaps? Waiting for the right time to release them?

Depending on what is on the tape if they exist, will influence people's decisions.

 

[sndral]

Diana had signed a confidentiality agreement as part of her divorce settlement, why then would she make a series of tapes speaking about things she had promised to not speak about?
The possibilities:
1) Just another wild rumour w/ no substance, she did not make any tapes - the evidence being she had agreed to end the very public attacks she had been making on Charles and his family.
2) They did exist and Diana made the tapes as a sort of verbal diary w/ no intention of ever allowing them to be made public.
3) They did exist and Diana intended to use them at some future date, perhaps following her pattern w/ Morton's book, denying she had anything to do w/ their release perhaps claiming they got into the public domain via theft.
If the latter scenario, then she had not buried the hatchet, moreover the alleged contents of the tapes - that she wanted Charles to be bypassed and she intended to be the power behind the throne via William suggests that she had not matured and moved on, but was biding her time waiting to attack again.
Assuming the tapes were made the question becomes do they still exist or have they been destroyed?
If they exist, IMO releasing them now can only do harm, mostly because Diana was so sincerely and believably deceitful about so many things - why rehash it all again.

 

[Queen Camilla]

It isn't about rehashing.

If the tapes exists then the unedited tapes should be released in their entirety.

Along with the unedited Settelen tapes also in their entirety. The same for the Morton tapes and the phone tapes.

Everything should be released at the same time, as that would cause the least amount of damage to the royal family.

There were 21 Settelen tapes, but Burrell only had a few, what happened to rest? Is someone waiting to release them on an anniversary of her death/birth. At Charles' coronation?

Unless all the tapes, both audio & video are securely with the royal family, these tapes can be used against the royal family at any time. (That is why I support releasing everything.)

 

[ladongas]

I am well aware of what is needed to undertake a formal program of research at university level but I am teaching High School students whose teachers are actually teaching them how to be historians at a more basic level.

As for studying Diana at the thesis level - has been done - my supervisor for my Ph.D has had two students look into Diana at that level already - one looked into her in a comparison with other Princesses of Wales and how they define their roles in that position showing how the role has changed over time and the other looking at her social impact on young people across the Commonwealth - neither 'lightweight' studies.

I have certainly taught Diana to high school students and know many other teachers who do so - as a means of getting students into the idea of writing a biography and to be careful with using one source alone - she is great to use for teaching about bias and how we are all biased in the way we see the world and how, as historians, we have to take into account the bias of the writer, person speaking etc.

I'm surprised to hear that there is so much interest in the BRF in Australia.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

I agree that most people will rally around Charles when the time comes, but the War of the Waleses continues to impact Charles' popularity now. The last poll I saw indicated that approximately 30 percent of the people want the crown to pass directly to William and fewer than 20 percent want to see Camilla crowned as Queen. I believe that will change as time goes on, but I also think that Diana's words and actions are still having an impact.

I still would like to hear exactly what she said in the Morton tapes. They may be irrelevant but they also may completely change how people perceive Charles' first marriage--either positively or negatively.

It would have been different if Morton hadn't released some of the tapes.

In popularity the Prince of Wales and certainly the Duchess of Cornwall will never ever beat the fresh, young, goodlooking Cambridges with their spotless reputation and Baby George as an irrestistible bonus. However, this was the same in 1982 when the young Charles and Diana proudly showed Baby William to the nation. 10-15 years later little was left from that so sweet royal sugarcake.

People who say that the monarchy has to skip a generation do show at the same time that they do not understand the system of hereditary succession. They want to replace it by a system of popularity. But we all know: popularity comes on foot and goes away on horseback....

Once the nation is in mourning, the flag flying half-mast, the church bells tolling and solemn proceedings are under way for Her late Majesty Queen Elizabeth II, then the wheel of history will move further: "The Queen is dead; long live the King!". The then new Duke and Duchess of Cornwall will join in that chorus and for no second think with grumblin' teeth: "Pfff... papa should move away and make place for us!" I am sure that was also never Diana's wish. She was not thát stupid to undermine the foundations and principles of the same monarchy her own flesh and blood will inherit.

 

[Iluvbertie]

I'm surprised to hear that there is so much interest in the BRF in Australia.

We have a population of over 23 million and two have chosen to do their Ph.D's on aspects of Diana. Hardly proof of interest or otherwise.

What we do have is a strong culture of teaching and studying history - although virtually no British history is taught now - and none is compulsory so more and more kids are coming to some study of Britain, if at all, when they reach university level.

Some teachers teach 'elective history' in addition to the compulsory courses and within that course teach 'biography' or 'construction of history' and then use Diana as a great case study for those topics.

 

[Mermaid1962]

I believe that the tapes are either in the Royal Archives or have been destroyed. Quite honestly, I'm not sure what good they would do being released now. Unless there's evidence there of criminal activity on behalf of members of the Royal Family, I don't think they need to be made public. Genuine historians in the future might be able to view them from a more dispassionate distance.

Unless all the tapes, both audio & video are securely with the royal family, these tapes can be used against the royal family at any time. (That is why I support releasing everything.)

 

[Roslyn]

I have just re-watched "Princess Diana: The Secret Tapes" which is available on youtube.

That documentary is based on the premise that Diana wanted her story told, and that the best way to tell that story is in her own words, and I have to agree with that. The doco actually paints a very sympathetic picture of her. It shows her as a flawed woman but one with a lot of admirable qualities. And it shows her as a woman, not a mythical fairytale princess.

The Morton/Colthurst tapes were Diana's answers to questions written by Morton and conveyed between them by Colthurst. I doubt that there will be anything particularly nasty or scandalous in those tapes. Yes, the three in a marriage stuff is rehashed, but we all know about that anyway. And, yes, we see Diana imply that she thought Charles should go off with Camilla and leave her and her sons to look after business. But, as Morton himself said in the doco, the book told Diana's story, from her point of view. He doesn't vouch for the accuracy of what she says.

The video of the Settelen recordings that is shown was actually very interesting. It showed how Diana applied herself to learning how to present speeches and showed her working on a particular speech and preparing for interviews. It also shows her answering questions about her goals and learning how to do that in interviews. The parts I saw are very instructive and show her in a very favourable light.

I think a lot of people are assuming the worst about these tapes. I doubt there is anything sinister on them. There might be stuff the Queen or Duke don't like, but that's another issue. I really hope they are not lost or destroyed and that one day, even if it is not for a couple more decades, the whole lot are released for they are a very valuable resource.

Though it must be noted that those tapes were not made in 1997.

 

[anbrida]

Mystery tapes which Princess Diana gives advice to William and Kate 'are exactly like her' | Daily Mail Online

Tapes allegedly made by Princess Diana for Prince William echo sentiments she expressed just months before her death, a close friend said yesterday.

The existence of the tapes was revealed by US magazine Globe. In them, she is said to urge her oldest son and his future wife: ‘Cherish your children for me. Let them know I’ll love them and watch over them.’

It reported the voice on the tape stated: ‘I know I’d adore you and we’d be fast friends. You’d have to be someone truly special. If you weren’t, you wouldn’t be William’s wife.’

Speaking directly to her daughter-in-law, Diana reportedly advised her to work at her marriage to survive the pressures of public life and warned her that being a future queen makes marriage harder.

Is this tape also part of the secret tapes she made during 1997? If the existence of these tapes are true, I think there must be something really frightened her at that time.

There is another possibility why she made these tapes. She used some of them as a blackmail to the government (establishment), warning them if something ever happened to her, these tapes will be disclosed to the public. In these case, all the tapes would not be located in Britain, but very likely in USA. It has been reported that Paul Burrel would regularly send something to a friend in USA. Not surprise the news was from USA.

 

[Curryong]

I'm not a conspiracy theorist in any way, but I do have a feeling that Paul Burrell was more deeply involved in Charles and Diana's affairs after the breakup of their marriage than has ever come out in the public arena. He worked for Diana's interests in many ways, in my opinion, and the royal family knew it.

 

[anbrida]

Although whether the tapes really exist can not be confirmed. But it was well reported that in the last year of her life, she had sent the following morbid quotes to not only one, but a bunch of her friends.

"And at night you will look up at the stars...and in one of the stars I shall be living. I have to go to the stars. And one day, when you look at the stars, you will remember me. "

I don't think it is a promotion, but she was fearing for her life.

 

[Mermaid1962]

The person was named. The person was "my husband" and she thought that he wanted her dead so that he could marry Tiggy. This has been in the public domain for quite some time.

I thought Diana was more worried about a car accident happening to her than snipers. She wrote that a certain person (never publicly named) was planning an accident involving brake failure for her in a handwritten letter only ten months before she died. She supposedly gave this letter to Paul Burrell as 'insurance'.

Oh yes, I'm sure she believed that someone or some group was out to kill her. Perhaps she was told this by one of her psychics or astrologers, or perhaps someone who wanted to further emotionally destabilize her for their own purposes. Martin Bashir forged some documents to get an interview with Diana, for example. Lots of people were probably telling her lots of things, whether true or not. BBC quizzed Diana over Bashir 'fake' - News - The Independent

I'm sure that's true, and as I said earlier I am not a conspiracy theorist. Nevertheless, there is evidence that Diana FELT that she was in danger. It was her perception, her view, that someone or some organisation was trying to eliminate her.

 

[COUNTESS]

Perhaps, she was right.

 

[US Royal Watcher]

Diana was somewhat concerned about her personal safety at times. Her letters indicate that there were times she certainly felt Charles would physically harm her. Perhaps someone was whispering in her ear, but I tend to think that she was probably looking for attention.

It doesn't necessarily follow that she left tapes for William and Harry because she thought she was going to be murdered. If you go by that logic, she made a will because she was afraid of Charles, which is ridiculous. She executed a will because she was being a responsible parent, not because she thought she would be killed.

If she made the tapes, they were probably made at about the same time she made a will. When my husband and I made wills after my kids were born, it got me thinking about what I would want my kids to remember if I died and I wrote them letters (I need to re-read those). Diana probably decided to make a videotape--if the tape exists at all. I don't see anything sinister.

 

[Zonk]

This thread has been reopened after a through clean up, posts have been moved to http://www.theroyalforums.com/forum...at-is-left-or-what-will-be-left-17784-66.html, http://www.theroyalforums.com/forum...er-from-france-funeral-and-interment-787.html , http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f34/william-and-harry-education-9455-9.html#post1733612 .

In addition, posts about the number of Diana marriages and whether Charles would have married Camilla if Diana was alive have been deleted. The former are specualtive and the latter are pointless since she is not and they are married.

Let's stay on topic. Any and all off topic posts will be deleted without notice.

Zonk
British Forums Moderator

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

The real reason Diana tapes were shelved: Director claims BBC axed 'dynamite' footage amid fears of upsetting monarchy - despite spending £500,000 on programme | Daily Mail Online